348 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

StowyMcStowstow wrote...

You know what'd be even better? Splitscreen. Nothing like saving the galaxy with a friend. Oh wait. There isn't any. Because gamers have no friends except the ones that are on XBL or PSN or whatever, so they couldn't possibly ever think to make something that would allow two people to enjoy a game together.

I'm all for bots.

Then if the problem is no split sceen, then just make a topic asking for it..... The problem is not bot's it's split screen.

[Taciter]

dreman9999 wrote...

I'm not ageinst bots....Just questioning the logic of it....

Playing a co-op horde mode alone with bot's makes the game no longer a co-op game, it makes it a survival mode. Playing the game with bots make the chances of beating the mode worse because you working with bots with very limited intelligents. If you want the bots and the horde mode expriance....Just ask for it based on the sp where they already have a proper system in place

I 'think' I understand your gist dreman, are you suggesting that instead of asking for the MP co-op mode to incorporate an AI squad member(s) option, we should be asking for extra SP 'survival mode' missions instead?

If so, I understand what you're suggesting but mechanically I think it would be asking a lot of Bioware Edmonton to incorporate new missions into SP at this late stage and if they became part of the the main SP chain then there would be none of the fun of customising a cool alien co-op character - I want to experience what it would be like to fight as a Turian or Salarian, I just don't want to have to engage in Human co-op.

Modifié par Taciter, 28 octobre 2011 - 07:00 .

[dreman9999]

Taciter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

I'm not ageinst bots....Just questioning the logic of it....

Playing a co-op horde mode alone with bot's makes the game no longer a co-op game, it makes it a survival mode. Playing the game with bots make the chances of beating the mode worse because you working with bots with very limited intelligents. If you want the bots and the horde mode expriance....Just ask for it based on the sp where they already have a proper system in place

I 'think' I understand your gist dreman, are you suggesting that instead of asking for the MP co-op mode to incorporate an AI squad member(s) option, we should be asking for extra SP 'survival mode' missions instead?

If so, I understand what you're suggesting but mechanically I think it would be asking a lot of Bioware Edmonton to incorporate new missions into SP at this late stage and if they became part of the the main SP chain then there would be none of the fun of customising a cool alien co-op character - I want to experience what it would be like to fight as a Turian or Salarian, I just don't want to have to engage in Human co-op.

....Grunt's loyalty Mission...

Point is, yourjust in a big box fighting waves.That's not hard to make and Edmonton does not need to make it. Themp team can, they did make the dlc form ME2, so it's not out of question that they can make it. Think of it more like a pinnicale station 2.0

[MrFob]

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

Modifié par MrFob, 28 octobre 2011 - 07:16 .

[dreman9999]

MrFob wrote...

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

But the thing is your missing a key base of ME combat...Coordination. How do you coordinate with a bot that does things randomly? We got a taste of how that is like when we let the AI in ME1 and 2  do what ever they want......and it's not very good. Do we really want that in the mp....While facing stronger and stronger enemies?

Modifié par dreman9999, 28 octobre 2011 - 07:26 .

[MrFob]

I don't expect it to be as good as real people. I fully expect a survival mode in the end. I just don't want to ask BW to put any work in a NEW survival mode, just give us the co-op maps. Really, I don't see your problem with that or the point you are trying to make (that is not supposed to come of as hostile, I just really don't see it, sorry).

[Taciter]

dreman9999 wrote...

MrFob wrote...

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

But the thing is your missing a key base of ME combat...Coordination. How do you coordinate with a bot that does things randomly? We got a taste of how that is like when we let the AI in ME1 and 2  do what ever they want......and it's not very good. Do we really want that in the mp....While facing stronger and stronger enemies?

I love the 'we' part dreman, you don't subscribe to our vision and therefore you're not part of the 'we'.

And for the love of God, stop presuming to know what 'we' would like. If we've said that we'd 'like' absurdly stupid bots complementing our squad, then that's what 'we' have decided - have you got some sort of God complex or something? Also, I don't think you give the AI enough credit, sure they're not going to win any Chess Grandmaster tournaments but for the sake of 'survival' type co-op mission, they don't have to - all they have to do is take cover and 'hold the line'! Solo players will inevitably survive longer with a three expendable meat shields than they would Rambo mode.

Oh and regarding the Krogan 'experience', that's hardly a substitute for playing one of seven races is it? Come on man... think!

Modifié par Taciter, 28 octobre 2011 - 07:48 .

