182 réponses à ce sujet

[Realmzmaster]

Aaleel wrote...

jlb524 wrote..

Dragon Age already does this.  This is why they have a different protagonist in each game and change the setting.  That has nothing to do with multiple origin stories in a single game.

But they tried to connect the games and carry over characters for no reason.  If you're not going to contiune one story in full what's the point of carrying over small bits and retconning the hell out of them.  They messed up continuity as far as when stuff happened in the timeline.

If they set new games with new characters in completely different areas and time, they have total freedom, and peoples' endings and characters in previous games are respected and not retconned.

Since the Dragon Age games are about the world of Thedas certain events have to carry over, but not all of them. Bioware could have easily said in DA2 that Alstair will be the King no matter what you did in DAO including becoming the prince consort. Bioware could have made Harrowmont the King no matter what you did in DAO.  Bioware could have made canon that the Warden sided with the werewolves and killed all the elves.

Bioware never stated that all the choices from DAO or Awakenings would carry over. The events that do carry over are to add flavor and backdrop and maybe some quests for cameos.

I think Bioware should have just junk the entire import save idea and stated what it wanted to be canon for the world of Thedas in a prologue for DA2 and let the game continue from there.  Gamers may have still been upset, but Bioware would have established what is canon. The prologue could state that Alstair and Harrowmont are kings. The werewolves and warden destroyed the elves. Morrigan and OGB died in childbirth or whatever they want as canon.

[TEWR]

Persephone wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

I didn't feel insulted by Bioware with DA2.

 If anything is insulting about the DA series, it's DAO's protagonist having no character growth whatsoever outside of headcanon. To me, anyway.

I have to agree with this. As much as I love Xanthos Aeducan, I was not able to accurately roleplay him the way I wanted to. I wanted to roleplay a politically savvy Dwarf who suspected Bhelen of doing something, and then coming back to Orzammar to take the throne.

Not to mention that the Warden does kinda become the same type of character because the dialogue is all the same.

That isn't to say that I didn't feel insulted by DAII. I did.

[Aaleel]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Since the Dragon Age games are about the world of Thedas certain events have to carry over, but not all of them. Bioware could have easily said in DA2 that Alstair will be the King no matter what you did in DAO including becoming the prince consort. Bioware could have made Harrowmont the King no matter what you did in DAO.  Bioware could have made canon that the Warden sided with the werewolves and killed all the elves.

Bioware never stated that all the choices from DAO or Awakenings would carry over. The events that do carry over are to add flavor and backdrop and maybe some quests for cameos.

I think Bioware should have just junk the entire import save idea and stated what it wanted to be canon for the world of Thedas in a prologue for DA2 and let the game continue from there.  Gamers may have still been upset, but Bioware would have established what is canon. The prologue could state that Alstair and Harrowmont are kings. The werewolves and warden destroyed the elves. Morrigan and OGB died in childbirth or whatever they want as canon.

So they added nothing to the game which is my point.  If it's not going to be substanitive there's no need for it.  It's like they did to make the players of the original happy, but accomplished the opposite because they retconned so much stuff.

If it's just about Thedus, why are we still stuck in Ferelden/Ferelden Territories in the exact same time period.  Just give me new game with a new protagonist, in a new area, at an important time in history for that area.  There would be no need to carry anything over except some generic facts from the mage/templar war.  And that's if the next game even took place after the war, and not in a time before it or Origins.

Modifié par Aaleel, 28 novembre 2011 - 07:57 .

[jlb524]

Aaleel wrote...
Because if you don't have to worry about respecting the previous game or contengencies for following games you can make as many origins, branching storylines, and endings as you want.  If you're trying to connect games you have to limit things like Origins, story paths and choices.

I think the multiple origins issue affects the current game more than the next one.

If you'd want to do it properly and avoid the origins merging into one generic character, you'd have to create as many game paths as there are origins.  That's a lot of time/effort/money.  It has little to do with 'the next game' and more to do with the current game.  Multiple origins that persist throughout the entire story is a huge resource hog and that would still be an issue even if they were creating games that weren't connected at all.

Aaleel wrote...
So they added nothing to the game which is my
point.  If it's not going to be substanitive there's no need for it. 
It's like they did to make the players of the original happy, but
accomplished the opposite because they retconned so much stuff.

It added to my enjoyment of DA2.

I didn't really see anything retconned from DA:O in my imports.

Modifié par jlb524, 28 novembre 2011 - 08:10 .

[Aaleel]

jlb524 wrote...

