204 réponses à ce sujet

[Vilio1]

*shrugs*

We obviously have different definitions of racism. Calling aliens "monsters" and the "I can't tell the aliens from the animals" line are clearly racist, imo.

Modifié par Vilio1, 21 décembre 2011 - 05:33 .

[CptData]

Vilio1 wrote...

*shrugs*

We obviously have different definitions of racism. Calling aliens "monsters" and the "I can't tell the aliens from the animals" line are clearly racist, imo.

The later line is glitched and wasn't intented as generic banter afaik.
Seriously, BW should have fixed that one.

I'm not sure at what point she pulled the "Monster".

[Drone223]

Vilio1 wrote...

*shrugs*

We obviously have different definitions of racism. Calling aliens "monsters" and the "I can't tell the aliens from the animals" line are clearly racist, imo.

Keeper's do look like bugs, Hanar look like jellies, elcor look like elephants, she was suppose to say that next to a keeper, I don't think she would say that to a turian or asari, She even hates Cerberus and the Terra Ferma party and suprise suprise, they are both extremely pro-human and anti-alien groups 

Modifié par Drone223, 21 décembre 2011 - 09:15 .

[Dariustwinblade]

Cerberus is a terrorist organisation. The very defination of Space N@zi.


She you don't need to be a N@zi to be a racist.


"I may not like Aliens but I don't agree with Cerberus"

Just replace Alien with ******,Black, Jews if you don't understand.
That is by is very much shows her racist belief.

[Yuqi]

Stardusk78 wrote...

RampantAndroid wrote...

Drone223 wrote...

RampantAndroid wrote...

I romanced ash on my first PT (I've only done 5 PTs or less...heh) - Ash to me is a bit of a b****....through ME1 she's just anti-alien, and then into ME2 she just hates on you. I think it was after Ash showed up that that playthrough (where I had romanced ash in ME1) finished with Miranda. Ash just got on my nerves on a second play through, and I seem to remember telling her to shut up once or twice.

Liara is honestly in my mind a "better" person if you will, though I also have the complaint of her sounding like she has less emotion than Data from Star Trek TNG. Given the changes seen in LOTSB I think I'll enjoy her character a bit more in ME3.

If you listen carfully Ashley volenter's to work with Salerian STG without being told by Shepard, there is some banter between Tali and Ashley where she hope's tali's people will be able to return to their homeworld, she also hate's Terra Ferma a Pro-human and anti-alien group, and after Noveria she suggest that you talk to Liara

Yup, I remember all of that. But through it all, she sounded like a broken record, all the way up through the end - if she's with you and you decide to help the council/save the destiny acension, Ashley again pulls out the "aliens are bad" harp and starts strumming it. It got old. Fast.

That, and in terms of the characters themselves....scholar vs soldier....soft spoken vs brute force....logical vs blindly following the alliance...

My choice seemed simple.

Not only this but Ashley is very masculine, very unfeminine and brutish, poetry notwithstanding. At least she will look decent in ME3 so it might be worth it to do a romance with her for RPG reasons.

Facepalm.

[Creedio]

Yuqi wrote...

Stardusk78 wrote...

RampantAndroid wrote...

Drone223 wrote...

RampantAndroid wrote...

I romanced ash on my first PT (I've only done 5 PTs or less...heh) - Ash to me is a bit of a b****....through ME1 she's just anti-alien, and then into ME2 she just hates on you. I think it was after Ash showed up that that playthrough (where I had romanced ash in ME1) finished with Miranda. Ash just got on my nerves on a second play through, and I seem to remember telling her to shut up once or twice.

Liara is honestly in my mind a "better" person if you will, though I also have the complaint of her sounding like she has less emotion than Data from Star Trek TNG. Given the changes seen in LOTSB I think I'll enjoy her character a bit more in ME3.

If you listen carfully Ashley volenter's to work with Salerian STG without being told by Shepard, there is some banter between Tali and Ashley where she hope's tali's people will be able to return to their homeworld, she also hate's Terra Ferma a Pro-human and anti-alien group, and after Noveria she suggest that you talk to Liara

Yup, I remember all of that. But through it all, she sounded like a broken record, all the way up through the end - if she's with you and you decide to help the council/save the destiny acension, Ashley again pulls out the "aliens are bad" harp and starts strumming it. It got old. Fast.

