4309 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

And Xili fails to make any sense, as usual.

It's when I start to make sense to someone who thinks like you that I should be scared. But what are you talking about this time?

Being able to justify the slaughter of innocent, harmless pyjaks, you heartless Renegade!

If she was wholly sane, she wouldn't be Renegade.

[Virginian]

Bogsnot1 wrote...

One fantasy that Bioware has fulfilled for many people through the ME series is the Captain Kirk Fantasy. Bangin' the Blue Babes.

More of a John Crichton fantasy for me, if he was a girl and into girls.

Never liked Kirk, always came off as a douche to me.

[Killjoy Cutter]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

I agree we shouldn't strip away player choices... For the most of the time.

In a game where choice is key. Then having that one moment of helplessness is even stronger, that one moment where there is nothing you can do to change the outcome. Sorry, but sometimes you shouldn't be able to take a third option. Sometimes you should face the no-win scenario.

And I'm not saying there SHOULDN'T be that moment of helplessness.  The thing is, it doesn't have to be the part where Liara gets blown up.  There are other ways to do it, and in my opinion they're more creative than just saying LOL VIRMIRE TIME KIDS.

Actually, that moment of helplessness is exactly what shouldn't be in the game. 

[frozn89]

Yeah, an ending where you get to save every crew-member should be possible, as long as they make it hard for you to do so. Unlike SM where all you needed was all the ship upgrades combined with the whole loyalty stuff. When and if my Shep save everyone, it should be in a manner that makes you feel like you have actually earned it.

That said, since I am playing as 100% paragon, I think some of my choices from ME1/2 will backfire and make this nearly impossible. Then again, that is exactly how I want it to play out

[Killjoy Cutter]

Xilizhra wrote...

That's not my main problem. I can't kill the rachni queen, I can't kill the Feros colonists, I can't kill the Council...

I really don't understand the outright visceral glee that some people derive from taking the "bloody" path on decisions like those. 

[Computer_God91]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's not my main problem. I can't kill the rachni queen, I can't kill the Feros colonists, I can't kill the Council...

I really don't understand the outright visceral glee that some people derive from taking the "bloody" path on decisions like those. 

I should ask my brother. He plays 100% renegade. He's evil in every game though. Personally the first time I played ME1 I let the concil die and picked "focus on Sovereign." because I didn't want to risk the return of the Reapers to save the council but seeing as everyone in ME2 treats you like you purposely left the council to die because you're just a huge dick not because you didn't want to risk the lives of everyone for the lives of the council. So I save the council now.

[AdmiralCheez]

Computer_God91 wrote...

Never saw the footage for Japan but I did for the other one a long while ago and I remember them saying the water retreated for miles and everyone just sat around investigating and then the huge wave came and all I thought was "What idiots, if the water retreats MILES farther then normal that's when you get the hell out of there." My reaction to the Japan one was "Wow, that really sucks to be in Japan right now." but those tsunami's were inevitable do to it being on a fault line so more or less human stupidity that we decided living on a tiny ass island and packing it to the brim with people sounded like a good idea.

See?  This is the problem.  You feel no pathos nor pity.  Maybe you're better off for it personally, but the rest of the world is not.  It is my opinion that apathy is what dooms civilization.  Yeah, maybe founding a nation over a subduction zone is asking for trouble, but your first reaction should be "my god, that's terrible!"  Not "what idiots."

Here's the footage.  The bad stuff starts about one minute in.  I am seriously choked up from just watching that.  Need chocolate.

I don't see the commercials for the feed the kids but the ones for the help the animals I have to mute because they are so long and annoying. I get it animals are beaten and abused, nothing I can do stop wasting my time with your annoying voice and song lady. God, no wonder why you hate life so much, you care about stuff way too much. Do you cry when celebrities die too? When Steve Jobs died I made a lame joke and moved on with my day. When Ryan Dunn died I called him an idiot for driving drunk and said "If you make stupid choices, bad sh!t can happen."

I don't really get worked up when celebrities die.  They're just one person, someone I didn't know, and while it's truly a shame when a great, creative mind goes to waste (and is definitely no fun for the people close to him/her), I find it hard to cry at the funeral of a stranger.  After all, everyone dies.

But when I see suffering, or great tragedies where so many people are needlessly hurt or killed, I can't help but feel it a little.  And I don't think I'm going to change that about myself, because the first step to changing something is giving a sh*t about it.