I think the multiple origins issue affects the current game more than the next one.

If you'd want to do it properly and avoid the origins merging into one generic character, you'd have to create as many game paths as there are origins.  That's a lot of time/effort/money.  It has little to do with 'the next game' and more to do with the current game.  Multiple origins that persist throughout the entire story is a huge resource hog and that would still be an issue even if they were creating games that weren't connected at all.

Not exactly, you wouldn't need a story path for every Origin, you would just need every origin to lead to one of two or three different paths, and just make sure your experience changed depending on your race.  And it does have to do with the next game.  It's like how ME2 was so narrow and felt more like a bridge game.  Because if there were too many different paths in ME2 , ME3 would have been impossible.  But now since ME3 is the last game they can do whatever they want with it and have as many endings as they want since it's the last game and Shepard's story ends.

It added to my enjoyment of DA2.

I didn't really see anything retconned from DA:O in my imports.

Merrill, Andres, Justice all got retconned in mine.  Andres being in Kirkwall when they said he was with all the events of Origins, Awakenings, and after Awakenings happening was a complete retcon of the time line.

Merrill somehow going back and getting the eluvian that everyone agreed was evil and should be destoyed and then having said Eluvian in Kirkwall at the same time my Warden in Witch Hunt goes and finds it in the same exact spot it started at.

There were many in mine.

[alex90c]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

I didn't feel insulted by Bioware with DA2.

 If anything is insulting about the DA series, it's DAO's protagonist having no character growth whatsoever outside of headcanon. To me, anyway.

I have to agree with this. As much as I love Xanthos Aeducan, I was not able to accurately roleplay him the way I wanted to. I wanted to roleplay a politically savvy Dwarf who suspected Bhelen of doing something, and then coming back to Orzammar to take the throne.

Not to mention that the Warden does kinda become the same type of character because the dialogue is all the same.

That isn't to say that I didn't feel insulted by DAII. I did.

I wouldn't say DAII as a whole insulted me, that's just stupid. I just felt the fact that there was combat every 10 seconds just insulted my intelligence, as if Bioware felt their audience can't be arsed with anything requiring them to use their heads and that they just want to fight all the time. Sure, fighting's cool if the game was a hack n'slash, FPS, TPS or whatever but it's not, it's meant to be an RPG (well, action RPG I suppose ... just not that level of action) but I think what made it worse is that combat in Bioware games generally tends to be quite mediocre.

Gears of War is the kind of game that can throw endless enemies at you and you can find it fun as hell because the combat is bloody amazing. Call of Duty can throw endless mooks at you, and yet it's fun because it's stimulating. So those two games to be fair can actually slack on their stories and use their gameplay as their crutch because it's that enjoyable. But DA2 ... my God. The awful combat just made me want to slam my head against a wall in frustration because it was just tedious as hell, it happened non-stop, seemed like the only solution Hawke had for a problem and well I think I've been over enough times how much I hate the animations.

Right, I think I got carried away there.

tl;dr DA2 in its entirety wasn't insulting, the lack of anything to do besides killing things was what I felt was insulting.

[TEWR]

alex90c wrote...



I wouldn't say DAII as a whole insulted me, that's just stupid.

 
Oh I wouldn't either. But the main story and the one-sided combat is what insulted me.

I just felt the fact that there was combat every 10 seconds just insulted my intelligence, as if Bioware felt their audience can't be arsed with anything requiring them to use their heads and that they just want to fight all the time. Sure, fighting's cool if the game was a hack n'slash, FPS, TPS or whatever but it's not, it's meant to be an RPG (well, action RPG I suppose ... just not that level of action) but I think what made it worse is that combat in Bioware games generally tends to be quite mediocre.

Hit the nail on the head right here. That's exactly the problem with DAO's combat and DAII's.

Gears of War is the kind of game that can throw endless enemies at you and you can find it fun as hell because the combat is bloody amazing. Call of Duty can throw endless mooks at you, and yet it's fun because it's stimulating. So those two games to be fair can actually slack on their stories and use their gameplay as their crutch because it's that enjoyable.

can't comment on Gears of War's story, but to be fair CoD has actually made strides to make their stories great.

IMO anyway, but I really do like the stories in MW, MW2, and when I get it MW3.

But DA2 ... my God. The awful combat just made me want to slam my head against a wall in frustration because it was just tedious as hell, it happened non-stop, seemed like the only solution Hawke had for a problem and well I think I've been over enough times how much I hate the animations.

