127 réponses à ce sujet

[Bryy_Miller]

Yeah. Lucas neuters The Force big time in the prequels, to the extent of explaining it as bacteria (which doesn't explain it at all).

[KLUME777]

Wentletrap wrote...

Pacifien wrote...

As for lightsaber duels, the flashy ones are in the prequels, but the best one I still think is in Empire Strikes Back. Because Luke is trying very hard and Darth Vader isn't trying at all. That's how much better Darth Vader was than Luke.

"The Force is with you, young Skywalker... but you are not a Jedi yet..."

That line alone, delivered by Vader's silhouette, has more dramatic weight than anything in the prequel movies.

My favorite thing about the duel was the great use of the environment (flying debris and broken window). 

I've said it before on these boards:  for the most part, movies were much better before CGI.

 

I totally agree, I think CGI has kind of ruined movies of today.

[Blastback]

I grew up with Star Wars, and it will always have a special place in my heart. But I've become somewhat jaded with it.

Now my love for the Original Trilogy is unchanging. Lucas can screw with it all he wants, and I hate the changes, but nothing can or will take away from what those films meant to me as a kid.

The EU is a mixed bag. The X-wing series was awesome, and Shadows of the Empire was cool. I loved Anakin Solo. But starting with the NJO, the Star Wars started moving in the wrong direction for me. I get that people like darker and edgier material, but that just isn't what Star Wars should be in my mind. It is that genre where the good guys win and ride into the sunset.

And yeah, I hated the Travissty's writing. And this is coming from a huge Republic Commando fan.

[Il Divo]

chunkyman wrote...

Zanallen wrote...


My issue with it is that it seemed rushed in odd spurts, kind of contrived and relied on stupid events.

One of my favorite stupid moments was in Revenge of the Sith where Obi-Wan has those little droid things land on his ship during the opening scene. Instead of force pushing them off (like a logical person would do), he has Anakin shoot and ram his ship. Seriously, someone must have realized how illogical and stupid that was when reading the script, why didn't they tell Lucas to change it?!?

Still, if we relied on moments like this to condemn the prequels, we can hyperanalyze the original trilogy as well. When dealing with the Ewoks, why didn't Luke simply summon his lightsaber and cut everyone down from the trap? Events often happen as the plot demands and writers are occasionally forgetful of the lore they themselves establish.

[Blastback]

Il Divo wrote...

chunkyman wrote...

Zanallen wrote...


My issue with it is that it seemed rushed in odd spurts, kind of contrived and relied on stupid events.

One of my favorite stupid moments was in Revenge of the Sith where Obi-Wan has those little droid things land on his ship during the opening scene. Instead of force pushing them off (like a logical person would do), he has Anakin shoot and ram his ship. Seriously, someone must have realized how illogical and stupid that was when reading the script, why didn't they tell Lucas to change it?!?

Still, if we relied on moments like this to condemn the prequels, we can hyperanalyze the original trilogy as well. When dealing with the Ewoks, why didn't Luke simply summon his lightsaber and cut everyone down from the trap? Events often happen as the plot demands and writers are occasionally forgetful of the lore they themselves establish.

Here's another one.  Why did they have to skim the entire trench to reach the exhaust port.  Why not just enter it right in range to fire?

[Bryy_Miller]

Blastback wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

chunkyman wrote...

Zanallen wrote...


My issue with it is that it seemed rushed in odd spurts, kind of contrived and relied on stupid events.

One of my favorite stupid moments was in Revenge of the Sith where Obi-Wan has those little droid things land on his ship during the opening scene. Instead of force pushing them off (like a logical person would do), he has Anakin shoot and ram his ship. Seriously, someone must have realized how illogical and stupid that was when reading the script, why didn't they tell Lucas to change it?!?

Still, if we relied on moments like this to condemn the prequels, we can hyperanalyze the original trilogy as well. When dealing with the Ewoks, why didn't Luke simply summon his lightsaber and cut everyone down from the trap? Events often happen as the plot demands and writers are occasionally forgetful of the lore they themselves establish.

Here's another one.  Why did they have to skim the entire trench to reach the exhaust port.  Why not just enter it right in range to fire?

That's easy. 

1) More time to pck off/pull away the protection
2) Better chance of lining up the shot right
3) Far less of a clusterfudge

[Il Divo]

Blastback wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

chunkyman wrote...

Zanallen wrote...


My issue with it is that it seemed rushed in odd spurts, kind of contrived and relied on stupid events.

One of my favorite stupid moments was in Revenge of the Sith where Obi-Wan has those little droid things land on his ship during the opening scene. Instead of force pushing them off (like a logical person would do), he has Anakin shoot and ram his ship. Seriously, someone must have realized how illogical and stupid that was when reading the script, why didn't they tell Lucas to change it?!?

Still, if we relied on moments like this to condemn the prequels, we can hyperanalyze the original trilogy as well. When dealing with the Ewoks, why didn't Luke simply summon his lightsaber and cut everyone down from the trap? Events often happen as the plot demands and writers are occasionally forgetful of the lore they themselves establish.

