344 réponses à ce sujet

[Embrosil]

Someone With Mass wrote...

The Interloper wrote...

As far as I'm concerned, ME2 just needed a stance toggle. Agressive vs defensive (huddles behind cover). That way no running facefirst into a storm of fire because you're too stupid to realize that's not a good idea. So let the player tell them when it's clear to engage and when to focus on staying down.

Shouldn't even be that. Should be:

Are shields down? ---> Yes ---> Stay the **** back, numbnuts.
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V
No
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V
Attack!

But in this case we would have to have armor and shields as in ME1, not that **** we got in ME2 where shields are for laugh and armor is made of paper. Othrewise, teammates would permanently be hidden in a cover

Modifié par Embrosil, 25 septembre 2011 - 06:15 .

[Someone With Mass]

The Interloper wrote...

Well, I do think you should be able to order your men to take one for the team, if you want them too. Like if your fighting an enemy with regenerating health like the collossus and want fire output over safety.

They can't shoot back if they're knocked out. There are usually other ways to counter regeneration beyond letting the damage output be higher than the regeneration as well.

[Xeranx]

The Interloper wrote...

As far as I'm concerned, ME2 just needed a stance toggle. Agressive vs defensive (huddles behind cover). That way no running facefirst into a storm of fire because you're too stupid to realize that's not a good idea. So let the player tell them when it's clear to engage and when to focus on staying down.

I believe Mass Effect had those things.  Despite not being able to tell each individual squadmate where to go (as per Biowares primary goal with videos of the old build I've seen) you had more squad actions.  Two of which I'm sure were geared towards taking advantage of cover or maintaining the battlefield: hold position and one other.  

On Eden prime (and I think I have a screen shot of this) right after I first meet Ashley there's a number of rocks leading down to the Prothean dig site.  Directing Kaidan and Ashley to one rock formation has them spread out to take advantage of separate slabs of rock.  On the way to the tram (or is it tran) area telling them to go towards one side of cover can have them go to opposite cover positions and fire on the enemy from there.  Despite how combat worked I found that brilliant.  And they maintained those positions until the combat stopped.  Unfortunately I don't remember the other one off hand because I rarely used it, but stuff like that should have been optomized rather than removed.

[DRSH]

Gears of War 3 is awesome. Mass Effect 3 should take some lessons from it while staying true to its core formula.

[BBK4114]

 I have no problem with TPS or FPS games. They are just not for me.

The reason I play Bioware games is because they are were not about super-difficult combat but about story, character interaction, exploration, finding the best gear for my team, giving them direction on the battlefield so I could beat the enemy by playing smart, not just because I have the best reflexes- i.e. hand-eye coordination (which I don't).  

Unfortunately for me it seems I am in the minority - that the people who already have a plethora of reflex driven games are going to achieve their desire and will change the games I love.  

Makes me very sad. 

[LadyofRivendell]

If you're going to compare ME3 to a third person cover based shooter, at least compare it to Uncharted instead of GoW. Uncharted actually has good characters, great writing, and a fun story.

That being said, I found nothing wrong with the AI in ME1 or 2. If you're really being picky, maybe they could add something similar to DA:O with behavior tactics (i.e. Aggressive, they instantly attack, ranged, they stay back, passive, they wait for you to attack first, etc).

[AtreiyaN7]

gammameggon wrote...

You never played Arena? Wow...check it out sometime.

However, I disagree with your assertion. I'm rather stunned, too. You, more than most, should by now have recognized the reality that having certain NPC's, and more importantly, corresponding quests obtained from NPC's at particular times such as at night or what have you...or unique events occurring...creates a whole different and literal in-game dimension to exploration. This is perceived, logically, by many to be a significant aspect, for the aforementioned reasons.

As for your petty insult...ha. Whatever .

Unfortunately, Arena never really appealed to me at the time. In my opinion, while I enjoy day-night cycles and weather in sandbox games a la Bethesda, I think that the quests at specific times, etc. weren't terribly interesting  (except for vampire-related stuff and a few other things). For me, they didn't add terribly much to the game overall. If you want the day-night cycle to have meaning, fine, have a quest where an herbalist must gather a night-blooming cereus or some such for a potion, etc.

It's something that's reasonably enjoyable in a sandbox game, but what we have in the ME series is not a sandbox-style RPG. I'm sure that such an addition could/would add some flavor, and I actually advocated for a similar day-night cycle suggestion in a different thread because I like the idea; however, the devs need to focus on polishing things that were not done well in the past game(s) - like the ongoing issue with poor squad AI - not attempting to shoehorn in a day-night cycle just because someone finds the action part of the aRPG equation intolerable.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 25 septembre 2011 - 09:12 .

[Vertigo_1]

LadyofRivendell wrote...

If you're going to compare ME3 to a third person cover based shooter, at least compare it to Uncharted instead of GoW. Uncharted actually has good characters, great writing, and a fun story.

True, although I would say Gears 3 is much better story-wise than the first two combined IMO.

[didymos1120]

BBK4114 wrote...

Unfortunately for me it seems I am in the minority - that the people who already have a plethora of reflex driven games are going to achieve their desire and will change the games I love.  

Makes me very sad.

Then just play on Casual.  That's what it's for: people who don't do well with and/or don't like the combat.

[Soul Cool]

BBK4114 wrote...

