1467 réponses à ce sujet

[Alex_SM]

There won't be any fuss about if that disaster called Dragon Age 2 wasn't their last released game. But it is, and everything they are saying are showing recalls what they said and showed in DA2.

[upsettingshorts]

Alex_SM wrote...

There won't be any fuss about if that
disaster called Dragon Age 2 wasn't their last released game. But it is,
and everything they are saying are showing recalls what they said and
showed in DA2.

What if DA2 had a toggle between unique outfits and equipping companions?
What if it had a toggle between silent VA and voiced protagonist?
What if it had a toggle between over the top animations and slower deliberate ones?
What if it had a toggle for friendly fire?

The number of complaints about DA2 that have been proposed to be fixed with toggles is pretty much endless. 

Mass Effect 3 introduces a toggle and the sky is falling and the game genre is being changed. 

Vegos wrote...

So your problem is not the complaints, but your lack of patience?

Yes, that seems about right.

Too bad for you, but you know...reading these posts and replying to them is optional. They dont' have to affect you, so why are you complaining about people? Just don't read what they write. You know. Use the toggle.

Good advice, I'll take it.

Maybe you should also practice what you preach and get over the toggle. 

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 05 novembre 2011 - 09:02 .

[Merci357]

Vegos wrote...

Then don't use the toggle.  It doesn't have to effect you at all.  I'm going to put it on RPG mode when I get it and that's the last time I'll have to think about it.

You know, I'm getting tired of this "Why complain if it doesn't affect you" argument.

Then explain it to me, plain and simple. What is so bad about the existence of an option, that you are free to ignore?

[Alex_SM]

Merci357 wrote...

Vegos wrote...

Then don't use the toggle.  It doesn't have to effect you at all.  I'm going to put it on RPG mode when I get it and that's the last time I'll have to think about it.

You know, I'm getting tired of this "Why complain if it doesn't affect you" argument.

Then explain it to me, plain and simple. What is so bad about the existence of an option, that you are free to ignore?

The problem is not the option itself. 

The problem is that, as the game has been probably designed to please players who play using that option, it has probabley affected the design of the whole game. 

[Vegos]

Balek-Vriege wrote...


How is it default? Because it comes up first on the main menu?

The "default" options are indeed mostly listed on top of menus, but of course that doesn't necessarily make it the other way around. Still, I find it rather odd to list that one first; I mean, the implications of it are kinda uncomfortable.

Unless of course they were randomly placed, but I somehow don't think so.

[AtreiyaN7]

I think it's fine and that they're just adding different levels of control for people. It doesn't affect my RPG experience, so why should I care what others do in their games? They can enjoy it in their own way, and I will enjoy it the way that I want.

[Alex_SM]

What if DA2 had a toggle between unique outfits and equipping companions?
What if it had a toggle between silent VA and voiced protagonist?
What if it had a toggle between over the top animations and slower deliberate ones?
What if it had a toggle for friendly fire?

That where not, by any means, any of the main problems of that HORRIBLE game. 

[Vegos]

Then explain it to me, plain and simple. What is so bad about the existence of an option, that you are free to ignore?

You are asking for a plain and simple explanation on such an ABSTRACT question?

You've gotta be kidding me.

I'm afraid you'll have to be more specific. Are we talking about "an" option, ANY option the human mind has ever, will ever and might ever come up with? Or are we talking about this one specific option?

Modifié par Vegos, 05 novembre 2011 - 09:04 .

[Cimeas]

This is like having a toggle in CoD that just auto aims and fires in singleplayer so you can watch badly done cutscenes about a Russian guy's plot for world domination. That wouldn't make it a shooter, so I don't see why people somehow shouldn't complain when playing action mode doesn't make ME3 an RPG.

It doesn't matter if Action mode is a toggle, because it's a toggle that removes a core element of gameplay. Like removing 'story' from Uncharted or 'combat' from Dragon Age or 'stealth' from Deus Ex, simply having it as an option means that some gamers won't play the game Bioware has built.

