429 réponses à ce sujet

[BrandonMotz]

"Do you ever have the feeling that the word is getting.... simpler? Like everything from eating to fighting is a lot less complex than it used to be?"

Quote from talkative man in The Hanged Man

I was reading a post earlier in the week from someone who was miffed because DA2 was "Kiddied down" from Dragon Age 1 in its difficulty.

After going through my second playthrough I have to agree. From this quote it seems as if Bioware knows they kiddied it down. Cmon BW!! Plese make DA 3 more adult friendly! More tactical options, More blood... More gore... More sexually appealing options.

Video game target audience is what... 16 to 34?

Please Bioware, make DA3 for the mature audience (18 +)  and put an "M"rating on it. Let the stupid parents make the decision to purchase their underage children an M rated game take responsibility for their own actions, instead of forcing everyone to play a game that is suitable for 12 year old children.

If it is a matter of sales...... I promise to purchase 10 copies of the Dragon Age 3!

No idea why I am writing and whining about this.... Probably the rum I have been drinking!

Cheers Mates

Arrrrr!

Modifié par BrandonMotz, 28 septembre 2011 - 07:48 .

[naledgeborn]

I don't think so. I have a 12 year old cousin who's pretty much a gamer (better stay that way or I'll smack the **** out of him if he develops negative interests).

Anyway he wanted to sleep over the weekend an saw me playing DA2, DX:HR, and what have you. I let him start a new game in DA2. He was enthralled but he couldn't wrap his melon around the fact that he had to assign attribute points after I spent 5 mintues explaining it to him. Granted he's 12 but the kid is sharp for his age.

This revelation has lead me to believe that DA2 isn't as "streamlined" as the forum goers like to think. Perhaps poorly executed in the design department due to time restraints but that's not saying this game "is for kids".

[Johnny20]

It.. does seem to be aimed at a younger crowd, or at least be more assessable them. Which is ironic due the the mature rating the game has. Naughty Bioware.

I could be wrong, but either way, it is more simplistic, overly gory, has a lot of humongous breasts, less gameplay/story depth, etc. Most of these things are not appreciated by adults for the most part, who find them shallow, I believe. So yes, I think Bioware was hoping to attract a younger audience.

Modifié par Johnny20, 28 septembre 2011 - 10:09 .

[casadechrisso]

Yes, I very much agree. I felt like it was actually a kids game with a lot of blood pumped in for that cool 18 sticker on the box that makes the kids feel like they're playing an adult game. Nothing in DA 2 was actually adult or mature, unless you call a few dirty remarks by companions any teenager uses "adult". The violence was silly, not mature, the romances were utterly silly and naive, the gameplay is that of a teenage action game, dark and gritty is nothing in this game (nor in DA:O actually), so I don't see why there's a M/18+ sticker on the box for anything else than marketing purposes. Or Bioware's target audience starts at 18 and ends at 20.

[whykikyouwhy]

BrandonMotz wrote...

I was reading a post earlier in the week from someone who was miffed because DA2 was "Kiddied down" from Dragon Age 1 in its difficulty.

After going through my second playthrough I have to agree. From this quote it seems as if Bioware knows they kiddied it down. Cmon BW!! Plese make DA 3 more adult friendly! More tactical options, More blood... More gore... More sexually appealing options.

Degrees of difficulty between the games may be in sync with the plot and the various quests/battles that the player is engaged in. I didn't notice any difference between the two games - nothing that struck me as jarring. Both had relatively "easy" battles, and both had ones that were, for me, a struggle.

As far as making DA3 more "adult friendly" - tactics, blood, gore, and "more sexually appealing options" (I hesitate to ponder what exactly you mean there ), while making a game more mature in theme and having it garner certain ratings, do not necessarily make for a better game. Some extra arterial spray or side boob may not add anything special. Bioware does a great job in balancing the various elements of their games - let them do their thing, do what they do best, and put out a solid product.

[naledgeborn]

@ Dude above whykiky

Depends on how you play Origins. Despite being a sum of animated pixels some of the things my Dwarf Noble did was sick. Redcliffe by itself is full of "dark and gritty".

Modifié par naledgeborn, 28 septembre 2011 - 10:16 .

[casadechrisso]

@ Dude below whykiky

In general I agree that DA:O did better with the gritty atmosphere, maybe I'm just used to darker and grittier games in general. I played Origins multiple times and there were enough mature themes in it, especially in the Origins stories (e.g. Shianni). However, the general atmosphere didn't always support the storytelling, the general design wasn't very gritty and silly blood effects (again, city elf origin as an example) often ruined the immersion totally for me with the fountains of red juice. Less would've been more, and DA2 is even 10 times more over the top.

