59 réponses à ce sujet

[JHorwath]

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Modifié par JHorwath, 22 novembre 2009 - 02:11 .

[Kahryl]

JHorwath wrote...
Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.

The game was designed so that potion popping wins every battle

[JHorwath]

Kahryl wrote...

JHorwath wrote...
Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.

The game was designed so that potion popping wins every battle

Oh, that's just a cop out.  I think it's deeper than that.  Sure you can use potions to win every battle but then I think you missed the point.  What about using no potions to win every battle?

Has it become a potion popping game because that's the way you play it, and if so can you over come that?

Modifié par JHorwath, 22 novembre 2009 - 02:14 .

[Kahryl]

A cop out? I'm not even arguing with you. That's how the game was designed.

Sure you can use potions to win every battle but then I think you
missed the point.  What about using no potions to win every battle?

What if the game was so easy the only way to get a challenge was to play it with my toes.

Then when someone says "this game is too easy", you can say "no it isn't, you just have to realize that it was designed for you to play with your toes".

Modifié par Kahryl, 22 novembre 2009 - 02:15 .

[Shannara13]

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Get the Hardcore Mod

http://social.bioware.com/project/493/

On Nightmare difficulty you can't use potions at all.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

I don't understand all the negativity about having to use healing items. You won't win fights just by popping potions, because at the end of the day you can only pop them so fast so if you don't make use of stuns and Crowd control you'll die instantly on harder difficulties.

[Skellimancer]

If they stopped enemies from scaling with the player then that would cut down on intense potion chugging.



Playing without a healer is like a drinking contest that never ends.

[F-C]

JHorwath wrote...

Kahryl wrote...

JHorwath wrote...
Chances
are your not going to get through without using potions until you start
to learn and accept the way the game was designed.

The game was designed so that potion popping wins every battle

Oh, that's just a cop out.

oh dont take anything he says seriously. ive never seen him say a positive thing about this game, ever. he obviously loves the game because on the forums everyday, yet all he ever does is say its bad because of blah blah blah. sad little king of a sad little hill.

Modifié par F-C, 22 novembre 2009 - 02:15 .

[JHorwath]

Skellimancer wrote...

If they stopped enemies from scaling with the player then that would cut down on intense potion chugging.

Playing without a healer is like a drinking contest that never ends.

Ya, you would need a healer to do(maybe not?) this, I guess.  Unless, your really good.  However, keep in mind I'm talking about mana potions as well.

Modifié par JHorwath, 22 novembre 2009 - 02:20 .

[Jordi B]

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Would you care to enlighten us about how the game was designed, so that we may all stop our drinking habits?

[Skellimancer]

Jordi B wrote...

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Would you care to enlighten us about how the game was designed, so that we may all stop our drinking habits?

Slider down to easy or abuse AI, probably.

[Nighteye2]

Not using potions is not always an option. For example, if because of your story choices (being a bit vague to avoid spoilers) Morrigan is your only mage, you will find that doing what she asks of you is pretty much impossible without using at least a few potions...

[Niten Ryu]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

I don't understand all the negativity about having to use healing items. You won't win fights just by popping potions, because at the end of the day you can only pop them so fast so if you don't make use of stuns and Crowd control you'll die instantly on harder difficulties.

Not true since potions have unique cooldowns. It means you can glup lesser potion, normal potion and greater potion and potent potion and then start all over again. There ain't encounter in game that would deal damage so fast on four party members (no matter what difficulty).

[Shannara13]

Skellimancer wrote...

Jordi B wrote...

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Would you care to enlighten us about how the game was designed, so that we may all stop our drinking habits?

Slider down to easy or abuse AI, probably.

Sure if you think anything other than rushing head long into an ambush is abusing AI.

[Nighteye2]

Skellimancer wrote...

Jordi B wrote...

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Would you care to enlighten us about how the game was designed, so that we may all stop our drinking habits?

Slider down to easy or abuse AI, probably.

No, more likely just using a mage with healing spells. 1 mage with heal and regenerate can save a LOT of potions.

[Skellimancer]

Shannara13 wrote...

Skellimancer wrote...

Jordi B wrote...

JHorwath wrote...

I think it's something more.  Yes, potions are always there but there are definitely ways to play beyond the old stigma of potion popping.  Chances are your not going to get through without using potions until you start to learn and accept the way the game was designed.  Once that happens you can start to see the beauty in the game.  Currently, I feel if I had to use a potion, even just one, then I screwed up.

I relegate the successfulness of my character build and party combination relevant to how many potions I have to use.

Would you care to enlighten us about how the game was designed, so that we may all stop our drinking habits?

Slider down to easy or abuse AI, probably.

Sure if you think anything other than rushing head long into an ambush is abusing AI.

So? just bottleneck the enemies? have a healer or two? AW/BM? kiting? DLC gear? divine intervention? hint?

[kroosaydur]

in my experience with the game so far i have found it impossible to win most fights without some sort of potions. i either need a crap load of health pots so i don't die or i need a crap load of mana pots so my healer can heal so i don't die.

[F-C]

skellimancer starts posting and :

[deathwing200]

Potions are necessary because Bio didn't want having a dedicated healer to be a requirement, since some people don't enjoy that particular playstyle.

