[quote]Fenris_13 wrote...
Well that's the point with him! The thing is that Edward cares about Bella. Though the problem is that he cares
too much about her. He cares so much that he even leaves her in New Moon b/c he thinks this is better for her. Ridiculous? Absolutely! And that's exactly the point! Bella complains about it when they are reunited. Jacob even tells her that he left her. Meyer is not trying to hide it, it's the opposite in fact. Suddenly Edward is not so perfect after all.[/quote]
The thing is that I don't mind him being flawed or "caring about her too much" to a point where does things he shouldn't. I mind the fact that the author tries to pass him off as perfect, that Bella thinks he's perfect, and that millions of readers think he's perfect. Edward wouldn't be a bad character if Meyer actually went out of her way to point out his character flaws and their consequences. Instead, we have Edward acting jealous and taking apart Bella's truck and "it's okay because he loves her" and abandoning her for months and that's okay too "because he loves her." In neither of the two cases does he actually give Bella any semblence of choice and treats her as not being mature enough to make descisions on her own. He has no respect for her, but "it's okay, he only does it because he loves Bella SO much." The relationship between Bella and Edward is unhealthy and Meyer tries to pass it off as being a perfect love, even if you disagree with me here. Bella BARELY complains TO EDWARD about being left behind when she gets Edward back. She sees him about to step out into the sunlight and kill himself and all of a sudden everything is okay. Bella even mentions that getting him back made her "whole again," not like if the wounds had healed, but as if the "wounds had never existed in the first place," or something to that effect. Let me find the quote for you:
"It was very strange, for I knew we were both in mortal danger. Still, in that instant, I felt well. Whole. I could feel my heart racing in my chest, the blood pulsing hot and fast through my veins again. My lungs filled deep with the sweet scent that came off his skin. It was like there had never been any hole in my chest. I was perfect — not healed, but as if there had been no wound in the first place."
There. That's hardly complaining. Meyer makes it so that Bella not only immediately gets over the abandonment and the months and months of pain; it's like it never even happened in the first place. That's page 452 of New Moon. This is NOT okay.
Mind you, the best proof that Meyer doesn't seem to comprehend how unhealthy the relationship between her two characters is actually reaches its pinnacle when she brings Romeo and Juliet into the mix. We are expected to believe that Edward and Bella are the new Romeo and Juliet, while completely ignoring the fact that Romeo and Juliet is NOT a romance story. Romeo and Juliet is a tragedy about two idiot kids in lust who risk everything because they can't understand their feelings and then have to face the consequences of their idiotic actions. Meyer not only tries to paint the romance between Bella and Edward as perfect, but she even goes a step further and completely misunderstands the point of Romeo and Juliet and likens her characters to Shakespeare's couple. It's kind of awful.
[quote]Um, you did read the books, right? Yes, you're right about the Cullens are portraid as being "perfect", and that's exactly the case. They are
portraid as such, but aren't
that perfect. Some vampires in Meyer's books consider themself perfect, like the Volturi, though in the Cullens family, they have their "weakness". For example, Rosalie despises Bella for being human, which she as well would want to be. She even said that if she could choose to be human or be with Emmett she would choose to be human. The Cullens even sees themselves as "dead", only having powers, which aren't satisfying to them.[/quote]
Rosalie's hatred for Bella has nothing to do with her being a vampire and everything to do with Meyer's need to treat her female characters as incomplete on their own. I don't mean to sound like a crazy feminist here, but 90% of the female characters in Twilight are defined by either a man, marriage, or motherhood. The only clear exceptions to this are Alice and Leah. Rosalie wants a baby because she's incomplete as a female character, Bella wants Edward because she's incomplete without him, etc. Rosalie is an example of an incredibly weak female character.
[quote]To
you it might be a good thing, not to everyone. Granted, many millions of people would want to life forever and such, but is it really that good? Seeing everyone you love pass by your life? Your mum and dad and friends? Oh sure, some would say that you can get new friends after the "old" friends are dead. Well that's kinda creepy imo. And vampires have extremely long memory, so you would always remember them for the rest of your life (which is a very very long time).[/quote]
They're not technically immortal. They're biologically immortal. They don't age and they're hard to kill. But New Moon has shown us that if vampires want to die they can easily just commit suicide. That was Edward's plan when he thought Bella was dead. Regardless of whether or not being young and beautiful forever is so painful, and regardless of whether or not seeing the ones we love die is also so painful, then vampires don't really have much to complain here. They have a clear choice of whether they live or die.
