350 réponses à ce sujet

[Kakita Tatsumaru]

Inprea wrote...

I typically like to go the benevolent/paladin/open palm/paragon path whenever given a choice in games. Now I know these are typically considered the friendly choice but I'm wondering has anyone ever been left feeling a little guilty after taking this choice?

I've actually been put off a bit by it such as during Jacob's loyalty mission in mass effect 2. I honestly wasn't satisfied with letting Jacob's father live and felt I'd somehow wronged his victims by not letting them rip him apart just as he feared.

In a similar line of reasoning I felt bad whenever I didn't push the eclipse mercenary out of the window during the Thane recruitment mission. After what they did to the workers he really deserved to die. I'm thinking I'm going to give Mass Effect two another play through now that I'm thinking about this and be more honest to myself on those choices.

Besides it's not like we lose paragon points for pushing the mercenary out the window. It's just free renegade points.

Why limiting yourself to Parangon, that's the question, as those choices are the most RPGish thing about ME.

[Last Vizard]

Inprea wrote...

I typically like to go the benevolent/paladin/open palm/paragon path whenever given a choice in games. Now I know these are typically considered the friendly choice but I'm wondering has anyone ever been left feeling a little guilty after taking this choice?

I've actually been put off a bit by it such as during Jacob's loyalty mission in mass effect 2. I honestly wasn't satisfied with letting Jacob's father live and felt I'd somehow wronged his victims by not letting them rip him apart just as he feared.

In a similar line of reasoning I felt bad whenever I didn't push the eclipse mercenary out of the window during the Thane recruitment mission. After what they did to the workers he really deserved to die. I'm thinking I'm going to give Mass Effect two another play through now that I'm thinking about this and be more honest to myself on those choices.

Besides it's not like we lose paragon points for pushing the mercenary out the window. It's just free renegade points.

Paragon - using emotional logic most of the time sometimes the choice is completely foolish to the point of hurting more people in the future.
Renegade - cold logic while other times being a dick for no reason...  not sure what they are trying to pull with these types of choices.

I play Paragade for the most logical choices, or atleast my feeble interpretation of logic lol

[CroGamer002]

Only if I let Destiny Ascension to be destroyed and give Paragon response to reporter in ME2.


What douche response.

[Nizzemancer]

Vegos wrote...

I always pick Samara over Morinth, because it's stupid to pick Morinth.

I always shoot Elnora, because she's a lying b****.

I always headbutt Uvenk on Tuchanka.

I always give Tali a hug when she finds her father's body.
------------------------------------------

Bottom line is, playing paragon/renegade is more than just picking every possible option. Sometimes you'll want to go against your preferred alignment in order to keep your character the way you want to keep them.

The ME2 system may bite you for that, but it shouldn't, as long as you're consistent enough and you do the "opposing" actions early enough.

Elnora and Kathka on omega is the only Renegade options I take, because Elnoras alternative is really stupid (let her go? even if she was innocent of the murder she's still a criminal and a possible suspect, just let her walk off is completely off the scale dumb.) And the blue suns sergeants untimely death gives me an edge I prefer having.

Edit: I also headbutt Uvenk on occasion, because I like his stunned reaction, but having the shaman compliment my verbal warfare prowess is also a good reaction..

Modifié par Nizzemancer, 09 novembre 2011 - 02:45 .

[Nizzemancer]

Inprea wrote...
Besides it's not like we lose paragon points for pushing the mercenary out the window. It's just free renegade points.

No but when it comes to your success in the crew arguments, it is based on your total amount of paragon and renegade points taken, if you have 50% of each you won't be able to reach the 80% line that'll let you convice both to work together

[knightnblu]

I've never felt bad about taking the paragon option, but I have felt incredibly stupid at times. For example, allowing an enemy to pull a weapon on you in order to "talk" them down is a brain dead thing to do. When "fade" orders his Krogan henchmen to murder you and you just stand there like a statue, that is just deer in the headlights stupid.
 
