261 réponses à ce sujet

[Addai]

Was there another game with dragons released this year? I have a vague, uneasy memory of one, but Skyrim has allowed me to block it out.

[Costin_Razvan]

Also, off the top of my head, both PC Gamer and the Escapist rated TW2 lower. BEFORE you say that they were paid off or that they are idiots, that instantly proves your claim that none of the major reviewers rated it lower, wrong. Unless you don't consider them major reviewers...

Yes I don't consider them.

Major reviewers = Gametrailers, IGN and Gamespot. Hell even Xplay gave it a 5/5 score,

As for the escapist? Yeah I bet they didn't get bought off when their own site was full with DA2 banners pre-launch.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:07 .

[Brockololly]

Zjarcal wrote...
Also, off the top of my head, both PC Gamer and the Escapist rated TW2 lower. BEFORE you say that they were paid off or that they are idiots, that instantly proves your claim that none of the major reviewers rated it lower, wrong. Unless you don't consider them major reviewers..

Well, come on, PC Gamer and Escapist's DA2 reviews were incredibly over the top in terms of praise to the point of being ridiculous. No game deserves the amount of hyperbolic praise that DA2 received from those outlets, not even something like Skyrim. Not to mention they were also the outlets putting out early reviews for DA2 which just so happened to be stupidly positive. Hmmm...



The VGAs matter in the sense that they're another little thing marketing can gloat about in the future for the game/franchise. Ultimately, I'm thinking they nominated DA2 mostly because its a console game and the sequel to the VGA 2009 RPG (and PC game) of the year in DAO. Its a television event and sadly more people were subjected to DA2 than TW2, so DA overall has greater recognition for a TV audience than TW. Which is what Spike is going for- a bigger TV audience.

Anyway, based on the nominees, it should be TW2 getting best PC game, with Minecraft as best indie game and Skyrim for best RPG.

Modifié par Brockololly, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:10 .

[KenKenpachi]

Gurris wrote...

KenKenpachi wrote...

Well minus this forum and metacritic the game was well recieved and liked. And given all the problems I've read in reviews from Deus Ex, if it can be on the list why not DA2?

Where have you been hiding? Apart from the mainstream reviewers who are afraid of pissing Bioware off, people generally seem to dislike the game.
Also, one word: Neogaf. I've never seen such despite for a game there I think 

Wrong. In sells and among console players most of whom don't hang out on Forums the game is well liked and its sells picked up, in fact the mention of this forum tends to draw @_@ most of the time and dissapointed sighs. And the net isn't the world, PC gamers  however were pissed with it, but keep in mind most PC gamers are where? On a PC. So the bais they have, praticularlly among some I KNOW for sure on here never leave there homes is a mute point.

As to TW2 not being on the list.

Spike TV aims for the male console gamer mainly. Not the PC community. TW2 has not yet gained widespread fame or use, and among many gamers the PC is still a social network device. The PC as a gaming tool in popular culture is still seen as for "Nerds" and "people who live in there mom's basement" and "never touched a girl" so, would a network focused on whats "Hip" and popculture for the modern Western male, even have a PC title?

Hell they only even have two listings for PC in that line up if I'm not right and one of them has Minecraft as best PC game. That right there should tell how they and many other VGA shows view PC gaming. Plus funding and sponsorship is far larger from the console based market, earning more TV time, and lime light. Heck how many "General gaming magazines" even have a PC section, or more than a handful of PC reviews short of a **** ton of console games?

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:09 .

[slimgrin]

MerinTB wrote...

slimgrin wrote...
Who cares.

The game industry.  As a whole.

If CDPR stays on course with their current vision for the series, it will never garner mainstream recognition. It's not that type of game, no matter how much money and talent they pump into it.

For the record I have no problem with DA2 being nominated. But if it won..

And WTF is Zelda doing in there? That's the real joke.

[billy the squid]

Zjarcal wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

They didn't pick DA2 because it was better Zjarcal. They picked it because it was on a console.
The VGAs are biased for consoles.

Here's a ****ing fact, as a reviewer you need to be objective, and there is nothing no reviewer worth his spit out there can say that DA2 is better then TW2, and here's a shocker, NONE OF THE MAJOR REVIEWERS did!

You realize that I don't care why they picked it right? I don't care for the VGA awards because just as you, I also find myself scratching my head at many of the nominations. I'm just not going to make a big fuss about it because imo, it's irrelevant what they pick.

Also, off the top of my head, both PC Gamer and the Escapist rated TW2 lower. BEFORE you say that they were paid off or that they are idiots, that instantly proves your claim that none of the major reviewers rated it lower, wrong. Unless you don't consider them major reviewers...

At any rate, I'm not looking for a long winded argument here. I said that nomination lists will always carry a subsequent outcry of the people who feel the nominations were "dead wrong", which is clearly the case right now.

jlb524 wrote...

It's not possible for any human being to be purely objective...even reviewers.

Also this.