[Deflagratio]

Nothing wrong with using healing items. Mana potions or otherwise. Look at how the price scales. You can make almost unlimited First tier Mana and health potions. But at the end of the game, the cooldown versus cost of spells/enemy damage isn't sufficient for them to sustain you in a large battle (IE High Dragon on Nightmare) The Second tier are just cheap enough to still use, and still have some sovereigns left for new trousers at the end of the day. And even then however, there are ways where even potions won't save you (Scattershot spam comes to mind, as well as good old fashioned Grab and bash resist) The only way you'll get through the game without a healer on Nightmare at least, is to stock enough of the Tier Two and Three potions (Health) to constantly sustain yourself. The crafting agents for the tier Three and Four are expensive as all hell. If you plan to be a potion popper, don't plan on having more important things like Stamina regeneration equipment (Evon the Great's Mail, the Felon's Coat, ect).



Though, I fully support Bioware if they decide to patch potions a little, I'd recomend skewing the cooldown, so Lowest tier potions have a high cooldown, while Higher tier have a lower cooldown. Increasing their value in combat, while at the same time, eliminating the ability to binge drink your way out of a slightly sticky situation. As for the game "Being Designed for potion popping to win every battle" that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Obviously it is. Basically you're saying they designed potions to heal your HP. You can just as easily say "The game was designed for Mages to win every battle" or "The game was designed for every battle to be won by scaling the difficulty down to easy". More so, the game was designed so you don't ABSOLUTELY HAVE to use a healer, but the benefits of a healer are painfully obvious. Even without a designated HEALER however, you can cut down on potion chugging with a little smart character development and equipment. Lots of Resistance equipment, and a Dexterity Defense built warrior can take anything really. If it's not an elite boss, it has a 50% hit rate tops if built correctly. And a lot of the harder Elite bosses rely on elemental attacks. Identify which it uses most, and spec your resistance against it.

[Skellimancer]

F-C wrote...

stuff

I am always open to the infinite wisdom of my fellow forumers.

[Shannara13]

kroosaydur wrote...

in my experience with the game so far i have found it impossible to win most fights without some sort of potions. i either need a crap load of health pots so i don't die or i need a crap load of mana pots so my healer can heal so i don't die.

On Normal I managed to make it through 95% of the game without a healer or using potions. The only fights I had to potion pop on were dragons.

[Skellimancer]

Deflagratio wrote...

Nothing wrong with using healing items. Mana potions or otherwise. Look at how the price scales. You can make almost unlimited First tier Mana and health potions. But at the end of the game, the cooldown versus cost of spells/enemy damage isn't sufficient for them to sustain you in a large battle (IE High Dragon on Nightmare) The Second tier are just cheap enough to still use, and still have some sovereigns left for new trousers at the end of the day. And even then however, there are ways where even potions won't save you (Scattershot spam comes to mind, as well as good old fashioned Grab and bash resist) The only way you'll get through the game without a healer on Nightmare at least, is to stock enough of the Tier Two and Three potions (Health) to constantly sustain yourself. The crafting agents for the tier Three and Four are expensive as all hell. If you plan to be a potion popper, don't plan on having more important things like Stamina regeneration equipment (Evon the Great's Mail, the Felon's Coat, ect).

Though, I fully support Bioware if they decide to patch potions a little, I'd recomend skewing the cooldown, so Lowest tier potions have a high cooldown, while Higher tier have a lower cooldown. Increasing their value in combat, while at the same time, eliminating the ability to binge drink your way out of a slightly sticky situation. As for the game "Being Designed for potion popping to win every battle" that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Obviously it is. Basically you're saying they designed potions to heal your HP. You can just as easily say "The game was designed for Mages to win every battle" or "The game was designed for every battle to be won by scaling the difficulty down to easy". More so, the game was designed so you don't ABSOLUTELY HAVE to use a healer, but the benefits of a healer are painfully obvious. Even without a designated HEALER however, you can cut down on potion chugging with a little smart character development and equipment. Lots of Resistance equipment, and a Dexterity Defense built warrior can take anything really. If it's not an elite boss, it has a 50% hit rate tops if built correctly. And a lot of the harder Elite bosses rely on elemental attacks. Identify which it uses most, and spec your resistance against it.

Nerf healing pots?

But then we would need a mage...

[Schyzm]

I think my mages have urinary tract infections.

[orpheus333]

This isn't true. My lasy game was playing as a Human Noble Sword and Shield tank. My chouce of party member was leliana, morrigan and alistair. We could get through the majority of fights without drinking one potion. Potions are not essential and with a party without a healer it becomes necessary to use stronger crowd control. Scattershot, Cone of cold, Waking Nightmare, Taunt/Disengage etc And the majority of the time potions chugging is an in efficiant way of winning any given encounter.



It is my experiance that if i had to drink too many potions i was playing poorly for that encounter. There have been times when i have potion chugged throughout a fight and lost, reloaded thought about my foes and completed the fight without any healing what so ever.



It is the same with BG2, even more so when you consider the strength of healing in bg2 compaired to PC hard mode DA:O. Anyway thats just 2ps worth. I have never felt that i have had a reliance on potions with or without a healing mage in the party. Lyrium potions durign tough battles are used alot though just so i can maintain magic superiority. I have only played with wynne and morrigan in the party once and it was my most efficiant set of characters but i felt that leliana was more useful overall. (i had her set up with bombs and archery).