2261 réponses à ce sujet

[Garrison2009]

Wow... I must admit, I've honestly been intentionally staying away from these forums since Cooperative play was announced because I knew that, in a way, the effect of the news would be much like lobbing a grenade into a nuclear power plant that was already on fire. In essence, it takes the war, about whether RPGs should remain as they always have or change to fit a more modern crowd, and defines both sides and their respective views on the future of gaming very well. Now I'm not going to state my opinion in favor of one side or the other on the matter of the inclusion of Co-op here, as I wish to reserve final judgement of ME3 until I actually have played it, but I honestly am tired of the bigotry and condescension from both sides of the argument. For god's sake, yes, we're all entitled to our opinions, but we should be wary not to dissolve completely into animalistic rages whenever someone posts something that does not necessarily agree with our point of view. Now I know that my words here will not do an iota of good, as this war has been going on for a long time now and will continue to go on whether I choose to participate in it or not, but my warning to you all is simply this: If we cant at least debate with civility about how we think a game should be... How can we be expected to act as rational human beings when debating issues that are FAR more important than this?

Modifié par Garrison2009, 18 octobre 2011 - 05:57 .

[dreman9999]

Garrison2009 wrote...

Wow... I must admit, I've honestly been intentionally staying away from these forums since Cooperative play was announced because I knew that, in a way, the effect of the news would be much like lobbing a grenade into a nuclear power plant that was already on fire. In essence, it takes the war, about whether RPGs should remain as they always have or change to fit a more modern crowd, and defines both sides and their respective views on the future of gaming very well. Now I'm not going to state my opinion in favor of one side or the other on the matter of the inclusion of Co-op here, as I wish to reserve final judgement of ME3 until I actually have played it, but I honestly am tired of the bigotry and condescension from both sides of the argument. For god's sake, yes, we're all entitled to our opinions, but we should be wary not to dissolve completely into animalistic rages whenever someone posts something that does not necessarily agree with our point of view. Now I know that my words here will not do an iota of good, as this war has been going on for a long time now and will continue to go on whether I choose to participate in it or not, but my warning to you all is simply this: If we cant at least debate with civility about how we think a game should be... How can we be expected to act as rational human beings when debating issues that are FAR more important than this?

[Pro_Consul]

Garrison2009 wrote...

How can we be expected to act as rational human beings when debating issues that are FAR more important than this?

You are assuming that everyone posting here IS a rational human being. Overall I have found that to be a rather rare species, sadly. In my experience that majority of human beings are emotional, prejudicial, judgemental, ignorant and/or unthinking. Sadly, though our species is called "thinking man", that is merely a statement about our physical potential, not our actual behavorial tendencies. Hence my sig.

[Balek-Vriege]

iakus wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Please, if your still this forum.....Your going to buy it. If you truely burnt your brigde with Bioware, you would not be here.

I'm still here because I want to know what ME3 will be like.  I didn't care for the direction ME2 went and want to be more careful this time.  I'm not going to blindly accept that everything Bioware makes is "awesome" anymore.

And like I said, I will probably buy ME3 at some point.  To finish Shepard's story if nothing else.  When is still in question.  I will have no need for an online pass, so it's not like I'd need a new copy.  At this point I have to be convinced that single player is going to be such an enthralling experience that it's worth preordering.

 Adding multiplayer did not help their case at all in that.

Expectations are a big deal.  Too high of expectations usually means you're always going to be disappointed.  Too low of expectations and you brainwash yourself into not liking something regardless of merit.

Not jumping on the hype or bash wagon leads to a chance to enjoy a game for what it is rather than what you think it is.


Edit:

Garrison2009 wrote...

Wow... I must admit, I've honestly been intentionally staying away from these forums since Cooperative play was announced because I knew that, in a way, the effect of the news would be much like lobbing a grenade into a nuclear power plant that was already on fire. In essence, it takes the war, about whether RPGs should remain as they always have or change to fit a more modern crowd, and defines both sides and their respective views on the future of gaming very well. Now I'm not going to state my opinion in favor of one side or the other on the matter of the inclusion of Co-op here, as I wish to reserve final judgement of ME3 until I actually have played it, but I honestly am tired of the bigotry and condescension from both sides of the argument. For god's sake, yes, we're all entitled to our opinions, but we should be wary not to dissolve completely into animalistic rages whenever someone posts something that does not necessarily agree with our point of view. Now I know that my words here will not do an iota of good, as this war has been going on for a long time now and will continue to go on whether I choose to participate in it or not, but my warning to you all is simply this: If we cant at least debate with civility about how we think a game should be... How can we be expected to act as rational human beings when debating issues that are FAR more important than this?

