3794 réponses à ce sujet

[DaringMoosejaw]

Lard wrote...

Spartanburger wrote...

Ancient Metal wrote...

Multiplayer.

Optional to play it.

Mandatory to pay for it.

Don't want to play MP? Don't play it. You can still achieve what you want through SP and SP is as long as ME2.

Don't want to pay for MP? Don't pay for it. If you weren't planning on playing it in the first place, then why pay for it?

The MP directly affects the SP game.
That's why.

It ONLY does so if you choose it to.

[NOD-INFORMER37]

Systems Alliance Prime Minister Amul Shastri arrived on the Citadel today, beginning a planned, week-long visit to the station. The Prime Minister was greeted as he arrived by a small crowd of onlookers, who watched as he was whisked away by C-Sec and his MoJ bodyguards to visit with the Citadel Council. Most of the Prime Minister’s visit will be spent at personal meetings with individual Council members, as well as in talks with representatives from throughout Citadel Space. It is expected that trade and defense concerns will be high on the Prime Minister’s agenda, though he will not spend all of his time working: This evening, he is scheduled to attend a showing of the salarian play Saramel, followed by a reception at a private diplomatic residence on the Presidium.

[JigPig]

[quote]rolson00 wrote...



[quote]JigPig wrote...
Let's say $500,000 was spent on the MP component.

If that $500,000 was spent on the SP portion of the game. It would improve it.

Fact.
[/quote]

oh sorry i had no idea you were an expert
[/quote]

Not an example of a retort, isn't it past your bed time?

[quote]Maeshone wrote...


It is also extremely likely that Bioware only got those 500.000
BECAUSE they were adding multiplayer. [/quote]
Prove it
[quote]Unless you can PROVE otherwise,
this is the most likely circumstance. [/quote]
Nope, you made a claim, burden of proof lies on you.

[quote]Because no matter what you may
think about EA, they are not morons and know how to run a business.
(hint: it's not by making one of your most succesful developers dig for
spare change in the office couch)[/quote]
That's all fine and dandy but we are discussing whether or not the inclusion of MP or funds used in development of, could or could not affect the length/quality of singleplayer.



[/quote]

[quote]stysiaq wrote...
1. it fits the game, because the fights are everywhere[/quote]
What.
[quote]
2. it allows you to play for a moment as someone other than Shepard, which is awesome[/quote]
The ME series is centered around a centrel protaganist called Shepard. The MP is catering to the shooter crowd, plain and simple.
[quote]
3. It allows you to enjoy the universe even more[/quote]
Why not implement more of the universe in singleplayer?
[quote]
4. you didn't play it, you don't judge it[/quote]
and you haven't played it either, I have just as much right to judge from what I've seen.
[quote]
5. you don't have to play it[/quote]
You are right, I'll end the trilogy at ME2.
[quote]
6. longer SP is not always the best choice, because SP isn't the peak of gameplay [/quote]
ME is a singleplayer series. Choosing the third game to implement multiplayer is a horrible decision. Did you at any time during your playthrough of ME1&ME2 think "Hey, I can't wait to shoot some alienz in multiplayaaa XDXD"
[quote]
7. you can play a gazzilion other games and stop whining "OMG MY ME3 SP IS TOO SHORT D: "[/quote]
What
[quote]
8. whining about the obvious fact, that AAA titles are made to make as much money as possible is stupid[/quote]
Where did I say the opposite?
[quote]
9. I'd rather fight along 3 other people for a while rather than spend the same amount of time mining dem minerals[/quote]
"A is stupid, B is stupid, substitute B in place of Feature A"
[quote]
10.
ME gameplay is awesome, and ME3 will consist of shooting things 90% of
the time, so I don't see a reason why not include more shooting[/quote]
If you played ME solely for the combat aspect, that speaks volumes about you.

[Killjoy Cutter]

whitey2525 wrote...

butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt butthurt

Could you at least come up with a new pathetic "kewl" catchall ad hom attack phrase, chief? 

