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[Raonar]

Maybe he was a Dragonborn?

Oh, and Alistair stabbed the witch through the stomach, which means she can miraculously survive, just like she healed Isabela. Why didn't Alistair chop her head off? Is plot induced-stupidity the ONLY way forward?

Modifié par Raonar, 02 mai 2012 - 01:53 .

[Brockololly]

I think I'll go back to Origins and have Alistair killed/exiled. What an incompetent dolt and lousy king. Loghain was right.

[Quinnzel]

Brockololly wrote...

I think I'll go back to Origins and have Alistair killed/exiled. What an incompetent dolt and lousy king. Loghain was right.

All we need now is for Orlais to invade Ferelden again, and then we can start selling 'Loghan was RIGHT"' merch.

[Maria13]

Alistair haters gonna hate...

And it always seemed to me there was something special about Calenhad's bloodline, it was highlighted in DA. Alistair himself used to take the ****** out of it (the joke about putting a vial of blood on the throne). You could equally argue that Andraste was a local phenomenon... There may be a link between Andraste & Calenhad BTW.

[Agelico]

Am I just slow and miss something, but why is it called "FIRST six issues"? Like... there's going to be "second" or what?.. And if yes, then -- when?

I'd love that. Though Mr. Gaider used his philosophy of hurting fans yet again -- I really liked Yavana *sobs*

Edit: found that link about Dragon Age: Those Who Speak on the previous page. Made me a bit sad: it's way easier to get digital comics in Russia. And those are not digital as far as I understood.

Modifié par Agelico, 02 mai 2012 - 04:46 .

[Quinnzel]

Maria13 wrote...

And it always seemed to me there was something special about Calenhad's bloodline, it was highlighted in DA. Alistair himself used to take the ****** out of it (the joke about putting a vial of blood on the throne). You could equally argue that Andraste was a local phenomenon... There may be a link between Andraste & Calenhad BTW.

Hmm, I can't say I've ever seen the 'special'-ness of Calenhad's line. From the Codex's:

http://dragonage.wik...nhad:_Chapter_1
http://dragonage.wik...nhad:_Chapter_2
http://dragonage.wik...nhad:_Chapter_3

It sounds as if he had a rather simple origin, though I wonder if'n that in itself isnt a point of interest. (Why isnt one of the greatest Kings of all times early childhoodd and family better documented?)

There are definately things in the Legend I think could be attributed to some form of innate specialness (His luck, for one; poor merchants son to King, his ability to bring all the Nobles under him etc.  though In equal parts, Calenhad himself seems like he had a tough time towards the end of his reign: Dead Friend, Crumbling Kingdom, Jilted Wife etc.) but the bloodline itself (and the evntual Thierin line) had always seemed a rather simple case of being the 'First' proper line of royalty to me, rather than some mystical magical lot that can 'OMG Summon Dragons!'

Obviously with Issue 6 of the comic, we have reason to suspect more of the latter eventuality, but before this issue, I kinda don't see anything special about them. Keep in mind that Arland was said to be a real bastard in DA:Wardens Keep, and he shared blood with the rest of them. Though the rest of the Calenhad line (that we at least, know about) seemed stable enough, he just seemed like a real bastard.

I guess I'm just really ineterested in how it all ties toegther. Flemmeth saved Maric in the Stolen Throne, and Is cagey enough with her replies that it seems to hint that she was actively searching for him via the Dalish/damned good luck and then has Maric promise her something (the details of which revealed to Yavana in The Silent Grove) This always helped foster the idea to me that Maric himself was special. If he was simply a wee bitty more special because of who he was realted to, I begin to wonder if the rest of his Ancestors ever had a run in with the Witch of The Wilds.

With THAT in mind, onwards to DA:O, and the top of the Tower of Ishal...

Then she saves the Warden and Alistair, again for a greater purpose (The Dark Ritual or to simply stop the Blight) but I wonder if 'We cant simply have all the Grey Warden's dying out' wasnt yet another cagey response of 'We can't go having all of the Calenhad blood dying out'.

If Calenhad's blood 'sings of a time when Dragons ruled the skies.' I really hope David Gaider and co. go deeeep into the who's and whys, because I think it needs it. Aagin, what seems like a very simple origin for a Royal Family to me, just got thrown a curve ball into Complex-ville.  It's an inetersting concept, and (madly enough) just brings more questions as to the origin of Dragon's in Thedas.

