4309 réponses à ce sujet

[Killjoy Cutter]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Sure you do, you don't know what you want or what you need. You'll be better off for it.

Wow.  That's some ego you have there, chief.   To actually believe that you know more about what someone else wants or needs than they do?  Arrogant, smug, and kinda pathetic.

I sure as hell do not need a squadmate to die in order to make beating the Reapers "meaningful" -- not that I'm really looking for "meaningful" of the sort you mean in my games. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:21 .

[WizenSlinky0]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Peanut butter helps!

Not funny and not cool.

Was actually being quite serious in a joking manner.

Peanut butter is my go-to for any kind of emotional pain. 100% serious, actually a family remedy of sorts since it seems to run in my family.

Unless you're allergic. In which case, I agree, not cool!

[Hathur]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Sure you do, you don't know what you want or what you need. You'll be better off for it. Victory over the Reapers will be all the more meaningful that way.

Sounds to mee like sumwons bweing a bwit of a gwumpy pants..... Kitty hug will cheer you up!



No kitty! Not the eyes! Bad kitty! 

Modifié par Hathur, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:22 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Wow.  That's some ego you have there, chief.   To actually believe that you know more about what someone else wants or needs than they do?  Arrogant, smug, and kinda pathetic.

Somebody has to make that call. If we turned the entire game into fan service it would lose all depth, rendering it a shallow mess of cop-outs and predictability.

There should be surprises, there should be moments that make you angry, moments that leave you feeling powerless... followed up by moments of triumph.

Maybe you need anger and powerlessness in your entertainment. 

Others don't. 

I certainly don't.  In fact, if something I expect entertainment out of gives me those sorts of things instead, I pretty much just turn it off, walk out, quit  playing, whatever... and try to get my money back if I spent any.  

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:25 .

[WizenSlinky0]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Wow.  That's some ego you have there, chief.   To actually believe that you know more about what someone else wants or needs than they do?  Arrogant, smug, and kinda pathetic.

Somebody has to make that call. If we turned the entire game into fan service it would lose all depth, rendering it a shallow mess of cop-outs and predictability.

There should be surprises, there should be moments that make you angry, moments that leave you feeling powerless... followed up by moments of triumph.

So your call is to tell somebody that they have no idea what they 'need'? Good going, cowboy! What one person 'needs' is entirely different from that of another, and to try and assume you know what another 'needs' in their life is just asking to fail. Like, begging for it, even.

[AdmiralCheez]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Sure you do, you don't know what you want or what you need. You'll be better off for it. Victory over the Reapers will be all the more meaningful that way.

You don't know me, you have no right to say what I want or what I need or what I'd be better off with.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Maybe you need anger and powerlessness in your entertainment.

I need the full range of human emotions or otherwise whichever emotions and conditions are relevant to the plot. 

EDIT:  too snarky

So knowing that as many as a trillion individual lives have been snuffed out and that dozens of civilizations face anihilation isn't enough to give you your fix of black mood? 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:31 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Peanut butter helps!

Not funny and not cool.

Well, there's always fudge, chocolate and ice cream.

Modifié par Kaiser Shepard, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:31 .

[AdmiralCheez]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Sure I do and can and did.

Sorry, but you're wrong.

[AdmiralCheez]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Not every detail or event should be up to you because not everything is up to Shepard.

Never argued for this to begin with.

[rapscallioness]

@AdmiralCheez: Yeah, I want the "Rainbows and Butterflies", too. Yes, it should be challenging, on the edge of your seat because you don't know...but in the end, I want my ppl safe.

I don't see the killing off of major characters for the emotional impact as mature storytelling. I see it as emotional extortion. A cheap sucker punch. And these demands for such standards of realism is bewildering in the context of such an unrealistic video game.

I understand there are those that enjoy those situations, and that's cool. However, I would like, and expect, the Option for Rainbows and Butterflies.