Right, I think I got carried away there.

tl;dr DA2 in its entirety wasn't insulting, the lack of anything to do besides killing things was what I felt was insulting.

Fair enough.

I disagree on the animations, but I do agree that the game being stuck in "Stabbity stab stab!!" mode and the lack of Hawke actually being able to get out of fighting people -- save for a very scant few instances -- tends to make Hawke less amazing.

Along with the story being the same no matter what.

[jlb524]

Aaleel wrote...
Not exactly, you wouldn't need a story path for every Origin, you would just need every origin to lead to one of two or three different paths, and just make sure your experience changed depending on your race.  And it does have to do with the next game.  It's like how ME2 was so narrow and felt more like a bridge game.  Because if there were too many different paths in ME2 , ME3 would have been impossible.  But now since ME3 is the last game they can do whatever they want with it and have as many endings as they want since it's the last game and Shepard's story ends.

Why wouldn't you need to have a different story path for each origin (if you want to do it right)?  Why even do them then?

Creating one character that can branch at certain points in the game (usually near the end) is one thing (and not too difficult) but creating multiple characters that branch from the beginning because they start from a different place is.  Look at your example...if you are playing as a Templar, Mage, or Seeker in DA3 each story is going to be unique with little overlap.  That hogs up a lot of resources for a single game, which is why I doubt they'd do something like that.  It has more to do with this issue than with importing into the next game.

Aaleel wrote...
Merrill, Andres, Justice all got retconned in mine.  Andres being in Kirkwall when they said he was with all the events of Origins, Awakenings, and after Awakenings happening was a complete retcon of the time line.

Awakening happened 6 months after the end of Origins.  Act 1 of DA2 happens over a year after the end of Origins.

Aaleel wrote...
Merrill somehow going back and getting the eluvian that everyone agreed was evil and should be destoyed and then having said Eluvian in Kirkwall at the same time my Warden in Witch Hunt goes and finds it in the same exact spot it started at.

Merrill rebuilt her eluvian from scratch.  She only took a shard from the original one.

[alex90c]

can't comment on Gears of War's story, but to be fair CoD has actually made strides to make their stories great.

IMO anyway, but I really do like the stories in MW, MW2, and when I get it MW3.

Oh definitely, I agree. I played MW2 and thought it had a pretty cool story, and I find the Gears stories and setting pretty engrossing and interesting too. I was just kinda saying that those two games have a bit more room to slack on their stories (I mean let's be fair, they're not Bioware level, though you've got to admit the voice acting in MW2 was exceptional and definitely Bioware standard if not better) because their gameplay is so fun. It's why their multiplayer is great too, whereas people are a bit more cynical about ME3's because while the concept looks fun and interesting, we just have to wait and see whether Bioware can pull it off.

[Aaleel]

jlb524 wrote...

Why wouldn't you need to have a different story path for each origin (if you want to do it right)?  Why even do them then?

Creating one character that can branch at certain points in the game (usually near the end) is one thing (and not too difficult) but creating multiple characters that branch from the beginning because they start from a different place is.  Look at your example...if you are playing as a Templar, Mage, or Seeker in DA3 each story is going to be unique with little overlap.  That hogs up a lot of resources for a single game, which is why I doubt they'd do something like that.  It has more to do with this issue than with importing into the next game.

You can have like I said a Templar front, a mage front, and a neutral front.  Doesn't matter how many Origins or races you have it woud lead to one of those three places in the second part, and then the ending would depend on which front you went to.  They would just have to make the game actually react to your race of starting profession differently depending on which front you ended up in.

Awakening happened 6 months after the end of Origins.  Act 1 of DA2 happens over a year after the end of Origins.

The Blight ends during your year of servitude.  So you've started working off your debt in Kirkwall before the Blight even ends.  So depending on how far into the first year that happens Awakenings could just be starting when you finish working off your debt.  That doesn't even count the events of Awakenings, and the events after Awakenings where Andres takes one last trip to the Deep Roads, it told his cat is making him soft, takes a trip to Amaranthine to find it a home, and then finally takes the voyage across the ocean.  Makes a name for himself and starts a clinic.  Doesn't add up in any way.  In Origins at one point Wynne says it's been a year since you left the tower and Origins isn't even over yet, let alone Awakenings and the events after it.

Merrill rebuilt her eluvian from scratch.  She only took a shard from the original one.

She built this from a shard <_<

It's shattered in the center just like the original one, and in several pieces.  If you were rebuilding/growing a full mirror from a shard it would be one solid piece growing outwardly, not several pieces shattered in the middle.