Sometimes I think we end up with more questions than answers.
Here's hoping they get to answering them in the next comic/game/book.

Maria13 wrote...

Alistair haters gonna hate...

I will *does the hatin' dance*

Modifié par Quinnzel, 02 mai 2012 - 04:52 .

[ladyofpayne]

Alistair you such an **** in 6. I am going in game and get you a drunkaard.

[thats1evildude]

Corker wrote...

Why the beep should dragons care about Calenhad? They lived long before him; he's just one dinky human ruler in one dinky human nation on the butt-end of Thedas.

Bah.

A re-read of Calenhad's history is interesting. It seems that a witch was partially responsible for his downfall, and that he eventually disappeared under mysterious circumstances.

[Maria13]

Yay!

And all was not roses for Maric, either, obviously. Kills his elven lover who betrayed him... His nobleborn wife who he grew to love dies young... His second elven lover is a Grey Warden and a mage who does not aspire to a life together... (BTW how come he managed to get her pregnant and not succomb to the Blight like the others? There is magic in that there bloodline... Perhaps Theirins are super fertile... Perhaps it was part of the deal with Flemeth... ). And that's just his early life.

I say it's witchy, Elven, magicy thingy blood...

Arland... But thingymajig who opposed his was also a Theirin and obviously the magic one. Have you read A song of ice and fire? Some of Targyeans are magic blood of the dragon. Some are not. Same goes for the Starks (they're the ice, the wolves). Some of the Lannisters are extremely canny whereas others are not... The House of Atreus in Greek myth... I think that may be the template.

Being special does not immortality nor happiness bring. Quite the contrary, It just attracts the claws of destiny...

Modifié par Maria13, 02 mai 2012 - 05:21 .

[Corker]

Quinnzel wrote...

It sounds as if he had a rather simple origin, though I wonder if'n that in itself isnt a point of interest. (Why isnt one of the greatest Kings of all times early childhoodd and family better documented?)

If you read him as alt-King Arthur, that all about fits.

With THAT in mind, onwards to DA:O, and the top of the Tower of Ishal...

Then she saves the Warden and Alistair, again for a greater purpose (The Dark Ritual or to simply stop the Blight) but I wonder if 'We cant simply have all the Grey Warden's dying out' wasnt yet another cagey response of 'We can't go having all of the Calenhad blood dying out'.

Am I crazy, or did Morrigan specifically need new Grey Wardens for the Ritual?  Something about the taint?  Wasn't there a reason she couldn't use Riordan?  Flemeth grabbed the two newest recruits who weren't dead yet, IMO.

Otherwise, I have to believe that Flemeth is somehow responsible for Alistair's fosterage to Eamon, his subsequent education in the Chantry, and Duncan's recruitment of him.  And... no.  I refuse.  If Flemeth can do all that, game over, she's God.

If Calenhad's blood 'sings of a time when Dragons ruled the skies.' I really hope David Gaider and co. go deeeep into the who's and whys, because I think it needs it.

Yeah.  Especially when it seems like there ought to be other families just as old or older.  Up in, say, Tevinter.  Where they *worshipped* dragons.  Or even in Ferelden: the Howes, the Couslands, and whatever Bann Alfstanna's family name is.  (They're the ones who shot Calenhad's horse out from under him, right?)

Or there's the elves, whose presence in Thedas predates *all* the humans by ages.

[Corker]

Maria13 wrote...

Quite the contrary, It just attracts the claws of destiny...

That's my primary problem with it.  

Destiny, Fate and all their ilk can go and take a flying leap, IMO.

[Maria13]

Fair enough.

But if they did, a lot of literature, art, music... Would go over the precipice with them.

[Quinnzel]

Destiny you say?

Modifié par Quinnzel, 02 mai 2012 - 05:47 .

[Maria13]

Corker wrote...

Am I crazy, or did Morrigan specifically need new Grey Wardens for the Ritual?  Something about the taint?  Wasn't there a reason she couldn't use Riordan?  Flemeth grabbed the two newest recruits who weren't dead yet, IMO.

Otherwise, I have to believe that Flemeth is somehow responsible for Alistair's fosterage to Eamon, his subsequent education in the Chantry, and Duncan's recruitment of him.  And... no.  I refuse.  If Flemeth can do all that, game over, she's God.

