3434 réponses à ce sujet

[BlueMagitek]

D.Kain wrote...

BlueMagitek wrote...

If she doesn't owe the society anything, why does she deserve to take from it? Nef accepted her, she didn't know she was an AY, I doubt she knew what an AY was. And yet she ate her up too.

You hear from Samara, who knows Morinth more than any other person. And if Morinth can go on without melding, she's just a predator who is addicted to her melding.

Nef treated her as a person, look how that went.

Why do you act like you know Nef? She can be a bitc*h for all I know. All I hear on her journal is mindless worship of Morinth, due to Morinth's hypnotise abilities, most likely. I know that my Shepard acted like a thug boss in the club and got Morinth's attention. Nef could have been anyone until when she lost her head. 
Some mother tears an you are ready to kill anyone, without a second though.. Mother didn't know that Nef was into dark clubs with drugs. 
Morinth sure can go on without melding, that is if she is willing to risk her life to Justicars or other thugs on the galaxy.

Shall we continue to blame the victim?  Okay.  Damn Shepard's Colonist family!  They had the gall to go and get themselves killed or enslaved by Batarians!  They deserved it!  I can't believe the game allows us to save Tali!  We should have just let her die like she deserved to for having information!

Oh, wait, no, it's ridiculous to do so and flawed.

Attempting to defame the villify because you don't have ground to stand on is a pretty weak way of going about things.  Even if Nef was a rude person and she used drugs, she didn't deserve to die for it.  The villagers didn't deserve to die for their suspicions on AY (if such a thing did happen and Morinth didn't just mind warp them).   If nothing else, Morinth has proven that AY need to be locked up or else they'll go off and murder people across the galaxy.  Truly that will show the Justicars to leave her alone and let her keep killing!

Except the Justicar won't manage to find her if she stopped feeding her addiction.

[Flashflame58]

I had to check to see if I was in the right forum, I thought for sure this was about Morrigan.

In all seriousness, no I couldn't possibly see any way anyone could find out about Morinth. Even your squad seemed oblivious to the fact that she wasn't Samara..

[SandTrout]

D.Kain wrote...

But ofcourse you can both kill him or lock him up. In your scenario the kills came first not after. Morinth case is that it was BEFORE, simple as that. 

If people locked him up before he started killing because they thought that he MIGHT kill, then he would be perfectly justified.

He would be justified in taking actions that ensure his own freedom. He would not be justified in taking actions that take away other people's life and liberty unnecessarily.

[BlueMagitek]

Flashflame58 wrote...

I had to check to see if I was in the right forum, I thought for sure this was about Morrigan.

In all seriousness, no I couldn't possibly see any way anyone could find out about Morinth. Even your squad seemed oblivious to the fact that she wasn't Samara..

If Morrigan is anything like Viconia, we should be good. ~_^

But then, I did read about ~400 pages in that 5-600 page topic about her, so I may be a tad biased.

[SandTrout]

Morrigan is not a monster, she is an exceptionally practical and logical person, and as far as I know, she's not a serial killer.

That's off topic though.

[dreman9999]

Flashflame58 wrote...

I had to check to see if I was in the right forum, I thought for sure this was about Morrigan.

In all seriousness, no I couldn't possibly see any way anyone could find out about Morinth. Even your squad seemed oblivious to the fact that she wasn't Samara..

Kasumi knows...

[D.Kain]

@Sandtrout

You must understand that an opinion can't be flawed. It is an opinion, it is how one person views right and wrong, it is different for different people.

Most of your argument is based on that Morinth could be able to live in peace if she didn't kill anyone. I just don't think it is possible, atleast it is a big risk of her dying, and it is greater than the one she had when she gathered power.

I believe that Morinth is a strong individual, and that she fully controls herself, and isn't a mindless addict. If anything, I already said that until I hear from Morinth's mouth that: Hey Shepard I really need a fix, I can't go on like this anymore. Until then I don't even consider her addicted. I need facts.

She was as strong as Samara, already, if she wasn't Samara would deal with her without asking me for help, in that particular biotic fight.

