185 réponses à ce sujet

[Kakita Tatsumaru]

As individuals it would be irrational to hate all Batarians, but as a culture and government I sure does make sense as they are actually defending their right to arbitrary strip other poeple of their rights just because it's traditional for them (heard during a flash info on Omega).

[OmegaXI]

Arijharn wrote...

OmegaXI wrote...

They let their masters do these things and do nothing to stop it, I'd have far more respect for the batarians if the atleast attempted to overthrow or rebel againist their leaders. 

Why would they if they've known nothing else? It's not as if aliens have freedom of movement within Batarian space; hell every Batarian we meet in game have in some way escaped the Batarian Hegemony (or given tacit approval to operateoutside Hegemony space -- such as slaver gangs etc).

I think you're forgetting something else too; there is no universal sense of morality. The western world here on Earth doesn't operate exactly like other places; why should we expect otherwise?

For all I know (in other words; strongly suspect) most Batarian's probably just want to put their head down, do their job and be suitably rewarded for it... just like everyone else. Their social mores may be different, (i.e., they may not care that much about slavery) but that still isn't something harsh enough to damn their entire civilisation for.

OmegaXI wrote...
All the alien races are like humans in some way, but what can we learn from the batarians?

Who says we 'need' to learn anything from them to begin with? Don't they have the right to exist just as much as the Krogan or anyone else?

Speaking of the Krogan though; you don't want to exterminate their species due to the mass devastation they caused in the past do you?

They do have the right to exist but they do not have the right to enslave others. And if they refuse to stop being slavers then a very harsh message must be sent to get them to change their ways. If the batarians as a race refuse to stop this then they will have to be brought down through force or be quarantined to their home world.

If their entire civilization is based off of the enslavement of others than, yes it is a reason to damn their entire civilization. The current batarian system must be completely brought down for their civilization to start again.
People defend the batarians but do not defend those who they enslaved.

[Ieldra]

DeathDragon185 wrote...
People need a race to hate. that's it really.

Do they? In-game, I don't hate any species. I hate the concept of the asari as omnisexual blue-skinned space babes, but that doesn't transfer to the asari in the game.

[Ieldra]

Kakita Tatsumaru wrote...
As individuals it would be irrational to hate all Batarians, but as a culture and government I sure does make sense as they are actually defending their right to arbitrary strip other poeple of their rights just because it's traditional for them (heard during a flash info on Omega).

Exactly. There are certain cultures I hate on Earth (won't mention to avoid this going off into politics) but that doesn't mean that I hate all individuals from that culture. In fact, most often the average people from those cultures are OK. Unfortunately, it appears we rarely meet the average batarian. 

[Athayniel]

Slavery is culturally endemic to the batarians and an intergral part of their caste syste. Enough so that the Hegemony considers Councilspace anti-slavery laws to be prejudicial. If they limited it only to other batarians it would be an internal matter, a reprehensible internal matter but beyond the scope of external intervention nonetheless. However they do not restrict it to their own species and I expect if batarian slavers ever strayed out of the Terminus Systems it would give the Council an excuse to declare war. As it is they are in a politically charged atmosphere where no-one really wants open war but a lot of races with interests in the Terminus, the Attican Traverse and the Skyllian Verge just want the batarians slavers and mercs gone.

It's not anyone's place to change batarian culture except the batarians, as deplorable as their society may be. However, if it becomes necessary to destroy the Hegemony in order to protect the rest of the galaxy from batarian slavers then so be it. I certainly wouldn't shed a tear if the Reapers did a number on the Hegemony either.

[sevach]

1- First impressions count, you meet the Asari, Turians, Salarians... and so on and get to talk to them and know what they're like.

Batarians? Your frist impression is that they are bastards who are trying to destroy a human colony.

2- Mass Effect kinda stereotypes it's races,
Turians are rigid hardasses, Asari are peacefull (and preachy and annoying), Salarians are smart, Krogan are badasses, Quarians are whiny emos, Volus are greedy, Hanar are big stupid jellyfishes... and Batarians are bastards/a-holes.

Humans you ask me?
Just too cool and diverse!!!!

[Quole]

DeathDragon185 wrote...

People need a race to hate. that's it really.

In my case thats Humans... and Turians.

[OmegaXI]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Kakita Tatsumaru wrote...
As individuals it would be irrational to hate all Batarians, but as a culture and government I sure does make sense as they are actually defending their right to arbitrary strip other poeple of their rights just because it's traditional for them (heard during a flash info on Omega).