Blablabla wall of text.

Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 18 octobre 2011 - 06:11 .

[Garrison2009]

dreman9999 wrote...

Garrison2009 wrote...

Wow... I must admit, I've honestly been intentionally staying away from these forums since Cooperative play was announced because I knew that, in a way, the effect of the news would be much like lobbing a grenade into a nuclear power plant that was already on fire. In essence, it takes the war, about whether RPGs should remain as they always have or change to fit a more modern crowd, and defines both sides and their respective views on the future of gaming very well. Now I'm not going to state my opinion in favor of one side or the other on the matter of the inclusion of Co-op here, as I wish to reserve final judgement of ME3 until I actually have played it, but I honestly am tired of the bigotry and condescension from both sides of the argument. For god's sake, yes, we're all entitled to our opinions, but we should be wary not to dissolve completely into animalistic rages whenever someone posts something that does not necessarily agree with our point of view. Now I know that my words here will not do an iota of good, as this war has been going on for a long time now and will continue to go on whether I choose to participate in it or not, but my warning to you all is simply this: If we cant at least debate with civility about how we think a game should be... How can we be expected to act as rational human beings when debating issues that are FAR more important than this?

lol, practically on the verge of that Dreman.

[Nashiktal]

dreman9999 wrote...

iakus wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Please, if your still this forum.....Your going to buy it. If you truely burnt your brigde with Bioware, you would not be here.

I'm still here because I want to know what ME3 will be like.  I didn't care for the direction ME2 went and want to be more careful this time.  I'm not going to blindly accept that everything Bioware makes is "awesome" anymore.

And like I said, I will probably buy ME3 at some point.  To finish Shepard's story if nothing else.  When is still in question.  I will have no need for an online pass, so it's not like I'd need a new copy.  At this point I have to be convinced that single player is going to be such an enthralling experience that it's worth preordering.

 Adding multiplayer did not help their case at all in that.

Regadeless, new or not. Your buying it.

Point, missing it.

[dreman9999]

Nashiktal wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

iakus wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Please, if your still this forum.....Your going to buy it. If you truely burnt your brigde with Bioware, you would not be here.

I'm still here because I want to know what ME3 will be like.  I didn't care for the direction ME2 went and want to be more careful this time.  I'm not going to blindly accept that everything Bioware makes is "awesome" anymore.

And like I said, I will probably buy ME3 at some point.  To finish Shepard's story if nothing else.  When is still in question.  I will have no need for an online pass, so it's not like I'd need a new copy.  At this point I have to be convinced that single player is going to be such an enthralling experience that it's worth preordering.

 Adding multiplayer did not help their case at all in that.

Regadeless, new or not. Your buying it.

Point, missing it.

I got his point and you missed my point. No matter what. An one who is on this forum and is a fan of ME is buying me3, one way or another. Even if you state you hate it. It rules you and you'll aways come back. If you truelly hatesomething you cut it away, not nag at it.

[Nashiktal]

Iakus never said he hated it. I think you are still missing his point mate. He is worried about some of the things bioware are doing, and is voicing them. He states he probably won't buy new, he probably won't.

I can tell you buying ME3 from the bargain bin is much different than preordering it, for all parties involved. If he pays ten bucks for ME3, finds it was an amazing experience, he got an incredible bargain.

If he buys ME3 from the bargain bin, hates (or at least doesn't love) the new features, he just saved himself fifty five plus dollars, and gets to be right, and he knows he probably won't buy the next bioware game new either, if he does at all. Either way he wins.

[Ronnel]

 This is the reason, http://gamrfeed.vgch...-modern-gaming/.

[dreman9999]

Nashiktal wrote...

Iakus never said he hated it. I think you are still missing his point mate. He is worried about some of the things bioware are doing, and is voicing them. He states he probably won't buy new, he probably won't.

I can tell you buying ME3 from the bargain bin is much different than preordering it, for all parties involved. If he pays ten bucks for ME3, finds it was an amazing experience, he got an incredible bargain.

