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[Sith Grey Warden]

Wulfram wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

I have no idea how you managed to deduce that.

Well, look at what your plans amount to. 

Firstly, you're going to seize control of the Fereldan Chantry
Then, you're going to use this to adopt Tevinter-like policies on Mages
Finally, you're going to consider raising again the nation which came closest to destroying the Chantry

How could the Divine do anything but conclude that you represent a clear threat to the faith and call for an exalted march?

Even so, the Divine may be powerless to do anything if this takes place post-DA2 as there really would not be much of a response. The Anderfels are ruled by the Wardens, who don't want to threaten their own holdings in Amaranthine, Rivain is Qunari, Trevinter has their own divine, the Free Marches and Antiva are not unified themselves and would thus have little to contribute (and Antiva may or may not be in chaos due to Zevran's little war against his fellows), and Nevarra is the center of the mage world (the college at Cumberland) and would thus be the center of the Mage-Templar War already in progress.

[Augustei]

Paars wrote...

I would surrender to Orlais immediately and join their glorious nation. Ferelden is a backwater which smells like a wet dog.

As opposed to Orlais the snobby supremacist's who feel they can look down on the rest of society while talking about it as their nobles mingle amongst each other, and worry about their rediculous hair etc.. Fereldens have a spirit and awesome ideals which the orlesians are lacking.. Orlesians.. they make me sick, Fereldens are awesome - I'd rather surrender to Tevinter than Orlais

Sith Grey Warden wrote...
Rivain is Qunari

No they're not, the Qunari have Kont-arr and thats about it.. The chantry has influence in Rivain although not as much as the rest of thedas due to the rivaini seers which are also a good reason to reduce qunari influence but the chantry has influence there as seen by the fact that there is a circle of magi in Dairsmuid. just because the Qunari conquered Rivain a few centries back doesn't mean they still hold it, they were pushed out with only Kont-arr remaining with them during the Exalted marches

Sith Grey Warden wrote...
The Anderfels are ruled by the Wardens

Unofficially, and The Anderfels are very devoted Andrastians so it remains to be seen what will happen with The Anderfels.

Modifié par XxDeonxX, 29 novembre 2011 - 12:29 .

[jamesp81]

Wulfram wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

I have no idea how you managed to deduce that.

Well, look at what your plans amount to. 

Firstly, you're going to seize control of the Fereldan Chantry
Then, you're going to use this to adopt Tevinter-like policies on Mages
Finally, you're going to consider raising again the nation which came closest to destroying the Chantry

How could the Divine do anything but conclude that you represent a clear threat to the faith and call for an exalted march?

1.  Yes.

2.  No.  Ferelden will not become Tevinter-lite.  I might grant them generally the same freedoms that most others enjoy, but I'd likely keep the prohibition against mages holding political office.  Allowing a mage to be a noble concentrates too much power in one person.  A person may be a noble, or a mage, but not both.

3.  The Divine can sod off.  She can declare anything she feels like.

Also, re-read my post.  Raising the Dalish against Orlais is not a plan I'd likely follow through on, but it's one I'd keep in my back pocket in case the opportunity presented itself.  Most likely, I'd attempt to hold them at the Frostbacks and inflict enough damage that continuing the war was no longer worthwhile.  Breaking from the Orlesian Chantry and getting the mages on my side would be a significant part of this, since mages boost an army's combat ability considerably.

If I got lucky at Sulcher's pass or Gherlen's pass and destroyed all or most of the Orlesian military, I'd then seriously consider following through with a major counter attack, bringing the Dalish with me.  This scenario is exceedingly unlikely.  In the event it did happen, though, I want a game plan in place to exploit my good fortune.  If that did happen and the plan worked, after Orlais surrendered I would attempt to divide the country between the Anderfels and Nevarra.  This would likely avoid indefinite insurrection, as the Orlesians would never accept Dalish rule under any circumstances, and imposing Ferelden rule would send the wrong message about Ferelden.  Turning the conquered land over the Nevarra and the Anderfels would leave the Orlesians still under the rule of Andrastian leaders and avoid long term problems for Ferelden.  There would still be a Divine installed at Val Royeaux and though she wouldn't directly wield political power as she does now, she'd still be the head of the Chantry.

[jamesp81]

XxDeonxX wrote...

Paars wrote...

I would surrender to Orlais immediately and join their glorious nation. Ferelden is a backwater which smells like a wet dog.

