585 réponses à ce sujet

[LobselVith8]

I didn't like Leliana in "Faith," I found what she said deplorable, and I couldn't imagine that my pro-mage apostate Hawke would simply watch her walk away after everything she said about an Exalted March against Kirkwall. Much like Sister Petrice in "Shepherding Wolves," I felt like I was watching Hawke simply allow a dangerous antagonists to simply walk away instead of putting down an enemy.

Here's a high ranking member of the Chantry, ignoring the dictatorship that is going on in Kirkwall, either dismissing or completely ignorant of the fact that mages and templars are conspiring together to remove a despot from power, never mentioning how commoners and nobles will rally around Hawke if he publicly condemns Meredith's dictatorship, and Leliana is talking about an Exalted March against the city-state instead of simply removing the problem that has caused so much unrest among so many groups of people.

Leliana has no problem providing her name, her history with The Warden, her purpose in Kirkwall, or addressing a potential Exalted March against Kirkwall, so why does she seem ignorant about why there's unrest in Kirkwall if she explicitly states that's why she's in the city-state? When Meredith is causing so much dissent among the people, why doesn't Leliana actually do something about the situation? If Leliana is representing the Divine and she was sent to investigate the situation in Kirkwall, why doesn't she once mention the actual problem that the narrative makes clear is causing so much trouble for both mages and templars: Knight-Commander Meredith... the self-appointed ruler of the city-state of Kirkwall? Is an Exalted March preferrable to simply replacing Meredith, especially if the Champion is one of the people speaking out against her draconian rule?

This isn't a character who I want to see again, and I think Hawke should have had the option of killing Sister Nightingale in "Faith" instead of doing nothing about someone I view as a dangerous antagonist.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I wonder how faith plays out if you kill her in origins..

[Monica21]

Nope, didn't want to kill her, and think it would be kind of a career-ender for Hawke to do so, knowing she's there at the Divine's instruction.

Reno_Tarshil wrote...

I wonder how faith plays out if you kill her in origins..

She still shows up.

[whykikyouwhy]

If Hawke had dealt the killing blow to as many high-ranking members of Thedas society/government as you would have liked, DA2 would have played out like a prison movie. Or would have been a quick cutscene to Hawke's execution. Which I'm sure several people would have loved to see.

To answer your thread's question though...no. I had no desire to kill Sister Nightingale. I was happy to see her. And I'll be happy to see how her role in the DA story unfolds.

[TEWR]

No, but I think that if Bioware wanted her to not sound anti-mage they should've done a better job with her dialogue, as that's how it came off.

[mesmerizedish]

If by "kill" you mean "donner une petite morte," then yes.

[whykikyouwhy]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

If by "kill" you mean "donner une petite morte," then yes.

Well, now I want to rant about the fact that Bioware didn't include that scene. I feel cheated!!! Wronged!!!

[Dave of Canada]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

If Hawke had dealt the killing blow to as many high-ranking members of Thedas society/government as you would have liked, DA2 would have played out like a prison movie.

A few people wish to extend the protagonist's plot armor to it's fullest extent and hopes they can do everything they can without consequence.

[Lenimph]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

If by "kill" you mean "donner une petite morte," then yes.

Well, now I want to rant about the fact that Bioware didn't include that scene. I feel cheated!!! Wronged!!!

  I think I feel a fanfic idea uprising inside of me...

[TJPags]

Nope, didn't want to kill her at all.

She was there to investigate.  She didn't condemn at all.  She provided her observations.  You disagree with them, which is fine.  And guess what?  YOU GET TO INFLUENCE HER.

She states that the Divine is considering an Exalted March, and she was there to provide her recommendation.  She says she's in favor of it, or leaning toward it, or something similar.  Yes when she walked away from my Hawke, I'd convinced her not to do it, and SHE AGREED.
As others have said, how stupid would it be to kill her?  She's sent by the Divine, who is already considering wiping the city off the map.  You want to kill her?  Do you realize what a guarantee that would be to destroy Kirkwall?  The Divine's best agent, assassin, bard, smart, well-experienced at this, killed in the City you think may be beyond saving?  Killed in the Chantry?  Come on.  You just signed the death warrant for that hellhole.  Which is fine with me, but some of you seem to think it's worth saving.
Seriously, this is getting nuts.  Kill Elthinna.  Kill Meredith.  Kill Leliana.  Kill Orsino.  Is there a single person in authority in Kirkwall that you DON'T want to kill?

[TEWR]

Filament wrote...

That's how it came off to a few very persistent posters on this topic, anyway.

It definitely could've been worded better though to ensure no one thinks that.

Personally, it comes off as anti-mage to me, but I won't call Leliana anti-mage just yet.

[whykikyouwhy]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Filament wrote...

That's how it came off to a few very persistent posters on this topic, anyway.

It definitely could've been worded better though to ensure no one thinks that.

Personally, it comes off as anti-mage to me, but I won't call Leliana anti-mage just yet.

Now see, I heard anti-extremist, not anti-mage. Extreme measures are bad, not the desire for change. That was my take.

[TEWR]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Filament wrote...

That's how it came off to a few very persistent posters on this topic, anyway.

It definitely could've been worded better though to ensure no one thinks that.