Mind you, I'm not sure how fair it is to say that they would suffer so deeply; after living several hundreds of years I am sure the psychology of a human being/vampire would probably be very different than the way you and I think about it. That's another problem I have with Meyer: her vampires live for hundreds of years and yet the only one to have gathered some sense of wisdom is Carlisle. Everyone else seems kind of incredibly naive by comparison.
[quote]Jasper did snap in New Moon, remember? And you must have forgotten, even Edward-- whose been in control of his bloodlust for decades-- almost snapped when he first met Bella. Edward even explains that people have certain "flavours" to vampires. Some smell differently than others. Some have a much sweeter scent, and sometimes you just might snap. Edwars says in the first book that he must always be in control when he is close to Bella. Otherwise he might snap. Bella even says late in the book that "he's gotten much better being close to her" which he repies that it might seem like it, but it isn't even close to that.[/quote]
I guess I could give you this one.
[quote]Harmed or not, it doesn't change the fact that they still can't live among humans. There's a reason why they live in Forks; there's very very little sunlight there. It's always cloudy. Cloudy equals no sunlight. Simple logic. They disappear when the sun is actually shining.[/quote]
I won't even get into the cloudy day = no sunlight debate here. But saying they can't live among humans isn't true: they obviously do live among humans. Let's ignore the Cullens for a moment; the Volturi seem to be doing just fine in Volterra. Heidi even goes out during the daylight to "fish for tourists." I'm not sure how, considering that Voleterra has enough sunlight to expose Edward, but she does. Remember that Alice is in Volterra too.
Edward also visits Florida, which, as a Floridian I can tell you there is no way to hide from the light here during the day. He also visits Brazil with Bella. He's pretty well integrated into the world of humans.
The "sparkling" of the characters seems like a very small problem, to be honest. It's a minor annoyance at best, and a far cry from stepping out into the sunlight and catching fire.
[quote]Yes, and? Don't tell me there's a rule where vampires have to be ugly and vicious.[/quote]
That wasn't my point. I don't mind vampires being beautiful. It makes sense really; vampires need to lure their victims and what better way to do it than by using lust? I'm simply pointing out that Edward has incredible beauty. It's not like the guy is hideous or has some sort of deformity. We're not talking Cyrano de Bergerac here.
[quote]So does a few hundred thousands of other people too.[/quote]
Your point? I'm explaining that Edward has got it pretty damned good. He's a vampire with a family that loves him. It's hard to have a good family for a normal human being, but Edward has a great one that loves and supports him. Take Bella and Jacob as an example: Bella's parents are separated. They're still "good people" but Bella lacks the support of one or the other depending on where she's living. Mind you, she still has it good, but it's worse than Edward. Jacob only has his father and his father is handicapped. Edward has no right to complain here. He's immensely lucky, even by human real world standards.
[quote]So being rich is a bad thing now? Well we all have different opinions. And you do know how they got those money? I'll give you a hint. It starts with an 'A'.[/quote]
On the contrary! Being filthy rich is a great thing! That was my point! Edward can buy anything he wants and needs and never has to worry about being poverty stricken. Again, he's got it made.
And yes, I know Alice helped the Cullens cheat the stock market to get their money. I've read the books and seen a few interviews with Meyer.
[quote]That's usually the case when you're handsome and beautiful.[/quote]
Exactly.
[quote]Do humans have a predator? I think not. And Edward even describes this in the first book; He
is the ultimate predator. You can't hide, you can't run, and you'll never deafet him in a fight. Wouldn't the point of him being the ultimate predator be kinda dumb if there was a predator?[/quote]
Again, that's exactly my point. Edward doesn't have anything to worry about. Being the ultimate predator means he's not going to suddenly get a stake through his heart from Buffy. He's safe.
[quote]These underlinings I didn't even bother to explain, b/c you should read what you wrote and think about it again.[/quote]
Why? We're in agreement that he's incredibly beautiful, that being rich is great, that he has nothing to worry about, and that he has a great family. If anything, I think you should reconsider my points about Edward having a pretty fantastic life and that his complaints and negative feelings are unfounded. Edward suffers from "first world problems."
[quote]I couldn't make sense what/where you was heading at here, so if you could please explain that would be nice.[/quote]
I'm simply saying that the idea of sending Jasper away temporarily for losing control makes more sense than having the entire Cullen family move away. It's less conspicuous and there's no reason that the Cullens couldn't come up with a nice reason as to why Jasper went on an extended vacation.
Modifié par FoxHound109, 22 novembre 2011 - 08:28 .
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