Here's another one.  Why did they have to skim the entire trench to reach the exhaust port.  Why not just enter it right in range to fire?

That is another fun one. The Death Star trench run is classic Star Wars, but it flies completely in the face of all logic.

[Il Divo]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

That's easy. 

1) More time to pck off/pull away the protection
2) Better chance of lining up the shot right
3) Far less of a clusterfudge

 It was a cluster"fudge" either way. They didn't simply enter from a reasonable range. They entered at a range that required knife-fighting through turrents. There was absolutely no reason to enter the trench from that far back. You literally need enough room to enter, level yourself, and pull off the shot. That was really it. In other words, a trench "skirmish", not a trench "run".

[Blastback]

Il Divo wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

That's easy. 

1) More time to pck off/pull away the protection
2) Better chance of lining up the shot right
3) Far less of a clusterfudge

 It was a cluster"fudge" either way. They didn't simply enter from a reasonable range. They entered at a range that required knife-fighting through turrents. There was absolutely no reason to enter the trench from that far back. You literally need enough room to enter, level yourself, and pull off the shot. That was really it. In other words, a trench "skirmish", not a trench "run".

I just always figured, Star Wars logic is not my logic.

[chunkyman]

For the reason behind a trench run, I imagine they did it to avoid laser turrets near the exhaust port. Maybe where they entered the trench was lightly defended so it made approach easy, and they followed the trench to avoid the heavily fortified section where the exhaust port was. If they tried going straight at the exhaust port, they might have been easier to shoot down.

[Il Divo]

Blastback wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

That's easy. 

1) More time to pck off/pull away the protection
2) Better chance of lining up the shot right
3) Far less of a clusterfudge

 It was a cluster"fudge" either way. They didn't simply enter from a reasonable range. They entered at a range that required knife-fighting through turrents. There was absolutely no reason to enter the trench from that far back. You literally need enough room to enter, level yourself, and pull off the shot. That was really it. In other words, a trench "skirmish", not a trench "run".

I just always figured, Star Wars logic is not my logic.

Which is fine. I'll gladly throw away my own logic in exchange for the fun and adventure which Star Wars allows. I just think that calling out the prequels on the logic (or lack of) compared to the originals is rather weak.

[Il Divo]

chunkyman wrote...

For the reason behind a trench run, I imagine they did it to avoid laser turrets near the exhaust port. Maybe where they entered the trench was lightly defended so it made approach easy, and they followed the trench to avoid the heavily fortified section where the exhaust port was. If they tried going straight at the exhaust port, they might have been easier to shoot down.

But that's not really supported by the narrative. There were also still turrets firing at them within the trench itself. The story must give us a reason for why the rebels are sprinting down a track along the Death Star, despite the threat of turrets and much more deadly prospect of being gunned down by Darth Vader, which no one seems to consider for some reason.

Modifié par Il Divo, 08 octobre 2011 - 05:00 .

[chunkyman]

Il Divo wrote...

chunkyman wrote...

For the reason behind a trench run, I imagine they did it to avoid laser turrets near the exhaust port. Maybe where they entered the trench was lightly defended so it made approach easy, and they followed the trench to avoid the heavily fortified section where the exhaust port was. If they tried going straight at the exhaust port, they might have been easier to shoot down.

But that's not really supported by the narrative. There were also still turrets firing at them within the trench itself. The story must give us a reason for why the rebels are sprinting down a track along the Death Star, despite the threat of turrets and much more deadly prospect of being gunned down by Darth Vader, which no one seems to consider for some reason.

I know there isn't any narrative basis for that, I was just trying to justify the plot with my own theory. 

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

The expanded universe, most of them are rubbish.
About them movies, Episode II is the worst. Episode III is a great Tragedy and Episode I only is worth the battles.
The old ones are great, except the Jungle Part in the end of VI.

[Blastback]

On a side note, who else would like to see Gaider and company writing a Rogue Squadron game? Imagine what they could do with Janson..

[Il Divo]

chunkyman wrote...

I know there isn't any narrative basis for that, I was just trying to justify the plot with my own theory. 

Fair point. Sorry for being such a downer. I should probably work on that.

[Jestina]

I never even watched the last three SW movies fully. I guess I would describe them as just feeling...ordinary. Blah CGI, forgettable characters. Nothing like the magic of the first three films.

As for gaming...I was totally killed when West End lost the rights to Star Wars. WOTC promptly turned it into D&D in space. After that I stopped paying attention to anything SW.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

My Favorite Star Wars Games:

Modifié par Jedi Sentinel Arian, 08 octobre 2011 - 05:27 .

[KLUME777]

chunkyman wrote...

Galactic Runner wrote...

Anybody check out the complete saga on blu-ray? Are the changes for better, for worse, or do they not really change the perspective at all?

Out of all the characters in the series, Darth Vader is my favorite. Even though he got tragically burned on Mustafar, I consider him very awesome, even more so when, in Episode I, it was revealed that his Midi-Chlorian count is higher than even Yoda's, making him more powerful in the Force in my opinion.

Changes, what changes?!?! 

Oh god, what did Lucas do now? 