[jlb524]

Aaleel wrote...
You can have like I said a Templar front, a mage front, and a neutral front.  Doesn't matter how many Origins or races you have it woud lead to one of those three places in the second part, and then the ending would depend on which front you went to.  They would just have to make the game actually react to your race of starting profession differently depending on which front you ended up in.

But that isn't the same as having different origins.   That is incorporating three different paths that branch out mid-game.

Different origins = different from the very beginning with that continuing onward (if they want to do it good). 

Aaleel wrote...
The Blight ends during your year of servitude.  So you've started working off your debt in Kirkwall before the Blight even ends.  So depending on how far into the first year that happens Awakenings could just be starting when you finish working off your debt.  That doesn't even count the events of Awakenings, and the events after Awakenings where Andres takes one last trip to the Deep Roads, it told his cat is making him soft, takes a trip to Amaranthine to find it a home, and then finally takes the voyage across the ocean.  Makes a name for himself and starts a clinic.  Doesn't add up in any way.  In Origins at one point Wynne says it's been a year since you left the tower and Origins isn't even over yet, let alone Awakenings and the events after it.

The only thing...we don't know how much time passes between the end of Hawke's year of servitude and the beginning of Act 1.  I believe it's mentioned that it's about a year after the Blight's end, so a few months must have passed in between the end of Hawke's servitude and Act 1.  Which makes sense, because it seems she spent some time looking for other ways to earn money (and discovered Bartrand's Deep Roads thing).

Aaleel wrote...
She built this from a shard <_<

It's shattered in the center just like the original one, and in several pieces.  If you were rebuilding/growing a full mirror from a shard it would be one solid piece growing outwardly, not several pieces shattered in the middle.

She incorporated the shard into another mirror she probably got from somewhere in Kirkwall.

This has been confirmed by the writers.

[TEWR]

She built this from a shard

It's shattered in the center just like the original one, and in several pieces. If you were rebuilding/growing a full mirror from a shard it would be one solid piece growing outwardly, not several pieces shattered in the middle.

Gaider said that she took a shard and studied lore surrounding the Eluvian and extrapolated from it, using that information in building a brand new Eluvian.

The reason why it's all cracked and everything is because she was using pieces of glass that didn't quite fit into the Eluvian, which is why she needed the Arulin'holm. It's a special type of carving tool that helped her get everything to fit in neatly.

I imagine there's extra pieces of glass she hasn't yet used in her house during Act 2.

[Persephone]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

I didn't feel insulted by Bioware with DA2.

 If anything is insulting about the DA series, it's DAO's protagonist having no character growth whatsoever outside of headcanon. To me, anyway.

I have to agree with this. As much as I love Xanthos Aeducan, I was not able to accurately roleplay him the way I wanted to. I wanted to roleplay a politically savvy Dwarf who suspected Bhelen of doing something, and then coming back to Orzammar to take the throne.

Not to mention that the Warden does kinda become the same type of character because the dialogue is all the same.

That isn't to say that I didn't feel insulted by DAII. I did.

It'll be a sad day when something as insignificant as a GAME will be able to actually insult me. DAO and DAII had flaws enough that frustrated me. While DAII's flaws are less tedious to me than DAO's (I already mentioned my most glaring annoyance but: Padding dungeons, always getting the same answers to matter how I try to role-play.... Leliana calling my cheerful, bubbly Brosca "severe"....meh. The Approval system and its illogical setup, the tedious combat system....yes, I prefer DAII's...esp. as a mage) I will not deny they exist (Enviroments being repeated, illogical events surrounding the ending, over the top rogue combat, badly implemented waves....) However, DAII got ahead by a mile with its story DLCs while DAO's story DLC range from mediocre to rotten and do nothing to improve matters.

[Gunderic]

Well deserved. SWTOR on the other hand is amazing.

[Aaleel]

jlb524 wrote...

The only thing...we don't know how much time passes between the end of Hawke's year of servitude and the beginning of Act 1.  I believe it's mentioned that it's about a year after the Blight's end, so a few months must have passed in between the end of Hawke's servitude and Act 1.  Which makes sense, because it seems she spent some time looking for other ways to earn money (and discovered Bartrand's Deep Roads thing).

The Blight ends during your first year.  Varric says word came across the ocean of the ending of the Blight.  So you have.

(1year) - (however long into you year of servitude that was), then you have to add six months to that before Awakenings even starts.  Then you have all the events of Awakenings and after Awakenings before Andres even sets foot on a boat to make the voyage.  It just does not add up.