[DxWill10]

I support having bots. I understand why some don't, but it would certainly make things much more enjoyable and simple, for me anyway. Perhaps wait and initiate them until the multiplayer fan base has died down, then us long time fans can take a crack at it without having to worry about getting put in a match with some 12 year old who sounds like an evil micky mouse telling people what to do and hurling insults and profanity through the mic like a **** officer

[dreman9999]

Taciter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

MrFob wrote...

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

But the thing is your missing a key base of ME combat...Coordination. How do you coordinate with a bot that does things randomly? We got a taste of how that is like when we let the AI in ME1 and 2  do what ever they want......and it's not very good. Do we really want that in the mp....While facing stronger and stronger enemies?

I love the 'we' part dreman, you don't subscribe to our vision and therefore you're not part of the 'we'.

And for the love of God, stop presuming to know what 'we' would like. If we've said that we'd 'like' absurdly stupid bots complementing our squad, then that's what 'we' have decided - have you got some sort of God complex or something? Also, I don't think you give the AI enough credit, sure they're not going to win any Chess Grandmaster tournaments but for the sake of 'survival' type co-op mission, they don't have to - all they have to do is take cover and 'hold the line'! Solo players will inevitably survive longer with a three expendable meat shields than they would Rambo mode.

Oh and regarding the Krogan 'experience', that's hardly a substitute for playing one of seven races is it? Come on man... think!

Sure, because we all agree that the AI for the squad mates are so great in ME2.
Please....Don't pretend to note know anything I'm talking about or that you play ME2 in such away that it's 100% different from the way I do......At the basic level,people play ME in to ways....With the squad or not. You ether idnore them and do it yourself or work with them... And that is the problem with wanting bots.

It would still be playing by yourself, the AI will not keep up or be smart enough to add weight to the battle. This is the consern with the players who normally ignore their squad, they have to do everything on you own....And that doen't work out well in a horde mode with scaling difficulty. Anyone that plays horde mode can thell you team work is the way to BEAT the mode. So in thend it would be no differnt if you had bot or not because they won't beable to help you enouhgt.

And as for people who work with the squad......How can they control bots that play on their own? They doing their own thing and you can't plan your attacks.

In short, if you normally ignore your squade in the sp and do everything yourself....That won't work well in the mp, because it not build for that and bot are not advance enough for that type of support to pull you through, clearly based on ME1 and 2. And, with people who coordinate, you lose the ability to do that with bots only.

Also, if the only wayto play the krogan experiance is with mp....To bad.

[Taciter]

That's great DxWill, nice to have another supporter within our swelling ranks. However...

DxWill10 wrote...
I support having bots. I understand why some don't

Don't prostrate yourself in the face of irrational self-interest. Anyone who 'opposes' the idea of MP AI bots is basically just a narcissistic zealot - since an AI bot 'option' would have no impact on the ability to play with other humans, any arguments they submit are unfounded and unjustified. Don't give them them the acknowledgment they demand.

Modifié par Taciter, 28 octobre 2011 - 08:38 .

[Taciter]

dreman9999 wrote...
*enormous quantities of baseless supposition and narcissistic drivel*

You bore me dreman, you seem to follow me around like a lingering odour and ALL you ever do is argue in favour of denying people their wishes despite the fact that their wishes would in no way impinge on your chosen style of play. You have to be just about the most supremely arrogant little vegetable I've ever encountered.

[edit] Okay, I know what it is now... you're an attention seeker. You discovered some time ago that contradicting people compels them to engage in discourse. You're insecure and desperately crave acknowledgement and this is how you choose to stimulate it. I suggest you find a more fulfilling pastime and practise working on your self-esteem.

Modifié par Taciter, 28 octobre 2011 - 08:27 .

[BloodyTalon]

It would be nice to have bots I know I dont have many friends to do mps with, none really but couldn't you join one of the groups to help get some to mp with you or just don't want to run the risks of jerk wards messing things up.

In either case  bots could work well I think, but nothing beats mping with others to get the job done.

Modifié par Talosred, 28 octobre 2011 - 08:25 .

[Taciter]

Talosred wrote...

It would be nice to have bots I know I dont have many friends to do mps with, none really but couldn't you join one of the groups to help get some to mp with you or just don't want to run the risks of jerk wards messing things up.

In either case limited use of bots could work well I think, but nothing beats mping with others to get the job done.

It's not that black and white Talos, we're not asking for some sort of 'limited' compromise, we're asking for an 'option' to use AI squad mates entirely. But a side benefit for human coop inclined players, an option to simply 'fill in' the missing squad member slots when the player roster is looking a bit anemic, could be of invaluable worth to casual MP'ers.

[BloodyTalon]

Taciter wrote...

Talosred wrote...

It would be nice to have bots I know I dont have many friends to do mps with, none really but couldn't you join one of the groups to help get some to mp with you or just don't want to run the risks of jerk wards messing things up.