For decades, even if you play on 'easy mode' you have been able to experience the core gameplay elements of the games you buy, and ME3 is changing that, turning the game from what will hopefully be a pinnacle in digital storytelling to a mediocre shooter.

Mass Effect as a franchise, deserves better.

[Balek-Vriege]

Vegos wrote...

Balek-Vriege wrote...


How is it default? Because it comes up first on the main menu?

The "default" options are indeed mostly listed on top of menus, but of course that doesn't necessarily make it the other way around. Still, I find it rather odd to list that one first; I mean, the implications of it are kinda uncomfortable.

Unless of course they were randomly placed, but I somehow don't think so.

The implications could be as simple "It looks best listed this way."  Lets see:

Action Mode

Story Mode

RPG Mode

--

RPG Mode

Story Mode

Action Mode

--

Story Mode

RPG Mode

Action Mode

Meh who knows.



All I know is that Action Mode is listed as just that, Action Mode (not Default Mode).  Everyone who has played a Mass Effect  also knows what the default mode is and that's RPG Mode.

[Vegos]

Yes, "could be" is the bit where things get foggy.

[publius1000]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Montezuma IV wrote...

Nearly every argument I've seen you make seems to be against the majority --- curious.

Either way, Toggling a game series specificly known for the factors it contains -- such as dialogue and RPG elements, is stupid and useless, in my opinion.

Sometimes I'm against the majority, sometimes I'm with them, most of the time I just think everyone arguing is missing the point.

Then don't use the toggle.  It doesn't have to effect you at all.  I'm going to put it on RPG mode when I get it and that's the last time I'll have to think about it.

But I know some people who will pick story mode, for example.  I don't know anyone personally who would pick action mode, but I'm sure they're out there.  And considering it's a toggle that doesn't hurt anyone, they'll be allowed to enjoy the game on their terms, too.  

Everyone wins, no-one loses, except people who waste their time arguing on message boards about what this means for BioWare's "direction." 

slimgrin wrote...

I like toggles too, until toggles start changing the genre of your game.

Your slippery slope argument is hysterical.

Are you still going to be able to play how you wanted?  Stop complaining. 

This. If you want to play RPG mode then PLAY ****ING RPG MODE! Why do you care that other people will get a different experience, live and let live guys. I know that I personally will play only RPG mode, but for instance my mom, who by the way has about 2x more playthroughs of ME2 and 1 and DA2 and DA:O than I have, will like story mode because she's not that good at combat (not that she hasn't beaten ME2 on insanity several times) and is mostly into plot and characters.

[Vegos]

jreezy wrote...

Vegos wrote...

Then don't use the toggle.  It doesn't have to effect you at all.  I'm going to put it on RPG mode when I get it and that's the last time I'll have to think about it.

You know, I'm getting tired of this "Why complain if it doesn't affect you" argument.

Stop arguing about it then.

I'm not, I'm just stating a fact, the fact that I'm tired of it

[1136342t54_]

Alex_SM wrote...

The problem is not the option itself. 

The problem is that, as the game has been probably designed to please players who play using that option, it has probabley affected the design of the whole game. 

Explain in a proper way how difficult it would really be for bioware to actually just not give the player a manual choice in dialog? Bioware just basically created a linear play style with specific dialog choices and quite possibly purposely skipped a lot of things (like most players do after playing ME3 for the hundreth time) it really shouldn't be as difficult as people are making it.

[Sainthood85]

So, I just pick RPG Mode and set to Insanity? Seems reasonable enough for me to enjoy the game. I just hope that the enemies are difficult and varied like in ME1, yet ME3 lacks that certain point in Leveling up where you hit it, then you turn into an avatar of unstoppable death become man.

[Balek-Vriege]

johnxtreeme wrote...

This is like having a toggle in CoD that just auto aims and fires in singleplayer so you can watch badly done cutscenes about a Russian guy's plot for world domination. That wouldn't make it a shooter, so I don't see why people somehow shouldn't complain when playing action mode doesn't make ME3 an RPG.