As opposed to Orlais the snobby supremacist's who feel they can look down on the rest of society while talking about it as their nobles mingle amongst each other, and worry about their rediculous hair etc.. Fereldens have a spirit and awesome ideals which the orlesians are lacking.. Orlesians.. they make me sick, Fereldens are awesome - I'd rather surrender to Tevinter than Orlais

Sith Grey Warden wrote...
Rivain is Qunari

No they're not, the Qunari have Kont-arr and thats about it.. The chantry has influence in Rivain although not as much as the rest of thedas due to the rivaini seers which are also a good reason to reduce qunari influence but the chantry has influence there as seen by the fact that there is a circle of magi in Dairsmuid. just because the Qunari conquered Rivain a few centries back doesn't mean they still hold it, they were pushed out with only Kont-arr remaining with them during the Exalted marches

Sith Grey Warden wrote...
The Anderfels are ruled by the Wardens

Unofficially, and The Anderfels are very devoted Andrastians so it remains to be seen what will happen with The Anderfels.

The Anderfels are extremely devout, but if you read the lore, they have a lot of good reasons to hate the Orlesians.  Same goes for Nevarra.

[Dave of Canada]

Help the Orlesians take over.

[Malanek]

philippe willaume wrote...

Well you would get a guy or a girl, regardless of the background, round up allies and settle the templar mage dissention to form small forces to delay the enemy invasion force in a natural choke point. To give the queen/king time to assemble the ban and the arriere ban.

of course the coming of that guy or girl would be heralded by a treason of biblical proportion and a massive defeat. Like accepting a battle in the open with no prepared defence against Orlais heavy cavalry or taking position on a steep hill that negates the heavy horse advantage and the leader killed or betrayed and killed at the battles turning point.

That being said an invasion from Orlais can only benefits Ferelden, they can’t dress and they can’t speak with a French accent in there. So it would be more like Orlais bringing freedom, civilisation and good taste to the poor oppressed in crass stupididty Ferelden native.
Not mention that every ferelden women would have a chance to have great skin by using the Oil of Orlais line of products.


no?

 Great post.

But seriously, setting DA3 in the intrigue before a possible invasion of Ferelden would be a good move IMO.

[Augustei]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Help the Orlesians take over.

Blasphemy! =P

[dragonflight288]

Ferelden most likely wouldn't get Orzammar to help out. The Chantry is the main buyer of lyrium, the (small) main export of the dwarves. The Chantry head is also located in the heart of Orlais. And the Divine's have a long history of supporting Orlais.

But since the templars have left the Chantry, the need for lyrium will be scaled up considerably. There is a rogue army of drug addicts running around hunting mages. That will not end well.

If anything, Orzammar will be locking down the hatches and fight the darkspawn like they always do. Orzammar is on the front lines of a much larger and deadlier battle anyway.

In DA2, Act 1, it seems like Amaranthine is building up a powerful navy and trade force because there are important people in Kirkwall trying to get any Amaranthine ship sunk. So were I in charge of Ferelden's armies, my plan would be pretty simple.

Pull a church of England and free the mages from Chantry control. I would still require mages to attend the circle and maybe undergo the Harrowing, but tranquility would be for volunteers only. Mages would be free to live outside the tower once they reach mage or enchanter status, so long as they check in with a local chantry each week.

I would send the armies to the two mountainous choke points with multiple mages capable of widespread long range damage and healers. (only 7 mages were at ostagar, I think that's stupid that people are ruled by their fear of mages when their skills are so useful.)

Using catapults, trebuchets, mabari charges, mage attacks, archers, and a few divisions of footmen, those mountain passes can easily be held. The real problems come from the northern sea route. We would have to determine the most likely landing zone of Orlais and position the fleet there. Should Orlais attack from the North, Ferelden would spread itself far too thin to defend itself, and there are plenty of flat, open plains that would suit an Orlesian calvary.

The big problem is keeping Orlais OUT of Ferelden, but if that happens, then Ferelden rises as a world power. If it doesn't, Orlais will face tough opposition...again.

[Urzon]

dragonflight288 wrote...

But since the templars have left the Chantry, the need for lyrium will be scaled up considerably. There is a rogue army of drug addicts running around hunting mages. That will not end well. 

As a 100% mage supporter, i got to admit that the idea of a drug addicted rogue templar army is getting old. If there is going to be a big scare from mages during the war, you know that towns and cities are going to hire templars to help guard the city. The Chantry might not like it, but it's not like the mages are going to go away if the Mother in the local Chantry says "Shoo!." The nobles and monarchs are going to want protection against mages, even more so against blood mages. 