That, and in terms of the characters themselves....scholar vs soldier....soft spoken vs brute force....logical vs blindly following the alliance...

My choice seemed simple.

Not only this but Ashley is very masculine, very unfeminine and brutish, poetry notwithstanding. At least she will look decent in ME3 so it might be worth it to do a romance with her for RPG reasons.

Facepalm.

 ²

[Creedio]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

Cerberus is a terrorist organisation. The very defination of Space N@zi.


She you don't need to be a N@zi to be a racist.


"I may not like Aliens but I don't agree with Cerberus"

Just replace Alien with ******,Black, Jews if you don't understand.
That is by is very much shows her racist belief.

she says: "I'm no fan of aliens, but Cerberus has a history of being extremist, I'll never work for a group like that"
not "i don't like aliens"

[Drone223]

Creedio wrote...

Dariustwinblade wrote...

Cerberus is a terrorist organisation. The very defination of Space N@zi.


She you don't need to be a N@zi to be a racist.


"I may not like Aliens but I don't agree with Cerberus"

Just replace Alien with ******,Black, Jews if you don't understand.
That is by is very much shows her racist belief.

she says: "I'm no fan of aliens, but Cerberus has a history of being extremist, I'll never work for a group like that"
not "i don't like aliens"

She also suggest to Shepard to talk to Liara after the Noveria mission, is willing to work with STG without being told so by Shepard and hopes Tali's people will return to there homeworld

Modifié par Drone223, 22 décembre 2011 - 03:45 .

[Drone223]

FallTooDovahkiin wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

^Ashley is not racist.

Dats right.
Shes an pessimist.

People take her pessimist for xenophobia, but its actually her cuation (sp) is understandable humanity is new to the galaxy, and most of the alien's are concered with humanity's grwoing influence on the galaxy, she never once said that the council race's where a threat to humanity

Modifié par Drone223, 22 décembre 2011 - 04:09 .

[Yuqi]

 @ Stardusk78

I find it amusing how fickle some people can be. Ashly is not at all unfeminine,brutish, or unattractive.  So you didn't romance her before because she was not feminine wth? So  because she is not the sterotype of femininity in ME1, you didn't like her, but now because she has been 'better looking' your going to romance her. YOu need to get out in the real world more. There are plenty of women who are muscular, don't take crap, and are attractive.

Modifié par Yuqi, 22 décembre 2011 - 04:17 .

[Creedio]

I'm on my phone now so I can't quote I'm sry
@Cthulhu42
counterquestion
why should someone BE a fan of Asian, Caucasian, Black... or heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual... people? We're all just human.
Plus put yourself in her position (grandfather thingy etc) would you be a FAN of aliens then?

[PauseforEffect]

Hmm, tough call. Then again, I don't play a dude Shepard.
For Ashley:
1. She's tough, capable, great sense of humor
2. Strong sense of family, works well with other people, very protective of her loved ones.
3. Poetic, soulful enough to balance out her more blunt aspects, able to empathize for others.
4. Personally, I think she looks better than the other female LI's I've seen so far
5. She's stayed faithful to Shepard during the two years by not dating anyone else
Downside:
1. Antagonistic personality, can be a little snippy
2. Frequent hostility towards aliens
3. Very quick to both anger and the trigger
4. Has no qualms shooting a fellow teammate against Shepard's wishes
For Liara:
1. She's soft-spoken, reasonable and competent in her work
2. Loyal to Shepard to death and beyond
3. Intelligent, kind to her friends and persistent
4. She's pretty enough to have a large enough group of admirers
5. She's strong enough without being excessively aggressive
Downside:
1. Antisocial, calculating and manipulative
2. Tendency to go behind Shepard's back and look up personal information instead of outright asking the commander
3. Slightly lacking in sympathy for anyone outside her circle of friends
4. Obsessive fixations

[CptData]

PrimalEden wrote...

