82 réponses à ce sujet

[Alesia_BH]

Understood. Jan's Armor is nice even if you aren't doing the Mighty Mouse thing. 25% Resistance to Physical Damage can help in a pinch. Alesia wears it and she rarely uses the Cloak of the Sewers. It's more helpful for a non-arcane rogue though. I could see myself skipping it with a Bard.

You may want to look into Valygar's Armor as well. Based on the .ITM file, it may allow you to cast and it does have some nice resistances.

Of course, there are plausibility/role playing issues with using NPC armor. It basically requires you to say: "No. I don't want to party with you. But I would like to see you strip..." I could see Savvy getting away with that, and Valygar might be down. Your call though of course.

Good Hunting!

A.

Btw. If you allow Savvy any NPC items, I'd recommend the Chaos Blade. Haer Daelis keeps it in his off-hand but it can be a great main-hand weapon for a Blade in certain fights.

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 23 novembre 2011 - 07:03 .

[corey_russell]

I just finished reading this entire thread - great read guys. Man, that Savvy is a menace! Keep causing enforcers to appear, taking down his own groupmate! No wonder Savvy's controller usually plays solo - he's a menace to his party members! : ) Good luck guys.

[Grond0]

@Alesia.  It may be less true in ToB, but at the moment the physical resistance benefit would be negated by the poorer AC unless an alternative means is used of keeping this low.  Savvy essentially is not using potions at all, but I have been thinking recently that perhaps he has got enough spells now to start using spirit armour so thanks for the prompt.

Savvy got access to use any items last night so the chaos blade is a possibility now.

@Corey.  Someone has to keep these berserk cavaliers on their toes.

[Alesia_BH]

Grond0 wrote...

@Alesia.  It may be less true in ToB, but at the moment the physical resistance benefit would be negated by the poorer AC unless an alternative means is used of keeping this low.  Savvy essentially is not using potions at all, but I have been thinking recently that perhaps he has got enough spells now to start using spirit armour so thanks for the prompt.

Agreed. Wearing Jan's Armor means using Potions or Spell Armor to keep the AC down. And it you aren't using Potions, then that means sacrificing a Level 3 or 4. That is a non-trivial opportunity cost. That's why I could see skipping it with a Bard. 

In Alesia's case, she's often wearing the Bracers of AC 3 and using Potions of Defense or Invulnerability  as needed so for her it's a matter of whether she wants, say, Acid Resistance, Fire Resistance, Magic Damage Resistance, or Physical Resistance via her Armor slot in a given fight. The considerations do differ for a Bard.

You may want to consider taking it into ToB nonetheless. That would give Savvy a 95% Crushing Resistance avenue in ToB. Merro can do better, but it may be a tactical option worth having.

Savvy got access to use any items last night so the chaos blade is a possibility now

Understood. That's a nice tool against enemies with high physical resistance.

Someone has to keep these berserk cavaliers on their toes.

Why stop with the spells? You may want to, say, drain his movement rate to 0 with the Sword of Arvoreen and follow by wrecking his Dex with the Chaos Blade. A little Soul Reaver might do him some good as well...

Btw. The movemet rate drain on Arvoreen does seem to wrap around so if he buffs his Piercing Resistance, and leaves his Save v Wands up, you should be able to give him a few Improved Haste Offensive Spins and produce a crazy fast Merro. Crazy cheesy no doubt, but potentially amusing...

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 23 novembre 2011 - 06:16 .

[Gate70]

Alesia_BH wrote...
@Gate70- What are your thoughts on the Firecam Plate? It's tempting, but it also seems like a good way to get yourself killed...

I absolutely recommend it for a cavalier or unkitted paladin if you have enough stats to equip it. I died due to hold a few times and now have one less thing to worry about. No use to an undead hunter though. I'm not keen on inquisitor PC's but did wonder why Keldorn was immune to hold but still had armour that overlapped a class ability.

It stops oils of speed working. Died against Firkraag thanks to that, equipping the armour after glugging works but feels like an exploit to me. Ring of Gaxx improved haste works well with it. Merro has cranked up his party value as a result.

Grond0 wrote...
In a no-reload game I would certainly have suggested that Savvy should be the lead character quite a while ago (keeping the PC safer behind) and the rat / armour combination would then be effective in many combats.

I'd have been happy to be mr-backup with almost any other class but this is a major weakness with cavaliers. A throwing axe or throwing dagger just isn't the same.

Alesia_BH wrote...
Btw. If you allow Savvy any NPC items, I'd recommend the Chaos Blade. Haer Daelis keeps it in his off-hand but it can be a great main-hand weapon for a Blade in certain fights.

