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[Killjoy Cutter]

D.Kain wrote...

Dunstan wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Nef, a spy for Aria?

LOL, OK, whatever, like I said, desperate attempt to make excuses for a monster.

Xeranx doesn't try to make exuses, he is a rational person with a lot of good thoughts. Thing is you don't know Morinth enough to call her a monster.

We do know that she corrupted an entire village and convinced them to worship her, the villagers would then hand over their daughters as sacrifices to her. And when Samara tried to stop her she used the villager's as meat shields, has that altered your opinion?

That's Samara's fault in the first place!

Um... what?

[Killjoy Cutter]

D.Kain wrote...

Dunstan wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

Dunstan wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Nef, a spy for Aria?

LOL, OK, whatever, like I said, desperate attempt to make excuses for a monster.

Xeranx doesn't try to make exuses, he is a rational person with a lot of good thoughts. Thing is you don't know Morinth enough to call her a monster.

We do know that she corrupted an entire village and convinced them to worship her, the villagers would then hand over their daughters as sacrifices to her. And when Samara tried to stop her she used the villager's as meat shields, has that altered your opinion?

That's Samara's fault in the first place!

Is it.. how so?

Because Morinth used the village to become stronger and as a meat shield to survive Samara. If Samara would leave her alone, she wouldn't do that.

No, she kills because she gets off on it.  That's it, end of story, she kills for the rush, she's on a downward spiral of wanting to kill more every time she kills. 

She was offered a chance to live without killing, and she rejected it.  She ran off and started murdering people for the thrill and the fun of it. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 26 septembre 2011 - 06:04 .

[ryoldschool]

This thread is humorous, well the part defending Morinth. The Asari believe she is a serial killer, and give Justicar's full range to eliminate them. The asari evidently feel that serial killers are a serious enough threat to their society that they have a Justicar going after her. Its a no-brainer - Law officer or serial killer.

[Medhia Nox]

@Killjoy Cutter - oh, but she was BORN this way! Have you no heart!

Everyone who was born with a depraved desire to slaughter someone should just be allowed to do it - or, didn't you get the memo?

------

As for Samara - if memory serves - she never claims to serve "Good" - she serves "Justice" and in my conversations with her, she made no apologies for the fact that sometimes things got complicated and you have to do something messy.

====

To those who think 'justice' and 'good' are the same thing... well, we're all entitled to think what we want.

[AlexXIV]

What makes is difficult is that Samara is not really acting on a Asari homeworld. I mean police, even secret service of other countries have no rights in my country. Unless they are working with the officials. So Samara threatening police officers isn't exactly something many people can agree with. Me neither btw.

[Killjoy Cutter]

ryoldschool wrote...

This thread is humorous, well the part defending Morinth.

It's sad but not surprising that there are people who think Morinth is the victim, and misunderstood, and so on. 

Ted Bundy had groupies at his trial, married one of his character witnesses (who took eight years to realize what a monster he actually was), etc.  

[Medhia Nox]

It wasn't Ted Bundy's fault - it was the fault of anyone who follows a strict moral code.

Ted Bundy is a blameless victim of black and white morality.

====

Damn you Samara - for making Ted Bundy kill people.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 26 septembre 2011 - 06:25 .

[Xeranx]

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

[Killjoy Cutter]

LoL.

We know exactly why she does what she does, she gets off on it. She murder people for the thrill, the rush of power, the joy of killing another thinking being. End of story.

[AlexXIV]

Xeranx wrote...

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

How's killing Shepard on the Normandy doing what she has to do to survive? It's probalby the most stupid thing anyone has done so far. Including Udina and the turian council member.

[didymos1120]

Arkitekt wrote...

Did anyone let the cop die rather than giving Samara what she wants? I just thought about this possibility.

That's not an option: once you travel to that location, you have to complete the mission before you can leave.

[Xeranx]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL.

We know exactly why she does what she does, she gets off on it. She murder people for the thrill, the rush of power, the joy of killing another thinking being. End of story.

Samara claims the same.

[Xeranx]

AlexXIV wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

How's killing Shepard on the Normandy doing what she has to do to survive? It's probalby the most stupid thing anyone has done so far. Including Udina and the turian council member.

Shepard has to give consent in order for the meld to take place.  Unless you want to change things up and say that Morinth forces herself onto people.  She could also be entirely truthful that she believes Shepard can survive.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Xeranx wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

How's killing Shepard on the Normandy doing what she has to do to survive? It's probalby the most stupid thing anyone has done so far. Including Udina and the turian council member.

Shepard has to give consent in order for the meld to take place.  Unless you want to change things up and say that Morinth forces herself onto people.  She could also be entirely truthful that she believes Shepard can survive.

Morinth does force herself on people.  She seeks them out, lies to them, manipulates them, brings them under her sway, and then consumes them. 

Shep might be the one of the rare people who actually has to consent, and any player who actually did have their Shep consent was a fool for not knowing exactly what would happen when they did. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 26 septembre 2011 - 07:49 .