She incorporated the shard into another mirror she probably got from somewhere in Kirkwall.

This has been confirmed by the writers.

This goes back to my whole not buying her story, that explanation makes no sense and sounds like something made up after they realized things didn't add up.

Modifié par Aaleel, 28 novembre 2011 - 09:30 .

[Persephone]

Aaleel wrote...

She incorporated the shard into another mirror she probably got from somewhere in Kirkwall.

This has been confirmed by the writers.

This goes back to my whole not buying her story, that explanation makes no sense and sounds like something made up after they realized things didn't add up.

Merrill: The shard I picked up was corrupted.

So it's right there, in the game itself.

[TEWR]

Persephone wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

I didn't feel insulted by Bioware with DA2.

 If anything is insulting about the DA series, it's DAO's protagonist having no character growth whatsoever outside of headcanon. To me, anyway.

I have to agree with this. As much as I love Xanthos Aeducan, I was not able to accurately roleplay him the way I wanted to. I wanted to roleplay a politically savvy Dwarf who suspected Bhelen of doing something, and then coming back to Orzammar to take the throne.

Not to mention that the Warden does kinda become the same type of character because the dialogue is all the same.

That isn't to say that I didn't feel insulted by DAII. I did.

It'll be a sad day when something as insignificant as a GAME will be able to actually insult me. DAO and DAII had flaws enough that frustrated me. While DAII's flaws are less tedious to me than DAO's (I already mentioned my most glaring annoyance but: Padding dungeons, always getting the same answers to matter how I try to role-play.... Leliana calling my cheerful, bubbly Brosca "severe"....meh. The Approval system and its illogical setup, the tedious combat system....yes, I prefer DAII's...esp. as a mage) I will not deny they exist (Enviroments being repeated, illogical events surrounding the ending, over the top rogue combat, badly implemented waves....) However, DAII got ahead by a mile with its story DLCs while DAO's story DLC range from mediocre to rotten and do nothing to improve matters.

oh I'd definitely agree that the story DLCs are better than DAO's, for the most part. MotA's ending for an anti-Qunari Hawke kinda brings it down, and the flaws in the stealth also bring it down, but otherwise both Legacy and MotA are solid DLCs.

[Aaleel]

Persephone wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

She incorporated the shard into another mirror she probably got from somewhere in Kirkwall.

This has been confirmed by the writers.

This goes back to my whole not buying her story, that explanation makes no sense and sounds like something made up after they realized things didn't add up.

Merrill: The shard I picked up was corrupted.

So it's right there, in the game itself.

I don't remember it, but I'll take your word for it.  Just because it's you

[alex90c]

I'd prefer if the stock game was great and the DLC sucked rather than the stock game sucking and the DLCs being good.

[eyesofastorm]

jlb524 wrote...

I blame the Origin stories, though.  While each one of these crafted an interesting character, that character was quickly lost when they all merged into a single, generic, 'Warden' person about an hour into the game.

I could not disagree with this more vehemently.  DA:O was probably the most re-playable game I have ever played because of the origin stories... they changed the whole complexion of the game for me.  Alistair was my mage character's boy... he LOVED that fool, but even so, he couldn't bring himself to kill or let Alistair kill probably the most valuable military mind in all of Ferelden even if it meant losing Alistair's friendship.  My human noble character on the other hand watched his parents sacrifice themselves to Howe's men so that he could escape.  This character would have fought Alistair tooth and nail for the opportunity to kill Loghain.  My dust town Dwarf on the other hand was my only character to make the ultimate sacrifice because he was so thankful to the Grey Wardens for giving him an opportunity to be something more than a thug for the Carta.  The origin stories were brilliant and they made for the best, most engrossing roleplaying I've ever experienced in a computer game... period.  

[Aaleel]

And here's the Dragon Age Timeline

9:30 Dragon -: Events described in Dragon Age: Origins begin. The Fifth Blight begins in the Korcari Wilds around Ferelden when The Architect's botched attempt to make a Disciple of Urthemiel instead results in the Old God becoming an archdemon.

9:30 Dragon: The Warden is saved by Duncan, the Warden-Commander of Ferelden and becomes a Grey Warden.

9:30 Dragon: The Warden, Alistair, Wynne, Hawke(if not a mage), Carver Hawke, and Aveline Vallen fight in the Battle of Ostagar against the Darkspawn; the battle is lost when Teyrn Loghain deserts, resulting in the destruction of the Fereldan army, the near-destruction and exile of the Grey Warden order, and the death of King Cailan Theirin and Duncan. The Warden and Alistair are saved by Flemeth. Loghain returns to Denerim and declares himself regent, triggering a civil war between him and Ferelden's nobility.

