106 réponses à ce sujet

[happyelf]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

What is there to get over? >.>

You people are just calling random story possibilities "obviously canon".

I will bet you a million deep mushrooms that Morrigan and/or her kid make it into the sequel.
I am not faking this bet, my man ruck in the deep roads wil fix you up if it comes to that.
(ruck is also canon)

Modifié par happyelf, 22 novembre 2009 - 06:07 .

[Riona45]

Mystranna Kelteel wrote...

What is there to get over? >.>

You people are just calling random story possibilities "obviously canon".

I do think the "Morrigan's child" plot point is likely to be seen as too compelling to ignore for future storylines, but at the same time I agree with you that it's still only one possibility and at this time it certainly isn't "obviously canon."

[Saurel]

Indeed I would hardly call it random. Now if it was something along the lines of Sten goes onto become a carrot cultivator or bean farmer that would be a different story.

edit: I still think an awesome Origin for a sequel would be a Templar one where you are hunting down Morrigan.

Modifié par Saurel, 22 novembre 2009 - 06:33 .

[Mystranna Kelteel]

It's just as random as other choices, if not more so.



There's two options for the circle tower: mage or templar.

There are four options for Morrigan's baby, and that's DISCOUNTING who the parent of the child is. That would make it even more possibilities.

You can impregnate her yourself or with the male party Warden. You can refuse her. On top of that, you have the conclusion of Morrigan's personal quest to take into consideration, the outcome of which might have her killed by Flemeth.



So, yes, it is random.

[Saurel]

You're in denial, its the possibility that lends itself best to sequels.

[Mystranna Kelteel]

I'm not in denial.. I don't care if Morrigan has a baby or not, and I gave her the damn baby in my first playthrough.

All I'm saying is that the way people handle this option is as if it wasn't an option at all. They treat it like having sex with Morrigan is what ends the blight and must be the main aspect of the story and any future storylines! It's guesswork!!

!

[Maria Caliban]

Saurel wrote...

You're in denial, its the possibility that lends itself best to sequels.

You are in denial. Whether something lends itself to sequels in no way means it will appear in the sequal.

Heck, I thought the biggest player choice in ME1 was whether to save the council or not. Turns out that's rather unimportant in ME2 as you're not even in Citadel space.

[Saurel]

Maria Caliban wrote...


Heck, I thought the biggest player choice in ME1 was whether to save the council or not. Turns out that's rather unimportant in ME2 as you're not even in Citadel space.

Yeah but the other options don't seem all that interesting in DA. I mean DEMON BABY. I know we don't technically know its a demon baby. But still DEMON BABY

...

the Mass Effect one kinda had a "well either way could be interesting" type deal........and ok maybe all the early wallpapers with Morrigan and the Ogre. And artwork with Morrigan everywhere lead me to believe she will be a leading force in the story.

Like MK said its guesswork, but I wouldn't say its shotty guesswork.

Modifié par Saurel, 22 novembre 2009 - 06:51 .

[Raltar]

You all seem to miss the obvious thing here...if they choose one canon ending, they alienate all of the people that didn't like that ending. Grey Warden dies? Thousands of people are upset. Morrigan has evil demonspawn god child? Just as many people are upset. The only feasible work around for this is to never mention the specifics of what happened, leaving the actual ending as vague as they possibly can.

[Saurel]

Raltar wrote...

You all seem to miss the obvious thing here...if they choose one canon ending, they alienate all of the people that didn't like that ending. Grey Warden dies? .

What about the people who didn't like any ending ?

(all 5 of us)

[gelfie]

Kalfear wrote...
Fustrates me when I see people trying to push their narrow minded agendas in topics like this! For crying out loud, do whats best for the story, not your beleif system or what is the obvious choice of bucking the system. That junk attitude never helps anyone or anything.

Same here. "Canon" rocks for people who want to create their own tale or game and keep it faithful to the original, however, "canon" is chiefly out there for people who are in a position to create their own IPs such as Wizards of the Coast (thanks Riona!), Lucas etc. and best suits people with limited imaginations who love the rigidity that "canon" imposes

[Riona45]

Raltar wrote...

You all seem to miss the obvious thing here...

I didn't miss that, I just didn't state that in so many words in my earlier post.  For what it's worth, I do agree with you.

[Maria Caliban]

David has said that Morrigan's story is not over.



He's also stated that her's was the first NPC role thought of and that she was the face of the game for a reason. She also never dies, but survives to the end no matter what you do.



She's up to *something* but the idea that she needs dragon-baby to do it is doubtful.

[Saurel]

gelfie wrote...
Lucas etc. and best suits people with limited imaginations who love the rigidity that "canon" imposes

I don't know if I'd say they have limited imagination. Sometimes writers feel the story just works better a certain way and in their minds allowing people any choice (even if it isn't the "real" one) is still a nice thing to offer.

Its not necessairly a mentality I agree with or think is completely fair to the players, but I could understand it. The writer could say  'Well the alternative is to be like other games where you have absolutely no choice".

I mean the fact that there are static elements in rpg games (e.g. in this one Duncan dies regardless, Cailan dies regardless, you become a Grey Warden no matter what.) understandably convolute things a bit. If there were no canonical elements in an rpg it wouldn't be an issue up for discussion. But considering nearly infinite or say even 10 possibilites for each situation is not really feasible.....

ok I'm rambling...just saying imo, that without knowing the people behind the games mentality first hand its hard to say.

[Saurel]

Maria Caliban wrote...

David has said that Morrigan's story is not over.

He's also stated that her's was the first NPC role thought of and that she was the face of the game for a reason. She also never dies, but survives to the end no matter what you do.

She's up to *something* but the idea that she needs dragon-baby to do it is doubtful.