No he doesn't. Merro stashed both blades near the Adventurers Mart. Nearly took Valygars armour too but decided Savvy had better options.

corey_russell wrote...
Man, that Savvy is a menace!

I've summoned the cowled wizards enough times to understand this can be an automatic response when in the city. Much of the rest is two different playstyles which often complement each other but sometimes leaves us fnargled.   I've picked up some good buffing hints along the way, e.g. how a bard should be played and also when I should use say death ward. I'm a lazy buffer so tend not to bother too much but can see what a difference it makes; a bit like recent solo no-reloads have upped my potion game.

Alesia_BH wrote...
That would give Savvy a 95% Crushing Resistance avenue in ToB. Merro can do better, but it may be a tactical option worth having.

Haven't looked into this, I usually keep the 50% crushing helm but appreciate Savvy might like the staff of the ram. I wasn't planning on using the DoE and will memorise a hardiness or two so not convinced I will get to that amount of resistance.

Modifié par Gate70, 23 novembre 2011 - 07:26 .

[Alesia_BH]

Gate70 wrote...

It stops oils of speed working. Died against Firkraag thanks to that, equipping the armour after glugging works but feels like an exploit to me. Ring of Gaxx improved haste works well with it. Merro has cranked up his party value as a result.

That's the rub. The thought of taking Free Action through the Armor slot is worrisome. I'd mostly be interested in it for Stun protection which appears to be implemented in my install. Dragon Slayer + Harmony + Firecam + Gaxx + Claw would be a nice setup at times.

Haven't looked into this, I usually keep the 50% crushing helm but appreciate Savvy might like the staff of the ram. I wasn't planning on using the DoE and will memorise a hardiness or two so not convinced I will get to that amount of resistance.

Understood. With the Helm you could reach 100% without the Defender using AoF and Hardiness. I can understand Savvy's potential longing for the Staff of the Ram though- especially since he has never used it. I love staves, but I always keep the hat. 

Anyhoo. Continued good luck guys1

Best,

A.

[corey_russell]

Gate70 wrote...

Alesia_BH wrote...
@Gate70- What are your thoughts on the Firecam Plate? It's tempting, but it also seems like a good way to get yourself killed...

I absolutely recommend it for a cavalier or unkitted paladin if you have enough stats to equip it. I died due to hold a few times and now have one less thing to worry about. No use to an undead hunter though. I'm not keen on inquisitor PC's but did wonder why Keldorn was immune to hold but still had armour that overlapped a class ability.

@Gate70: Just wanted to clarify about inquisitor immunity to hold person. This immunity ONLY protects from hold person spell (mage/cleric) and hold person attacks from undead. With Keldorn's armor now he would also protect against web and entangle -- e.g.. Savvy could fire a web sequencer but it wouldn't affect you.

[Grond0]

Alesia_BH wrote...
Understood. With the Helm you could reach 100% without the Defender using AoF and Hardiness. I can understand Savvy's potential longing for the Staff of the Ram though- especially since he has never used it. I love staves, but I always keep the hat. 

Just picked up the staff of the magi tonight for the first time ever, so Savvy is already broadening my experience of staves.

[Alesia_BH]

 Congrats! And that has to be the full invisibility version since you are playing vanilla...
Don't get addicted! It'll make you lazy! 

Best,

A.

Btw. This multiplayer game seems like a really fun way for you to get your first completed vanilla run in. It would be great if Slider made his SCS No Reload as well. I'm definitely rooting for him!

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 23 novembre 2011 - 11:31 .

[Grond0]

It's nice for Slider to have little messages strewn along the path to keep him going in the right direction. Of course some are more helpful than others - "Savvy woz 'ere" counting in the latter category!

[Gate70]

Fair point Corey, but wouldn't Keldorn just be unable to move but still attack/defend in range plus buff/cast/glug and not be entirely helpless. Might have to check this out to see,

Savvy the blade and Merro the cavalier.

Twisted Rune. Merro quickly outlines the plan to Savvy and after buffing tries to interest Shangalar. No luck protection from evil is active, didn't realise this would happen. Merro indicates for Savvy to briefly step forward. As the lich begins to appear Merro indicates for Savvy to retreat.

Shangalar arrives between the two of us, and it is a brief race to kill him. We're both out of luck, and Merro has had his many potions dispelled together with his buffs.


Merro steps forward to melee the beholder, foolishly switching to the FoA and is drained by the vampire to level 14 so no real danger but blunts his effectiveness.

Back to the iMOD, a less than ideal way to drop the beholder. The vampire is next and then Merro can switch to Carsomyr. Savvy and the deva have more than held their own, and the fight can be best summed up by Grond0. "That the lot?", a bit of an anticlimax (although reading his post above he appears to have got some satisfaction out of it).