Justicars were after Morinth because she chose freedom, they didn't care if she killed or not, they already thought that she WILL kill no matter what. What is the point of being celebate if you are already accused of killing? And again living on the run or hiding IS NOT FREEDOM.

[SandTrout]

Tigerblood and MilkShakes wrote...

Saving Morinth didnt seem evil at all.

if anything i want some kind of reward for saving her and how she actually saves the universe with her power

You traded Samara's power for Morinth's. Either could have been used in the same way, so the primary difference is which one had more right to live.

[D.Kain]

SandTrout wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

But ofcourse you can both kill him or lock him up. In your scenario the kills came first not after. Morinth case is that it was BEFORE, simple as that. 

If people locked him up before he started killing because they thought that he MIGHT kill, then he would be perfectly justified.

He would be justified in taking actions that ensure his own freedom. He would not be justified in taking actions that take away other people's life and liberty unnecessarily.

Ok, see easy as that. I think that he would be justified to ktake away others peole's life. Basic concept disagreements here.

[dreman9999]

BlueMagitek wrote...

Flashflame58 wrote...

I had to check to see if I was in the right forum, I thought for sure this was about Morrigan.

In all seriousness, no I couldn't possibly see any way anyone could find out about Morinth. Even your squad seemed oblivious to the fact that she wasn't Samara..

If Morrigan is anything like Viconia, we should be good. ~_^

But then, I did read about ~400 pages in that 5-600 page topic about her, so I may be a tad biased.

Morrigan is just one of the many faces of Viconis bioware always seem to use in each game. From Bastia, , to the silk fox, to Ashley, to Marrigan, to Jack and Miranda, and finally Isabella.

Modifié par dreman9999, 01 octobre 2011 - 08:06 .

[D.Kain]

BlueMagitek wrote...

Shall we continue to blame the victim?  Okay.  Damn Shepard's Colonist family!  They had the gall to go and get themselves killed or enslaved by Batarians!  They deserved it!  I can't believe the game allows us to save Tali!  We should have just let her die like she deserved to for having information!

Oh, wait, no, it's ridiculous to do so and flawed.

Attempting to defame the villify because you don't have ground to stand on is a pretty weak way of going about things.  Even if Nef was a rude person and she used drugs, she didn't deserve to die for it.  The villagers didn't deserve to die for their suspicions on AY (if such a thing did happen and Morinth didn't just mind warp them).   If nothing else, Morinth has proven that AY need to be locked up or else they'll go off and murder people across the galaxy.  Truly that will show the Justicars to leave her alone and let her keep killing!

Except the Justicar won't manage to find her if she stopped feeding her addiction.

This is again how injustise works. You are being an as* to somebody and they will be an as* too, and not only you but it goes a long way. Remember the scene on Narshada with a homeless person in KOTOR 2? 

I don't care what Justicars think anymore. If another Justicar comes for Morinth I will kill them too, without even having second thoughts. 

[Flashflame58]

SandTrout wrote...

Tigerblood and MilkShakes wrote...

Saving Morinth didnt seem evil at all.

if anything i want some kind of reward for saving her and how she actually saves the universe with her power

You traded Samara's power for Morinth's. Either could have been used in the same way, so the primary difference is which one had more right to live.

Keep in mind that Morinth is Samara's daughter, and is also younger than her which means that if she's just as powerful as her, imagine how much more powerful she will become as she ages.

[SandTrout]

D.Kain wrote...

@Sandtrout

You must understand that an opinion can't be flawed. It is an opinion, it is how one person views right and wrong, it is different for different people.

Sure, an opinion cannot be objectively proven to be 'wrong' unless the facts on which it was based are proven wrong.  You are claiming that she is killing because she is being hunted. This is an inverse of the factual cause-effect relationship. Therefore, you are wrong.

Most of your argument is based on that Morinth could be able to live in peace if she didn't kill anyone. I just don't think it is possible, atleast it is a big risk of her dying, and it is greater than the one she had when she gathered power.

