2261 réponses à ce sujet

[Lumikki]

dreman9999 wrote...
Could you tell me the cost to add co-op to a gamE? At the base you add player control to another avatar and split the screen. That does not cost much to do. Extra cost would be with online support  and getting the AI to work  in tangent with each system and kill any bugs,which is also not that expensive to do ether.
If you play any fps online co-op, you will clearly see it doesn't take much to make a co-op game. You just add it tothe sp. The most the other team will do is make new skin, make a new rpg system, cut up maps and kill bugs.

No, I can't tell you much anything related to it, but I haven't made assumptions about it.

All what I have sayed is that making any content cost money and it has affect. I haven't sayed anything how big or small affect. That is because I don't know how big or small the affect is, I just know it has affect and costs. All development time cost money. Time and resources limits what content can be made.

Point been again, it would be easyer to discuss without too much assumptions from personal needs and desire. I can understand need to defend own desire, but it just cause a lot of arguing from nothing if it goes too "unknown" assumptions.

Modifié par Lumikki, 18 octobre 2011 - 07:54 .

[Taciter]

dreman9999 wrote...
1. you not understanding.I taking about the games value in it's self not a a varible.  ME1 is a hour 30+ game. ME2 is a hour 30+ game and ME3 is ahour  30+. So in the end you gettingthe same amount of play time for the sp as each ME game in ME3. This mean ME3 is the same value as the last 2 games.

Also,

2. I stated this over and over again that I'm not ageinst bots in the co-op. Just that the logic for wanting to use a 100% bot play in the mp is lost on me. Why? Because you can just do the same thing in the sp. Can you tell me the difference between mp co-op bot matchsand just playing the sp side mission with out stating you get a 4 man?

1. You can't apply a subjective single-player time value to the question of multiplayer 'exclusivity'. Anyway, I completed ME2 in fraction of the time it took me to complete ME1.

2. Yes, I heard you and I approve of your approval but if you dont comprehend the underlying motivation - why have an opinion on the topic at all?

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the MP 'addon' is an entirely seperate entity to the SP 'side missions'. It was developed in a different division by entirely different developers in a different location and for that reason alone, it will almost certainly include conspicuous references to things a Solo Player will never be able to acknowledge. As to what those things are I won't speculate but rest assured, if they had intended for the MP to have no bearing on the storyline whatsoever, they wouldn't have given it such an integral role.

THAT'S why we solo players want some way of experiencing the MP content without having to participate in the actual MP mechanic - and all we ever asked for was that compromise which would in NO WAY affect the muliplayer function besides adding an 'option' to use AI companions instead of Human ones.

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

How would increasing the playability of the MP content, especially going forward into a future time when the MP won't have a lot of people playing it (say, in two years) "not" make the game better?

How would adding AI  bots impove mp if you playing by yourself? That's not a mp any more, it a sp game with a short term objective. It would be no different than the sp side mission. If you want that you can just replay the side missions over and over.

Obviously, it allows you to play the "MP" missions with a full squad if 3 other people you want to play the game with aren't available for play at that time.  Or play them all single-player as if they were SP content. 

It addresses almost all the issues that people have with sticking content off in "MP" and having "MP" impact "SP". 

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 18 octobre 2011 - 08:03 .

[dreman9999]

Lumikki wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Could you tell me the cost to add co-op to a gamE? At the base you add player control to another avatar and split the screen. That does not cost much to do. Extra cost would be with online support  and getting the AI to work  in tangent with each system and kill any bugs,which is also not that expensive to do ether.
If you play any fps online co-op, you will clearly see it doesn't take much to make a co-op game. You just add it tothe sp. The most the other team will do is make new skin, make a new rpg system, cut up maps and kill bugs.

No, I can't tell you much anything related to it, but I haven't made assumptions about it.

All what I have sayed is that making any content cost money and it has affect. I haven't sayed anything how big or small affect. That is because I don't know how big or small the affect is, I just know it has affect and costs. All development time cost money. Time and resources limits what content can be made.

Point been again, it would be easyer to discuss without too much assumptions from personal needs and desire. I can understand need to defend own desire, but it just cause a lot of arguing from nothing if it goes too "unknown" assumptions.

I understand that but you don't know if they went over the estement of a return yet. And with them making a very basic mp, I don't think they have.
Without the estament of return and  product cost numbers,you just doing some pointless speculation with know sign to support it. You feel we got less to the sp because of the mp bu the fact is we got more o the sp because of it. Remeber, we werenot going to get homosexual romances in ME3 when it was coming out in nov. Once the game was delayed , that got change. So if they have to time and finaces to program and dubthe extra scene, you don't think they may add more then just that to the game?