[SkittlesKat96]

Well DAO did have a lot more blood and gory scenery and sexual content, so I suppose DAO was sort of 'kiddied' up a little. I have to say though they were somewhat realistic about it...

It makes sense that DAO would have a bit more grit since the people of Ferelden are a little bit more savage and brutal than a lot of other countries and there is war and bloodshed going on and you go to lots of ruins and rape/murder dungeons and etc.

[Forst1999]

I disagree.
Tactical options: We could argue all day long what tactical options DAII removed, which were bad or good to remove, which mattered in the first place. But i think that we can all agree that on difficulty settings that your "kiddies" play, DA:O and DAII play exactly alike, DAII only is faster. There was no need to remove anything to cater to kids, because whatever was so tactical about DA:O could be easily ignored on easy/normal.
Blood/Gore: Come on, both games use an amount of blood that is almost silly. DAII was over the top with the explosions, but that got patched, they are seldom now. So i see no big difference here.
"Sexual appealing options": That is in the eye of the beholder. Anyway, i don't see how the DAII options are more for kids than the DA:O ones. Or is this about the sex scenes? The removal of the awful DA:O scenes is definitly a improvement in my book. Stiff figures in underwear making out to cheesy music doesn't make a game "mature". Both games have romances that are rather complex tales, and such that are more simple (i guess what you call naive).
Or does the ability do commit atrocious acts make a game mature? DA:O for sure offered more options of senseless murder, but come on. That is similiar to the violence, sometimes it is just so over the top, that it reminds me of an old GTA (i watch a "murder knife" compilation on youtube, after a few scenes it becomes funny...). Playing as psychotic as possible is something that "kids" (let's say a 14 year old) do as much, if not more than adult gamers.
What makes a game mature or not are the themes of the story. DA:O offered some heavy stuff about duty (the warden's duty to protect the people from the life, even if it costs their live, and the way to escape this / what kings and politicians see as their duty, how it can throw over their life (Alistair) or your country (Loghain)). DAII on the other hand explored the freedom/security conflict, with the mage/templar plot as well as with the qunari.
You can play either game just to smash puny monsters, see some gore, say "woo" when your char beds a companion. But both games offer much more, and there is some maturity needed to appreciate that. Both games are as mature as the people who play them.

[Yuqi]

DA2 did seem a tiny bit more kiddied down, but not by much. I would argue COD is way more kiddied down.. ( Ironicly, pokemon seems to be getting more adultish in its mechanics)

DAO & DA2 are defiantly not, games I would let my nephews play.(They have asked..begged even, and they are 8)

[SoulRebel_1979]

BrandonMotz wrote...

More blood... More gore... More sexually appealing options.

Yes, that's one thing Bioware is really shy about 

http://gamernode.com...e1257214929.jpg

[mousestalker]

I don't see how it was more child friendly. Regardless of your positions on exposing children to sex and violence, DA2 had more of both.

I do think they conflated 'easy' with 'awesome' and on going for the latter more correctly achieved the former in certain instances. But that's not kiddifying a game. My eleven year old nephew can handle the jumping, diving and zooming around of a first person shooter more easily than I ever could. If anything, simplifying the movement and combat controls made the game more friendly for us geezers.

[culletron1]

The violence in DA2 was cartoon over the top violence...

In DA:O with finishing moves you stabbed guys and lopped heads off. In da2 the slashes of swords were never realistic and seemed to hit air most of the time...

So though there was probably more "gore" in Da2 it was never more violent as the "gore" had no realism to it.

[Pasquale1234]

I also felt that the story (or at least the way it was told) was tailored more toward - how shall I put this? - a different common denominator.

In DAO, we were exposed to the mage-templar conflict in ways that were much more subtle and thought-provoking, imho. DA2 beat us over the heads repeatedly with the notion that there are good and bad intentions on both sides of that conflict, and never bothered to explore the different political alignments within the circles.

Generally, I found that conflict intriguing as it was presented in DAO, but by the time I finished DA2 I had grown really, really tired of it - as in, just kill each other already, and leave me out of it.

It is also notable that DAO consisted of one primary goal / objective, supported by 4 other major questlines, all of which were revealed early in the game. DAO also presented a wide variety of sidequests, many of which could not be completed until much later in the game. In contrast, DA2 had essentially 3 different storylines, and quests that could be completed shortly after they were revealed / assigned. I've often wondered if the intention was to support a target audience with shorter attention spans.

[billy the squid]

I wouldn't say it was made for kids, but it tries too hard to be "awesome" when it really doesn't have to be so over the top. Most gamers are actually in their twenties and older, I don't think we need to be beaten over the head with vastly overblown animations and ramped up combat to appreciate a game, in fact my opinion of Da2 was lower because of it. It seemed more an attempt to distract the player from cringe worthy combat encounters than anything else.

