1381 réponses à ce sujet

[Harmless Citizen]

Wait wat? He was actually *speaking* geth? I thought it was some handwaved process of interacting via mathematical processing.

Lmfao.

[Someone With Mass]

Random Nobody wrote...

Wait wat? He was actually *speaking* geth? I thought it was some handwaved process of interacting via mathematical processing.

Lmfao.

No, I'm pretty sure he told a geth to take a step forward using their own language when Shepard is on his/her little power trip.

I might not be the smartest man, but that's just insulting.

[MisterJB]

Andorfiend wrote...
Incorrect. An experiment you cannot replicate is scientifically invalid. You should have learned that in Elementary school. If it only happens once it's not science, it's a miracle.

Who says it can't be replicated? Cerberus simply chose not to. I'm sure that, if they wanted, they could kidnap some Biotic kids and create another Jack.
Hell, Gillian is stronger than Jack thanks to Cerberus.

If your short term goal is "develop cheap, expendable shock troops for our use" then the Creeper, husk, and Rachni experiments were dismal failures because cheap, expendable shock troops that spend all their time trying to kill you are not useful.

 The experiment was incomplete. There's no telling what they would have achieved had Shepard not kicked in the front door.
And even if uncontrollable, the Husks, Creepers and Rachni could still be useful. Just drop them on top of whoever you want dead. 

Worse, the experiments led to the total destruction of entire human colonies, thereby setting the cause of human expansion back by decades.

No, they didn't. There's zero evidence that Cerberus ever tested any creepers or husks on human colonies.

(Directly like the team playing with Creepers, which got eaten,

Shepard's fault. They were all very well contained until he showed up.

 

or indirectly like the team which unleased thresher maws on Akuze and were all assasinated by their escaped test subject.) 

Toomb's fault. Why do you blame Cerberus for the loss of brilliants mind instead of, you know, the actual people with guns who blew those brilliants minds off? Cerberus was giving those brilliant minds use.

While I hate to Godwin myself, consider that a large part of the reason we got the nuclear bomb and the ****s didn't was that Hitler was such a ****** that scientists like Oppenheimer and Einstein fled Germany for the states.

Except that some of the most brilliant minds we see in the ME universe work for Cerberus.

Modifié par MisterJB, 27 novembre 2011 - 03:50 .

[MisterJB]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Given the right tools, the Reapers can hack the geth.

We don't know that.

Besides, that was the whole reason with Legion's loyalty mission. To stop the Reapers from turning them all.

Which was only possible because a faction of the geth was assisting the Reapers and what the virus did was make it so that all geth concluded that worshipping the Reapers was right. What if Overlord worked as a stronger religious figure?

[111987]

MisterJB wrote...

Worse, the experiments led to the total destruction of entire human colonies, thereby setting the cause of human expansion back by decades.

No, they didn't. There's zero evidence that Cerberus ever tested any creepers or husks on human colonies.
 

UNC: Colony of the Dead. They turned an entire colony into husks.

[Someone With Mass]

MisterJB wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Given the right tools, the Reapers can hack the geth.

We don't know that.

Trust me, they can.

[MisterJB]

111987 wrote...
UNC: Colony of the Dead. They turned an entire colony into husks.

Again, no evidence. What we do know is that the colony unhearted some kind of technology and then provided samples of it to Cerberus. The colony could have found the Dragon's Teeth from a previous Reaping cycle. Cerberus learned about it and bought some. Then the colony was indocrinated and placed themselves on the Dragon's Teeth, like what the Cerberus scientists on the Derelict Reaper did.

Someone With Mass wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Given the right tools, the Reapers can hack the geth.

We don't know that.

Trust me, they can.

Story leaks?

[Someone With Mass]

MisterJB wrote...
Story leaks?

Can't say.

[111987]

MisterJB wrote...

111987 wrote...
UNC: Colony of the Dead. They turned an entire colony into husks.

Again, no evidence. What we do know is that the colony unhearted some kind of technology and then provided samples of it to Cerberus. The colony could have found the Dragon's Teeth from a previous Reaping cycle. Cerberus learned about it and bought some. Then the colony was indocrinated and placed themselves on the Dragon's Teeth, like what the Cerberus scientists on the Derelict Reaper did.

Didn't ExoGeni provide Cerberus with the Dragon's Teeth, whom then placed the Teeth around that colony to test them?

It's been a while since I've played that mission though.

[MisterJB]

111987 wrote...
Didn't ExoGeni provide Cerberus with the Dragon's Teeth, whom then placed the Teeth around that colony to test them?
It's been a while since I've played that mission though.