I have a rule that has worked well for me in RL, if you try to draw down on me you die. Seems to also work in the ME universe as well, but that's a renegade option. Therefore, I have to conclude that self defense is the purview of the renegade in the eyes of BioWare. If one examines the Citadel policy regarding weapons restrictions and the wondrous effect it had on reducing crime and increasing clearance rates for crime, you also arrive at the same conclusion and draw the inference that such a policy must be fiction given that real weapons restrictions have actually increased violent crime wherever they have been implemented anywhere in the world. It would seem that criminals love a public that cannot defend itself against them.
 
So in summation, I have never felt bad about paragon choices. But I have felt troubled by the unfathomable stupidity of some of the paragon branches.

[Bad King]

BluSoldier wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

 Rewriting the geth. Mass murder and mass mind control are both ugly, and every time, I'm not sure I'm doing the right thing.

This might be the only thing in the game I go renegade for.  Blowing them up always seemd like the most moral thing to me.  I would rather be killed then brain-raped.

I'm quite certain BioWare screwed up with this one. Renshep throughout the mission justifies re-writing while parashep has doubts about re-writing. And yet suddenly at the end, the renegade and paragon options reflect the opposite to what the renegade or paragon had been saying throughout the mission.

[Bad King]

Saphra Deden wrote...

111987 wrote...

Paragon Shepard's reasoning was terrible for destroying the base. If he/she said something like "we can't risk indoctrination" it would have been a little better

Yeah, it would be better but not justified. Indeed "saving the soul of our species" (or whatever) is terrible.

Shepard can say that if you keep the base too.

Vegos wrote...

Cthulhu42 wrote...

No, blowing up heretic geth cannot be anything other than good.

Good for who?

It's most ceirtainly not good for THEM?

Why are we constantly assuming that "good for me" and "good for everyone" are the same things?

Actually rewriting/blowing the up probably is good for them. They'll just be slaves to the reapers otherwise- the reapers generally show disdain towards the heretics, and it's highly unlikely that the reapers would give them their 'collective population (aka dyson sphere)' body in return for their aid.

Modifié par Bad King, 09 novembre 2011 - 01:29 .

[N172]

"We are conflicted. There is no consensus among our higher-order runtimes: 573 favour rewrite, 571 favour destruction".
Its 50,09% for rewrite and 49,91% for destruction, the majority is for rewrite, so rewrite is better because it is (slightly) favoured by Legion.

[Shinobu]

Bad King wrote...

BluSoldier wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

 Rewriting the geth. Mass murder and mass mind control are both ugly, and every time, I'm not sure I'm doing the right thing.

This might be the only thing in the game I go renegade for.  Blowing them up always seemd like the most moral thing to me.  I would rather be killed then brain-raped.

I'm quite certain BioWare screwed up with this one. Renshep throughout the mission justifies re-writing while parashep has doubts about re-writing. And yet suddenly at the end, the renegade and paragon options reflect the opposite to what the renegade or paragon had been saying throughout the mission.

I think maybe it was an attempt to "randomize" the dialogue wheel. But yes, I'm surprised no one brought this up before now.

The paragon choices I never take any more:
Sparing Elnora (Arrest her, sure, but let her walk away? Uh uh.)
The interrupt in the last part of Garrus' romance arc. The poor guy is trying his awkward best and Shepard basically replies with "You're lame, shut up and do me." Ugh.

[sassyJacen]

For the most part: no.
But rewriting/killing the heretic geth had me tearing my hair out...
It will come back to bite me in the ass inME3, I just know it. No matter wich I chose. (sorry bout the spelling)

[Medhia Nox]

The "Geth Question" was easy for me - they're talking appliances - and, up until Legion, I was destroying (to me, it's not killing) thousands of Heretics all throughout ME 1 (and some of 2).

Legion doesn't plead for the "life" of his fellows - the fact that there's a consensus at all suggests to me that "life" doesn't even factor into it for the Geth. It is simply "Positive" vs. "Negative" - and for the Geth, the variables that played into either choice were very close.