[someguy1231]

Why are people still playing the "MP diverts resources from SP" card? As has been pointed out many, MANY times (including the OP), the MP is being handled by a different studio. If it weren't for this decision to include co-op, this studio would not be involved in the game to begin with. The money and resources they've been allocated weren't taken from the SP team, they presumably came from the higher-ups at EA or Bioware who allocated them for this specific purpose. You can't claim the SP is being "diluted" when it never had those resources to begin with. The SP is being developed by the same studio that did the first two, and what info has been released so far (ME3 having at least twice as much dialogue as ME2) suggests the SP campaign won't be compromised in the slightest.

Again, this bears repeating: it is not the case that the team working on the single-player was suddenly told "OK, you guys gotta implement a co-op feature. Make some cuts." Resources are NOT being "diverted" - because those resources were never meant for the single-player to begin with!

Quit being so selfish and entitled and recognize that your precious single-player isn't being diluted. In my opinion, the real reason for all this "outrage" is simply because you can't tolerate the idea of a team of developers working on this game for a feature that isn't single-player.

[bigheadzach]

Lard wrote...

BatmanPWNS wrote...

I am pretty sure you don't even know 1% of the fans opinion about MP and reduce it? It didn't stop Assassin's Creed from selling, it didn't stop Portal, it sure as hell didn't stop Uncharted 2. Yes they may have DLC maps released but ME has useless stuff like appearence pack and DLC weapons released just to get money as well.

Lots of people bought the Spice Girls, lots of people buy Justin Bieber too.

There are plenty of examples of people buying crap.

I was wondering when someone would throw out the "Mass Effect Hipster" argument.

[Lard]

Il Divo wrote...

This argument has no basis in logic. People buy what they find appealing. That you think Mass Effect is a good game is irrelevant to its popularity, much like the Spice Girls or Justin Bieber. You dislike the latter singers, so you think they are "bad" and assume ignorance on the part of listeners. It assumes a very objective stance on what is an acceptable form of entertainment. Mass Effect is popular. I think Mass Effect is bad.

The only difference in the two positions is that you enjoy Mass Effect, and so you want to claim that it is immune from the popularity argument.

There's nothing wrong with a good product being popular for its quality.

There's something wrong with a product being focus tested and bullet pointed in order to appeal a completely different crowd from the original intended audience, just to make a quick buck.

[Cainne Chapel]

Darkeus wrote...

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

Darkeus wrote...

Like I said, I am on the opposite side.  A horrible disaster is what I am seeing and 80 bucks for a Collectors Edition for a game that may have just been ruined is a big deal for my wallet.

And my worries are not gone because of the faq.  It was a PR Faq that was rushed out to quell the outrage.  They could say anything and that is where blind faith comes in.

You really believe everything you read?  Especially coming from a company that was feeling MAJOR heat?

They don't lie, at least if they do it is VERY rare, but they WILL use lawyer-speak at times when it's obvious they can't say anything. That FAQ had no lawyer-speak, so I see no reason to assume everything in it is a lie.

It has plenty of double-speak in it.  And it will probably affect the Single Player way more than they admit.  It is PR to defend an unpopular decision that alienates fans.  

Right dark, its realy healthy to be distrustful of the people making an entertainment venue that you "Claim" to enjoy playing.

Why should we take your word over the Devs again? Considering they have way more insight on the IP and inner workings than you ever will?

Are they always right? No, they're human.  But dont play off like you're somehow above everything when you're not.  Not anymore than anyone else on this forum.

[N7Infernox]

Wow this thread is moving a mile a minute

[Zanallen]

Lard wrote...

And it's the same four or five people saying "Dude! MP is AWESOME!" over and over again.

I was including those in the initial 14 or so. 4-5 negatives, 6-7 positives and a group just along for the ride.

[Darkeus]

Cainne Chapel wrote...

Lard wrote...

Spartanburger wrote...

Ancient Metal wrote...

Multiplayer.

Optional to play it.

Mandatory to pay for it.

Don't want to play MP? Don't play it. You can still achieve what you want through SP and SP is as long as ME2.

Don't want to pay for MP? Don't pay for it. If you weren't planning on playing it in the first place, then why pay for it?

The MP directly affects the SP game.
That's why.