If he buys ME3 from the bargain bin, hates (or at least doesn't love) the new features, he just saved himself fifty five plus dollars, and gets to be right, and he knows he probably won't buy the next bioware game new either, if he does at all. Either way he wins.

I never said he did. It's ageneral statement.My point is no one here really hates ME, no matter what direction it's going. As much as we fight, and state how much we hate this or that, the fact we are giving our opioion show we really love this series. If we did not, none of use would be here.
You may say, I'm not buying. In the end one way oranother you will. That's my point.

[Lumikki]

dreman9999 wrote...

Regadeless, new or not. Your buying it.

I don't think you get it, so I say it directly. This is about voting with wallet. Money is only language what companies understand. It's message to EA. (money & forum)

Because of MP feature "we" don't neccassary buy ME3 with full price, but wait the ME3's price to drop. This is direct consequence of MP feature to be there, because "we" have no use for MP feature at all in ME3. We will buy ME3 when the price is right (lower), because we wanna finish single player Shepard story. Meaning company get less money from "us" who did not like MP feature in ME3, even if we will buy the product later.

Point been, just because you think MP feature is great, many of us it has had totally opposite reation in ME3's case. Don't get me wrong, we don't hate MP, but we played ME serie because it is excelent single player game sci-fi story serie. Not because multiplaying. This is about not paying features what has no use to "us". "We" still support Biowares single player side in ME3, so "we" will buy the product when the price is right. (Full price - MP cost  = Buying price)

Modifié par Lumikki, 18 octobre 2011 - 12:07 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Iakus never said he hated it. I think you are still missing his point mate. He is worried about some of the things bioware are doing, and is voicing them. He states he probably won't buy new, he probably won't.

I can tell you buying ME3 from the bargain bin is much different than preordering it, for all parties involved. If he pays ten bucks for ME3, finds it was an amazing experience, he got an incredible bargain.

If he buys ME3 from the bargain bin, hates (or at least doesn't love) the new features, he just saved himself fifty five plus dollars, and gets to be right, and he knows he probably won't buy the next bioware game new either, if he does at all. Either way he wins.

I never said he did. It's ageneral statement.My point is no one here really hates ME, no matter what direction it's going. As much as we fight, and state how much we hate this or that, the fact we are giving our opioion show we really love this series. If we did not, none of use would be here.
You may say, I'm not buying. In the end one way oranother you will. That's my point.

Your "point" is the "point" of a presumptuous arse. 

Telling someone that they'll end up doing something no matter what they say or think now is arrogant, insulting, and pathetic. 

[CptBomBom00]

All I can see here is lots of letter but no sense.
no offence anyone.

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

I'll wait for the reviews before I'm 100% convinced about MP being 100% optional and detached.

But it is optional. It's just not as detached as you want it to be. The mp is more depended to the sp. Just be glad that it's not so attached to the sp to make it manditory.

"Just be glad he shot you in the leg instead of the face."  

[Killjoy Cutter]

iakus wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

That assumes we trust Bioware all that much after getting the runaround for months about MP, about the reasons for the release delay, etc, not to mention DA2...

Yet somehow many people didn't feel like they've been lied to at all regarding MP.

I'd say that many people didn't care that they'd been lied to regarding MP

But then, there are also a bunch who do.

Far more accurate statement. 

And I always care if I've been lied to. 

I don't care what the marketing strategy or the corporate direction or whatever issue or situation is going on, do not effing lie to me for any reason. 

[CptBomBom00]

So when did BioWare lied to us?

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

iakus wrote...

KBomb wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Ok, then. Then that's your problem if your a completist.

It is a problem if you don’t want to be a completist on every.single.play.through. If you have ten or more imports, you may not want to be a completist on them all, so if you want to gain those RP, you’ll have to scoot on over to MP, or settle for a lackluster ending even if you do all the important missions.

I think I have only one ME1 playthrough where I found all the Matriarch writings.

Whoops, there goes Thessia!

How many Keepers am I gonna hafta scan, insignias to find, minerals to probe/mine for to make up for not doing MP?

Thanks,iakus.

That exactly my point. You don't need to do everything to get the mos tout me3 and BW is not forcing you to do everything to get the most out of ME3.
So the consern is mute.

Actually, what Iakus said, and your point, are entirely opposed. 