It doesn't matter if Action mode is a toggle, because it's a toggle that removes a core element of gameplay. Like removing 'story' from Uncharted or 'combat' from Dragon Age or 'stealth' from Deus Ex, simply having it as an option means that some gamers won't play the game Bioware has built.

For decades, even if you play on 'easy mode' you have been able to experience the core gameplay elements of the games you buy, and ME3 is changing that, turning the game from what will hopefully be a pinnacle in digital storytelling to a mediocre shooter.

Mass Effect as a franchise, deserves better.

Again how does a toggle to auto choose options completely remove the story and RPG elements?  It doesn't.
How does casual difficulty completely remove combat from the game?  It doesn't.

That's like saying the auto level up feature completely takes away RPG elements even though your character still progresses with level ups, is a certain profession, still plays the same and story choice is still available.  You're making points as if the auto dialogue option means no dialogue and skips conversations all together.  Not the case (you still need to press spacebar for that I think).

[jeweledleah]

johnxtreeme wrote...

This is like having a toggle in CoD that just auto aims and fires in singleplayer so you can watch badly done cutscenes about a Russian guy's plot for world domination. That wouldn't make it a shooter, so I don't see why people somehow shouldn't complain when playing action mode doesn't make ME3 an RPG.

It doesn't matter if Action mode is a toggle, because it's a toggle that removes a core element of gameplay. Like removing 'story' from Uncharted or 'combat' from Dragon Age or 'stealth' from Deus Ex, simply having it as an option means that some gamers won't play the game Bioware has built.

For decades, even if you play on 'easy mode' you have been able to experience the core gameplay elements of the games you buy, and ME3 is changing that, turning the game from what will hopefully be a pinnacle in digital storytelling to a mediocre shooter.

Mass Effect as a franchise, deserves better.

oh for the love of.  was ME any less of an rpg due to having an option to auto level? did people developing console commands for skipping combat parts make it any less of an rpg?
was Lords of the realm and Heroes of might and magic any less of a strategy game for having an option for auto combat?

existance of an option tdoes NOT devalue your ability to play a full game.  just becasue ME2 for example had very sparse defautl decisions for ME1 didn't negate the fact that those who played ME1 got to pick out their own choices, on the contrary.

I played original Deus Ex on god mode.  i wanted to play through the story, but I disliked the bombat very much.  how did my playing on god mode detract from your experience of playing the full game without it?  does existance of renegade choices and romances you are not interested in, detracted from thechoices YOU make?

its a choice.  by definition, you don't have to take it.

as  franchise that's allabout choice, I think this is a fantastic idea on a part of Bioware.it may not be the choice you like or will ever take, but its mere existance doesn't devaluate your chosen playstyle.  not at all.

its a game.  let people play it the way they like best.  what does it matter, as long as YOU can play it the way you like best as well?

[Sajuro]

Alex_SM wrote...

Merci357 wrote...

Vegos wrote...

Then don't use the toggle.  It doesn't have to effect you at all.  I'm going to put it on RPG mode when I get it and that's the last time I'll have to think about it.

You know, I'm getting tired of this "Why complain if it doesn't affect you" argument.

Then explain it to me, plain and simple. What is so bad about the existence of an option, that you are free to ignore?

The problem is not the option itself. 

The problem is that, as the game has been probably designed to please players who play using that option, it has probabley affected the design of the whole game. 

It's like Silent Hill Dood, you can have hard,medium, or easy puzzles and hard,medium, or easy combat.
They aren't changing anything game except how difficult the enemies will be, it would be like playing on Casual for Story mode, Insanity for combat mode, and normal or veteran for RPG mode.

[1136342t54_]

johnxtreeme wrote...

This is like having a toggle in CoD that just auto aims and fires in singleplayer so you can watch badly done cutscenes about a Russian guy's plot for world domination. That wouldn't make it a shooter, so I don't see why people somehow shouldn't complain when playing action mode doesn't make ME3 an RPG.

It doesn't matter if Action mode is a toggle, because it's a toggle that removes a core element of gameplay. Like removing 'story' from Uncharted or 'combat' from Dragon Age or 'stealth' from Deus Ex, simply having it as an option means that some gamers won't play the game Bioware has built.