Fair enough, I may be too much in M. Night Shyamalan detective mode to the point where as soon as something obvious appears I have to say "A-ha that's it- Thats the reason why she is important"

[Draguling]

Lot's of interesting thoughts at least.

[Cuthlan]

Any of you found Arl Foreshadow in the game? Read the codex you can pickpocket from him. Like Lord Foreshadow from Baldur's Gate, it's a little easter egg of future Bioware plans:

"Books to pursue for future endeavors.
Lost countenance: Ferelden to Orlesian Phrase Book
-Must not offend the potential landlords
Raising Spirits: Offsprings and the Fade
-Terrible two's indeed!
Forest Fall: Truth and Legend in the Search for Arlathan
-Survivors? poppycock!
The Origin of Theses: Knowing more than Everyone without Looking Like a Jackass
-Never get the time to read this. Maybe there's a stage play? "

...the "offspring" part sure sounds like it might be pointing at Morrigan's child.

Modifié par Cuthlan, 22 novembre 2009 - 11:53 .

[Keeoto]

It's easy to build sequels/history/lore around the different origins of your grey warden without any question of canonical sense. What will have to be answered eventually is who ends up on Ferelden's throne, what Morrigan is up to, wether the god child plays into her plans, and the fate of your companions.

[Jsmith0730]

Kalfear wrote...

I guess it could be a human Noble Rogue but Warriors are so much more traditional and awe inspireing as lead heros then rogue characters are. Plus you have strong rogue characters in Lelianna and Zevran. To many Rogues spoile the stew  heh

Super necroing this thread but personally I have always felt that Alistair should be "The" Warrior/Templar/Champion/Actual Hero of the group. My character is just there to sculpt him into King material.

Modifié par Jsmith0730, 30 décembre 2009 - 04:10 .

[wwwwowwww]

k i'm officially lost in this one

[hyrulehistorian]

a canon is probably going to be necessary in the future. Dragon Age is so lore heavy.

[MorningBird]

You know, I'm aware that not many people on this forum like Fable, but I DO like how they addressed 'cannon' in Fable 2.  There method of storytelling allowed a senario where there was no cannon for Fable 1, so players of Fable 2 didn't have to live by someone else's version of events.

First off, they made Fable 2 take place 500 after the first game and burned the Hero's Guild to the ground.  This allowed Lionhead to create a world free of cannon.  This is because everything regarding the Hero of Oakvale burned with the guild, leaving only rumors and legends behind.  Some residents of Albion believed the hero to be benevolent, others evil.  It was up to the player to decide which was true.

BioWare could easily copy this method of storytelling by making the stage of Dragon Age 2 take place in a different country hundreds of years after the Blight.  Burn down an important library in a revolt in Fereldan, and you've effectively created a senario where the new hero could have been told that the last Warden to defeat the Blight was an elf.  Or a human noble.  Or a Mabari hound.

I'm not suggesting the senario would exactly play out like that, but something similar, and perhaps better executed, would certainly work towards the benifit of all without inserting cannon into anything.

Secondly, no characters in the sequal, save Theresa, had anything to do with the original game.  This stopped the player from asking too many how, what, where, when, why questions because the game, for the most part, had a completely revamped cast, and Theresa's past was left so ambiguous that it didn't conflict with the previous Fable.

I do have an inkling that we may not have seen the last of Morrigan or her 'brood'.  Even if the Warden turns down her ritual, there's nothing stopping her from having children.  I don't know how birth control works in Ferelden, but to my knowledge if she gets jiggy with someone, she stands a good chance of becoming preggers and furthering her line.

And let's say her and this child (soul of an Old God or no) do appear in the sequel.  Morrigan is so tight-lipped, I doubt she'd say anything about her time with the Wardens, especially whether or not she had relashions with one to create a god baby.  Morrigan is all about survival and secrets, so this doesn't strike me as information she would willingly part with, so once again we're left with a situation where the player can assume whatever they like.

Really, even if you're writing Dragon Age novels and comics, you don't need 'cannon' to make it work.  There's always a way around the 'details'.

[Taleroth]

Draguling wrote...

Baldurs Gate had a canon.

Yeah, the canon is that Baldur's Gate is not canon.  You find no reference to it in any WotC published product I've yet seen aside from the novelizations.  There's no mention in Drizzt novels, I've not seen official stats for any Baldur's Gate original characters, and if there's any mention in Forgotten Realms campaign settings, I've not seen it.  In fact, the canon status of Bhaal slightly conflicts with Baldur's Gate in that his essence is in a river or whatnot.

Modifié par Taleroth, 30 décembre 2009 - 05:25 .

[Draguling]

I was more referring to the link between 1 and 2, ignoring what choices were made throughout the game. I mean, you can keep Imoen as a thief, or make her a thief/warrior in 1, but she's still a thief/mage in BG2.

[AsheraII]

There should be no canon, and there is no need for canon.

1) Morrigan's story is too big for DLC, that much is true. However, it's definitely NOT too big for an expansion. Which means, whatever origin or ending you pick, it will fit.

1b) The baby does not have to know its father, and Morrigan would probably never tell it who the father is anyway.

1c) The baby is in Orlais, and will probably find more interresting places to mess around than going back to Ferelden, so any news from Ferelden will be vague at least.

2) Although your character is the player character, it is FAR from the main character of the game. The background of your PC is puny compared to Allistair's or Morrigan's background. Allistair may be referred to as the kings half-brother, information about whether he was the one to climb the throne can (and probably will) be vague. Morrigan will be the "Witch of the Wilds", but she'll be very secretive about detailed information that people have no need to know (according to her). So in history, you'll simply be another Grey Warden, helping these two characters defeat the archdemon. No personal information (like: had sex with M and L, also said to have had a relation with Z) is given or required to be given. You're just a John or Jane Doe.