Okay, the Krayt Dragon call in Ep 4 has been changed to a seriously retarded sound.
Some rocks were added in Ep 4 where R2-D2 is hiding from the sand people, yet dissapear when R2-D2 goes out.
The Scene in Ep 6 of Jabbas door now zooms in (which imo makes it less effective and less intimidating).
Some extra TIE fighters were added in the Ep 6 space battle, except they jarringly appear out of nowhere, major wtf (start at 2:00).
The ewoks now blink creepily.
Darth Vader Yells "NOOO!" when he throws the emporer in Ep 6.
The puppet Yoda in Ep 1 is replaced by a CGI Yoda (a mistake imo, the puppet had more personality).
The Greedo and Han scene is redone, but Greedo still shots first.
A CGI dug was added to Jabbas palace.
A few other minor changes, like improving lightsaber effects, hardly noticeable.


Not all the EU is crap, the Legacy of the Force book series is pretty good and i like the character of Jacen Solo. Some of the games set during or after the movies are good (Jedi Knight: jedi Outcast, Empire at War: Forces of Corruption, Republic Commando). And of coarse, everything set before the movies in the Old Republic are good (baring Bioware's TOR - the more i read about it the more i hate it. Both Revan and the Exile are ruined, and Bioware seems set to ruin another of their game series like they did to Dragon Age).

Modifié par KLUME777, 08 octobre 2011 - 05:33 .

[chunkyman]

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

snip

I noticed they were all old games lol. I've played most of them, and they are amazing. I loved Jedi Academy, too bad they never made a 360 or PS3 continuation of it. 

Am I the only one who thinks they haven't made a single good Star Wars game since Battlefront 2? (I found The Force Unleashed to be total crap.)

Modifié par chunkyman, 08 octobre 2011 - 05:32 .

[Bryy_Miller]

Il Divo wrote...

Blastback wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Bryy_Miller wrote...

That's easy. 

1) More time to pck off/pull away the protection
2) Better chance of lining up the shot right
3) Far less of a clusterfudge

 It was a cluster"fudge" either way. They didn't simply enter from a reasonable range. They entered at a range that required knife-fighting through turrents. There was absolutely no reason to enter the trench from that far back. You literally need enough room to enter, level yourself, and pull off the shot. That was really it. In other words, a trench "skirmish", not a trench "run".

I just always figured, Star Wars logic is not my logic.

Which is fine. I'll gladly throw away my own logic in exchange for the fun and adventure which Star Wars allows. I just think that calling out the prequels on the logic (or lack of) compared to the originals is rather weak.

Another way of putting it is "Lucas plagarising every movie he ever saw". 

Star Wars is goddamn CELEBRATED for its amount of plagarism.

[chunkyman]

KLUME777 wrote...

Okay, the Krayt Dragon call in Ep 4 has been changed to a seriously retarded sound.

That was terrible, why did it even need changed to begin with?!?

Some extra TIE fighters were added in the Ep 6 space battle, except they jarringly appear out of nowhere, major wtf (start at 2:00).

So to "improve" a scene he randomly adds more TIE fighters that appear from nowhere?

Darth Vader Yells "NOOO!" when he throws the emporer in Ep 6.

This is the worst piece of editing I've ever seen. This seen was PERFECT before, and now it has been completely and hopelessly ruined by Lucas.

The puppet Yoda in Ep 1 is replaced by a CGI Yoda (a mistake imo, the puppet had more personality).

I'm okay with this because it makes it more consistent with Episodes 2 and 3. But if he CGI's the original Yoda, I will walk to Skywalker ranch and bust his nose open lol.

[csfteeeer]

oh **** yes.

My Favorite is.... Well, i don't actually have a favorite, i love ALL of the Original trilogy equally.
Revenge of the Sith was alright i guess, while the other 2 where gigantic bubbles of donkey spunk.

[csfteeeer]

chunkyman wrote...

KLUME777 wrote...

Okay, the Krayt Dragon call in Ep 4 has been changed to a seriously retarded sound.

That was terrible, why did it even need changed to begin with?!?

Because Lucas is a Retard.

[Il Divo]

chunkyman wrote...

KLUME777 wrote...

Okay, the Krayt Dragon call in Ep 4 has been changed to a seriously retarded sound.

That was terrible, why did it even need changed to begin with?!?

Some extra TIE fighters were added in the Ep 6 space battle, except they jarringly appear out of nowhere, major wtf (start at 2:00).

So to "improve" a scene he randomly adds more TIE fighters that appear from nowhere?

Darth Vader Yells "NOOO!" when he throws the emporer in Ep 6.

This is the worst piece of editing I've ever seen. This seen was PERFECT before, and now it has been completely and hopelessly ruined by Lucas.

The puppet Yoda in Ep 1 is replaced by a CGI Yoda (a mistake imo, the puppet had more personality).

I'm okay with this because it makes it more consistent with Episodes 2 and 3. But if he CGI's the original Yoda, I will walk to Skywalker ranch and bust his nose open lol.

Excluding the Yoda alteration, I gotta say that most of those links kill me inside. Why Lucas thinks they were an improvement or even necessary is a mystery.