((Of course - it's just a construct to empower the player - not unlike the Rachni queen))

[Shinobu]

jreezy wrote...

Chaosty wrote...

I find this one situation in Omega pretty funny. The merchant supperessing the quarian.
Renegade -> Make, Diplomaticly, the merchant buy up the quarian, which gives him money to leave the station.
Paragon -> Punch the mercant until he stops beeing an ass..

Roles reversed much

What copy of Mass Effect 2 did you play?

The paragon choice was to threaten to break the elcor's legs, which is pretty close to punching him.

[wizardryforever]

Shinobu wrote...

The paragon choices I never take any more:
Sparing Elnora (Arrest her, sure, but let her walk away? Uh uh.)
The interrupt in the last part of Garrus' romance arc. The poor guy is trying his awkward best and Shepard basically replies with "You're lame, shut up and do me." Ugh.

Well, since there is no reasonable option to take with Elnora, I take the one that leaves the possibilities for such an option open.  If you kill her (when she isn't even a threat to you), that can't be undone.  So if you were wrong, there's no fixing it.  But sparing her leaves the detective free to catch her later.  But I seriously think there should have been an option to arrest her, or at least tie her up or something.

As for the Garrus interrupt, it's Shepard's way of ending the awkward conversation Garrus is trying to make.  Allowing that level of awkwardness to continue is certainly not my idea of romantic, much less understanding/caring.

[Gabey5]

Killing Jacob's father would not undo what he did or even make them feel better. I saw no reason in killing him

[Gabey5]

Bad King wrote...

BluSoldier wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

 Rewriting the geth. Mass murder and mass mind control are both ugly, and every time, I'm not sure I'm doing the right thing.

This might be the only thing in the game I go renegade for.  Blowing them up always seemd like the most moral thing to me.  I would rather be killed then brain-raped.

I'm quite certain BioWare screwed up with this one. Renshep throughout the mission justifies re-writing while parashep has doubts about re-writing. And yet suddenly at the end, the renegade and paragon options reflect the opposite to what the renegade or paragon had been saying throughout the mission.

would you rather be killed or given a different personality/name/viewpoint etc?

You would still be alive, living the same standard of living as you do now but with a change.

Paragons tend to preserve life

[111987]

wizardryforever wrote...

Shinobu wrote...

The paragon choices I never take any more:
Sparing Elnora (Arrest her, sure, but let her walk away? Uh uh.)
The interrupt in the last part of Garrus' romance arc. The poor guy is trying his awkward best and Shepard basically replies with "You're lame, shut up and do me." Ugh.

Well, since there is no reasonable option to take with Elnora, I take the one that leaves the possibilities for such an option open.  If you kill her (when she isn't even a threat to you), that can't be undone.  So if you were wrong, there's no fixing it.  But sparing her leaves the detective free to catch her later.  But I seriously think there should have been an option to arrest her, or at least tie her up or something.

As for the Garrus interrupt, it's Shepard's way of ending the awkward conversation Garrus is trying to make.  Allowing that level of awkwardness to continue is certainly not my idea of romantic, much less understanding/caring.

If you listen to the some of the dialogue on Samara's recruitment, you learn that every Eclipse mercenary has to make a kill before getting their uniform. So even if Elnora didn't kill the Volus, she is still a murderer. My Shepard just wouldn't let someone like that walk away.

[Vegos]

111987 wrote...


If you listen to the some of the dialogue on Samara's recruitment, you learn that every Eclipse mercenary has to make a kill before getting their uniform. So even if Elnora didn't kill the Volus, she is still a murderer. My Shepard just wouldn't let someone like that walk away.

Zaeed sums it up pretty nicely if he's present: "Isn't that an Eclipse uniform? Turn around and face the wall."

[Jedi31293]

I felt guilty that my Paragon Shepard was such a pushover. Honestly, some of the paragon options in the ME series are so face-palm worthy...