Brynnlaw and Spellhold next. Brynnlaw is taken at a hectic pace showing the two protaganists are higher level than would typically be experienced in a larger party.

Spellhold is a similar story, although Merro foolishly decides to sacrifice some wisdom and Keldorn's armour greys out. He continues briefly before deciding to swap armour.

We grab a bag of holding on the way back to Irenicus. A greater whirlwind sees Irenicus in trouble as Wanev casts time stop.


Moments later we are free to leave. Merro has tried and abandoned a ring of free action as it prevents Gaxx haste and boots of speed from working so yes Alesia, Keldorns armour is a major boost. Considering whether to use it via Lum's machine wisdom boost or retire it for a more balanced gameplay.

Saemon leads us into two fights and then we are dumped into an underwater city. A good place to rest for the night, after killing an ettin.

A good night, little lag and no deaths, and using Alt/F4 to quit gives a clean exit instead of hanging 2 Linux started tasks. One reload when my repeated ENTERs selected option 1 (how?) and the wrong item for 5 tokens. In hindsight I could have grabbed the remaining 6 tokens and come back.

Stats etc.








Look at the chapter stats. Either something is hugely messed up or Savvy is on fire.

Modifié par Gate70, 24 novembre 2011 - 12:34 .

[Alesia_BH]

Gate70 wrote...
 so yes Alesia, Keldorns armour is a major boost. Considering whether to use it via Lum's machine wisdom boost or retire it for a more balanced gameplay.

Makes sense. Alessandra met up with Keldorn and played around with it a bit. It does work with Boots of Speed in my install (I didn't test Oils of Speed). Checking again though, the Free Action Protects against Stun tweak didn't effect Keldorn's Armor so that removes the main draw for me. Power Word: Stun is my biggest fear with her due to the lack of an incantation and counter window. 

One thing that worries me about it in a No Reload is that it grants immunity to Slow and Hold (109, 175) but relies primarly on Protection from Spell (X) effects. And if something was missed by whoever made it, one could be in for a unpleasant surprise... 

It's all totally moot for my run since Alessandra's alignment (Chaotic Good) prevents her from using it.

Anyhoo. Nice work!

Best,

A. 

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 24 novembre 2011 - 12:45 .

[Grond0]

Gate70 wrote...
Look at the chapter stats. Either something is hugely messed up or Savvy is on fire.

Alesia_BH wrote...
Makes sense. Alessandra met up with Keldorn and played around with it a bit. It does work with Boots of Speed in my install (I didn't test Oils of Speed). Checking again though, the Free Action Protects against Stun tweak didn't effect Keldorn's Armor so that removes the main draw for me. Power Word: Stun is my biggest fear with her due to the lack of an incantation and counter window.

A large part of the reason for the kill ratio will be because Savvy was using cloudkill quite a bit.  This killed a lot of weaker enemies straight away as well as pinching others that Merro had done most of the work on.  The concern over free action meant cloudkill was used on a number of occasions where a web would have been cast earlier in the game.

[Humanoid_Taifun]

Gate70 wrote...
Considering whether to use it via Lum's machine wisdom boost or retire it for a more balanced gameplay.

After getting so far, wouldn't it be easier to just finish SoA?

[Gate70]

Plan thought out a couple of days ago was this

3 Sahuagin, Underdark,
4 Ust Natha, rest of Underdark.
5 Watchers Keep
6 Suldanessar.
7 Tree of Life, Nine Hells.
8 TOB.

Does that sound OK or would you suggest moving the keep a bit further

[Gate70]

Savvy the blade and Merro the cavalier.

City of caverns. We kill the prince and leave the survivors to a lingering death one reload when Merro is mazed near the spectator then Savvy explores and also gets mazed.

Underdark. One death at the soul portal, clean run through the beholder lair and one death in the illithid lair.

Merro is level 23, Savvy 30. Doesn't look like much done tonight but about 2 1/2 hours time.

[Alesia_BH]

Gate70 wrote...
City of caverns. We kill the prince and leave the survivors to a lingering death one reload when Merro is mazed near the spectator then Savvy explores and also gets mazed.

That takes the prize for funniest reload so far. The kicker is that you, Gate70, probably knew the Maze Trap was there while Grond0 probably had no idea. I'm just imagining you watching him and then, panicing -scrambling to message him- and then: the hand.

Am I correct in assuming that this is Grond0's first trip to the City of Caverns?

[Grond0]

I've done it once before, but don't remember anything about traps - probably defused them all with a thief.