Exactly. There are certain cultures I hate on Earth (won't mention to avoid this going off into politics) but that doesn't mean that I hate all individuals from that culture. In fact, most often the average people from those cultures are OK. Unfortunately, it appears we rarely meet the average batarian. 

Or maybe we have met the average batarian, in which case would mean that yes their race is a heartless slaver race. The game does not present enough evidence to say what the average batarian is like. But with this lack of evidence people always seem to think the average batarian is not a heartless slaver, but it could also be that they are. Their culture condones and is based on slavery, so the average batarian who lives in the culture would have no problems with the enslavement of people/aliens.

People keep usign the lack of evidence about the majority of batarians to say hey maybe they not so bad, but that lack of evidence can also mean that the average batarian is worst.

Now you maybe right maybe the average batarians are really good people, but you have no evidence to prove that. Just as I have no evidence to prove that they are all heartless slavers.

[Porenferser]

Well, but it IS a fact that all Batarians we have met so far are not normal citizens, but criminals, beacause they are moving outside their clusters.
This could at least be a hint.

[Kakita Tatsumaru]

OmegaXI wrote...
Or maybe we have met the average batarian, in which case would mean that yes their race is a heartless slaver race. The game does not present enough evidence to say what the average batarian is like. But with this lack of evidence people always seem to think the average batarian is not a heartless slaver, but it could also be that they are. Their culture condones and is based on slavery, so the average batarian who lives in the culture would have no problems with the enslavement of people/aliens.

People keep usign the lack of evidence about the majority of batarians to say hey maybe they not so bad, but that lack of evidence can also mean that the average batarian is worst.

Now you maybe right maybe the average batarians are really good people, but you have no evidence to prove that. Just as I have no evidence to prove that they are all heartless slavers.

Even if most of the Batarians were heartless slavers that doesn't makes sense to hate them for that as individuals, as "most" doesn't mean "all" (unless they got an hive mind).
To me at least only your personal actions define who you are, the rest just doesn't matters (even don't care how one is inside himself actually).

[Thompson family]

"Slavery is an inextricable part of the Batarian Caste System. By restricting the slave trade, the Council is unfairly denying our cultural and economic rights," or words to that effect.

It's not the Batarians singled out here, it's slavers. The Batarians singled themselves out by being the only major civilized faction to sanction the practice.

[Homey C-Dawg]

Thought I might post this here since it seems relevant. This is from Cerberus daily news 12/3/2010...

Youth United is a galaxy-wide extranet group that aims to connect young people of all species. Founder Darchas Clark says he wants to provide a helpful, positive environment for children to learn about each others' cultures. A batarian raised in a human family, Clark says he knows things can be difficult for young people of mixed backgrounds. "My parents were good people, but they didn't know how to help with my struggle to relate to either batarian or human cultures when I was a kid," he recalls. "It's important that Youth United lets kids know they're not alone in that struggle. There's still too many vicious and ignorant attitudes towards mixed families out there." The group's services include chat sessions with peers and counselors, free classes on alien languages and cultures, and a guide to the galaxy's major legal systems.

Doesn't that sound a bit like a white kid born in an asian community, or a black kid born in an indian community, etc.?

[IliyaMoroumetz]

Let's just hope the Reapers decide to eat them first. Problem solved!

[eye basher]

The reapers go threw their space first problem solved.

[Fifth Fleet Out]

Mesina2 wrote...

Except that Batarian merchant on Omega is actually a legit merchant and doesn't mind that Shepard is human, at all.
Also that sick Batarian on Omega apologies for doubting you and his reasons weren't irrational.
I mean, only humans are Vorcha weren't dieing from that plague. It was kinda obvious choice that humans made that plague, not Collectors who aren't even known in majority of the public.

exactly

[Cutlass Jack]

Not all Batarians are Terrorists, quite true. But as a culture they do support the unwilling servitutde of other species (aka Slavery). As opposed to the willing servitude you might find on Illium.

[Dave of Canada]

 Here's the forum morality logic: Everybody who has kind souls must be saved regardless of the cost, do anything else must be inhuman. Unless the person is a jerk or filled with jerks, then they can die because they conflict with my Shepard! It isn't evil, it's doing the universe a favour!

Apply this logic to the Batarians and you've got them dead.
Apply this logic to Udina and he's going to die.
Apply this logic to the Krogan and they must be saved!!11 because of Wrex and maybe Grunt.

Some of them kill the Council because the Turian Councilor was a jerk, though they reload and spare him to rub it in his face before maybe killing him in Mass Effect 3.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 03 octobre 2011 - 03:06 .