Iakus' point was that if not doing MP requires you to have been utterly attentive to the smallest detail and backwater planet all the way back to the start of ME1, in order to get through ME3 for a decent outcome without doing MP, thrn it's hardly "optional" on any imported playthrough that wasn't utterly completionist from the start. 

Of course, you're now going to go through some convoluted rhetorical gymnastics to confuse and obfuscate and distract, instead of simply comprehend that you've misread yet another post.

[Killjoy Cutter]

CptBomBom00 wrote...

So when did BioWare lied to us?

When they were asked if there was going to be multiplayer in ME3, and they didn't say "yes, there will be multiplayer in ME3." 

The alternative is that the Bioware division didn't plan on MP, and they had it imposed by EA at the last minute. 


Neither is in any way good. 

[CptBomBom00]

guys from my point of view I think is best to wait till march and when everybody starts to play ME3 and see their past decision/choices in the effect then we gonna lecture each other, but for now lets talk about something more mature.

[Iakus]

Nashiktal wrote...

Iakus never said he hated it. I think you are still missing his point mate. He is worried about some of the things bioware are doing, and is voicing them. He states he probably won't buy new, he probably won't.

I can tell you buying ME3 from the bargain bin is much different than preordering it, for all parties involved. If he pays ten bucks for ME3, finds it was an amazing experience, he got an incredible bargain.

If he buys ME3 from the bargain bin, hates (or at least doesn't love) the new features, he just saved himself fifty five plus dollars, and gets to be right, and he knows he probably won't buy the next bioware game new either, if he does at all. Either way he wins.

This.

If multiplayer is in fact some ploy to get people to buy new, it has failed spectacularly with me.  I see it as an actual disincentive.  Why should I buy a new copy at full price for a feature and content I won't use?  They have me as a captive audicience with the conclusion of Shepard's story.  But just because I will at some point spend money on the game does not speak of when or how much.

So right now Bioware has to convince me that, even with multiplayer in the mix, the single player is great enough to warrant a day one purchase, knowing there is content and missions in there I'll likely never see.  In this day, people are careful how they spend their money

Modifié par iakus, 18 octobre 2011 - 01:25 .

[Iakus]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

CptBomBom00 wrote...

So when did BioWare lied to us?

When they were asked if there was going to be multiplayer in ME3, and they didn't say "yes, there will be multiplayer in ME3." 

The alternative is that the Bioware division didn't plan on MP, and they had it imposed by EA at the last minute. 


Neither is in any way good. 

"Wasn't entirely honest.  Lie of omission.  Also other kinds" 

[CptBomBom00]

So the EA is the villain here ****s.

[dreman9999]

Lumikki wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Regadeless, new or not. Your buying it.

I don't think you get it, so I say it directly. This is about voting with wallet. Money is only language what companies understand. It's message to EA. (money & forum)

Because of MP feature "we" don't neccassary buy ME3 with full price, but wait the ME3's price to drop. This is direct consequence of MP feature to be there, because "we" have no use for MP feature at all in ME3. We will buy ME3 when the price is right (lower), because we wanna finish single player Shepard story. Meaning company get less money from "us" who did not like MP feature in ME3, even if we will buy the product later.

Point been, just because you think MP feature is great, many of us it has had totally opposite reation in ME3's case. Don't get me wrong, we don't hate MP, but we played ME serie because it is excelent single player game sci-fi story serie. Not because multiplaying. This is about not paying features what has no use to "us". "We" still support Biowares single player side in ME3, so "we" will buy the product when the price is right. (Full price - MP cost  = Buying price)

And your not getting it. If they drop the price, That means they don't need to sell it at $60antmore. Buying it after the price drop does nothing because they already got the amount of money they wanted, so they can sell it at a less price. As for buying it use,they won't make money unless  you'll buy dlc. Can anyone guarantee they will not buy the dlc?

[Killjoy Cutter]

Companies don't lower their prices because they've "made enough money". They lower prices when sales are getting low and they still want to get something instead of nothing.

If the price drops on a video game, it's because it's not selling, or not selling any more, and only because of that. If the sales are still strong, the price doesn't drop.

If sales on ME3 are low, then the price will drop because EA and/or the retailers want to recoup some of the sunk costs. Not because "it's time to lower them" and not because "they've made enough money".  

LoL @ "they don't need to sell it at $60" 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 18 octobre 2011 - 01:35 .