83 réponses à ce sujet

[PantheraOnca]

As an FYI, rolling to live SUUUUUUUUCKS. You might want to make the roll have to do with how bad their char's nightmares/taintsong/voice of the archdemons is. maybe give them some kind of debuff? (i haven't read the RPG books, so i'm not sure how the system works.)

[MKDAWUSS]

I suppose it's 50-50. You either live or you die.


There is a theoretical(?) possibility that you could have all your candidates die in the Joining.

[Lazy Jer]

blaidfiste wrote...

Lethal to any non important character. Jory was right to resist.

Good point.  Before The Joining one should ask oneself "Am I a major character" if the answer is no...don't.

[MKDAWUSS]

Lazy Jer wrote...

blaidfiste wrote...

Lethal to any non important character. Jory was right to resist.

Good point.  Before The Joining one should ask oneself "Am I a major character" if the answer is no...don't.

But how do you know if you are a major character? 

[Lazy Jer]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

But how do you know if you are a major character? 

I suppose how major a character you are is directly related to how tragic your past is.  If your father is dead and your whole village was destroyed by darkspawn...you're a major character.  If your family is entirely intact and you had a happy well-adjusted childhood...you're not.

..but that's just a wild guess.

Modifié par Lazy Jer, 05 novembre 2011 - 09:01 .

[Zanallen]

Lazy Jer wrote...

I suppose how major a character you are is directly related to how tragic your past is.  If your father is dead and your whole village was destroyed by darkspawn...you're a major character.  If your family is entirely intact and you had a happy well-adjusted childhood...you're not.

..but that's just a wild guess.

What about poor Mhairi?

[dragonflight288]

What about poor Mhairi?

She's important to show that the Joining is dangerous and deadly for people just barely starting.

[AlexXIV]

dragonflight288 wrote...

What about poor Mhairi?

She's important to show that the Joining is dangerous and deadly for people just barely starting.

She also shows that you shouldn't be eager to become Grey Warden, also Jory.

[Finnish Dragon]

Zanallen wrote...

What about poor Mhairi?

She was Bioware´s trademark for being the redshirt who would die in the beginning. One can compare her to Trask Ulgo in KOTOR, Jenkins from Mass Effect or Wilson from Mass Effect 2. It proves that for other people it is healthier to associate and join forces with the hero later because then the chance to get the plot armor is higher. 

[blaidfiste]

Anders: I'm a mage and a spirit healer, I'm guaranteed to live
Oghren: I'm a returning DAO companion, I should be ok
Mhairi: #$%# you Bioware!

[Vegos]

Oghren: I'm a returning DAO companion, I should be ok

---Plus, there's not a drink in the world that could get anything more than a belch out of me.

My first reaction on his Joining was actually "OKAY, now you're just making me look bad! I nearly bit the dust myself!"

Modifié par Vegos, 08 novembre 2011 - 12:17 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

PantheraOnca wrote...

As an FYI, rolling to live SUUUUUUUUCKS.

I don't see any other way to avoid having the players be confident their characters will survive.

I love the rolling to live approach.  But then, I also think that 80% of all RPG characters should die before they reach level 5.

[Fast Jimmy]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

PantheraOnca wrote...

As an FYI, rolling to live SUUUUUUUUCKS.

I don't see any other way to avoid having the players be confident their characters will survive.

I love the rolling to live approach.  But then, I also think that 80% of all RPG characters should die before they reach level 5.

I loved being that kind of DM.

I hated playing under that kind of DM. LOL 

Survival of the luckiest!

[PantheraOnca]

The binary nature of the joining is a real **** to work around when trying to keep a group together while imparting a sense of risk.

Hence the idea of guaranteeing survival, but potentially imposing a long-lasting/permanent penalty based on the severity of the darkspawn jibber jabber while asleep (based on a roll). This would also allow for different degrees of severity which could be exhibited throughout the group.

[PantheraOnca]

doublepost.

I blame my cat.

Modifié par PantheraOnca, 08 novembre 2011 - 01:33 .

[EmperorSahlertz]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

PantheraOnca wrote...

As an FYI, rolling to live SUUUUUUUUCKS.

I don't see any other way to avoid having the players be confident their characters will survive.