I thought your OP put it quite eloquently and sincerely. However, do not underestimate your (ppl in general) impact on life situations in the real world. One has no idea the ripples they cause, for good or bad, in the real world. The smallest random act of kindness can have a huge effect. You never know when someone is at the end of their rope, and then here "you" come w/ some small random act of kindness that makes a difference in their lives. In that moment of their lives. Then so on..and so on..Ever see the movie, "It's a Wonderful Life"? We affect others. Then others affect others and so it goes.

No one is powerless. It can feel that way because, unlike in the video games, we don't get that immediate knowing. That immediate gratification of seeing the impact of our little choices. We never get to know, but we do impact each other. Profoundly.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Saphra Deden wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

You don't know me, you have no right to say what I want or what I need or what I'd be better off with.

Sure I do and can and did. If the developers let you make this story you'd get board with it. There'd be no twists, no surprises, no challenges.

Not every detail or event should be up to you because not everything is up to Shepard. Sometimes all Shepard can do is adapt and try to make the best of bad circumstances.

And if Shep could do everything right all the time and be perfect, Saren would have died on Eden Prime, and that would have been that.  No one dies, no one suffers, nothing. 

But Shep isn't perfect.  Shep is hundreds of billions, maybe trillions of deaths away from having absolute control. 


But that's not enough for you.  You need to make sure that it's shoved in the player's face. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 octobre 2011 - 03:35 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

rapscallioness wrote...

I don't see the killing off of major characters for the emotional impact as mature storytelling. I see it as emotional extortion. A cheap sucker punch.

DING!  Exactly. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Yeah and I see all your "arguments" against it to be nothing more than excuses you  invent to spare yourself the pain of a difficult choice or scene.

And what makes you think that everyone wants or needs to get pain and suffering and torment and loss and anguish from their entertainment?
 

[Codyacsmith]

rapscallioness wrote...

@AdmiralCheez: Yeah, I want the "Rainbows and Butterflies", too. Yes, it should be challenging, on the edge of your seat because you don't know...but in the end, I want my ppl safe.

I don't see the killing off of major characters for the emotional impact as mature storytelling. I see it as emotional extortion. A cheap sucker punch. And these demands for such standards of realism is bewildering in the context of such an unrealistic video game.

I understand there are those that enjoy those situations, and that's cool. However, I would like, and expect, the Option for Rainbows and Butterflies.

I thought your OP put it quite eloquently and sincerely. However, do not underestimate your (ppl in general) impact on life situations in the real world. One has no idea the ripples they cause, for good or bad, in the real world. The smallest random act of kindness can have a huge effect. You never know when someone is at the end of their rope, and then here "you" come w/ some small random act of kindness that makes a difference in their lives. In that moment of their lives. Then so on..and so on..Ever see the movie, "It's a Wonderful Life"? We affect others. Then others affect others and so it goes.

No one is powerless. It can feel that way because, unlike in the video games, we don't get that immediate knowing. That immediate gratification of seeing the impact of our little choices. We never get to know, but we do impact each other. Profoundly.

This. I agree with this.

[AdmiralCheez]

Saphra Deden wrote...

"Nobody should die because I don't want that to happen!"

Approximately six specific characters should be able to survive under certain conditions.  Failing that, exactly who dies should at least be partially determined by the player.

That is my argument.

[Hathur]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Hathur wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Sure you do, you don't know what you want or what you need. You'll be better off for it. Victory over the Reapers will be all the more meaningful that way.

Sounds to mee like sumwons bweing a bwit of a gwumpy pants..... Kitty hug will cheer you up!



No kitty! Not the eyes! Bad kitty! 

I don't know if it worked on them, but that sure cheered me up.

Well at least it cheered someone up.... seems to have bounced off Saph with no effect. "The grump is strong with this one"

Yeesh I never thought I'd see the day where I'd actually endorse the use of a mild narcotic to calm people the heck down.... *yoda voice* much anger with this one.