You were DEAD for two years and now what could have been two years of preparation is now a couple of months. There was nothing you could do. Mistakes happen, you sound like the kind of person to blame yourself for things that are out of your control and that aren't your fault. I don't. If I couldn't have done better, if it wasn't my fault then too bad that sucks, can't change what's already happened. I just have to keep going and hope I can save the rest of the GALAXY and not worry about the 50+ lives I couldn't save because if I do then I might waste the time I could have spent saving everyone else moping around at the loss of a town or a kid and then cause more losses because I stopped and cryed for their misfortune. I'm not a God, I can't save everyone. Losses will happen, it's unavoidable. I gain nothing for beating myself up for it.

And I think that's the difference between you and me.  When something bad happens, I ask myself how I could have helped prevent it, and how I can act now to prevent such a thing in the future.  I don't look for someone to blame or stop trying to make things better even when my impact is miniscule because even the tiniest amount of good is better than no good at all, and no good comes from pointing the finger and avoiding responsibility.  Yeah, it frustrates me that I can't save the world, but I can try.  By god, I can try.

It's nice to have a little game to myself where I can save the galaxy if I try hard enough.

You'll read all that up above and think I'm one cold hearted son of a b!tch. Want something that might sound ironic? I play paragon 100% with some renegade peppered here and there. I find it sorta ironic cause everything above sounds very renegade, which is a path I refuse to take unless 100% necessary.

Then the reasons you go renegade are different than mine.  Two people can do the same thing for different reasons.

[Kaiser Shepard]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's not my main problem. I can't kill the rachni queen, I can't kill the Feros colonists, I can't kill the Council...

I really don't understand the outright visceral glee that some people derive from taking the "bloody" path on decisions like those.

Nobody does, we those make decisions because we place duty and and logic above whatever you use when making decisions.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's not my main problem. I can't kill the rachni queen, I can't kill the Feros colonists, I can't kill the Council...

I really don't understand the outright visceral glee that some people derive from taking the "bloody" path on decisions like those.

Nobody does, we those make decisions because we place duty and and logic above whatever you use when making decisions.

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

[Killjoy Cutter]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

Never saw the footage for Japan but I did for the other one a long while ago and I remember them saying the water retreated for miles and everyone just sat around investigating and then the huge wave came and all I thought was "What idiots, if the water retreats MILES farther then normal that's when you get the hell out of there." My reaction to the Japan one was "Wow, that really sucks to be in Japan right now." but those tsunami's were inevitable do to it being on a fault line so more or less human stupidity that we decided living on a tiny ass island and packing it to the brim with people sounded like a good idea.

See?  This is the problem.  You feel no pathos nor pity.  Maybe you're better off for it personally, but the rest of the world is not.  It is my opinion that apathy is what dooms civilization.  Yeah, maybe founding a nation over a subduction zone is asking for trouble, but your first reaction should be "my god, that's terrible!"  Not "what idiots."

Here's the footage.  The bad stuff starts about one minute in.  I am seriously choked up from just watching that.  Need chocolate.

(Also, human habitation of Japan is thousands of years older than anyone having a clue what a "subduction zone" is, or what actually causes earthquakes, or the causal link between quakes and tsunamis.) 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 09 octobre 2011 - 11:09 .

[Dave of Canada]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Colonists have been infected with an alien disease which might or might not be cured upon killing the infector, do you kill them or do you knock them out and hope they wake up okay?

*shoots them dead*

*later in ME2*

"Hello, we're from Feros and we're all horribly sick and we're having signs of the Thorian's control. :("
"Didn't I kill you to stop this from happening?!"

[Killjoy Cutter]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Colonists have been infected with an alien disease which might or might not be cured upon killing the infector, do you kill them or do you knock them out and hope they wake up okay?

*shoots them dead*

Renegade rationalization always cracks me up.

[KotorEffect3]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's not my main problem. I can't kill the rachni queen, I can't kill the Feros colonists, I can't kill the Council...

I really don't understand the outright visceral glee that some people derive from taking the "bloody" path on decisions like those.

Nobody does, we those make decisions because we place duty and and logic above whatever you use when making decisions.

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Yeah it cracks me up how renegades claim they are more logical in their decision making.

[AdmiralCheez]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Actually, there's a bit of rationale behind that.

1. We don't know exactly how the spores affect them and how permanent the condition is.  They may be stuck as mindless thralls in constant pain for the rest of their lives.  Without any knowledge that they will get better (and no reason to think that it's even possible), killing them could be considered doing them a favor.

