42 réponses à ce sujet

[Thor Rand Al]

Hopes:  Protaganists with a VO.  Keep the conversation wheel with the diplo, snarky and aggressive options (giving the protagonist an attitude so to speak). 
Definitely more emotional family encounters like in DA2.  Heck having and seeing emotions n reactions lol.

N just because I have to add this, a boob slider for those that like either big or small boobs, not one size fits all  lmaooooo 

Fears: Going back to a silent protaganist like the Warden.
Don't have much for fears, biggest one I already mentioned. 

Love the direction Hawke went as far as emotion's, the wheel, the attitude.  A big difference between the Warden and Hawke, Hawke was more alive in some areas.

[DPSSOC]

highcastle wrote...
I've been hearing quite a bit from both the fans and the devs about the lack of player agency in DA2 compared to DAO. And while I understand the desire for choices that matter, I have to say, I'm really worried the devs will listen too much to those clamoring for more player agency. Here's the thing: choice is good. Choice at the expense of character development or story points is not.

What does that mean? Well, in DA2, we had several pivotal, emotional moments that Hawke couldn't prevent. The end of All That Remains, for one thing. I've heard several players proclaim they wished they could save Leandra. While I understand that desire, I think presenting us with that option would have been a big mistake. Losing his mother provides Hawke with a potential turning point. He can let his grief consume him, becoming self-destructive and aggressive. If he was previously a mage supporter, he has a compelling--if somewhat selfish--motive for turning against them. He can vow never to let something like that happen again and become an even more determined--if eventually tragic--hero. Heady stuff. Lots of fodder for roleplaying, which is rather the point of an RPG.

I don't mind player agency being taken away in certain circumstances (reinforcing the powerlessness of the character/player), but I think most people just want the choices we are given to matter, at least within their own context.  Clearest example is Best Served Cold, no matter how you handle the situation in Act of Mercy this quest plays out exactly the same.  Heck regardless of how you handle the situation Act of Mercy plays out exactly the same too (Mages end up in the Circle +/- one bad Templar, blame you).  If I'm given the choice to risk my life to help a character that should carry through to future interactions.  If I choose to be a complete dick and get that character thrown in prison, same deal.

highcastle wrote...
The other choices I don't want to see are those that undermine what could be a compelling story. For instance, DAO's most intriguing ending in my opinion was the Dark Ritual. But because it is not and won't be canonized, there's little to no chance that the Old God Baby will ever play a significant role in the franchise. Why? Because for some segments of the player base, he doesn't exist. And that's a shame, because like the Dark Ritual or hate it, it's still a compelling plot point. It's heavily tied to the game's lore, has strong overtones of the Arthur/Morganna/Mordred legend, and now we'll likely never get to see the OGB as more than a cameo. Imagine if DA2 had ended with an option for averting the templar/mage war. Then we'd never see the ramifications of that fallout.

I wouldn't be too worried about this.  You can import a playthrough where Leliana, Justice and Anders are all dead and they still show up right as rain for DA2.  If the devs decide they want the OGB to happen it's going to happen.

[Foolsfolly]

This long post is almost a reply to highcastle's post from the last page. Almost. It deals with player agency but not in comparison to DA:O.

I hope the next game takes choices and makes them more invisible. I feel too many choices are easily classified as Good and Evil. This is the Right Path and this is the Wrong Path. These things are unavoidable (or at least I will continue to think so until I can think of a way to make an action-RPG without good or evil choices ever cropping up, something I believe impossible). But it would be nice if there were some cases where the game realizes your choices.

And this would mean being less linear. Miss a conversation with an NPC, then this event happens differently. Take a secret path then all the guards are alive when you cause that explosion. Leave this guy alive not only does that guy continue to impact the story but the fact that he was spared also affects other NPCs, hopefully a few in unexpected ways. The same is true if you kill that guy instead.

Stealth should return for this purpose as well. Being able to sneak through an area or sabotage some choke point or not would show player's choice mattering. This generally would call for more open maps, not sandbox maps but open with multiple paths to victory and multiple points of entry. Storm the gate, climb the wall, sneak through the celler, or just bribe the rent-a-cops guarding the place. Your choice and reactions based on those choices.

Murder Knife often? When you go meet an NPC to discuss Import Plot-y Stuff that NPC does not show and instead has armed guards waiting in ambush for you. Play diplomatic and pragmatic? The person shows up, trusting that this isn't a trap. You're a flippant devil-may-care smart-ass? The NPC sends you through the official bureaucracy since you're not a threat nor trustworthy... just another person wanting their time and undeserving of it.

Or any mix depending on that NPC's character traits. Maybe that person likes dealing personally with funny people they can share a drink with?

These things would help. It would give player agency, help underscore the current personality system, and add to replayability.

Modifié par Foolsfolly, 20 septembre 2011 - 08:44 .