 I have no problem with TPS or FPS games. They are just not for me.

The reason I play Bioware games is because they are were not about super-difficult combat but about story, character interaction, exploration, finding the best gear for my team, giving them direction on the battlefield so I could beat the enemy by playing smart, not just because I have the best reflexes- i.e. hand-eye coordination (which I don't). 

I enjoyed that when it worked in Mass Effect 2, which was some of the time. I don't want to have to micromanage my allies to the point of having to hand-walk them to a good point of cover to hide behind so they can insta-cast that power I needed them to use right into the wall that's not even near the enemy I want the power used on, but still somehow hits the enemy. Which happened a lot.

Unfortunately for me it seems I am in the minority - that the people who already have a plethora of reflex driven games are going to achieve their desire and will change the games I love.  

Makes me very sad.

What the hell does having good AI squadmates have to do with making Mass Effect 3 a twtich game?

Modifié par Soul Cool, 25 septembre 2011 - 09:24 .

[didymos1120]

jreezy wrote...

Do all Third-Person cover based shooters have to be compared to the most recent games in the genre? I wonder if most people think the Third-Person cover shooter started with Gears of War?

Yes.  It's Internet Law.  Also, if you notice a familiar element in the story, you must assume it was copied from the most recent film to use that element.  Considering the possibility that both might be referencing a common source older than 5-10 years is not allowed.

[tonnactus]

The best thing would be to have game tactics like in Dragon Age games...

[Xeranx]

tonnactus wrote...

The best thing would be to have game tactics like in Dragon Age games...

That might be helpful.  I would love to play a single player game (no co-op) that had my crew covering me for a change.  Then again I'm all in it for story if I have a team.  I worry about cool stuff and what my character can do when said character has to do everything him or herself.

[Seifer006]

yeah, I completely agree with you on the whole squad mates problem of Mass Effect 1,2. Especially what you said in ME2. No matter what difficulty you play on, the squad mates "rarely" offer any help. It's almost pointless of having him/her in your team

[who would know]

Agree that squad behaviour could be more situationally reactive.

But for those arguing that the squad in ME2 may as well have not existed, did you never manually use their powers? Try it out, you might be surprised at the difference it makes. Think of their powers as an extension of your own.

[AcidRelic]

tonnactus wrote...

The best thing would be to have game tactics like in Dragon Age games...

That would be great, they do pretty good by themselves, ie- Mordan using Incenerate on Armor, but tactics you could assign would be sweet. Shep - shields down - focus fire on his target or Enemy shield greater than 75% Overload.

I really liked the improvement from ME1 to ME2 but they could do a little better, mostly with when to cover, when to shoot and when to cover and shoot, things like that.

Modifié par AcidRelic, 26 septembre 2011 - 02:59 .

[gammameggon]

Combat for me in ME2 was plain boring...not for any reason other than it was shooting all of the time in narrow areas with very limited breaks in shooting on a mission.

I wish missions were much more open and allowed truly unique playstyles and gameplay features. This includes stealth, puzzles, multiple ways to reach a location and hidden loot in obvious and obscure areas.

Instead of copying from Gears of War, create a unique and even better AI for squads and enemies. And instead of always looking toward tps and fps, start looking at Fallout 3 a little bit and see if there are elements that can be taken from that. Or even tactical shooters.

As far as squad AI is concerned,

[robarcool]

What I don't want Bioware devs to learn from Gears 3 is to pull off a cheap Deus Ex machina like Epic did by bringing Adam Fenix in. I haven't played the last 2 Gears games (don't have Xbox) but I was following the game and was really disappointed with the solution to the locust problem. Also, no clue was given as to why Locust queen looked so human like and some other stuff. I hope Bioware doesn't do that.

[robarcool]

I am sorry about the spoiler, but considering how charged up the TC is about Gears 3 and trying to teach Bioware a lesson, I wanted to express that Gears 3 is really a fail in terms of story and I don't want Bioware to do that.

[robarcool]

didymos1120 wrote...

BBK4114 wrote...

Unfortunately for me it seems I am in the minority - that the people who already have a plethora of reflex driven games are going to achieve their desire and will change the games I love.  

Makes me very sad.

Then just play on Casual.  That's what it's for: people who don't do well with and/or don't like the combat.

Yep. Leave higher difficulties for combat oriented players. It is always good to have fluent combat controls so that those who like it get more replay value by playing at higher difficulties. I started Fallout 3 and ditched it in 2 hours because of its absolutely junk combat. I was really enjoying that game before I realized I couldn't shoot one dog without spending a whole lot of bullets and half of them not hitting him. What a waste.

[littlezack]

robarcool wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

BBK4114 wrote...

Unfortunately for me it seems I am in the minority - that the people who already have a plethora of reflex driven games are going to achieve their desire and will change the games I love.  

Makes me very sad.

Then just play on Casual.  That's what it's for: people who don't do well with and/or don't like the combat.

Yep. Leave higher difficulties for combat oriented players. It is always good to have fluent combat controls so that those who like it get more replay value by playing at higher difficulties. I started Fallout 3 and ditched it in 2 hours because of its absolutely junk combat. I was really enjoying that game before I realized I couldn't shoot one dog without spending a whole lot of bullets and half of them not hitting him. What a waste.

With VATS, you don't even really need to aim at anything...