For decades, even if you play on 'easy mode' you have been able to experience the core gameplay elements of the games you buy, and ME3 is changing that, turning the game from what will hopefully be a pinnacle in digital storytelling to a mediocre shooter.

Mass Effect as a franchise, deserves better.

So you believe that every single player who probably will play the game multiple times won't actually care about playing Action mode? Action mode could actually help me out when I actually usually want to skip crap most of the time. 

Also your comparison is inaccurate. The core part of COD is combat which is inherently gameplay throughout most of the game. By cutting that out you are cutting out most of the game to be honest and no one actually play the COD campaign more than once. Your comparison would be more valid if you compared it to cutting out multiplayer in COD. Singleplayer is pretty fun in COD but MP is where the real focus usually is.

The core part of ME is a bit of a mix of combat (which includes leveling up, experience and all around plenty of RPG elements) and story. Cutting out either of those wouldn't make it Mass Effect at all. 

[Vegos]

Balek-Vriege wrote...


Again how does a toggle to auto choose options completely remove the story and RPG elements? 

Basically, if the game makes the decisions for me, then it doesn't really feel like I'm "role playing".

To me, "role playing" implies some action and decisions on my part, not just following a straight path.

And don't come back with "don't use it then", cause I was answering the question that assumes the option is being used.

Modifié par Vegos, 05 novembre 2011 - 09:16 .

[1136342t54_]

Balek-Vriege wrote...

Again how does a toggle to auto choose options completely remove the story and RPG elements?  It doesn't.
How does casual difficulty completely remove combat from the game?  It doesn't.

That's like saying the auto level up feature completely takes away RPG elements even though your character still progresses with level ups, is a certain profession, still plays the same and story choice is still available.  You're making points as if the auto dialogue option means no dialogue and skips conversations all together.  Not the case (you still need to press spacebar for that I think).

People get confused by any sort of choice. That is why Dictatorships sometimes get a lot of popularity .

[1136342t54_]

Vegos wrote...

Balek-Vriege wrote...


Again how does a toggle to auto choose options completely remove the story and RPG elements? 

Basically, if the game makes the decisions for me, then it doesn't really feel like I'm "role playing".

To me, "role playing" implies some action and decisions on my part, not just following a straight path.

That doesn't answer the question properly. You have a CHOICE to pick Action mode or story and RPG mode. If for some reason you pick Action mode and are pissed about having little to no choice in story then that is your fault. If you pick RPG or Story mode then you should get to make the decisions and roleplay. 

[jeweledleah]

Alex_SM wrote...

The problem is not the option itself. 

The problem is that, as the game has been probably designed to please players who play using that option, it has probabley affected the design of the whole game.

you know that its possible to finish ME1 and ME2 wth no issues while skipping something like 90% of the dialogue, right?  the game is already designed in such a way as to allow people to play as in depth or as shalowly as they wish.  the fact that you can skip 90% of the dialogue, doesn't invalidate its existance or all the extra experiences and enjoyment you can derive from it.  Action mode just makes the skipping a little bit easier.

edited  - from what I saw, you can change modes of conversation and combat at will at any point of the game.  so even if you start on action mode, you can switch to rpg settings at any time.  and the other way around.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 05 novembre 2011 - 09:18 .

[Vegos]

1136342t54 wrote...

Balek-Vriege wrote...

Again how does a toggle to auto choose options completely remove the story and RPG elements?  It doesn't.
How does casual difficulty completely remove combat from the game?  It doesn't.

That's like saying the auto level up feature completely takes away RPG elements even though your character still progresses with level ups, is a certain profession, still plays the same and story choice is still available.  You're making points as if the auto dialogue option means no dialogue and skips conversations all together.  Not the case (you still need to press spacebar for that I think).

People get confused by any sort of choice. That is why Dictatorships sometimes get a lot of popularity .

You know, the "action mode" could be called the "dictatorship mode", seeing as you don't get to make choices, cause the governemnt....I mean, game, makes them for you.