[Cutlass Jack]

Dave of Canada wrote...

 Here's the forum morality logic: Everybody who has kind souls must be saved regardless of the cost, do to anything else must be inhuman. Unless the person is a jerk or filled with jerks, then they can die because they conflict with my Shepard! It isn't evil, it's doing the universe a favour!

Apply this logic to the Batarians and you've got them dead.
Apply this logic to Udina and he's going to die.
Apply this logic to the Krogan and they must be saved!!11 because of Wrex and maybe Grunt.

Some of them kill the Council because the Turian Councilor was a jerk, though they reload and spare him to rub it in his face before maybe killing him in Mass Effect 3.

I've had it with your disingenuous assertations.

[darthnick427]

Swimming Ferret wrote...

Bioware is racist.

You humans are all racist!! 

[alex90c]

Most batarians are pretty damn unpleasant, but it definitely makes me appreciate the "good" ones more, like Marsh (Omega merchant), Salkie (after arriving at Archangel recruitment) and Cathka (who goes through the plan with you on the same mission).

I always felt a bit guilty when doing that mission because quite a few of the bosses you kill are actually pretty decent people, like that woman in the Blue Suns.

[Porenferser]

Dave of Canada wrote...

 Here's the forum morality logic: Everybody who has kind souls must be saved regardless of the cost, do anything else must be inhuman. Unless the person is a jerk or filled with jerks, then they can die because they conflict with my Shepard! It isn't evil, it's doing the universe a favour!

Apply this logic to the Batarians and you've got them dead.
Apply this logic to Udina and he's going to die.
Apply this logic to the Krogan and they must be saved!!11 because of Wrex and maybe Grunt.

Some of them kill the Council because the Turian Councilor was a jerk, though they reload and spare him to rub it in his face before maybe killing him in Mass Effect 3.

Word.

@alex90c
True.
I mean they were mercenaries, yes, but they didn't seem like really bad people to me.
Just like naive idiots who think that they can make money fast.

The only jerk at the Blue Suns was Tarak.
(And yes, he was a batarian, but the two others were too.)

[Homey C-Dawg]

Dave of Canada wrote...

 Here's the forum morality logic: Everybody who has kind souls must be saved regardless of the cost, do anything else must be inhuman. Unless the person is a jerk or filled with jerks, then they can die because they conflict with my Shepard! It isn't evil, it's doing the universe a favour!

Apply this logic to the Batarians and you've got them dead.
Apply this logic to Udina and he's going to die.
Apply this logic to the Krogan and they must be saved!!11 because of Wrex and maybe Grunt.

Some of them kill the Council because the Turian Councilor was a jerk, though they reload and spare him to rub it in his face before maybe killing him in Mass Effect 3.

Don't forget the geth. Before ME2 came out there was a lot of the same opinions about the geth as there are about the batarians now. I remember the rumors of a geth squadmate causing people to complain about "All geth are evil and we've never seen a good one therefore I will never trust them." Once people played ME2 and got to know Legion, he ended up being one of the more popular characters, and suddenly "Geth are cool! I love Legion".

I'm of the belief that the same thing would happen if we had an anti-hegemony batarian on the squad, or even as just a important NPC.

[BlueMagitek]

Dave of Canada wrote...

 Here's the forum morality logic: Everybody who has kind souls must be saved regardless of the cost, do anything else must be inhuman. Unless the person is a jerk or filled with jerks, then they can die because they conflict with my Shepard! It isn't evil, it's doing the universe a favour!

Apply this logic to the Batarians and you've got them dead.
Apply this logic to Udina and he's going to die.
Apply this logic to the Krogan and they must be saved!!11 because of Wrex and maybe Grunt.

Some of them kill the Council because the Turian Councilor was a jerk, though they reload and spare him to rub it in his face before maybe killing him in Mass Effect 3.

Nonsense, the logic of the forum is simple.  All those who disagree with Shepard, spear of the Emperor, must perish in the holy flames of Exterminatus. 

Unless that Shepard is allied with Xenos, in which case, all those who disagree with TIM, voice of the Emperor, must perish in the holy flames of Exterminatus.

[JeffZero]

I've been booking for an anti-hegemony batarian for a long time. The conversations would be rad.

SHEPARD: "Don't take this the wrong way but I thought all batarians served and believed in the hegemony."
BATARIAN: "Don't take this the wrong way but you're pretty dense."

The perfect solution to the growing complaint that everyone around you is 'Shepsexual'!