[BlueMew]

Hopes:
- a completely new hero
- and new NPCs, well, maybe except for Varric living a story of his oen instead of just telling it?
- plenty of dialogue again (if DA is the spiritual successor of the BG series, I trust it won't become a hack 'n slashfest)

Fears:
- canonization (i.e. 'Alistair is King', 'Anders was killed', 'Hawke is a male blood mage', 'Falling Rocks killed the Warden' etc. despite the choices you've made)
- lack of character customization
- sky high requirements that prevent me from actually playing the game

[Sith Grey Warden]

Hopes:

Silent protagonist. Barring that: a greatly improved dialogue wheel (something along the lines of Deus Ex:HR).

A coherent and consistent story

Strategic gameplay

An ending

Fears:

DA2:2 (Like how the developers said they didn't want to make DAO2)

[narokk]

hopes:

Cullen as a party member, i think he has an internal conflict about the best way to approach the mage/templar situation in thedas, this is evident if you encourage him to work out a peaceful solution during enemies among us. would be nice to have an opportunity to work with some Templars for a more positive peaceful solution.

more companion dialogue - more akin to origins in which you have a number of conversations to go through to find out more about your companions.

Evolving appearances for companions and important NPC's, companion wise, it could have been cool, if as you acquired armor upgrades for companions their armors appearance changed to reflect that.

Fears:

continually recycled environments, this really did not work well.

even less use of elves/dorfs.

[Everwarden]

 Hopes: 
-A return to the Origins art style.
-Moral depth.
-A good story.
-Good companions.

Fears:
-I fear that Bioware is now in a bubble that they have created where they think they are incapable of making mistakes. They blame the fans for Dragon Age 2's failures, and that's ridiculous.
-More Dragon Age 2 narrative style. It might have worked if they had implemented it better, but apparently EA cracked the whip and rushed them forward. Don't try something risky like a new art style or a new narrative technique unless you have the time to do it right. 

[Nayt Navare]

HOPES-

I want the Warden back. If they were done with their story (which I doubt, seeing how the Warden is "missing") then they should not have left it open. I love Bioware, but the whole MISSING crap is bull. Revan/Warden/Hawke- time for Bioware to capitalize on the way they tell their stories, or finish one.

Rogue kossith female LI. Eff. Yeah. Is it weird I'm totally in love with the female qunari concept art?

WORKING FLAGS. Everytime I talk to Leliana, and she doesn't remember loving the Warden or being with ISabela because I picked the wrong DLC end save file is dumb. (rage over)

FEARS-

Too many buff moves/not enough combat movies. Why have a new, more interactive interface with so few moves you can do? Otherwise, I'm just sitting there, pressing A...

More to come, haha.

[jamesp81]

I wouldn't mind seeing morale effects implemented that affected the enemy's behavior.

A rogue, for example, wouldn't inspire much fear because he doesn't look threatening. That, of course, gives him time to do something unpleasant that the enemy never sees coming.

On the other hand, a 2 handed warrior with reaver and berserker specialization should make enemies ****** themselves and run away screaming.

[Arthur Cousland]

Hopes: that DA3 is the best game in the series yet. There are other good rpgs coming out soon, so I'll be plenty occupied while Bioware spends their time achieving perfection with DA3.

Fears: that DA3 shows obvious signs of rush, just like DA2 and Awakening. Plenty of good franchises are 3-5 years in between installments and do well. Why must a new DA game be released every 2 years, full of bugs and cut content just to get the game out by said deadline? Perfection takes time.

[Heimdall]

Hopes:

The return of Origin stories, a Qunari (Or possibly Tal Vashoth) option please
Massive scale and many travels
Resolution of Hawke and the Warden's fate (Should DLC not handle it, I don't expect a return of the Warden nor do I want him to, I like having a new protagonist every game)
Polishing and improving DA2's combat

Fears:

Trapped in a single location all game
Recycled environments
Rushed DA3
And... that's it, I liked DA2 and hope they keep certain things, but there is PLENTY of room for improvement.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 22 septembre 2011 - 10:49 .

[teenparty]

I would like it if the Warden died under mysterious circumstances just prior to DA3 and the new hero had to find out why he/she died.

The warden have got to be one of the most powerful individuals in the Dragon Age universe and therefore needs to be killed off if their stories are finished. It wouldn't make sense for the warden to spend the rest of his/her life having tea with Alistair in Denerim.

[DPSSOC]

Missed a hope

Alternate race protagonist.  Either in the form of offering the player multiple races that can be played (DA:O) or simply making the character not human.  There are mountains of games that force you into playing a human protagonist I can't think of any that make you be a dwarf (and if you know some please share).

[Foolsfolly]

Build your protagonist's body. Instead of a one size fits all body you have sliders to build your own body. No more Mages who are as buff as warriors.

[Ninjaspoon]

highcastle wrote...

I've been hearing quite a bit from both the fans and the devs about the lack of player agency in DA2 compared to DAO. And while I understand the desire for choices that matter, I have to say, I'm really worried the devs will listen too much to those clamoring for more player agency. Here's the thing: choice is good. Choice at the expense of character development or story points is not.