In either case limited use of bots could work well I think, but nothing beats mping with others to get the job done.

It's not that black and white Talos, we're not asking for some sort of 'limited' compromise, we're asking for an 'option' to use AI squad mates entirely. But a side benefit for human coop inclined players, an option to simply 'fill in' the missing squad member slots when the player roster is looking a bit anemic, could be of invaluable worth to casual MP'ers.

Corrected my post after re-reading somethings I am more causal mp person. I am a bit out of it and really should stop coming on the forums late at night.

Modifié par Talosred, 28 octobre 2011 - 08:31 .

[Taciter]

Talosred wrote...
Corrected my post after re-reading somethings I am more causal mp person. I am a bit out of it and really should stop coming on the forums late at night.

No apologies Talos, I'm a borderline insomniac myself - don't let misinterpretations put you off something you clearly enjoy doing!

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

MrFob wrote...

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

But the thing is your missing a key base of ME combat...Coordination. How do you coordinate with a bot that does things randomly? We got a taste of how that is like when we let the AI in ME1 and 2  do what ever they want......and it's not very good. Do we really want that in the mp....While facing stronger and stronger enemies?

Because of course the AI squadmates in the SP gameplay can't be given orders...

Oh, wait.

[nelly21]

I don't understand. If you want bots instead of people, why not just stick to SP?

[Someone With Mass]

nelly21 wrote...

I don't understand. If you want bots instead of people, why not just stick to SP?

Because it's not the same thing.

[nelly21]

Someone With Mass wrote...

nelly21 wrote...

I don't understand. If you want bots instead of people, why not just stick to SP?

Because it's not the same thing.

But co-op is built around multiple players. It would be like playing WoW alone, i.e. pointless.

[Someone With Mass]

nelly21 wrote...
But co-op is built around multiple players. It would be like playing WoW alone, i.e. pointless.

This co-op is adjusting itself after the number of players, so no. It's not pointless.

Perhaps someone with a crappy internet connection (like myself) wants to have the mode scaled up to a full party, but can't. That's where I think the bots would do great.

[dreman9999]

MrFob wrote...

I don't expect it to be as good as real people. I fully expect a survival mode in the end. I just don't want to ask BW to put any work in a NEW survival mode, just give us the co-op maps. Really, I don't see your problem with that or the point you are trying to make (that is not supposed to come of as hostile, I just really don't see it, sorry).

By asking for bots and to be able to play the co-op allown is just asking for a survival mode. I can understand it's use to fill a spot, but a bot can never be better thanhavinga real person.Their not smart enough. It would be like playing the mode with just one member of the team and some gun turrents.

[dreman9999]

Someone With Mass wrote...

nelly21 wrote...
But co-op is built around multiple players. It would be like playing WoW alone, i.e. pointless.

This co-op is adjusting itself after the number of players, so no. It's not pointless.

Perhaps someone with a crappy internet connection (like myself) wants to have the mode scaled up to a full party, but can't. That's where I think the bots would do great.

But it's still build for mp.....Even bioware stated it's hard playing it for one person. Using bot to fill the team up will make game put a 4 player rush on one player.

[dreman9999]

Someone With Mass wrote...

nelly21 wrote...

I don't understand. If you want bots instead of people, why not just stick to SP?

Because it's not the same thing.

It is the samething.....
MP is a horde mode where try to servive. It take maps based on the sp and put players in a box and have them fight in waves.....That just how a sp side mission works. The only difference is that you don't have control over your team with bots in mp, you can change your race, and you have nopause menu....

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

MrFob wrote...

But they already have bots working for the coop maps right now (stated by dev). All they need to do is NOT take them out for the final product. They may want to do some balancing because they say it's really tough right now with the bots but IMO they don't even need to do that. Just let us use the system in place. That is what we are asking for, not some new missions that might or might not have to be made by anyone.

EDIT: Besides, this is about giving people who do not want/are not able to play MP the chance to still see and play these maps. You make a new mission, great but you still don't see/play these maps.

But the thing is your missing a key base of ME combat...Coordination. How do you coordinate with a bot that does things randomly? We got a taste of how that is like when we let the AI in ME1 and 2  do what ever they want......and it's not very good. Do we really want that in the mp....While facing stronger and stronger enemies?

Because of course the AI squadmates in the SP gameplay can't be given orders...

Oh, wait.

That's my point. AI squadmates can be given orders. With the mp...It's not built for that. It's built for a person to deal with their own powers only. It's not build for you to give orders to the AI, so you won't give orders to your bots in mp.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Yeah, you're still not getting it.