[Il Divo]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

I'm really curious how this is going to work, given that players have the ability to reload their games. Wouldn't it be possible to simply create separate save files?

[Taciter]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...
Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 
( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

lol... good call!

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

How would increasing the playability of the MP content, especially going forward into a future time when the MP won't have a lot of people playing it (say, in two years) "not" make the game better?

How would adding AI  bots impove mp if you playing by yourself? That's not a mp any more, it a sp game with a short term objective. It would be no different than the sp side mission. If you want that you can just replay the side missions over and over.

Obviously, it allows you to play the "MP" missions with a full squad if 3 other people you want to play the game with aren't available for play at that time.  Or play them all single-player as if they were SP content. 

It addresses almost all the issues that people have with sticking content off in "MP" and having "MP" impact "SP". 

And you don't see their is no difference in that at all? Why do a full bots co-op np game, when you can just go in the sp and play the sp side mission and get the same reward? In the end no matter what, your playing with AI character, so it's no difference. You get the same reward and play alone with the AI.

Modifié par dreman9999, 18 octobre 2011 - 08:10 .

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

Why worry about a mode your not playing?

[CptBomBom00]

Yes that's my thought exactly.

[FLYING GRENADE11]

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

Why worry about a mode your not playing?

1)  We have NO way of being certain that MP won't end up being at least partially necessary for a reasonable SP playthrough, despite the claims coming from Bioware at the moment.  After all, a few weeks ago, we were being lead to believe that there was no MP at all in ME3.

2)  Unlike some people, I am capable of comprehending that others want, feel, and think different things, and that some players will want to play MP with other actual human players, and -- on principle if nothing else -- I am capable of concern for what affect MP will have on SP for those players. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 18 octobre 2011 - 08:17 .

[dreman9999]

Taciter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
1. you not understanding.I taking about the games value in it's self not a a varible.  ME1 is a hour 30+ game. ME2 is a hour 30+ game and ME3 is ahour  30+. So in the end you gettingthe same amount of play time for the sp as each ME game in ME3. This mean ME3 is the same value as the last 2 games.

Also,

2. I stated this over and over again that I'm not ageinst bots in the co-op. Just that the logic for wanting to use a 100% bot play in the mp is lost on me. Why? Because you can just do the same thing in the sp. Can you tell me the difference between mp co-op bot matchsand just playing the sp side mission with out stating you get a 4 man?

1. You can't apply a subjective single-player time value to the question of multiplayer 'exclusivity'. Anyway, I completed ME2 in fraction of the time it took me to complete ME1.

2. Yes, I heard you and I approve of your approval but if you dont comprehend the underlying motivation - why have an opinion on the topic at all?

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the MP 'addon' is an entirely seperate entity to the SP 'side missions'. It was developed in a different division by entirely different developers in a different location and for that reason alone, it will almost certainly include conspicuous references to things a Solo Player will never be able to acknowledge. As to what those things are I won't speculate but rest assured, if they had intended for the MP to have no bearing on the storyline whatsoever, they wouldn't have given it such an integral role.

THAT'S why we solo players want some way of experiencing the MP content without having to participate in the actual MP mechanic - and all we ever asked for was that compromise which would in NO WAY affect the muliplayer function besides adding an 'option' to use AI companions instead of Human ones.

1. That because you did everything in ME1, and did not come close to that in ME2.

2.Look at it this way. The sp is basicly you playing with bot.  If your playing the co-op with bots only, it would be no different then playing playing the sp because in the sp you playing with bots any way. And playing the side mission in the spnets you the same reward asthe mp,so their is no differance. It would be better to ask for a suervival mode in the sp then to ask for bot in the mp.

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

How would increasing the playability of the MP content, especially going forward into a future time when the MP won't have a lot of people playing it (say, in two years) "not" make the game better?

How would adding AI  bots impove mp if you playing by yourself? That's not a mp any more, it a sp game with a short term objective. It would be no different than the sp side mission. If you want that you can just replay the side missions over and over.

Obviously, it allows you to play the "MP" missions with a full squad if 3 other people you want to play the game with aren't available for play at that time.  Or play them all single-player as if they were SP content. 

It addresses almost all the issues that people have with sticking content off in "MP" and having "MP" impact "SP". 