Yeah.  Especially when it seems like there ought to be other families just as old or older.  Up in, say, Tevinter.  Where they *worshipped* dragons.  Or even in Ferelden: the Howes, the Couslands, and whatever Bann Alfstanna's family name is.  (They're the ones who shot Calenhad's horse out from under him, right?)

Or there's the elves, whose presence in Thedas predates *all* the humans by ages.

Indeed she did but let's not forget Morrie tells the warden that she doesn't understand why Flemeth saved them and adds that had she taken the decision she would have saved the King... Meaning Cailan.  Morrie is yet young...

Not all gods are omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent or immortal... Only those of the Abrahamaic religions...

Yeah, and both Maric and Alistair have a special affinity for elves even when their are considered outcasts and socially inferior.

[thats1evildude]

Corker wrote...

Am I crazy, or did Morrigan specifically need new Grey Wardens for the Ritual?  Something about the taint?  Wasn't there a reason she couldn't use Riordan?  Flemeth grabbed the two newest recruits who weren't dead yet, IMO.

Yes, Grey Wardens were specifically needed for the ritual. And it had to be a recent Grey Warden recruit.

I don't think Flemeth was trying to preserve the Calenhad bloodline in DAO. If she was, why save a male Warden other than Alistair? Why instruct Morrigan to make the offer to a male Warden? The OGB was probably related to this other "age of dragons" business, though. A herald for the age to come.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 02 mai 2012 - 05:55 .

[Corker]

If modern fantasy fiction handled Fate the way Euripides did, I'd have a lot less of a problem with it.

[Corker]

Maria13 wrote...

Indeed she did but let's not forget Morrie tells the warden that she doesn't understand why Flemeth saved them and adds that had she taken the decision she would have saved the King... Meaning Cailan.  Morrie is yet young...

You mean at Flemeth's hut, when Morrigan is still lying like a rug?  I don't recall her saying anything of the sort at the DR; rather, "This was Flemeth's plan all along."

Not all gods are omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent or immortal... Only those of the Abrahamaic religions...

And I'm fine with Flemeth being some sort of Deep Fade Entity merged with a mortal or wtf Flemeth is.

But if Flemeth could steer and shape Alistair's life, on purpose, so that he ended up on the Tower of Ishal exactly when she needed him to be, then I would say that she is a god a la the Abrahamaic traditions.  And if she could do all that, then she should have been able to create Morrigan into his irresistable soulmate so that she'd get her Theirin-blooded OGB guaranteed.

[Brockololly]

thats1evildude wrote...
I don't think Flemeth was trying to preserve the Calenhad bloodline in DAO. If she was, why save a male Warden other than Alistair? Why instruct Morrigan to make the offer to a male Warden? The OGB was probably related to this other "age of dragons" business, though. A herald for the age to come.

It also calls into question how important any of this stuff with Calenhad's bloodline even is, if you can kill off Alistair in Origins, presumably killing off Calenhad's bloodline right there and stopping whatever Yavana was chatting about.

I know the comic isn't canon, but making Calenhad blood super important when its possible there are no Calenhad decendants in the game world of DA seems kind of odd. Unless they retcon that for future games or made genuine branching paths.

[Agelico]

Brockololly wrote...
... presumably killing off Calenhad's bloodline right there and stopping whatever Yavana was chatting about.

I know the comic isn't canon, but making Calenhad blood super important when its possible there are no Calenhad decendants in the game world of DA seems kind of odd. Unless they retcon that for future games or made genuine branching paths.

That is... IF we presume, that Fiona's child IS Alistair...

[Addai]

Brockololly wrote...
It also calls into question how important any of this stuff with Calenhad's bloodline even is, if you can kill off Alistair in Origins, presumably killing off Calenhad's bloodline right there and stopping whatever Yavana was chatting about.

I know the comic isn't canon, but making Calenhad blood super important when its possible there are no Calenhad decendants in the game world of DA seems kind of odd. Unless they retcon that for future games or made genuine branching paths.

There will always be long-lost cousin Festus from the Bannorn they can pull out of a hat.  I think they've even said that much in the forum.  Or, Maric boffed the chambermaid in Redcliffe after all and there's another bastard around.

So Alistair pulled a hissy fit and killed the witch who saved his father from a Crow prison and healed Isabela, because he's a badass king now.  Unless I'm missing something, Maric chose to keep his promise to Flemeth, and I don't recall anything about Yavana forcing him to help her.  Does this make sense to anyone else?  What am I missing?