Could be but then why would Exogeni have records of whose colony Cerberus picked? And why turn people into Husk and then just leave them and the Dragon's Teeth lying around with colony logs that can lead the act back to Cerberus. Makes no sense.

Also, Miranda who ought to know more about Cerberus than us, seemed to believe that whatever Husks Cerberus experimented on were already dead when they got their hands on them.

Modifié par MisterJB, 27 novembre 2011 - 07:27 .

[111987]

MisterJB wrote...

111987 wrote...
Didn't ExoGeni provide Cerberus with the Dragon's Teeth, whom then placed the Teeth around that colony to test them?
It's been a while since I've played that mission though.

Could be but then why would Exogeni have records of whose colony Cerberus picked? And why turn people into Husk and then just leave them and the Dragon's Teeth lying around with colony logs that can lead the act back to Cerberus. Makes no sense.

Also, Miranda who ought to know more about Cerberus than us, seemed to believe that whatever Husks Cerberus experimented on were already dead when they got their hands on them.

Because they know where there samples were sent? And likely the experiment just went wrong and the researchers were turned into Husks or killed by the husks themselves.

[MisterJB]

111987 wrote...
Because they know where there samples were sent?

Sending the samples directly to the coloney they intended to turn into Husks? That would be stupid.

And likely the experiment just went wrong and the researchers were turned into Husks or killed by the husks themselves.

The only log found in there suggests that a single Cerberus operative were in the colony recently. Nothing suggests a science team.

[Dean_the_Young]

[quote]MisterJB wrote...

[quote]
[quote]Someone With Mass wrote...

[quote]MisterJB wrote...

[quote]Someone With Mass wrote...

Given the right tools, the Reapers can hack the geth.[/quote]
We don't know that.
[/quote]

Trust me, they can.

[/quote]
Story leaks?
[/quote]Not really. The reason there are Geth working for the Reapers in ME3 isn't because 'the Reapers hacked them against their will.'

[Dean_the_Young]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

But the project wasn't finished.  Otherwise they would not have had to piggy back onto the Ascension Project.

'Had' or 'preferred to'?

It's hard to define 'finished', given that there are effectively infinite experiments and trials that could be pursued. When is a project like that 'finished'? You can always keep aiming for a higher target: there is no finish line.

Pragia did make biotic gains. But at the end of the day, with the disaster of Jack, Cerberus chose to continue the research elsewhere, co-opting the Alliance efforts rather than make another Pragia.

Which ended in another disaster

Ascension project is still going strong, regardless of what Cerberus added to it.

[Dean_the_Young]

Andorfiend wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
When the entire staff is killed and you're unable to recreate the experiment, it usually is a failure.

Did they achieve the goal?

Yes.

Then it's a success.


Simple as that.
Details like 'staff died' or 'cannot recreate' are irrelevent unless of course they were laid out as guidelines for achieving the goal (which they are not)

Incorrect. An experiment you cannot replicate is scientifically invalid. You should have learned that in Elementary school. If it only happens once it's not science, it's a miracle.

That certainly is an elementary-level definition of miracle.

If your short term goal is "develop cheap, expendable shock troops for our use" then the Creeper, husk, and Rachni experiments were dismal failures because cheap, expendable shock troops that spend all their time trying to kill you are not useful.

They didn't.

Worse, the experiments led to the total destruction of entire human colonies, thereby setting the cause of human expansion back by decades.

Bessides that the 'colonies' in questions were small pre-fabs, and most weren't even Alliance worlds at all, you made up that number.

Consider for a moment, just how many scientists have been killed by Cerberus directly or indirectly? (Directly like the team playing with Creepers, which got eaten, or indirectly like the team which unleased thresher maws on Akuze and were all assasinated by their escaped test subject.)  How far back has the loss of all those minds and training set the human race?

You're blaming Cerberus for Toombs spree...  and Cerberus for the Exogeni project that only went bad when Shepard killed the Thorian?

As for your question: indeterminable, but not much. Small numbers help.,,,

TIM is such an incredible ****hole the he is functionally a bigger threat to humanity than the Reapers just because of the way he operates. While I hate to Godwin myself, consider that a large part of the reason we got the nuclear bomb and the ****s didn't was that Hitler was such a ****** that scientists like Oppenheimer and Einstein fled Germany for the states.

...and an utter lack of perspective doesn't.

[111987]

Saphra Deden wrote...

111987 wrote...

Because they know where there samples were sent? And likely the experiment just went wrong and the researchers were turned into Husks or killed by the husks themselves.