Read the FAQ posted by the Dev.  It DOES effect the SP game as an ALTERNATIVE means to SP.  So SP/MP you can end with the same result.  So two different paths, same ending.

Whats the problem here?

You believe that?  You think it will not have unintentional or intentional effects on how Single Player is played out or maybe even affects it with bugs.

I see MANY problems that could happen with this.

[Lard]

someguy1231 wrote...

Why are people still playing the "MP diverts resources from SP" card? As has been pointed out many, MANY times (including the OP), the MP is being handled by a different studio.

MP takes resources directly away from the SP game. Every single time.

That is indisputable.

[addiction21]

Lard wrote...

The MP directly affects the SP game.
That's why.

How does it affect it?

[Zakatak757]

I don't LOVE the idea of co-op, I'm just pissed off at all the people condemning it without knowing any of what goes on behind the scenes.

I suggest you haters take a look at the new thread.

[Il Divo]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Lard wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/323/index/8481789/86#8489364

I wonder if any of the "you anti-MP guys are all paranoid fanboy geeks" crowd is going to bother with a reasoned and civil response to the concerns listed in the post linked above...

Of course they won't.

Dudebro shooter fans don't know how to reason.

DnD = MMO. Your argument is invalid.

Um... huh?   What are you trying to say here? 

About 40-50 pages back, he attempted to compare pen and paper RPGs as being similar to MMO online games, in comparison to single player CRPGs, also claiming that RPGs must be "single-player".

[JigPig]

Eudaemonium wrote...
It is entirely feasible that hypothetical $500,000 was only gifted to the ME team to create MP, and thus how that additional cash injection could have affected SP is irrelevant, since the finances did not exist.

Provide a source on that.
I can throw out pseudo-intellectual what-if's all day.

[Lard]

addiction21 wrote...

Lard wrote...

The MP directly affects the SP game.
That's why.

How does it affect it?

Don't know, I'm quoting what has been confirmed by Bioware.

[AdmiralCheez]

Lard wrote...

Anyone with common sense knows what I am saying about MP is fact.

Damn it, I hate it when I can't tell the difference between sincerity and satire.

In the even that you're serious, here's a protip: when arguing common sense, use it.  Saying you are right and that anyone who disagress is stupid while refusing to back up your position with hard evidence makes you look like an idiot.  It doesn't matter which position you are arguing; it's just good form.

In the event that you're trolling: damn, son.  You got me.

[Darkeus]

Cainne Chapel wrote...

Darkeus wrote...

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

Darkeus wrote...

Like I said, I am on the opposite side.  A horrible disaster is what I am seeing and 80 bucks for a Collectors Edition for a game that may have just been ruined is a big deal for my wallet.

And my worries are not gone because of the faq.  It was a PR Faq that was rushed out to quell the outrage.  They could say anything and that is where blind faith comes in.

You really believe everything you read?  Especially coming from a company that was feeling MAJOR heat?

They don't lie, at least if they do it is VERY rare, but they WILL use lawyer-speak at times when it's obvious they can't say anything. That FAQ had no lawyer-speak, so I see no reason to assume everything in it is a lie.

It has plenty of double-speak in it.  And it will probably affect the Single Player way more than they admit.  It is PR to defend an unpopular decision that alienates fans.  

Right dark, its realy healthy to be distrustful of the people making an entertainment venue that you "Claim" to enjoy playing.

Why should we take your word over the Devs again? Considering they have way more insight on the IP and inner workings than you ever will?

Are they always right? No, they're human.  But dont play off like you're somehow above everything when you're not.  Not anymore than anyone else on this forum.

Oh please.  And don't act like everybody tells the truth and doesn't lie to cover their butts.  I know enough to know that their claims it doesn't affect the Single Player. seems unlikely.

Come on man....  Put the Kool-Aid down. 

And Dragon Age 2.  Hell, they told enough lies for that game to fill a huge quota.

I have said before, If I am wrong, I am wrong.  But I have a bad feeling.  Others share my bad feeling.

Modifié par Darkeus, 11 octobre 2011 - 10:13 .