And you don't see their is no difference in that at all? Why do a full bots co-op np game, when you can just go in the sp and play the sp side mission and get the same reward? In the end no matter what, your playing with AI character, so it's no difference. You get the same reward and play alone with the AI.

Because the SP side missions and the MP missions are different content, possibly with a different affect on a playthrough.

[Iakus]

Il Divo wrote...

I want to argue more, but there's just... too... much...math.

Indeed.  My eyes are bleeding.

[FLYING GRENADE11]

dreman9999 wrote...

Taciter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
1. you not understanding.I taking about the games value in it's self not a a varible.  ME1 is a hour 30+ game. ME2 is a hour 30+ game and ME3 is ahour  30+. So in the end you gettingthe same amount of play time for the sp as each ME game in ME3. This mean ME3 is the same value as the last 2 games.

Also,

2. I stated this over and over again that I'm not ageinst bots in the co-op. Just that the logic for wanting to use a 100% bot play in the mp is lost on me. Why? Because you can just do the same thing in the sp. Can you tell me the difference between mp co-op bot matchsand just playing the sp side mission with out stating you get a 4 man?

1. You can't apply a subjective single-player time value to the question of multiplayer 'exclusivity'. Anyway, I completed ME2 in fraction of the time it took me to complete ME1.

2. Yes, I heard you and I approve of your approval but if you dont comprehend the underlying motivation - why have an opinion on the topic at all?

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the MP 'addon' is an entirely seperate entity to the SP 'side missions'. It was developed in a different division by entirely different developers in a different location and for that reason alone, it will almost certainly include conspicuous references to things a Solo Player will never be able to acknowledge. As to what those things are I won't speculate but rest assured, if they had intended for the MP to have no bearing on the storyline whatsoever, they wouldn't have given it such an integral role.

THAT'S why we solo players want some way of experiencing the MP content without having to participate in the actual MP mechanic - and all we ever asked for was that compromise which would in NO WAY affect the muliplayer function besides adding an 'option' to use AI companions instead of Human ones.

1. That because you did everything in ME1, and did not come close to that in ME2.

2.Look at it this way. The sp is basicly you playing with bot.  If your playing the co-op with bots only, it would be no different then playing playing the sp because in the sp you playing with bots any way. And playing the side mission in the spnets you the same reward asthe mp,so their is no differance. It would be better to ask for a suervival mode in the sp then to ask for bot in the mp.

http://www.gamenewsc...ious-games.html

[Swift Justice]

Ok my concern is that you want be able to get everypossible outcome without playing the multiplayer, is this completely irrationalor am i write worry,Can those of us withoutxbox live gold still see every possible ending or do i need to a gold account so that i can experience every possible STORY related toShepherd? just to clarify and, yes i know i am rambling now, If i do not play multiplayer will their be endings to the single player story i cannot see? and if i do play multiplayer do i link that to one specific playthrough of the single player or will it affect all the games i play?

[FLYING GRENADE11]

iakus wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

I want to argue more, but there's just... too... much...math.

Indeed.  My eyes are bleeding.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Il Divo wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

I'm really curious how this is going to work, given that players have the ability to reload their games. Wouldn't it be possible to simply create separate save files?

Good question. 

Of course, this entire "you have to recruit a species in SP to play it in MP" thing is coming from Dreman, so take it with a grain of salt.

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

Why worry about a mode your not playing?

1)  We have way of being certain that MP won't end up being at least partially necessary for a reasonable SP playthrough, despite the claims coming from Bioware at the moment.  After all, a few weeks ago, we were being lead to believe that there was no MP at all in ME3.

2)  Unlike some people, I am capable of comprehending that others want, feel, and think different things, and that some players will want to play MP with other actual human players, and -- on principle if nothing else -- I am capable of concern for what affect MP will have on SP for those players. 

1. Don't think it has to be said again that you can get what ever reward in the mp in the sp. It's like you ignore that fact like the plague.
2.Great. So your against mp because it will effect other people games, not the fact that it may subtract from the sp game which you stated earlier....How noble.

[dreman9999]

FLYING GRENADE11 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Taciter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
1. you not understanding.I taking about the games value in it's self not a a varible.  ME1 is a hour 30+ game. ME2 is a hour 30+ game and ME3 is ahour  30+. So in the end you gettingthe same amount of play time for the sp as each ME game in ME3. This mean ME3 is the same value as the last 2 games.