If she hadn't killed anyone, she would not be at risk of dying at the hands of a Justicar. If she stopped killing, she would be at less of a risk of dying at the hands of a Justicar because her trail would have gone cold. Sorry, but your logic doesn't add up here.

I believe that Morinth is a strong individual, and that she fully controls herself, and isn't a mindless addict. If anything, I already said that until I hear from Morinth's mouth that: Hey Shepard I really need a fix, I can't go on like this anymore. Until then I don't even consider her addicted. I need facts.

You again express ignorance of addiction. Addicts aren't mindless, they simply have a few of their through patterns screwed up. You can be extremely intelligent and still end up as an addict without knowing it. As someone with personal experience with addiction, I can tell you that she has every indication of being an addict.

Justicars were after Morinth because she chose freedom, they didn't care if she killed or not, they already thought that she WILL kill no matter what. What is the point of being celebate if you are already accused of killing? And again living on the run or hiding IS NOT FREEDOM.

And you make this claim based on what, exactly? You're pulling this out of your ass.

[SandTrout]

D.Kain wrote...

Ok, see easy as that. I think that he would be justified to ktake away others peole's life. Basic concept disagreements here.

Your morality is scewed up then. By that logic, the Germans were perfectly justified in slaughtering everyone that wasn't a member of thier 'Master Race' because they had been treated unfairly after WW1.

[BlueMagitek]

Of that list I would really only relate Morrigan to Viconia (though I have not played Jade Empire, so...), but this really isn't the place for this discussion.

Samara didn't really ask you for help in the biotic fight. Morinth makes a plea to Shepard, Samara tells him that she's already sworn to help her and they should finish this. I'd even say that Samara had the upper hand the majority of the fight.

~Kain

Once again, that does nothing to justify Morinth's actions. Nor did you respond to my points. Again.

[SandTrout]

Flashflame58 wrote...

Keep in mind that Morinth is Samara's daughter, and is also younger than her which means that if she's just as powerful as her, imagine how much more powerful she will become as she ages.

Which would be fine reasoning if the Reapers weren't due in a couple of years (months?).

[Flashflame58]

SandTrout wrote...

And you make this claim based on what, exactly? You're pulling this out of your ass.

You know, you can make your point and express your opinion without being rude.

[D.Kain]

@Sandtrout

I again see only one major argument that you are holding too, and you haven't payed attention to Samara.

Your last line. I didn't pull it out of my as*, it is exactly what Samara says. Morinth was given choice of prison or death. Choosing freedom is choosing death. Samara said that by RUNNING away Morinth proved her addiction, which leads me to think that Samara and other justicars are idiots that don't deserve the authority they have.

[SandTrout]

Flashflame58 wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

And you make this claim based on what, exactly? You're pulling this out of your ass.

You know, you can make your point and express your opinion without being rude.

I'm justified in this case. His arguement is baseless BS, and I'm calling him on it.

[D.Kain]

SandTrout wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

Ok, see easy as that. I think that he would be justified to ktake away others peole's life. Basic concept disagreements here.

Your morality is scewed up then. By that logic, the Germans were perfectly justified in slaughtering everyone that wasn't a member of thier 'Master Race' because they had been treated unfairly after WW1.

Yes damnit, that is how it works! If you treat people unfair they do sh*t! If you treat people unfair nothing good will come out of it EVER. So just treat people fair, instead of putting down those that were treated unfair! 

World war 2 is a bad example anyway. People wanted power and wanted to treat other unfair too. I am from europe and the previous soviet union. If Germany wouldn't start the war the soviet union would. Germany was just faster.

Modifié par D.Kain, 01 octobre 2011 - 07:53 .

[D.Kain]

SandTrout wrote...

Flashflame58 wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

And you make this claim based on what, exactly? You're pulling this out of your ass.

You know, you can make your point and express your opinion without being rude.

I'm justified in this case. His arguement is baseless BS, and I'm calling him on it.

I'm completely fine with rude, I can stand a good argument.