[Lucky Thirteen]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL.

We know exactly why she does what she does, she gets off on it. She murder people for the thrill, the rush of power, the joy of killing another thinking being. End of story.

Remember that time she said she still gets warm fuzzy feelings when she kills? Oh wait that was Jack.

The unfortunate thing about Morinth is that very little effort was put into her character by Bioware. The intention is clear they want her to be evil and despite other characters sharing similarities, she's just made out to be the evil one. There is no way to redeem or even attempt to see if her addiction to killing can be fixed as easly as it seems to be with Jack. I think it's mostly to benefit players who do want to play a sort of evil Shepard instead of just a renegade Shepard. 

The whole thing is shaky. Personally I think Bioware passed up a interesting moral dilemma and deep character when it comes to Morinth, for the sake of having something truely evil for Shepard to be involved with.

The only consequence I can think of is that Shepard will probably lose support from the asari and the Justicars. Samara isn't the only Justicar, she is just the best of them. Being that there is no way to help Morinth with her addiction, she will probably seduce and kill a couple more. It will be pretty apparent what Shepard allowed happen before too long and the asari will probably not like it. 

[SandTrout]

D.Kain wrote...

We do know that she corrupted an entire village and convinced them to worship her, the villagers would then hand over their daughters as sacrifices to her. And when Samara tried to stop her she used the villager's as meat shields, has that altered your opinion?

That's Samara's fault in the first place!

No. Just... no.

You have an extremely twisted way of laying blame. Samara was chasing down Morinth because Morinth was killing. Morinth wasn't killing because Samara was chasing her down.

Your cause-effect relationship here is reversed.

Modifié par SandTrout, 26 septembre 2011 - 08:06 .

[Nizzemancer]

You should be punished if you trust morinth with anything...Seriously, would you trust a vampire to kiss your boo boo better as well?

I don't trust her as far as I can throw her, and since game mechanics makes it impossible for me to use biotics on her I'd say that that trust is non-existant

[Nizzemancer]

AlexXIV wrote...

What makes is difficult is that Samara is not really acting on a Asari homeworld. I mean police, even secret service of other countries have no rights in my country. Unless they are working with the officials. So Samara threatening police officers isn't exactly something many people can agree with. Me neither btw.

Illium is an Asari world...

[Xeranx]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

How's killing Shepard on the Normandy doing what she has to do to survive? It's probalby the most stupid thing anyone has done so far. Including Udina and the turian council member.

Shepard has to give consent in order for the meld to take place.  Unless you want to change things up and say that Morinth forces herself onto people.  She could also be entirely truthful that she believes Shepard can survive.

Morinth does force herself on people.  She seeks them out, lies to them, manipulates them, brings them under her sway, and then consumes them. 

Shep might be the one of the rare people who actually has to consent, and any player who actually did have their Shep consent was a fool for not knowing exactly what would happen when they did. 

You may be able to say that if the way you met your significant other involved a megaphone and was similar to:
Ladies and/or gentlemen!

My name is Killjoy Cutter.

I am a [insert age] year old who works for [insert company].  I [insert position and parameters for position] and make [insert salary].

If you wish to go on a date with me, please meet me in the food court.  I'll be at the third table on the right if you're facing towards the mall entrance.

Thank you.

[didymos1120]

Xeranx wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL.

We know exactly why she does what she does, she gets off on it. She murder people for the thrill, the rush of power, the joy of killing another thinking being. End of story.

Samara claims the same.

It's not a "claim".  Why don't you go listen to what Morinth says when you examine the objects in her apartment?  Or, hell, just pay a modicum of attention to her conversation there and in the VIP lounge.  It's made ridiculously plain what her game is.

[1136342t54_]

Xeranx wrote...

I'm thinking this thread should be merged with the other one in the character section considering the thread starter actually posted in that thread before starting this one. Also the thread title resembles a call to action for those who feel Morinth is some unconscionable wretch.

Anyway, there's no telling what Morinth's motives are because they weren't fleshed out. You can think that she's as evil as anything, but that doesn't make it so. She can easily go full on satan or she can be a person who hates her condition, but does what she does to survive.

Here's the thread.

The main threat from Morinth is that she gets smarter, stronger and faster everytime she uses her ability. Hell she is much younger than Samara and is just as powerful as her. Morinth isn't evil but she can become a very very big threat. Hell I'd say a large part of the reason for Justicars are to kill rogue Ardat Yakshi like Morinth. 

I don't see her as very evil but someone who fought against the injustice thrust upon her. You know why? Because Samara her own mother actually sees that in her. She is even proud of her daughter resisting to the end no matter how twisted her life was.

[1136342t54_]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Lucky Thirteen wrote...

Remember that time she said she still gets warm fuzzy feelings when she kills? Oh wait that was Jack.

Remember that time she smiled as she was reminded how she loves the thrill of battle, the last gasp of a dying enemy? Oh wait, that was Shepard.