Actually PC gamer was forced to print a second review of DA2 from another reviewer, which was significantly more critical. The inital review glossed over many of the potential issues or simply failed to bring them up at all, in doing so it recieved so much flak that that paticular individual likely lost any semblance of credibility that they had.

"The best RPG of this decade? Nine more years will tell, but for now, yes."

Objectivity may be illusive, but internal consistancy in a publication's reviewers is something which lends some weight to their review. One review, as per DA2, passing off potential problems and gushing over a game whilst the other highlights the legitimate concerns and issues which were present in a game such as TW2, doesn't detract from TW2 being a brilliant game, but I consider that review to be more balanced and consider the review to have more weight than something which is so clearly biased and poorly written.

Even if a reviewer enjoys an unpopular game, making an effort to at least take note and present noticable potential problems, even if they don't affect that individuals final score and decision of the product. Their purpose is to try and give an objective series of reasons why some people may or may not like a game, followed by their opinion of whether that hurts it or not. They are not employed by the marketing department to pour out unadulturated praise on AAA games shoved in their direction, unfortunately marketing and economics being what it is, I can see that happening.

Modifié par billy the squid, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:21 .

[Zjarcal]

Brockololly wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...
Also, off the top of my head, both PC Gamer and the Escapist rated TW2 lower. BEFORE you say that they were paid off or that they are idiots, that instantly proves your claim that none of the major reviewers rated it lower, wrong. Unless you don't consider them major reviewers..

Well, come on, PC Gamer and Escapist's DA2 reviews were incredibly over the top in terms of praise to the point of being ridiculous. No game deserves the amount of hyperbolic praise that DA2 received from those outlets, not even something like Skyrim. Not to mention they were also the outlets putting out early reviews for DA2 which just so happened to be stupidly positive. Hmmm...

Just for the record, I'm not saying I agree with either of those two reviews (I stopped caring for PC Gamer's reviews quite a while ago as I feel they are extremely inconsistent in their views, like say Doom 3 getting a 94 and being called a "masterpiece of the artform" and years later it being called "a good engine, but not a classic game").

My point was more about arguing against the "no big reviewer rated TW2 lower" part, regardless of how one feels about those reviews.

billy the squid wrote...

Objectivity may be illusive, but internal consistancy in a publication's reviewers is something which lends some weight to their review.

Agreed, which is why I posted that clarification above.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:22 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Zjarcal wrote...

I have friends who think TW2 is garbage and they would never nominate it for anything with the word "best" in it. They are not stupid, they just have a different opinion.

It's not a case of stupidty, it's a case of different opinions and appreciating different aspects over others.

But they are not claiming it's purely personal opinion (unless I missed it). They are doing so based on critical reception and based solely on that, TW2 has to be nominated (among many other numerous reasons).

Sure, I never take those kinds of things seriously anyways (I just laughed when I heard this and my level of caring did not go past that). But this is an official site and they should at least have some semblance of objectivity. An objective standard by which they determine who gets to be nominated for awards. If they want to be taken seriously.

If this is supposed to be a purely subjective and amateurish award thing, then good for them, I would not be able to take them any less seriously.  

Just to clarify, I am not outraged at the slightest. Amused at best, but I really couldn't care less.
Now if DA2 wins, I will raise an eyebrow and probably laugh for a few minutes, but that's about it.

And yea I think by any objective standard, not nominating TW2 for best RPG (not favorite), when compared to what else was nominated, is pretty stupid and mind boggling. If you want to seem even slightly objective.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:33 .

[Lenimph]

Stupid 1% PC elitists ragging on the 99% of console users being represented in nominations!

OCCUPY THE BSN !

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

I have friends who think TW2 is garbage and they would never nominate it for anything with the word "best" in it. They are not stupid, they just have a different opinion.

It's not a case of stupidty, it's a case of different opinions and appreciating different aspects over others.

But they are not claiming it's purely personal opinion. They are doing so based on critical reception and based solely on that, TW2 has to be nominated.

Ok, just for the record, I don't know what their guidelines for nominations are. Do they base it on overall critical reception or their own? If it were based on overall critical reception then it'd basically just be the top rated games on metacritic.

At any rate, whether they claim it's opinion or not (or whatever their guidelines are), in my view is irrelevant because no one can claim to be 100% objective or to be able to hold all the facts. It's why I hate Gamespot's guidelines when they say "our reviews are not opinions, they are facts". No review is without a heavy dose of subjectivity, and neither are any award selections.

This speaks more of how I personally see awards and reviews. I don't give them much importance because I don't give any of their views (no matter how "professional" they might be) any more importance than the opinions of others.

[Mr.House]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Also, off the top of my head, both PC Gamer and the Escapist rated TW2 lower. BEFORE you say that they were paid off or that they are idiots, that instantly proves your claim that none of the major reviewers rated it lower, wrong. Unless you don't consider them major reviewers...

Yes I don't consider them.

Major reviewers = Gametrailers, IGN and Gamespot. Hell even Xplay gave it a 5/5 score,

As for the escapist? Yeah I bet they didn't get bought off when their own site was full with DA2 banners pre-launch.

lol, funny.