[Maria13]

Brockololly wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...
I don't think Flemeth was trying to preserve the Calenhad bloodline in DAO. If she was, why save a male Warden other than Alistair? Why instruct Morrigan to make the offer to a male Warden? The OGB was probably related to this other "age of dragons" business, though. A herald for the age to come.

It also calls into question how important any of this stuff with Calenhad's bloodline even is, if you can kill off Alistair in Origins, presumably killing off Calenhad's bloodline right there and stopping whatever Yavana was chatting about.

I know the comic isn't canon, but making Calenhad blood super important when its possible there are no Calenhad decendants in the game world of DA seems kind of odd. Unless they retcon that for future games or made genuine branching paths.

Point is Flemeth always saves the warden AND Alistair. I don't think Flemmy is omnisapient either, she hedges her bets and a Theirin warden and a warden are the best bet now Cailan is toast... Personally I always thought the real canon ending was the US, that a Theirin's blood was necessary to stop the Blight one way or another.

Presumably Levi and his family are also from Calenhad's bloodline.

[Maria13]

Addai67 wrote...

So Alistair pulled a hissy fit and killed the witch who saved his father from a Crow prison and healed Isabela, because he's a badass king now.  Unless I'm missing something, Maric chose to keep his promise to Flemeth, and I don't recall anything about Yavana forcing him to help her.  Does this make sense to anyone else?  What am I missing?

Ummm, potentially he was in the Crow's prison to be at her disposal. In any event Yvana didn't take Maric out to release him but to use him. And we don't really know whether he went willingly or not, or what happened to him... Likewise she cured Isabela as a way of getting back at Claudio and regaining Alistair without putting her precious dragons at risk.

Manipulation, duress, deceit, power games...

I think an argument can be made for Alistair seeing this.  How was Yvana proposing to use him? Well, having been used by Morrigan I don't think he cared overmuch to be used/abused that way again.  Seems Calenhad's blood is special but it attracts powerful beings, be they mages or demigods, who wish to use it for their own selfish ends...

[TEWR]

Maria13 wrote...

Presumably Levi and his family are also from Calenhad's bloodline.

I do think Sophia Dryden claimed a relationship to the Theirin blood line, albeit a distant one.

But I shudder to think what Ferelden would be like with Levi Dryden on the throne.

[Addai]

Maria13 wrote...
Ummm, potentially he was in the Crow's prison to be at her disposal. In any event Yvana didn't take Maric out to release him but to use him. And we don't really know whether he went willingly or not, or what happened to him... Likewise she cured Isabela as a way of getting back at Claudio and regaining Alistair without putting her precious dragons at risk.

Manipulation, duress, deceit, power games...

I think an argument can be made for Alistair seeing this.  How was Yvana proposing to use him? Well, having been used by Morrigan I don't think he cared overmuch to be used/abused that way again.  Seems Calenhad's blood is special but it attracts powerful beings, be they mages or demigods, who wish to use it for their own selfish ends...

Potentially she arranged the prison, but there's no way Alistair can know whether she did or not.  And so he just stabs her?  Sure she wanted something from him, but she was giving information and aid in return.  It's manipulative, but I don't see any justification for killing her.  Isabela last issue, and Alistair this issue, both killing someone who could potentially help them just because they didn't like the cut of their jib?

Maybe the blue contact lenses were irritating and made him cranky.

And what if the dragons really should be brought back?  She said something about them being the blood of the world.

[Who is that Masked Man]

Yeah, I lost a lot of respect for Alistair after reading that last issue.

Stabbing Yavana could make some sense practically speaking. She was certainly manipulating Alistair and company and trying to use them to her own ends. If Alistair had tried to answer her ritual offer with a polite "no thanks," would she have accepted that? Maybe not. And Alistair doesn't want to be used as a pawn any more? I understand that. That's certainly fair.

On the other hand, he's still a stupid tool for not bothering to follow up on her vague talk about dragons and why they're so important.

What really pisses me off, though, is the way Alistair blames YAVANA for Maric's disappearance and... literally... everything else.

Yavana? Really? He's holding HER responsible for everything that happened to Ferelden? Ugh. That makes about as much sense as blaming everything on Ser Cauthrien. As in, she was part of the plot, sure, but she was hardly in charge of it.

In addition to killing Mr. Tevinter Dude, I hope that Alistair takes another whack at the real culprit here: Flemeth.

And, frankly, at this point I also hope that Flemeth melts his face off.