Personally, it comes off as anti-mage to me, but I won't call Leliana anti-mage just yet.

Now see, I heard anti-extremist, not anti-mage. Extreme measures are bad, not the desire for change. That was my take.

Her line "If Kirkwall falls to magic" came off as anti-mage in general. Had she specified "If Kirkwall falls to the magic of the Resolutionists", I'd agree that she was anti-extremist.

However, like I said I'm not going to call Leliana anti-mage just yet. Just her dialogue.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 22 septembre 2011 - 01:22 .

[TJPags]

Come on, she's a high ranking agent for the Divine for crying out loud.

Do you really expect her to run around proclaiming, "FREEDOM FOR MAGES!!!!! FIGHT, KILL, REVOLUTION NOW!!!!!!!!!!!"??????

She was investigating extremist elements in Kirkwall. And some of you may not want to admit it, but a Mage Underground is certainly something the Chantry would want to look into, and likely stop.

It makes sense that she's there, and what she says makes perfect sense given who she is.

[Zanallen]

Nope. I rather like Leliana. Nor do I see anything particularly anti-mage about her statements.

[Lenimph]

Hey OP ... was talking about this in your "Will Sister Nightingale continue to be anti-mage?" thread not enough?

And no I don't want to kill her unless it's the way Ish proposed earlier.

Modifié par Lenimph, 22 septembre 2011 - 01:40 .

[DPSSOC]

TJPags wrote...
Seriously, this is getting nuts.  Kill Elthinna.  Kill Meredith.  Kill Leliana.  Kill Orsino.  Is there a single person in authority in Kirkwall that you DON'T want to kill?

Have Viscount Dumar or Aveline been mentioned yet?

I didn't want to kill Leliana but I can understand her position.  The Chantry can't openly acknowledge that Meredith is the cause of the trouble because Meredith is just a product of the system.  To suggest that Meredith was at fault could lead peole to thinking that the system was at fault, if the system is at fault it must be changed/eliminated, that ends their sweet ride on Mage Monopoly.

[TJPags]

DPSSOC wrote...

TJPags wrote...
Seriously, this is getting nuts.  Kill Elthinna.  Kill Meredith.  Kill Leliana.  Kill Orsino.  Is there a single person in authority in Kirkwall that you DON'T want to kill?

Have Viscount Dumar or Aveline been mentioned yet?

I didn't want to kill Leliana but I can understand her position.  The Chantry can't openly acknowledge that Meredith is the cause of the trouble because Meredith is just a product of the system.  To suggest that Meredith was at fault could lead peole to thinking that the system was at fault, if the system is at fault it must be changed/eliminated, that ends their sweet ride on Mage Monopoly.

Actually, I think I have seen many people saying they wanted to kill Dumar.  Some mention Aveline as well.  And how can I forget the Arishok???

As to Leliana - I find it hard to believe the Chantry DOES think Meredith is the problem.  First, the reports they get come from . . . well, Meredith.  She's hardly going to write "Dear Divine, I'm an incompetent idiot.  Please replace me with someone less insane,  Yours, Meredith".

And that's assuming Meredith IS at fault, something I highly doubt.

But even if she is - think.  The Chantry believes mages are dangerous.  That they need to be controlled.  The Chantry, after all, was built from the rubble of a revolution against a mage-dominated empire.  The Chantry is going to look first for a mage source for problems.  And given some of what goes on in Kirkwall, they will find it.  IN fact, Leliana does indeed find it.

Yet even so, she listens to Hawke and agrees to talk the Divine out of the Exalted March.  And given that no such March occurs, the Divine listens.

[DPSSOC]

TJPags wrote...
Actually, I think I have seen many people saying they wanted to kill Dumar.  Some mention Aveline as well.  And how can I forget the Arishok???

Huh.  I could see wanting to give Dumar a good kick to the backside from time to time but people realy wanted to kill him?

TJPags wrote...
As to Leliana - I find it hard to believe the Chantry DOES think Meredith is the problem.  First, the reports they get come from . . . well, Meredith.  She's hardly going to write "Dear Divine, I'm an incompetent idiot.  Please replace me with someone less insane,  Yours, Meredith".

And that's assuming Meredith IS at fault, something I highly doubt.

But even if she is - think.  The Chantry believes mages are dangerous.  That they need to be controlled.  The Chantry, after all, was built from the rubble of a revolution against a mage-dominated empire.  The Chantry is going to look first for a mage source for problems.  And given some of what goes on in Kirkwall, they will find it.  IN fact, Leliana does indeed find it.

That too.  Didn't mean to lay it all on Meredith just saying that even if the Chantry or even just Leliana did believe that Meredith was the problem they couldn't just come out and say, "Our bad we promoted a nut job, won't happen again."  Of course where they could find someone in Kirkwall with the experience necessary for the position who isn't a nut job is beyond me, they may need to employ a Knight Commander who never has, and never will, actually set foot in Kirkwall, but all decisions must still be run by him/her.

[Sabariel]

Even if there was the option to kill her, she wouldn't stay dead anyway

[TJPags]

Sabariel wrote...

Even if there was the option to kill her, she wouldn't stay dead anyway

You can has cookies.