Hmm, tough call. Then again, I don't play a dude Shepard.
For Ashley:
1. She's tough, capable, great sense of humor
2. Strong sense of family, works well with other people, very protective of her loved ones.
3. Poetic, soulful enough to balance out her more blunt aspects, able to empathize for others.
4. Personally, I think she looks better than the other female LI's I've seen so far
5. She's stayed faithful to Shepard during the two years by not dating anyone else
Downside:
1. Antagonistic personality, can be a little snippy
2. Frequent hostility towards aliens
3. Very quick to both anger and the trigger
4. Has no qualms shooting a fellow teammate against Shepard's wishes
For Liara:
1. She's soft-spoken, reasonable and competent in her work
2. Loyal to Shepard to death and beyond
3. Intelligent, kind to her friends and persistent
4. She's pretty enough to have a large enough group of admirers
5. She's strong enough without being excessively aggressive
Downside:
1. Antisocial, calculating and manipulative
2. Tendency to go behind Shepard's back and look up personal information instead of outright asking the commander
3. Slightly lacking in sympathy for anyone outside her circle of friends
4. Obsessive fixations

Nice analysis, although not 100% correct.
I marked some of the points.

Ashley/Downside/#2
Must say that's correct if you don't romance Ash and can't "paragonize" her. Since you don't play male Shepards I know where you come from - Ash was never a romance and therefore her views on aliens doesn't get better. I, however, call it "reserved towards aliens". Her issues with Turians have to do with her family's story. I don't know what Ashley thinks of Asari in general.

Ashley/Downside/#4
Definitely wrong. Ashley takes down Wrex to protect Shepard. Also Shepard can ask Ashley to stay on guard and to take the shot if Wrex can't be calmed down. Technically, Ashley was following orders.
I never had any issues with convincing Wrex - so Ash never had to shoot my Krogan buddy.

Liara/Downside/#1
Wouldn's say she's "antisocial". She's a bit displayed as such woman, but she isn't. Actually, you need to be a people's person to do the intel broker stuff. Sure, she has a strong tendency to be alone, but I wouldn't call her "antisocial".
Calculating fits to her career as intel broker. Manipulative? I don't know. Can't really say yes and no. I think that came up in LotSB, before that, Liara was a nice person. I dunno why, but I kinda felt uneasy when Shepard received all the hugs in LotSB - are those hugs appropriate for "just friends"? Think Liara loves Shepard even if not romanced, and that makes her acting a bit creepy, but definitely not "manipulative".

Liara/Downside/#2
Also came up with LotSB. Liara seems to be a bit obsessed with Shepard. Besides that, I don't have real issues with Liara doing that. Actually, that's something a lot of people do. Do you ask a woman you're interested in for her age? You want to know that, but since it's considered as impolite, you try to get that info from another source. Yesterday I found out a lot of stuff of a female co-worker I'm a bit interested in - just by asking another co-worker. I found out she has a new boyfriend and therefore, is no longer on the market. Helps a lot to avoid unpleasant surprises, you know? It's okay in my eyes ... everyone does it. And it's not half as rude as directly asking "have any boyfriend?" Just an example.

[Dariustwinblade]

Actually even if you told Ashley to stand down and you take too long to talk to Wrex she will shoot Wrex. Despite Wrex never firing even once.

She disobeys your order and justifies it by saying he was going to shoot.

" I CAN HANDLE WREX, FINE! WITHOUT YOU BUTTING INTO MY CONVO."

She murders one crew without consulting the captain.

Spoiler


I'll be glad when Garrus or EDI does the same in Me3.

KARMA IS A ****, just like you Ash.

[kumquats]

I would never ever romance Liara with a Paragon, the dialogues are disturbing ugh.
Ashley is a very good option, the only downside are the cheesy dialogues in the romance scene.
Wtf was BW smoking when they wrote this.

I wanted to slap my Shepard the whole time during the romance scene, I wished Ashley would have slaped him during the romance scene.

But to say something to the OP. If you go Paragon, go with Ashley. It's not as cheesy as Liara. If you go Renegade, go Liara all the way. It's so worth it.

Btw: Ashley is not a racist. She just has more braincells then Paragon Shepard.

