658 réponses à ce sujet

[matt-bassist]

mauro2222 wrote...

Wait... why is Shepard imprisoned?

Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

They aren't canon, no. Udina is not on the council, in fact Anderson is on the council.

The novels and comics are stupid and poorly written for the most part anyway, so just ignore them.

[mauro2222]

InHarmsWay wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

Wait... why is Shepard imprisoned?

Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

Shepard turned him/herself in after the events of Arrival.

I know that, but he/she was willing to go in peace, well at least the paragon one.

[MarchWaltz]

InHarmsWay wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

Wait... why is Shepard imprisoned?

Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

Shepard turned him/herself in after the events of Arrival.

Bioware kinda screwed up. You can do arrival in the middle of ME2. The comic starts off by saying a few days after shep cleansed the batarians. The problem with that is, hackette said do whatever you have to do out here first, blah blah.

Eh, small plot hole, but yeah, I am sure they are going to assume everyone did arrival after the SM.

[mauro2222]

matt-bassist wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

Wait... why is Shepard imprisoned?

Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

They aren't canon, no. Udina is not on the council, in fact Anderson is on the council.

The novels and comics are stupid and poorly written for the most part anyway, so just ignore them.

Well... thanks That's a relief.

[rapscallioness]

mauro2222 wrote...

Wait... why is Shepard imprisoned?

Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

Well....Shepard's in trouble. Mind you, some feel that the chains are just protocol. Personally, I think Shepard is some real trouble over the deaths of 300k Batarians and the destruction of an entire star system...and the whole Cerberus thing for good measure.

How real to the game are the comics? Idk entirely how much they'll impact, or rather foreshadow the game, but it's supposed to be a bit of a prelude to ME3. And it was written by Mac Walters so....

[rapscallioness]

laecraft wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...

Angmir wrote...

rapscallioness wrote...


Wait...it was a majority of slaves?  Were they human slaves? Or mostly human?

That was never said - and never will be i presume.

It is a safe bet thought that - no - humans arent likely mayoryty of Battarian slave manpower. I actualy think that most Battarian slaves are ... other Battarians
- I mean they have this caste system long before they took it into space so it is only logical that they would have Battarian slaves too.

Ah, okay. Don't get me wrong, imo, either way it was a horrible choice to have to make. I didn't like blowing up 300k Batarians. That was a sucker punch. And an entire star system with who knows how many other life forms.

I was wondering about it because I was afraid that if it came out that the majority of deaths were human, that would be more fuel on the fire as far as earth was concerned.

Here's from the entry about Aratoht:

Species: Batarian
Population: Estimated 90,000 (free), 215,000 (other)

It's possible that they don't consider slaves "species" or just don't bother list them all, but that's what we know.

Thank you

[MarchWaltz]

 Actually, the novels are cannon. Udina became the counciler in the third book, when they fired anderson for being black awesome.

[Angmir]

laecraft wrote...


Nothing's "wrong" with slavery, per see. The asari do it, too. But they don't kidnap humans or other species to make them slaves. Batarians do. Let's not speak about the universe in general, and concentrate on batarians.

And you have to take into consideration that the species who thinks it's normal to pillage, kidnap, and subdue people of other species into slavery, are not exactly on the same level of civilization as the rest of the galaxy. And you should expect them to act accordingly, and treat them accordingly.

I don't think people on Mindoir would agree with your view of modern slavery and a policy non-interference. I think they'd rather choose to restrict their freedoms in the way they desire, instead of being murdered, tortured, traumatized, and violated into submission.

My Colonist Shepard doesn't like you.

When did I ever stated that I support slavery ?? 
I actualy said I consider our current goverment to be too much restrictive

I only said it is bad  to impose your own believes upon others.

It is only natural to defend yourslef so should Battarians cross the line they should be punished acordingly.
Their internal affeirs are they own problem through.
Plus I dont think that Hegemony oficialy allow pirat raids and pilaging unconditionaly. This Battarians who do this are just privatiers (and not only Battarians capture claves other races do this too). They are not supported by goverment but just threated leaniently, Hegemony pretends nothing happened.

We can imagine that Hegemony isnt actualy the best example of Battarian rulers - in human hisotry there where times when worse poeple Ruled the world. I imagine that normaly Battarians would not allow pillaging and enslaving innocent folks, there would be regulation liek for exampole you could enslave the enemy you declared war at, and prisoners should be treated with relative care (like in 1700s on Earth).

Piracy is Piracy no mather how you look on it. if there is a market for slave labor  there are the people who supply that demand. be them Battarians or otherwise.