I love the rolling to live approach.  But then, I also think that 80% of all RPG characters should die before they reach level 5.

Roll to survive doesn't really work in a game where you can just reload a previous save and try again.... It loses all purpose, and simply become an annoyance.

[Andraste_Reborn]

Roll to survive doesn't really work in a game where you can just reload a previous save and try again.... It loses all purpose, and simply become an annoyance.

I'm pretty sure Sylvius is talking about tabletop RPGs here.

My intention is for my players to face a low but significant chance of death at their Joining. (Say, 10% or so. I won't necessarily be telling them their chances in advance, though.) It'll make it mean more if and when everyone pulls through without risking campaign-ending party death.

[Vegos]

Andrastee wrote...

Roll to survive doesn't really work in a game where you can just reload a previous save and try again.... It loses all purpose, and simply become an annoyance.

I'm pretty sure Sylvius is talking about tabletop RPGs here.

My intention is for my players to face a low but significant chance of death at their Joining. (Say, 10% or so. I won't necessarily be telling them their chances in advance, though.) It'll make it mean more if and when everyone pulls through without risking campaign-ending party death.

The moment there's a chance of death, there's a chance of a total party kill. Low probability, of course, but greater than zero.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Andrastee wrote...

Roll to survive doesn't really work in a game where you can just reload a previous save and try again.... It loses all purpose, and simply become an annoyance.

I'm pretty sure Sylvius is talking about tabletop RPGs here.

My intention is for my players to face a low but significant chance of death at their Joining. (Say, 10% or so. I won't necessarily be telling them their chances in advance, though.) It'll make it mean more if and when everyone pulls through without risking campaign-ending party death.

Oh, serves me right for not reading the whole thread....

But still, the lethality of the joinning should only matter if you as DM only want joinning the Grey Wardens to be optional to the story you have planned. There is nothing worse than forced "roll to surive" situations, which you must succeed to advance the story.

So if you want the joinning to be optional give the player a 1/6 or 1/3 chance of death, depending of course of how much of an advantage you plan on giving them for survivng (remember all Grey Wardens gain one extra skill/spell after the joinning).
But if you want the joinning to be mandatory, as in the story you plan is about Grey Wardens, then the mortality chance should be a clear zero.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I loved being that kind of DM.

I hated playing under that kind of DM. LOL 

Survival of the luckiest!

Not the luckiest.  The most risk-averse.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Andrastee wrote...

Roll to survive doesn't really work in a game where you can just reload a previous save and try again.... It loses all purpose, and simply become an annoyance.

I'm pretty sure Sylvius is talking about tabletop RPGs here.

I was, but even in CRPGs I think it's a good mechanic.  That the player can reload doesn't change the in-game reality that death is a real possibility, and that should influence the characters' decisions.

If the player had his character act cavalierly because the player knows he can just reload, then the player is metagaming.  For roleplaying purposes, I think the roll to survive is an excellent mechanic even in CRPGs.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Death being an eventuality won't ever influence the computer gamer, since he can just reload until he achieves the desired result.

[Sylvius the Mad]

You're completely ignoring roleplaying considerations. The possibility of death should affect the behaviour of the characters, and if the player's goal is to implement a coherent character design, then that influence should filter through.

[AlexXIV]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

You're completely ignoring roleplaying considerations. The possibility of death should affect the behaviour of the characters, and if the player's goal is to implement a coherent character design, then that influence should filter through.

Then you need a different way to make RPGs. Most quests and encounters suggest that the protagonist can't fail/die. I mean if you are realistic then the protagonist is a fool because he/she runs headlong into impossible odds. If there wasn't certainty to get out of it on top the protagonist would die very early and in a very foolish way.

[Herr Uhl]

AlexXIV wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

You're completely ignoring roleplaying considerations. The possibility of death should affect the behaviour of the characters, and if the player's goal is to implement a coherent character design, then that influence should filter through.

Then you need a different way to make RPGs. Most quests and encounters suggest that the protagonist can't fail/die. I mean if you are realistic then the protagonist is a fool because he/she runs headlong into impossible odds. If there wasn't certainty to get out of it on top the protagonist would die very early and in a very foolish way.

Which is why you shouldn't force the rushing headlong into impossible odds or risking their lives and those of others on very slight chances.

I'm looking at you Haven.