Considering most of Shepard's enemies are in general not people you'd feel sad about killing. I wouldn't be surprised if Shepard was thinking about killing Collectors at that time.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Well lookie here. We've got one mass murderer, Jack. Another mass murderer, Shepard, whose total is in the hundreds of thousands. A ritualistic serial killer (assassin), Thane. Mordin, who is just as likely to kill you as he is to heal you. Another one who just kills for money, Zaeed. We've had another murderer who just kills for whomever is paying his contract, Wrex. Liara who has maybe not gotten her own hands as dirty, but as an information broker has probably ordered a number of hits on dead-beat clients, and who is possibly Shepard's LI. And now we get all moral about Samara and Morinth?

Joker and EDI are the only sane ones on the ship.

I had the opportunity to choose Morinth once, and it's a real difficult dialogue option to get. I let her live to unlock Domination. But even Kasumi says something like, "Morinth and I had a conversation. She seems like a nice person, but I wouldn't want to be alone with her.

Apparently Samara is okay with blowing up the Batarian system because there, afterall, were a lot of what she would call "bad people" on that planet.

Both of them are monsters. You can count the non-monsters on your team on one hand: Kasumi, and Jacob. Otherwise, you basically have your classic mass murderers, and your serial killers, and Shepard is one of them.

And how is the Asari government, or anyone going to find out Shepard is at fault for getting Samara killed? No one is. Samara set up Shepard as bait, and her timing had to be perfect for Shepard to live. Everyone knows an Ardat Yakshi can dominate her prey. And it's obvious that Morinth knows exactly what she does when you go around her apartment. And Samara doesn't go in until you're totally enthralled??? Morinth is a classic serial killer with the sexual component. She's Hannibal the Cannibal without the cuisine.

Yet in the book "Hannibal", Dr. Lecter convinces Clarice she is just like him, and the two run off together. The book doesn't end like the movie.

[1136342t54_]

[quote]sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Well lookie here. We've got one mass murderer, Jack.
[/quote] Not necesssarily unreasonable. Hell it was implied she was forced to kill during the early days of her life.

[quote]Another mass murderer, Shepard, whose total is in the hundreds of thousands.[/quote]
Wouldn't necessarily compare Shepard to morinth on that level. Whenever Shepard commits mass murder or even just killing people. Its largely in self defense or in defense of the galaxy.

[quote]A ritualistic serial killer (assassin), Thane.[/quote]
That is inaccurate and you know it. Thane was trained by the Hanar since he was 8 years old. You could say he was a state assassin to be far more accurate.

[quote]Mordin, who is just as likely to kill you as he is to heal you.[/quote]
Yep. He healed some looters who attempted to steal medicine then kicked their ass. Plus he killed plenty of mercs trying to hurt innocents. That isn't so bad.

[quote]Another one who just kills for money, Zaeed.[/quote]
Nothing new there.

[quote]We've had another murderer who just kills for whomever is paying his contract, Wrex.[/quote]
Actually not anymore since he is actually attempting to save an entire race.

[quote]Liara who has maybe not gotten her own hands as dirty, but as an information broker has probably ordered a number of hits on dead-beat clients, and who is possibly Shepard's LI.[/quote] Thats a maybe and all we heard her do was make a threat.
[quote]Joker and EDI are the only sane ones on the ship. 
[/quote]
Not necessarily. Joker and EDI are responsible for the death of many many Collectors. I'm sure because they murdered someone they are insane killers.

[quote]
I had the opportunity to choose Morinth once, and it's a real difficult dialogue option to get. I let her live to unlock Domination. But even Kasumi says something like, "Morinth and I had a conversation. She seems like a nice person, but I wouldn't want to be alone with her.
[/quote]
Morinth always does that. You have to remember she excels at drawing people in to her web seeming nice or just plain sexy. Then when you get to know here enough you realise she is the perfect predator. Samara even realizes that she and Shepard isn't really much different from Morinth. The way Morinth kills and the reasons she does it makes her far more dangerous than most people.

[quote]
Apparently Samara is okay with blowing up the Batarian system because there, afterall, were a lot of what she would call "bad people" on that planet.
[/quote]
Never heard Samara okay that.
[quote]
Both of them are monsters. You can count the non-monsters on your team on one hand: Kasumi, and Jacob. Otherwise, you basically have your classic mass murderers, and your serial killers, and Shepard is one of them.
[/quote]
Depends on your definition of monster. Is Shepard a monster for sacrificing 300,000 batarians for the lives of trillions? Would Garrus be a monster for trying to save the innocents of Omega? Would Mordin be a monster for wanting to stop the Krogan from getting out of control leading to their own distruction? There are a few actual monsters on your team but I would classify very few in that light. Zaeed is as morally grey as you can get most of the time. Jack turned into an animal that is distrustful of everyone but can help her become something else. Morinth? You can't change her at all or stop her from killing. Its not really even her fault its just horrible luck but when she killed her first victim her condition kicked in and turned her into a monster sadly.