[Sajuro]

InHarmsWay wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

I don't see where all the love for Vega is coming from (other than he provoked a fight with some Batarians and then murdered them all for fun) but he just seems like an **** who lacks any self control (ripping the TV out instead of ignoring it, or even just putting his cards on the table and leaving) I was neutral on Vega, but this comic has made me dislike him, I hope ME3 redeems him, but if he continues to act like this I will be able to relate to him less than I was able to relate to Kaiden on my first playthrough.

I think we're reading two different comics. He did not in any way provok a fight. He destroyed a tv giving the news. Annoying, more so to the bartender, but he didn't say "**** every batarian hahaha". The batarian immediately took offense to him shutting off the tv, and Vega then says let's just get back to the card game. It was the batarian that completely loses it and attacks him with knives. The man was unarmed.

Do you expect him to stand there and take those knives in his chest, sir? He defended himself and killed the people who not only attacked him first but tried to kill him. This man was calm while defending himself. He even leaves the bar taking the fight with him which shows that he cared about collateral damage.

Might I suggest, sir, that you read the comic as you have seemed to have read something else.

I read the comic, but the destruction of the TV was the provocation for the fight in the comic more than Vega dismissing them like he did. My point was that Vega unprofessional in his handling of his dislike for the news, which I felt was much more than  fair to Shepard since it kept saying 'allegedly' and 'so called terrorist acts'
Besides, even after he ripped the tv off the wall and called it BS (even though Shepard did blow up that system) he could have said that something else than "lets all just get back to the game" acting like he didn't just rip the TV off the wall, I am prone to take the side of the Batarians because if the roles were reversed ( a batarian destroying a relay to stop the Reapers) Humans both in the game and on BSN would be screaming for blood and about how all Batarians are evil.

Edit: I'm pretty sure him leaving the bar was entirely coincidental since the only way he did it was by smashing through the balcony railings. Really if it was anyone other than Anderson, I wouldn't be surprised if Vega was court martialed since Kai Leng was thrown in jail for killing a Krogan when he was drunk and James murded about 6-7 Batarians.

Modifié par Sajuro, 18 septembre 2011 - 02:15 .

[Angmir]

mauro2222 wrote...


Another question. The comics and novels are supposed to be real?, I mean, they are supposed to have happened?

The comics are jsut as real and canon as enything else in the universe.
In Me games there is no canon but universe still needs to be consistent so it is only antural that iutside of your game there is a "default" course of events - and yes Udina beeing a Councilor is a fine example of how it works.

As much as some people like it or not there is default ME universe and some things about it might actualy not be to your liking. Some people recent actions of Arrival DLC but them did happen ! No point denying them.

[IndigoWolfe]

@Sajuro

I doubt he killed them. Incapacitated them and beat them bloody, yes, but I don't think he killed them.

[Sajuro]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

@Sajuro

I doubt he killed them. Incapacitated them and beat them bloody, yes, but I don't think he killed them.

at least 2, you know the guy who has a knife sticking out of his chest and the one he tackled from the balcony where you can see the puddle of blood where his head should be in the panel after that.

[IndigoWolfe]

Sajuro wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

@Sajuro

I doubt he killed them. Incapacitated them and beat them bloody, yes, but I don't think he killed them.

at least 2, you know the guy who has a knife sticking out of his chest and the one he tackled from the balcony where you can see the puddle of blood where his head should be in the panel after that.

I went over the fight pages and I could find any one where a batarian had a knife in his chest. Vega disarms the batarian with the knife and that's the last we see of it. And the blood, I expect, came from the batarian who got head-butted in the face.

[rapscallioness]

Angmir wrote...

laecraft wrote...

The Hegemony would be an exception. :happy: I think their govenment is in perfect harmony with their terrorists. I don't even think there's any difference between them. We're speaking of the species who considers slavery a part of their culture, and "slave grabs" from other species their rightful spoils. We're speaking of the species who was goading humanity while human colonies were disappearing, "look how humans prove themselves once again ineffective to protect their own colonies!" they were practically asking for conflict, their officials. I don't think they even consider acts of terrorism as something morally questionable. But they know the Council does, and humanity does, so they use this in their demands.

In that comic, they don't even look particularly offended. They just think they deserve retribution, and they try to take it where they can. They try to kill that human, they fail. It's the way they live. They treat other species this way, and they expect nothing less in return.

What is so strange about slavery beeing a part of culture and way of life ?? It was quite common a 100 years back in our reality, and some countries still maintain it to some degree.
Look on Indian society - it is not amybe the same as slavery but the lowest castes still bear much semblence of slavery.

From modern day ethincs it seams wrong to enslave anybody, but our current ethics are relative - if history took a difrent path we could still have it nowadays - maybe they would be treated better with overal lifestandards rising but still.