Whilst the attribute restrictions per class simply made the process utterly pointless as nothing but the two attributes for each class mattered. DAO had a auto level up button, did it really need to be simplified ? Tweeked and balanced better certainly. I see it as a shift to the casual game market, the CoD's of the industry where the central tenet is point and shoot simplicity. Which is fine if you like that sort of thing, but I think Bioware has shifted to that. ME3 and 2 seem to have gotten away with it, DA2 got a lot of backlash for it.

Oh, and as to gore and adult situations, no.. the blood in Da2 was over the top, more so than Dao, which was overdone as well, whilst adult situations ie: sex, does not translate into a mature game, The storyline needs to be more complex and invlolved, not the standard black and white fare which appears a lot.

Modifié par billy the squid, 28 septembre 2011 - 02:43 .

[The Baconer]

DAO more difficult? lol

DAO more 'gritty'? lolol

[Blastback]

DA2 was not made for kids. "Fellicitate me" is not kid friendly.

Bioware hoped to draw in more players by streamlining and making the game more actiony. At the same time they hoped to retain most of the old fans by keeping a number of RPG elements. However, one person's streamlining is another person's dumbing down. I think Bioware overestimated just how much change their more hardcore RPG fans were willing to accept, and got screwed even more by the short dev cycle.

[Salaya]

I don't think it's "for kids"; the problem is, though, that everything is so simple, direct and obvious that "childish" is a good way to define the game. 

Dragon Age: Origins was a comercial succes with both artistic and comercial care; instead, Dragon age 2 only cares about comercial-economic matters. The result? A product with no other value than the not-so-complicated fun.

Modifié par Salaya, 28 septembre 2011 - 03:37 .

[SnowHeart1]

mousestalker wrote...

I don't see how it was more child friendly. Regardless of your positions on exposing children to sex and violence, DA2 had more of both.

I do think they conflated 'easy' with 'awesome' and on going for the latter more correctly achieved the former in certain instances. But that's not kiddifying a game. My eleven year old nephew can handle the jumping, diving and zooming around of a first person shooter more easily than I ever could. If anything, simplifying the movement and combat controls made the game more friendly for us geezers.

I think this is largely accurate but there is one distinction I would make. I do think DA2 was made to appeal more to a demographic that, colloquially, has the term "kiddie" in it yet, strictly speaking, has little to do with actual age. We're not allowed to use that phrase here as it is deemed derogatory. But, yes, I do think DA2 was made to appeal to a wider audience that does not typically enjoy digging into the stats of a character nor finds pleasure in the more mundane aspects of adventuring (as are represented in a game such as Fallout). And the result was the jumbled mess that is DA2. Parts of it "mature" (blood, gore, sex, etc.) with other parts "kiddy-fied" (mash button = something awesome happens = win).

[Androme]

If they didn't use the horrible artstyle they did I'd not call it child friendly, but it unfortunately is. Even with all the blood.

[Johnny20]

It's not simply about what game has more blood and sex, it's about how the gore and romantic options are handled. Was it perfect in Origins? Nope. But in Dragon Age 2, I am constantly rolling my eyes. Honestly. People seem to fly into little chunks of meat when tapped on the shoulder. And some of the sexual humor... Nothing could possibly be more juvenile. It has all the wit of a 14 year old. It isn't endearing, it makes me cringe.

That said, Dragon Age 2 wasn't all bad. I still enjoy it and buy the DLC. I just hope they can mature the humor, so it's something adult people can enjoy. You know, the people the game was apparently aimed at.

Modifié par Johnny20, 28 septembre 2011 - 03:58 .

[Stanley Woo]

Dragon Age II has an M rating from the ESRB, meaning that in North America, the game is suggested for players aged 17 and up. Content advisories for the game include "Blood and Gore, Language, Sexual Content, Violence".

It also has a PEGI rating of 18, meaning that, in Europe, the game is suggested for players aged 18 and up. The content advisory is listed as "Extreme violence."

Dragon Age II is not a kid's game, and is not suggested or recommended for children.

[Johnny20]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Dragon Age II has an M rating from the ESRB, meaning that in North America, the game is suggested for players aged 17 and up. Content advisories for the game include "Blood and Gore, Language, Sexual Content, Violence".

It also has a PEGI rating of 18, meaning that, in Europe, the game is suggested for players aged 18 and up. The content advisory is listed as "Extreme violence."

Dragon Age II is not a kid's game, and is not suggested or recommended for children.

Indeed. And I mean no disrespect, but I'm not quite sure that was what the original poster was getting at.

[accessd]

To be honest. This game is not meant for anyone if they expect the regular BioWare quality. It's a betrayal.