[Gate70]

I use thieves too, only know vague locations of traps in SOA and can't remember effects or if they are repeating. Had given Grond0 a vague warning but Merro gets mazed for an eternity - can understand why he started moving around but yes I was expecting the hand as he started to move.

Worked out the second time not to tread within the floor pattern circle.

[Gate70]

Savvy the blade and Merro the cavalier.
This session was played at insane difficulty instead of core.

Underdark. After collecting some royal blood completing all three quests before they are required we sacrifice Kitthix to fight a group of demon knights and finally help Mekrath.

Then we head into Ust Natha requiring one reload when Solaufein decides not to turn up for an illithid ambush, and a second reload when we let the fake egg timer expire while playing with Deirex then shopping and a bit of real life. A third reload when the wrong savegame is loaded, I don't notice the eggs are missing and the timer expires.

Once the dragon eggs are safely returned we deal with two areas of wilderness and head back to civilisation to empty our backpacks. Cromwell forges the equalizer, wave halberd, Gesen shortbow and silver sword but we decide not to get Crom Faeyr forged.

Merro decides to move all the stored loot from the promenade into the entrance of Watchers Keep.

Edit, and the stats. Chapter stats can't be right?
e.g. Merro's last 2 have dropped from 91 chapter /1279 total to 28 chapter / 1501 total.
        Savvy's last to have changed from 642 chapter /769 total to 755 chapter /882 total.

So Merro has 222 more in total while Savvy has 113 more in total.
But Merro has dropped 63 in chapter while Savvy has gained 113.

I suspect Savvy is still on chapter 2 or something?

Modifié par Gate70, 26 novembre 2011 - 03:30 .

[Gate70]

Savvy the blade and Merro the cavalier.

The vampires lair. Savvy is dominated by the first group of vampires but Merro kills them, waits for the domination to wear off and gives Savvy the shield of harmony.

Merro looks like he's the main course in the dining area until Savvy charges him with a rod of resurrection HP from 10 to max. This is enough to see us through the remaining vampires.

A few mists are cleared from the trap chamber, then we descend. One of our summons springs two traps along the corridor and we buff ready for the final room.

Merro pays little attention to Savvy, using greater whirlwinds to hit with the improved mace of disruption. No idea what Savvy did but the room cleared quickly and Bodhi survives a final whirlwind. With her dead we are free to cleanse and loot the area before departing.

On to the final forest area where Merro is stunned and Savvy scared. Merro recovers first and removes the fear on attempt number two. Corans hut is cleared, as is a hill cave. Coran is killed by Lanfear but we extract revenge.

Back to Elhan, who takes us straight back again and opens the way to Suldanessar. We decided to have a break first though.

Blade 36, cavalier 27. Other stats;

[Grond0]

Gate70 wrote...
Merro pays little attention to Savvy, using greater whirlwinds to hit with the improved mace of disruption. No idea what Savvy did but the room cleared quickly and Bodhi survives a final whirlwind. With her dead we are free to cleanse and loot the area before departing.

Savvy wasn't in the room much, which is why Merro could overlook him.  He was setting spike traps outside the room and then luring vampires out into them.

[Gate70]

Savvy the blade and Merro the cavalier.

Suldanessar. We fight a few golems and Merro gets flattened oh yes, on insane mode. Reload.

On our second attempt and aware of the hard hitting we clear the area and give the Dragonslayer sword another outing.


Merro gets Savvy to drop some snares as a trio of parasites are killed. Irenicus gets all mouthy then collapses from the snares and we get dragged into the nine hells.

Merro takes the good path for the five tears well that was the plan but Savvy got a few conversations and decides to kill the dragon as the option seemed more benign than evil. Merro wasn't chuffed at being force-fallen at the final hurdle so invoked power word reload.

There was another reload with the tears; the third elder orb imprisoned Merro first time round so fireballs and continuous GWW's were used second time around.

Irenicus the slayer gets a double dispel.


What a way to go.


Grond0 timed out around here, not sure if he saw the movies so here is another part.


On to the Talking Heads, where Merro kills a black reaver but Savvy kills Illasera. Merro raises Sarevok and then recalls all the NPC's except for Yoshimo. Cespenar forges the Aslyferund chain and Blessed Bracers.

Stats etc.












& congratulations to Grond0 for finally completing SOA. Hope you enjoyed it.

Modifié par Gate70, 28 novembre 2011 - 10:59 .

[corey_russell]

Grats Grond0 on making through SoA. Hmm, Merro only got 3% of the kills for this chapter? What was he doing, napping while Savvy did all the work?

[BBMorti]

Its hard to keep up with a blade haha