Also,

2. I stated this over and over again that I'm not ageinst bots in the co-op. Just that the logic for wanting to use a 100% bot play in the mp is lost on me. Why? Because you can just do the same thing in the sp. Can you tell me the difference between mp co-op bot matchsand just playing the sp side mission with out stating you get a 4 man?

1. You can't apply a subjective single-player time value to the question of multiplayer 'exclusivity'. Anyway, I completed ME2 in fraction of the time it took me to complete ME1.

2. Yes, I heard you and I approve of your approval but if you dont comprehend the underlying motivation - why have an opinion on the topic at all?

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the MP 'addon' is an entirely seperate entity to the SP 'side missions'. It was developed in a different division by entirely different developers in a different location and for that reason alone, it will almost certainly include conspicuous references to things a Solo Player will never be able to acknowledge. As to what those things are I won't speculate but rest assured, if they had intended for the MP to have no bearing on the storyline whatsoever, they wouldn't have given it such an integral role.

THAT'S why we solo players want some way of experiencing the MP content without having to participate in the actual MP mechanic - and all we ever asked for was that compromise which would in NO WAY affect the muliplayer function besides adding an 'option' to use AI companions instead of Human ones.

1. That because you did everything in ME1, and did not come close to that in ME2.

2.Look at it this way. The sp is basicly you playing with bot.  If your playing the co-op with bots only, it would be no different then playing playing the sp because in the sp you playing with bots any way. And playing the side mission in the spnets you the same reward asthe mp,so their is no differance. It would be better to ask for a suervival mode in the sp then to ask for bot in the mp.

http://www.gamenewsc...ious-games.html

Um......So your say ME3 is going to be...longer and have more duologue?

[FLYING GRENADE11]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

uv23 wrote...

I'm sure its been posted but this forum software is pretty horrible for keeping up on topics: can we customize the appearance/name of our multiplayer characters?

Yes, but it  had a catch. You have to recuit the race first to do so.

Which means that if you are forced to choose between two species (not races, SPECIES) at some point in SP, your SP choice on the matter is then impacted by what you want to play in MP. 

( But no worries, MP won't negatively affect SP, right?   )

Why worry about a mode your not playing?

1)  We have way of being certain that MP won't end up being at least partially necessary for a reasonable SP playthrough, despite the claims coming from Bioware at the moment.  After all, a few weeks ago, we were being lead to believe that there was no MP at all in ME3.

2)  Unlike some people, I am capable of comprehending that others want, feel, and think different things, and that some players will want to play MP with other actual human players, and -- on principle if nothing else -- I am capable of concern for what affect MP will have on SP for those players. 

1. Don't think it has to be said again that you can get what ever reward in the mp in the sp. It's like you ignore that fact like the plague.
2.Great. So your against mp because it will effect other people games, not the fact that it may subtract from the sp game which you stated earlier....How noble.

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

How would increasing the playability of the MP content, especially going forward into a future time when the MP won't have a lot of people playing it (say, in two years) "not" make the game better?

How would adding AI  bots impove mp if you playing by yourself? That's not a mp any more, it a sp game with a short term objective. It would be no different than the sp side mission. If you want that you can just replay the side missions over and over.

Obviously, it allows you to play the "MP" missions with a full squad if 3 other people you want to play the game with aren't available for play at that time.  Or play them all single-player as if they were SP content. 

It addresses almost all the issues that people have with sticking content off in "MP" and having "MP" impact "SP". 

And you don't see their is no difference in that at all? Why do a full bots co-op np game, when you can just go in the sp and play the sp side mission and get the same reward? In the end no matter what, your playing with AI character, so it's no difference. You get the same reward and play alone with the AI.

Because the SP side missions and the MP missions are different content, possibly with a different affect on a playthrough.

Then you not understanding. Mp only effect is GR. Nothing more. SP side mission have more effect with GR, item, money, gear and so on. It's more of a benifit to play the sp side missions.

[FLYING GRENADE11]

hmmmm chat died.

[Taciter]

dreman9999 wrote...
And you don't see their is no difference in that at all? Why do a full bots co-op np game, when you can just go in the sp and play the sp side mission and get the same reward? In the end no matter what, your playing with AI character, so it's no difference. You get the same reward and play alone with the AI.

ZOMG.. what is it? Selective recognisance or just straight senility? I keep answering this very question over and over again and then, as if rotating on a 4 post countdown.. there it is again? Why can't you understand? What's wrong with you? THE SP SIDEMISSIONS ARE NOT THE SAME AS A THEORETICAL AI AIDED MP CO-OP MISSION