2. They're shooting at you.  They want to kill you.  And they're not going to back down because they're being mind-controlled by a giant plant that's fighting for its survival.  It is really, really hard (and somewhat suicidal) to try to make nice with the guy pounding slugs into you.

Granted, I always try to kill as few as possible, but not going out of your way to spare them is hardly pointless slaughter.

[Xilizhra]

It is really, really hard (and somewhat suicidal) to try to make nice with the guy pounding slugs into you.

For a given definition of "hard," maybe. I don't even need grenades, just activate Barrier and punch them out.

[Killjoy Cutter]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Actually, there's a bit of rationale behind that.

1. We don't know exactly how the spores affect them and how permanent the condition is.  They may be stuck as mindless thralls in constant pain for the rest of their lives.  Without any knowledge that they will get better (and no reason to think that it's even possible), killing them could be considered doing them a favor.

2. They're shooting at you.  They want to kill you.  And they're not going to back down because they're being mind-controlled by a giant plant that's fighting for its survival.  It is really, really hard (and somewhat suicidal) to try to make nice with the guy pounding slugs into you.

Granted, I always try to kill as few as possible, but not going out of your way to spare them is hardly pointless slaughter.

I gassed them all and killed the Thorian on my first time through, figuring that if they were still trying to take me out after I killed it, I could reconsider.  Seemed the best solution at the time, since I had been given the tool to finish the mission without killing civilians 

[Kaiser Shepard]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

LoL @ slaughtering the Ferros colonists in the name of "duty and logic". 

Colonists have been infected with an alien disease which might or might not be cured upon killing the infector, do you kill them or do you knock them out and hope they wake up okay?

*shoots them dead*

Renegade rationalization always cracks me up.

Suppose that's one thing Paragon aren't capable of, rationalising, at least not beyond "that's the blue option, so I'll choose that".

As for Feros, I personally didn't kill anyone there, but I do want that to bite me in the ass.

[Aggie Punbot]

In all fairness, Killjoy, I can see why some people would kill them all. Releasing a nerve gas is a risky action to take (regardless of how 'harmless' it may or may be). Pragmatic Shepards may simply feel that it's better to be safe than sorry.

[Inquisitor Recon]

KotorEffect3 wrote...
Yeah it cracks me up how renegades claim they are more logical in their decision making.

Which decision now? I spared the colonists but you could certainly justify leaving no survivors. We know virtually nothing about the thorian and the condition of those colonists. What if their "infection" isn't cured and instead could mutate and spread? Nobody's going to care that Shepard saved them if there is a pandemic on a populated planet a few years later.

[KotorEffect3]

Xilizhra wrote...

It is really, really hard (and somewhat suicidal) to try to make nice with the guy pounding slugs into you.

For a given definition of "hard," maybe. I don't even need grenades, just activate Barrier and punch them out.

The way I see it the colonists would have crap weapons while Shepard would have top of the line high quality armor with kinetic shielding.   I can take a few hits while I deploy the gas grenades.

[Dave of Canada]

I don't see why you're laughing at the rationalization when it's confirmed to be a problem in ME2.

[AdmiralCheez]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Suppose that's one thing Paragon aren't capable of, rationalising, at least not beyond "that's the blue option, so I'll choose that".

Killjoy Cutter is not an adequte representation of most paragon players.

As for Feros, I personally didn't kill anyone there, but I do want that to bite me in the ass.

Ye olde foreshadowing suggests that it will.

[KotorEffect3]

ReconTeam wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...
Yeah it cracks me up how renegades claim they are more logical in their decision making.

Which decision now? I spared the colonists but you could certainly justify leaving no survivors. We know virtually nothing about the thorian and the condition of those colonists. What if their "infection" isn't cured and instead could mutate and spread? Nobody's going to care that Shepard saved them if there is a pandemic on a populated planet a few years later.

I am talking about renegade attitudes in general I often see in the forums, I often see a rational viewpoint to both decisions in this particular instance and I often see both sides of the coin in most decisions in the series.  I just get annoyed that some of the renegade players try to invalidate the paragon point of view.

[AdmiralCheez]

Dave of Canada wrote...

I don't see why you're laughing at the rationalization when it's confirmed to be a problem in ME2.

Becauses Killjoy's in a derpy mood today (no offense bro).  I certainly don't feel that way, and I'm much more inclined to be paragon than renegade.

[Dave of Canada]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Ye olde foreshadowing suggests that it will.

I doubt it will, I killed everybody at the colony and shot Shiala and they still had a nameless colonist come and tell me they're grateful for having saved them but they're sick and hurting.