[Mr.House]

Last time I checked, overall DA2 has a 8.2, the TW2 has a 8.7. So yes, DA2 deserves to be nominated, if it wins well oh well. It's there opinion. If the manner of thinking is it's not over a 9 it should not get a nom, then TW2 should not be nominated at all. /trollface

Modifié par Mr.House, 17 novembre 2011 - 06:47 .

[jlb524]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
If this is supposed to be a purely subjective and amateurish award thing, then good for them, I would not be able to take them any less seriously.  

All awards are subjective.  Therefore, this one is as well.

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
And yea I think by any objective standard, not nominating TW2 for best RPG (not favorite), when compared to what else was nominated, is pretty stupid and mind boggling. If you want to seem even slightly objective.

Who's 'objective standards'?  Yours? 

Standards are made by people and hence include their personal biases...thus they aren't objective in the strict sense of the term.

[Zjarcal]

jlb524 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
If this is supposed to be a purely subjective and amateurish award thing, then good for them, I would not be able to take them any less seriously.  

All awards are subjective.  Therefore, this one is as well.

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
And yea I think by any objective standard, not nominating TW2 for best RPG (not favorite), when compared to what else was nominated, is pretty stupid and mind boggling. If you want to seem even slightly objective.

Who's 'objective standards'?  Yours? 

Standards are made by people and hence include their personal biases...thus they aren't objective in the strict sense of the term.

Pretty much a carbon copy of what I would've replied.

[csfteeeer]

Skypezee wrote...

Didn't know that Xenoblade was finally released outside of Japan.

i don't think that Matters.

Cause apperantly, 2010 games that Came out in 2011(in japan) are allowed to be Nominated(Epic Mickey? WTF?)

Modifié par csfteeeer, 17 novembre 2011 - 07:09 .

[Arcadian Legend]

I honestly couldn't care less about what wins the VGA's. I'm more interested in seeing trailers and such, that official reveal of the new IP Bioware is working on and possibly that Femshep trailer we were promised for ME3.

[Ciryx]

I like turtles.

[slimgrin]

Ciryx wrote...

I like turtles.

GTFO. Tortoises rule.

[KnightofPhoenix]

jlb524 wrote...
All awards are subjective.  Therefore, this one is as well.

Some are less subjective, more informed, studied, analytical and consistent than others.

I am not fond of this false dichotomy of 100% objective vs 100% subjective, where more often than not it's in between and the goal to strive for is on the left.

Who's 'objective standards'?  Yours? 

Standards are made by people and hence include their personal biases...thus they aren't objective in the strict sense of the term.

Objective standards depending on how they define an RPG, which then allows them to nominate DA2 and Deus Ex (very different games), and not TW2. Their definition of an RPG might be subjective, but they can be objective when judging games according to that definition.

Furthermore, they should also take into account all aspects and measure them more or less equally (or depending on how they define what a genere is supposed to do). For instance, I rank DA2 very low because my primary focus is the political storyline. But I do not pretend that this focus is universal and a professional critic of the game should judge the story based on all factors more or less equally.

No one is saying that personal biases are not present. But some make more effort to go beyond them than others.

[DownyTif]

seriously those nominations are garbage. Witcher 2 should be in RPG of the Year, Original Score of the Year and Best Graphics. DA2 nominated and not TW2? haha.

Those guys at Spike TV needs to think more.

[slimgrin]

DownyTif wrote...

seriously those nominations are garbage. Witcher 2 should be in RPG of the Year, Original Score of the Year and Best Graphics. DA2 nominated and not TW2? haha.

Those guys at Spike TV needs to think more.

There's a graphics category? Well hell, that's strictly between TW2 and BF3. No one else should even try on that count. It's funny how they excluded titles with PC as lead platform in the graphics category. Of course console games aren't going to win that one, lol.  

I think Skyrim has music on par with TW2, and Deus Ex has a solid soundtrack a well.

Modifié par slimgrin, 17 novembre 2011 - 08:28 .

[billy the squid]

I agree that TW2 not being in the RPG category or best graphics is daft as graphics wise it clearly blows most competitors out of the water.

But TW2 is up for best PC game of the year, Make it happen people.


http://www.spike.com...ng/best-pc-game

Modifié par billy the squid, 17 novembre 2011 - 08:15 .

[Veex]

Is their a blurb or description about the criteria Spike uses for the VGAs? I'd be interested in reading that and whether or not it has changed over the past couple of years.

[Zjarcal]

billy the squid wrote...

I agree that TW2 not being in the RPG category or best graphics is daft as graphics wise it clearly blows most competitors out of the water.

But TW2 is up for best PC game of the year, Make it happen people.


http://www.spike.com...ng/best-pc-game

FWIW, I voted for it in that category. 

[HiroVoid]

I don't know what people are so upset about. Skyrim is going to win this by a long shot.

*Looks at pc games of the year*
Wow.  Witcher 2's got some heavy competition.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 17 novembre 2011 - 09:00 .