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[Gyrefalcon]

***lots of spoilers, you have been warned***

     I know there are a lot of people who hate Anders for what he did at the end.  Even supporters of Anders can't feel comfortable with his actions.  Of course, that is part of what actually makes the game great.

      I will throw out a hypothesis for both parties:  Anders actions are upsetting because he takes them instead of the player/Hawke. 

     When you, as the player, get to sit in judgement and decide whether to support an action or not You can kill Templars or blood mages all day, innocent or not.  (Look at DuPuis, did he get spared since he wasn't doing the killings or killed for being a blood mage and looking for revenge?)  But Anders does it without the player/Hawke's consent.  Thus it is more shocking.  Yet he isn't doing it thoughtlessly.  He had to realize there would be innocent lives lost in the process,hence how absolutely miserable he is when it all goes down. 

     When you, as the player, get to decide the fate of Merrill versus the desires of the whole Dalish clan, you feel more comfortable with the outcome, even if it was slaughtering hundreds for the sake of one.  What about Isabella and her holding onto the book?  Her selfishness cost the city many completely innocent lives, including the Vicount's and his son's.  You were stuck doing combat and having chunks of the city burn then also.

     But you had a choice:  give the book to Isabella or set her free with it to save her life.
     You as the player felt you had some say, some control.

     But that is not the case with Anders.  You can have suspiscions but the final decision was his not yours/Hawke's.  And that means that the character really came to life in the tale as having independence from your actions/approval.  And that is why I think Anders draws so much love/hate.  He proves to be a very complex element in the game by chosing to start a revolution. 

      So kick the idea around and see whether it makes sense to you or not and throw your thoughts down below.  Opinions?

    
       I am going to be quite curious as to what DA canon will be on his fate.  Anders is well-noted to be extremely gifted as a healer.  Do you think a simple knife in the back would to him in?  And even if a lot of people think he died,  who knows how Varric will spin it?   

***spoilers are over***

Modifié par Gyrefalcon, 03 novembre 2011 - 10:19 .

[randomcheeses]

You know, there is actually an Anders thread where you'd be better off posting this.. It's over two thousand pages long. Can't miss it.

[LadyJaneGrey]

Gyrefalcon wrote...
...

And that is why I think Anders draws so much love/hate.  He proves to be a very complex element in the game by chosing to start a revolution. 

      So kick the idea around and see whether it makes sense to you or not and throw your thoughts down below.  Opinions?

...

The lack of player control certainly contributes to the Anders love/hate, but it's certainly not the only reason he's disliked.  Merrill, Fenris, and Isabela have their fair share of haters even though the player has more influence in their arcs than Anders'.  I loved that the characters had their own agendas for most of the story and Hawke could either help or get out of the way.  How I feel about Andersultimately comes down much more to the character interactions than the Chantry explosion.  (Though I still make the same end decision every time.  Go figure.)

I had the misfortune of getting all Anders' most sanctimonious//inappropriate/clueless lines with my first Hawke.  Dude, are you REALLY asking someone you just met about private role-playing with her recently deceased husband?  Or commenting on Isabela's sex life?  Or b****ing about a friend's behavior when all she's done is protect you for seven years?  And why are you babbling about Hawke always supporting you personally when she hasn't? 

The second Hawke was almost the exact opposite; Anders has some genuinely funny/charming lines and several well-reasoned arguments (well, when he isn't being over-the-top dramatic at least).  The arc of his losing himself to Justice felt natural and truly tragic.

It's a weird see-saw of loving the guy and wanting to give him a hug and hating him and wanting to smack upside the head...but Hawke's impotence never factored into it.

[Gyrefalcon]

Thanks, Random Cheeses. I will have to look again at the list. I did come across a large page that wasn't loading properly for me, might have been that one. Maybe it will work better today.

LadyJaneGrey wrote...


The lack of player control certainly contributes to the Anders love/hate, but it's certainly not the only reason he's disliked. *snip*

I had the misfortune of getting all Anders' most sanctimonious//inappropriate/clueless lines with my first Hawke. The second Hawke was almost the exact opposite; Anders has some genuinely funny/charming lines and several well-reasoned arguments (well, when he isn't being over-the-top dramatic at least). The arc of his losing himself to Justice felt natural and truly tragic.

It's a weird see-saw of loving the guy and wanting to give him a hug and hating him and wanting to smack upside the head...but Hawke's impotence never factored into it.

@LadyJaneGrey: It's interesting that your various Hawke's feelings towards Anders were well set in advance of the big explosion. And I have to hand it to Bioware for writing realistically flawed characters. It is much better to not have everyone you help suddenly change their ways and become shining paragons of society (pun intended). You know darn well that Fenris, Isabella, Merrill, and Anders will still have the same opinions and do the same kinds of things tomorrow as they did today. You might moderate them some when you are around but there is not a sudden shift. The characters are much more human than those if Fable 3. Lionhead Studios could learn a lot from Bioware's efforts. I do think Bioware is raising the bar for storyline and character writing. This is really good news for everyone.