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[Jedi Master of Orion]

I would think Tallis was implying that the people on the list live like the locals because aren't among Qunari society anymore Also she does mention some of them have left the Qun behind .

[haroldhardluck]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...
I grew up in a Muslim country. They aren't some unified collective of opinions. The culture in one country will always be different than one in another.

That hardly makes you an authority. Saudi Arabia has a large American community that lives in an isolated ghetto that is the epitome of Hometown America. An American can gorw up there and have less contact with Muslim culture than if they lived in New York City with its large Muslim population.

If your experience is only with one Muslim culture, how can you say that other Muslim cultures are different? Especially when there are so many well known universalities with Muslim practices such as halal laws.

While there are some Muslim cultures such as the Tuaregs whose cultural practices differ significantly from the norm, they are also considered heretics by mainstream Muslims for that reason. Then there are Chinese Muslims who gave up long standing Chinese cultural values such as eating pork. So sometimes a culture retains some pre-Muslim practices and sometimes they drop pre-Muslim practices. That does not change the fact that there is a norm that all Muslims strive for regardless of their culture.


Harold

[haroldhardluck]

kheldorin wrote...

Not true in practise though. People pick and choose what they want from religion or they interprete it differently or certain apects are less emphasized.

How very Ugly American. This is a common attitude in the USA in recent times but it is not the norm. Religion comes as a total package. When a group tries to pick and chose as the original Black Muslims did, they were branded as heretics by other Muslims. It took extensive revisions of the Black Muslim canon for them to be accepted as orthodox Muslims in recent years.

Back in the Reformation when Protestants tried to pick and chose their religion practises instead of accepting the Roman Catholic canon, the results were a series of wars that killed millions.

So this idea is a very parochial one that is limited only to a very specific subgroup of people in the USA today. In the rest of the world, small differences are cause for wars and massacres. It the reason why the Druze support Israel. Other Muslims consider them heretics to be killed. Israel allows them ro poractice their brand is Islam in peace. So while it is possible for people to pick and chose, the result is usually they are hunted down and killed for those differences.

Harold

[Jedi Master of Orion]

haroldhardluck wrote...

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...
I grew up in a Muslim country. They aren't some unified collective of opinions. The culture in one country will always be different than one in another.

That hardly makes you an authority. Saudi Arabia has a large American community that lives in an isolated ghetto that is the epitome of Hometown America. An American can gorw up there and have less contact with Muslim culture than if they lived in New York City with its large Muslim population.

If your experience is only with one Muslim culture, how can you say that other Muslim cultures are different? Especially when there are so many well known universalities with Muslim practices such as halal laws.

While there are some Muslim cultures such as the Tuaregs whose cultural practices differ significantly from the norm, they are also considered heretics by mainstream Muslims for that reason. Then there are Chinese Muslims who gave up long standing Chinese cultural values such as eating pork. So sometimes a culture retains some pre-Muslim practices and sometimes they drop pre-Muslim practices. That does not change the fact that there is a norm that all Muslims strive for regardless of their culture.


Harold

I've been to more than one country in the Middle East. I've known different Muslims in different parts of the world. I think I have a pretty good idea. Even within one country there are many subcultures (just like everywhere else).

There are many universal things between cultures within Europe or America. Does that mean that everyone there is the same?

[Gervaise]

Getting back on topic regarding the Qunari. The way their society is ordered is that there are 3 main branches - the warrior class, the priestly class and the artisans/workers. The priestly class are responsible for education and ensuring the rest of the population follow the qunari way of life. They keep a record of bloodlines to ensure close relatives do not mate because there is no such thing a family unit - children are placed in a central care facility to be raised and when they reach a certain age they are selected for their task in life based on their breeding and the abilities they have shown. People might be able to perform other tasks if required but the thought just does not occur to them to do so - Sten makes it quite clear when he asks why people in Ferelden never seem satisfied with the role in life and seek to become something different. Essentially what the Qunari have done is encourage specialisation to the extreme. In a way, think of them as an ant colony. You have the Queen who has all the babies and effectively is the "priestess" with those ants that specifically look after raising them, you have soldier ants and you have worker ants.

People outside of Qunari controlled lands will not be living to this system because they do not have the structure there to do so and if they did, would stand out from their fellow citizens, making it easy to identify and eradicate them. So their "sleeper" cells are more likely to be disenchanted citizens who have adopted the basic ideology of the Qun and are waiting for the day when the Qunari invade, when they will rise up against the current rulers. This is what happened when the Arishok declared war in Kirkwall, suddenly all these elves came out of the woodwork and started to fight with them. Nevertheless, behind closed doors they may still adopt certain practices, such as rejecting their families who have not converted and aspects of the local culture that do not fit with their new beliefs - hence I must assume the reaction of the elf who tried to frame the Qunari, since it is hardly likely that she followed them all the way to Kirkwall from, say, Rivain. Even so, they are probably not aware of the full extent of the culture change they would experience if the Qunari did take control.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

It is also possible that they practice the Qun similar to the way the Rivaini do. They are allies with the Qunari of Par Vollen, but even in Kont-Aar, they seem to have "Seers" so I would expect they don't follow the Qun to the letter the way their Kossith allies do.

[labargegrrrl]

i vastly pref'd Legacy, because i miss saving the world. doesn't seem like Hawke gets to save the world as often as she messes it up. and the family element was compelling. and it was worth it to get the key! i freaking love that thing! plus, i was glad to see they finally brought the genlocks back.

MoTA had some cool elements, though. i liked mingling, poking fun at Orlais, playing sneaky and such...too many puzzles, though. plus, i was kind of hoping the prison break would be more allong the lines of the "Captured!" quests in Origins. i was actually anticipating that until Tallis popped the gate open and gave me a major case of the let-downs.

on the other tangent...why is everyone so eager to compare the qunari to real-world religion instead of similar counterparts in other scifi/fantasy worlds? just a thought.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The Qunari do remind me a little bit of a more authoritarian version of the Tau Empire, since people often like to make Warhammer comparisons.