9:30 Dragon - : Events described in Dragon Age II begin. Lothering is destroyed by the Darkspawn and the Hawke family flees into the Blightlands. Around the Korcari Wilds, Hawke, the rest of his/her family, and Aveline Vallen are saved by Flemeth and flee Ferelden to Kirkwall in the Free Marches.

9:31 Dragon: Urthemiel is slain by one of the two remaining Grey Wardens in Ferelden at the Battle of Denerim and The Warden becomes the "Hero of Ferelden".

9:31 Dragon -: Events described in Dragon Age: Origins - Awakening begin. The Architect awakens The Mother, who goes insane sending out The Children armies to conquer Ferelden.

9:31 Dragon: The Mother is slain by the new Warden-Commander of Ferelden. The dwarves of Orzammar are able to reclaim the city of Kal'Hirol. Amgarrak Thaig is overrun by Harvesters. The Warden-Commander of Ferelden slays the first Harvester and destroys the Golem research.

9:31 Dragon: Hawke helps fund an expedition to the Deep Roads with Bartrand Tethras and Varric Tethras and discovers an ancient, pre-First Blight Primeval Thaig and an ancient Lyrium Idol contained within.

The Archdemon is slain in 9:31, SIX months pass, and not only do Awakening, the events after Awakenings and everything else, pass.   Hawke has worked of his'her year of servitude, raised the money for the expedition and finished the expedition, and it's STILL 9:31.

Really/??  Really, this is absolutely impossible.

The second bolded Hawke still hasn't even left Lothering yet, or even reached Kirkwall.

Modifié par Aaleel, 28 novembre 2011 - 09:54 .

[Morroian]

eyesofastorm wrote...

Morroian wrote...

Yeah well apparently if people stop harping on about it Bioware will somehow forget the criticisms people have about it.  

I suspect people will stop harping on about it as soon as Bioware says something encouraging about their future direction. 

They have, they've even demonstrated it in the DA2 DLC.

[Monica83]

Morroian wrote...

eyesofastorm wrote...

Morroian wrote...

Yeah well apparently if people stop harping on about it Bioware will somehow forget the criticisms people have about it.  

I suspect people will stop harping on about it as soon as Bioware says something encouraging about their future direction. 

They have, they've even demonstrated it in the DA2 DLC.

Not all that disliked dragon age 2 puchased the dlc

[Realmzmaster]

Aaleel wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

She incorporated the shard into another mirror she probably got from somewhere in Kirkwall.

This has been confirmed by the writers.

This goes back to my whole not buying her story, that explanation makes no sense and sounds like something made up after they realized things didn't add up.

Merrill: The shard I picked up was corrupted.

So it's right there, in the game itself.

I don't remember it, but I'll take your word for it.  Just because it's you

Persephone is correct about the shard. Merril states when Hawke talks to her that she search for Tamlen but all they found was a busted mirror with shards lying around. She pick up one of  the shards. She tells Hawke that she tried to cleanse it which is why she turned to blood magic. She cleansed the shard or so she thinks using blood magic.

[jlb524]

eyesofastorm wrote...
I could not disagree with this more vehemently.  DA:O was probably the most re-playable game I have ever played because of the origin stories... they changed the whole complexion of the game for me.  Alistair was my mage character's boy... he LOVED that fool, but even so, he couldn't bring himself to kill or let Alistair kill probably the most valuable military mind in all of Ferelden even if it meant losing Alistair's friendship.  My human noble character on the other hand watched his parents sacrifice themselves to Howe's men so that he could escape.  This character would have fought Alistair tooth and nail for the opportunity to kill Loghain.  My dust town Dwarf on the other hand was my only character to make the ultimate sacrifice because he was so thankful to the Grey Wardens for giving him an opportunity to be something more than a thug for the Carta.  The origin stories were brilliant and they made for the best, most engrossing roleplaying I've ever experienced in a computer game... period.  

I liked the origins stories themselves.  I just hated what came after.

It added to my replayability...until I hit Ostagar...then I lost interest.

Aaleel wrote...

And here's the Dragon Age Timeline

From the wiki...I'm not sure everything is accurate there.

I wish BW would put out an official timeline.

Modifié par jlb524, 28 novembre 2011 - 10:30 .