[BeefoTheBold]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

Ancient Metal wrote...

Multiplayer.

Optional to play it.

Mandatory to pay for it.

Well said. Works with Kinect too.

Kinect is ENTIRELY optional. This is exactly the same as complaining about ME3 having an option for a left-handed control scheme and you're pissed that you as a rightie have to pay for their options.

Your point?

Development resources went towards features I don't care about and won't use. There's a good chance that will result in a somewhat lesser game that I'll pay the exact same price for. HOW MUCH more is debateable. But you can bet your ass that a lot of people will see things that they don't like in the game and wonder, "What if there was no MP or Kinect? Would that have been fixed?"

I don't care if it is "optional" or not. I don't want it tacked on to the third game of a singleplayer trilogy when Bioware SHOULD be spending ALL of their resources on ending the trilogy on a high note, eliminating the mountain of problems that have plagued other recent releases like DA2 and basically focusing ALL of their efforts on optimizing the end of this trilogy.

Bioware wants to experiment with doing coop or multiplayer? Okay, I don't like it but I can understand. Why throw it into the last game of a trilogy?

[AdmiralCheez]

Anyway, my primary concern is that I won't be able to play ME3 in my own home because I can't hook up to the internet.  This is reason #1 that I hate Valve and Blizzard right now.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 11 octobre 2011 - 10:11 .

[Darth Vengeant]

Il Divo wrote...

Darth Vengeant wrote...

Except people didnt buy ME because it was popular or to fit in, I certainly didn't, they bought it because it is a good game. Bioware makes good games, for the most part. That is not a popularity trend, it is just a simple fact.

People only buy Spice Girls and Justin Bieber because they dont know any better and are trying to fit in. Kids mostly. They don't know there is actually GOOD music out there that isn't a trendy processed formula for cash. But, you wont hear the media and Teen Beat tell them that.

This argument has no basis in logic. People buy what they find appealing. That you think Mass Effect is a good game is irrelevant to its popularity, much like the Spice Girls or Justin Bieber. You dislike the latter singers, so you think they are "bad" and assume ignorance on the part of listeners. It assumes a very objective stance on what is an acceptable form of entertainment. Mass Effect is popular. I think Mass Effect is bad.

The only difference in the two positions is that you enjoy Mass Effect, and so you want to claim that it is immune from the popularity argument.

It is quite logical. Alot of people buy only because they dont know any better. They are ignorant, they only follow the trend to fit in and be "cool". They simply just dont know any better and like things because everyone else does. They don't know there are MUCH better things out there.

[Lard]

Il Divo wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Lard wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/323/index/8481789/86#8489364

I wonder if any of the "you anti-MP guys are all paranoid fanboy geeks" crowd is going to bother with a reasoned and civil response to the concerns listed in the post linked above...

Of course they won't.

Dudebro shooter fans don't know how to reason.

DnD = MMO. Your argument is invalid.

Um... huh?   What are you trying to say here? 

About 40-50 pages back, he attempted to compare pen and paper RPGs as being similar to MMO online games, in comparison to single player CRPGs, also claiming that RPGs must be "single-player".

I said pen and paper RPGs were more similar to MMOs because you play with a group of people, as opposed to a "regular" RPG like Mass Effect or Final Fantasy where you just play by yourself.

If Il Diva were literate, he would have understood what I was trying to say.

[Il Divo]

Lard wrote...



There's nothing wrong with a good product being popular for its quality.

There's something wrong with a product being focus tested and bullet pointed in order to appeal a completely different crowd from the original intended audience, just to make a quick buck.

All this proves is that popularity =/ quality, which indicates to us that pointing out Justin Bieber is no different than pointing out Mass Effect. The only difference is that you seem to perceive quality in Mass Effect, which is still subjective. Popularity tells us nothing about quality, only that it is popular. Your multiplayer argument only has basis in that you dislike multiplayer.

[NOD-INFORMER37]

Why are ppl so flameful over this and to each other? Man, we're all Mass Effect fans arent we? (srsly, arent we or are some of you CoD sleeper agents o-o)

anyways they'll release more info tommorow at 10 AM, just found out. :]