Since the templars aren't under the control of the Chantry anymore, they can easily send an envoy to the dwarves to buy the lyrium for themselves. The dwarves aren't going to turn down money. They can even use the money they get for guarding the cities to pay for it. That or, the nobles can pay them a portion of their wages in lyrium itself.

The Chantry isn't going to be sending anywhere near the amount of gold that they used to for lyrium, with the whole templar break and all. The dwarves will welcome the templar's money with open arms.

Modifié par Urzon, 01 décembre 2011 - 06:54 .

[CrimsonZephyr]

Using catapults, trebuchets, mabari charges, mage attacks, archers, and a few divisions of footmen, those mountain passes can easily be held. The real problems come from the northern sea route. We would have to determine the most likely landing zone of Orlais and position the fleet there. Should Orlais attack from the North, Ferelden would spread itself far too thin to defend itself, and there are plenty of flat, open plains that would suit an Orlesian calvary.

The big problem is keeping Orlais OUT of Ferelden, but if that happens, then Ferelden rises as a world power. If it doesn't, Orlais will face tough opposition...again.

Also, train mages to fight like line infantry or archer corps. A reason they lost at Kirkwall was because the Templars easily flanked the idiots dawdling in the main square. Seriously, they could wield those bladed staves like bayonet-fixed long rifles - they work on almost exactly the same timescale and principle. They're long-ranged and deadly, but slow to fire.. Just have them guard a choke point and fire en masse, and by rank to keep the pressure on.

Also, Ferelden is flat in its central region, the Ferelden Valley, where the Bannorn is. The term valley implies the presence of a significant high-groun, so using tactics like spear walls, schilitrons, and infantry squares are not entirely out of the question. What's funny is that in the Ostagar scenes, the Ferelden archer corps was standing in front of their spike wall - you're supposed to stand behind them, idiot!

What Ferelden needs is decent light cavalry, for hit-and-run. Get rid of using mabari on the front lines. They get killed in two seconds and its tactically retarded. Someone walking around in full plate with a massive battle axe, and thundering forward on a horse, won't be seriously impeded.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 01 décembre 2011 - 08:24 .

[SkittlesKat96]

The Ferelden army probably does have cavalry, since its mentioned in the novels and some quests and origins in DA:O...they'll need to come up with a few excuses though as to why we haven't seen horses in say the battle of Ostagar...

Maybe horses are afraid of Darkspawn and the taint?

[Dave of Canada]

XxDeonxX wrote...

Blasphemy! =P

Creating protagonists which oppose the previous one is wonderfully fun.

Pro-Mage Warden.
Pro-Templar Hawke.

Hope the third protagonist can work against the Dark Ritual.

[Augustei]

Dave of Canada wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

Blasphemy! =P

Creating protagonists which oppose the previous one is wonderfully fun.

Pro-Mage Warden.
Pro-Templar Hawke.

Hope the third protagonist can work against the Dark Ritual.

I agree completely =D on occassion ive wrote about my Hawke and Warden battling it out.. My Warden is far more politically powerful but in combat they are pretty even. But yeah I cant see my Warden and Hawke getting along at all. One is pro-chantry one is anti-chantry, one killed flemeth the other resurrected her, my hawke killed a bunch of wardens and unleashed Corypheus upon the world. My Warden loves Ferelden and my Hawke doesn't really care for it.. The only thing my characters have in common is their hatred for Tallis, Darkspawn and Tallis... Yes I mentioned her twice because they / me really hates Tallis =P

Anyway In my opinion Ferelden has the ability to smash the Orlesian armies and invade Orlais.. However it is not something done easily and I doubt at all unless a future pc helps out =D

[LinksOcarina]

How does the Warden know Tallis?

[Pistolized]

Even with the best, most unifying outcome from DA:O, Ferelden will still be militarily weak for a long time.  

Ferelden independence war (20-30 years ago?) -> huge soldier population loss
Civil War -> moderate soldier population loss
Blight -> Large soldier and general population loss, and 10-20% landmass suffers blight conditions (unusable)
Orzammar can be freindly, but is not explicitly aligned with Ferelden, and must now defend Deep Roads
Elves may have been given a designated sub-nation, which could be written to become powerful-ish
The Bannorn could be cooperative, yet weak because of civil war
Amaranthine had some problems, and the Wardens wont help
Mages are freed, and would have to be recruited locally, but many would be loyal, could be written to become combat adept or weaker
Templars separated from Chantry, could: join autonomously, or join as citizens, or ambush both side's mages , or defect to Orlais

Orlais, however, has had no notable conflicts apart from the Mage/Templar/Chantry schism.

So, the goal would be to hold out as long as possible.  Hold choke points, don't get ambitious, and pray.