Hell, from some perspective even now we all are slaves anyway. We are allowed some freedom but only allong some very narrow list of possibilities, we are not allowed to do as we want - just given some bigger room of options than 1800s slaves.
If some alien culture would confront us in the future they mind consider our society to be allmost as freedom-limiting and unethical as we consider Battarian's

Well that might be a little to philosophical statement for this thread but I do belive we peole have no right to impose our way of thinking upon anybody. There is no prove that our way of thinking is superior to anybodys. So let us stick with wat we belive and let them choose their own ways as long as they do not threaten our freedom and wellbeeing.

Well, my thing is that the Batarians are known for attacking other species as well as their own and putting them in slavery. So, their cultural beliefs are infringing on my cultural beliefs, and quite frankly my personal freedoms.

When it comes to slavery and the fact that individual has no rights because they kidnapped you. They can rape, steal from you and murder you with no worries of consequences. I have a problem with that. And I think ppl that are enslaved by the Batarians have a problem with that, too.

Should we impose our life views on others? No. We've had way too many wars trying to do that very thing. However, sometimes you gotta call Bull sh*t!

We've got religious beliefs and cults that feel like it's their right to have relations with young girls. Children. That's not okay. I don't care in situations like that if it's their life view and is acceptable to them. I'm gonna call Bull Sh*t!

Btw, yes, we are all slaves. we've been royally hoodood. Unfortunately, imo, it's mostly our own fault. Alt of ppl aren't reading; aren't informing themselves; aren't aware of both sides; don't pull back the curtain to check out what's really going on w/ the Wizard. We are mindgamed up  the wazoo.

On the one hand, I undertsand. Ppl are tired at the end of the day. Providing food and shelter is not as easy as it looks.

On the other hand, I worry for us. If we can't get out from under this, as a species--as a world--then we will never get to fulfill all the amazing things we really are.

Ah, but that's neither here nor there. Not here. Let's talk about those Batarians.

[rapscallioness]

Question everyone:

Are we sure that Vega was angry because they were bad mouthing Shepard? How do we really know that's what set him off? Maybe he doesn't like Shep for whatever reason and it was grating him that the name kept coming up.

Or maybe something about the Alliance and the Council. Perhaps he went thru some stuff w. them himself.

I mean, we really don't have any evidence that Vega is indeed a Shepard lover. There was a news story on abt Arrival, et al, and he got irate, but why exactly--we don't know

[Sajuro]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

@Sajuro

I doubt he killed them. Incapacitated them and beat them bloody, yes, but I don't think he killed them.

at least 2, you know the guy who has a knife sticking out of his chest and the one he tackled from the balcony where you can see the puddle of blood where his head should be in the panel after that.

I went over the fight pages and I could find any one where a batarian had a knife in his chest. Vega disarms the batarian with the knife and that's the last we see of it. And the blood, I expect, came from the batarian who got head-butted in the face.

Knife in chest: page 3, panel 6: That Batarian also has blood running from his mouth which indicate an internal wound, the chest wound is bleeding heavily despite the knife and TV, the tv, if I may add, is also pinned to the Batarian's chest by the knife, it isn't just a flesh wound.
For Batarian that went through glass: Look at Vega's arm, it got cut up along with a head wound, and Vega went through the glass second, think about the Batarian whose head went through the glass before James did, besides that is a ot of blood just for getting head butted.

[Labrev]

 So, how did Anderson get the Normandy back anyway?

[rapscallioness]

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

 So, how did Anderson get the Normandy back anyway?

According to a tweet from Mac Walters in response to didymos--it's a ME3 mystery...<_<

[didymos1120]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

I went over the fight pages and I could find any one where a batarian had a knife in his chest. Vega disarms the batarian with the knife and that's the last we see of it. And the blood, I expect, came from the batarian who got head-butted in the face.

You must be blind:



I'm sure he's just taking a nap, though, and that knife is like his teddy bear.

[didymos1120]

laecraft wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

I'm sure he's just taking a nap, though, and that knife is like his teddy bear.

If you attack someone with a knife, be prepared to be impaled on your own weapon.

Perfect poetic justice.

OK, whatever.  The point was simply that the guy died.  I made zero comment on whether or not he deserved it.

[1136342t54_]

laecraft wrote...
snip

So basically beating or killing someone means the winner is right in the debate?
That is twisted logic and has no place in a civilized society. Both groups were wrong end of story.

[rapscallioness]

Vega was clearly defending himself. The Batarians took it to the next level in this one situation. Vega tried to resume the card game....if some thugs jump you and try to kill you, I hope you fight for your life.

They assumed he was a Shepard lover, and took it from there. Even when Vega said let's just play cards. I don't understand faulting him for defending himself. He didn't go after them. He went after that tv..lol. But then he even paid for that plus with his winnings...