What does that mean? Well, in DA2, we had several pivotal, emotional moments that Hawke couldn't prevent. The end of All That Remains, for one thing. I've heard several players proclaim they wished they could save Leandra. While I understand that desire, I think presenting us with that option would have been a big mistake. Losing his mother provides Hawke with a potential turning point. He can let his grief consume him, becoming self-destructive and aggressive. If he was previously a mage supporter, he has a compelling--if somewhat selfish--motive for turning against them. He can vow never to let something like that happen again and become an even more determined--if eventually tragic--hero. Heady stuff. Lots of fodder for roleplaying, which is rather the point of an RPG.

Those types of moments were largely lacking in DAO, and I fear that if the devs listen to certain elements of the fan base, we may be heading back down that route. The closest choice I can think of is the Redcliffe quest, where the Warden has the choice to sacrifice Isolde, Connor, or nobody. It's not much of a choice at all, because there's an "everybody wins" button attached to it. It had the potential to be a very moving moment, in which the Warden realizes he can't save everybody, that some choices have no right answer. But in giving us the option to keep both parties alive, the decision is made null. That type of choice is no choice at all because there's an easy answer. I don't want to see that return in DA3.

The other choices I don't want to see are those that undermine what could be a compelling story. For instance, DAO's most intriguing ending in my opinion was the Dark Ritual. But because it is not and won't be canonized, there's little to no chance that the Old God Baby will ever play a significant role in the franchise. Why? Because for some segments of the player base, he doesn't exist. And that's a shame, because like the Dark Ritual or hate it, it's still a compelling plot point. It's heavily tied to the game's lore, has strong overtones of the Arthur/Morganna/Mordred legend, and now we'll likely never get to see the OGB as more than a cameo. Imagine if DA2 had ended with an option for averting the templar/mage war. Then we'd never see the ramifications of that fallout.

I'm not advocating a lack of choice completely. I'd like to see things like alternative paths for completing quests return. In DAO, the stealth mechanic and persuasion abilities made this possible. It looks like stealth is returning in Mark of the Assassin, so that adds additional choices for how you want to finish quests as well as replayability value for those of us who like to do multiple playthroughs. I'd also like to see greater consequences for sidequests. In DA2, completing Magistrate's Orders by killing Kelder results in the magistrate swearing vengeance upon you. But this never happens. The devs could make this choice more meaningful by throwing in an encounter later in the game.

Basically what I'm saying is this: I'd like to see more consequences for smaller choices, but I'd like the devs to continue DA2's tradition of including meaningful, fixed points that tell a stronger, more cohesive story. I'm afraid the devs will listen to the vocal members of the fanbase who want the player to have absolute free rein in the DA universe. I understand the appeal of open world or sandbox games, but I prefer DA2's tighter narrative.

Excellent post Highcastle, couldn't agree more with you

[Cobra's_back]

Hopes: More maps with new environments.
A good story with interesting characters that can actually develop during the story.
Love to see Varric in it.
An ending that provides more details like Dragon Age Origins

FEARS: Silly characters like Anders.
Stupid ending that leave you wondering what was that all about.

[Gervaise]

Hopes: Companions and NPCs who make decisions/take actions that are consistent with what has gone before and make sense to you - not shoe honed into a situation which makes no logical sense - think Orsino and the mage ending.
If endings are meant to be alternative then make them clearly so and in keeping with decisions you take and the world you inhabit - so no blood mages changing sides at the last minute and becoming Vicount with Templars bowing the knee to them - it just would not happen.
Make important information part of the main game, not DLC (Sister Nightingale should have been in the main game)
Able to play different races again.
Have a greater choice of specialisations again - so if have objections to a certain type, like blood mage, you are not left with no choice at all.
Have dialogue prompts that match the end result.
Have dialogue prompts that don't make you cringe or just don't match your sentiments but if you don't select them you cannot advance a relationship in a particular way - thinking of Anders' friendmance dialogue after he nearly kills Ella - choice of "You're really cute when you're rebellious" (No you're bloody scary when you're rebellious) or "I did it all for you" (Throw up - no I didn't, I did it for the other mages who aren't free)
Not being required to hit on an NPC the moment you meet them, or shortly after, no matter how inappropriate you feel that would be, otherwise you lose your chance at romance.
All possible romances are part of the main game, not added on as a DLC, only become a companion half way through and then you are expected to be psychic to know that you must live like a nun the entire game for it to work.
Fears: Returning characters who end up being completely different from how you remember them.
Returning characters who end up screwing you over and then you have to kill them despite all your efforts to prevent this. (I am worried that David Gaider has hinted that the lyrium tattoos could send Fenris mad or poison him in some other way).

[Heimdall]

An addition:

Hopes:

Reformed Dialogue Wheel - I liked DA2's idea of a voiced protagonist and the icon system, but felt too bound by it. To that end, I believe the Writers should forget about the symbols and assign them to the lines only after they are written, forget about the personality system. Also, strive for very specific and clear paraphrasing.

More specializations

Fear/Hope:

In the midst of the Templar-Mage war, the Qunari invade in force and the Sixth Blight begins when Coryphius finds Razikale... and the DA3 protagonist has to stop ALL of it... That would either be incredibly awesome or hugely disappointing, though I guess it would prove the DA3 protagonist was more badass than Hawke and the Warden combined.