Paragon Shepard is the kind of person who would give a mass murderer the cain and say: "I trust you, to do the right thing." At least Ashley has some common sence in ME1.

[CptData]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

Actually even if you told Ashley to stand down and you take too long to talk to Wrex she will shoot Wrex. Despite Wrex never firing even once.

She disobeys your order and justifies it by saying he was going to shoot.

" I CAN HANDLE WREX, FINE! WITHOUT YOU BUTTING INTO MY CONVO."

She murders one crew without consulting the captain.

Spoiler
*snip*

That Karma-stuff does happen to the other VS as well, buddy.

Besides that ... seriously: I never managed it to get Wrex killed. Seriously. Do you guys never do that family-armor mission? That's one of the paths to regain Wrex' loyalty on Virmire. Another one is to paragonize him. And the last (cheapest) way is to do Virmire without Garrus and Liara recruited (yet) - Wrex will follow you without the need to convince him.

I'd say the main issue why Wrex gets killed on Virmire is not Ashley but a stupid player.

Modifié par CptData, 22 décembre 2011 - 09:36 .

[Dariustwinblade]

But paragon Shepard is NEVER wrong how is he stupid.

[CptData]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

But paragon Shepard is NEVER wrong how is he stupid.

Uhh, I'm a 90% paragon player ... and must say, sometimes it's really difficult to keep it that way. Some of Shepard's paragon options can only be explained by "le grande naivete" aka "stupid".


Uhh and I edited my posting. I had a really hard time to get Wrex KIA at least in one of my (never saved) playthroughs. It's hard work to get him killed. It's much easier to save him. 

[Dariustwinblade]

Yeah but Kaidans a nice guy and all. But after Vermire he and Ash was so traumatised that they took each others lingering spirit and merged into one meta character called KaiAshly WilliAnko.

[CptData]

kumquats wrote...

I would never ever romance Liara with a Paragon, the dialogues are disturbing ugh.
Ashley is a very good option, the only downside are the cheesy dialogues in the romance scene.
Wtf was BW smoking when they wrote this.

I wanted to slap my Shepard the whole time during the romance scene, I wished Ashley would have slaped him during the romance scene.

But to say something to the OP. If you go Paragon, go with Ashley. It's not as cheesy as Liara. If you go Renegade, go Liara all the way. It's so worth it.

Btw: Ashley is not a racist. She just has more braincells then Paragon Shepard.

Paragon Shepard is the kind of person who would give a mass murderer the cain and say: "I trust you, to do the right thing." At least Ashley has some common sence in ME1.

Must say, Ashley is ... more the renegade type. At least it appears so. I know a bit more of the leaked stuff so I know that's not true, but hey, in ME1 she's definitely more renegade. Liara is far more paragon than Ash.
Never had a romance with Liara so I can't confirm your observations.

I kinda liked the sappy romance scene. "Oh captain, my captain". And Shepard is pulling one cheesy line after another. It works ... it's a bit awkward. But it also fits; after all, it's between a crewmember and her superior officer - that should cause a great deal of awkwardness.

Dunno of Liara. I seriously should do one playthrough with her as romance.

Dariustwinblade wrote...

Yeah but Kaidans a nice guy and
all. But after Vermire he and Ash was so traumatised that they took each
others lingering spirit and merged into one meta character called
KaiAshly WilliAnko.

Kinda need to agree for Horizon. In ME3 they'll fill the same role, although - and that's spoilery stuff - their romance arcs and banter will be entirely different. And it's not just about who tops Shepard :innocent:

Modifié par CptData, 22 décembre 2011 - 09:43 .

[Dariustwinblade]

Regardless Cptdata I NEVER got Wrex killed. I experimented with all the choices and then restarted back to the Normandy did his armor mission.

I was just saying I am going to make a plythrough where Ash kills wrex and Karma occurs in Me3.


Edit: On second though I can't do it, I can't Wrex.

[kumquats]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

But paragon Shepard is NEVER wrong how is he stupid.

The way BW is treating Paragon Shepards, Balak and Vido will probably have a tea party in ME3 and tell Shepard how they became street workers.
But I'm going off topic. I still love my Paragon. ^^