No. Based on the log that gives us the quest and Miranda's statements in ME2 we can conclude that ExoGeni was running the experiment. They gave some husks to Cerberus and sometime after that the colony was indoctrinated/overrun.

Okay. Like I said I can't recall the specifics of that mission. I only really remember the ending, where it says "This Cerberus group has a lot to answer for."

[Andorfiend]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Worse, the experiments led to the total destruction of entire human colonies, thereby setting the cause of human expansion back by decades.

Bessides that the 'colonies' in questions were small pre-fabs, and most weren't even Alliance worlds at all, you made up that number.

*sigh* Again, remember the news story in the elevator from ME 1? About how the colonial projects were losing funding and human colonial efforts has been set back, by years by the relatively minor attack on Eden Prime?

How much worse do you think think it is to get a whole colony wiped out? How about when the colonies attacked by the Geth (who were Galactic boogymen) survived (Eden Prime and Feros) but other colonies were completely wiped out by Husks/Creepers which as far as the press knew are just random bad stuff that can happen to anyone stupid enough to leave earth? How about when word gets out that feral Rachni are attacking our Marines, and have been spreading out throught the verge along trade routes?

You do not encourage human expansion by wiping out colonies, wiping out marines for funs (Akuze), and spreading deadly and essentially unstoppable hazards (Thorian spores, feral Rachni) along the Verge.

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Consider for a moment, just how many scientists have been killed by Cerberus directly or indirectly? (Directly like the team playing with Creepers, which got eaten, or indirectly like the team which unleased thresher maws on Akuze and were all assasinated by their escaped test subject.)  How far back has the loss of all those minds and training set the human race?

You're blaming Cerberus for Toombs spree...  and Cerberus for the Exogeni project that only went bad when Shepard killed the Thorian?

When you hire scientists to commit treason/crimes against humanity, you are pretty much responsible for what happens, yes.

And the Exogeni project was doomed. The Thorian was apparently telepathic across interstellar distances. It was only a matter of time.

Dean_the_Young wrote...
As for your question: indeterminable, but not much. Small numbers help.,,,

Every cerberus person you talk to goes on about how the scientists they hire are they best in their field.

So, we lost a crop of our best Biotics guys from Jack going rogue.

We lost our best medical/cyberneticists when every single person in the Lazarus project besides Miranda and Jacob died.

Plus the Rachni/Husk/Creeper teams.

And god knows what else.

Worse, even if none of that had gone wrong, he was still setting humanity back by hiring these guys for black projects in the first place. Science advances because it is a collaborative process. People working on black projects do not publish. Their work is not shared. Humanity is not advanced by their work.

Tim has been single handedly stopping humanities best minds from helping humanity for decades.

...and an utter lack of perspective doesn't.

*sigh* The feral Rachni you fight on the volcanic project escaped from the Cerberus project. If they weren't contained that single act of incompetance and stupidity could have led to the destruction of humaity and galactic civillization as a whole. No more Krogan horde to fight them, remember? Try that on for perspective.

[CerberusWarrior]

the alliance can burn in the depths of hell for all I care

[Kusy]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

No, I'm pretty sure he told a geth to take a step forward using their own language when Shepard is on his/her little power trip.

I might not be the smartest man, but that's just insulting.

I refuse to believe this because it is so stupid... but frighteningly plausible.

It was the case. The minecraft player in project Overlord was indeed speaking with the clanks and clutters the Geth used... it was a cool gimmick but made absolutely zero sense since acording to Legion, Geth understood languages used by organics... not to mention they weren't talking because it was inefficient, they were sending data directly to one another.

[onelifecrisis]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

No, I'm pretty sure he told a geth to take a step forward using their own language when Shepard is on his/her little power trip.

I might not be the smartest man, but that's just insulting.

I refuse to believe this because it is so stupid... but frighteningly plausible.

It was the case. The minecraft player in project Overlord was indeed speaking with the clanks and clutters the Geth used... it was a cool gimmick but made absolutely zero sense since acording to Legion, Geth understood languages used by organics... not to mention they weren't talking because it was inefficient, they were sending data directly to one another.

Yup, this.
Cue mental image of bad writing accumulating with other bad writing until a critical mass is reached, and it all implodes into a Black Plot Hole from which nothing can escape...
Aha! Now I know why they called that colony "Horizon"!

[onelifecrisis]

Saphra Deden wrote...

onelifecrisis wrote...

Cue mental image of bad writing accumulating with other bad writing until a critical mass is reached, and it all implodes into a Black Plot Hole from which nothing can escape...

I call it Mass Effect 3.

Well, I don't consider that a certainty yet.