322 réponses à ce sujet

[Someone With Mass]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Amen to that.  In fact, you usually need both hands to fire a handgun anyway--you use your non-dominant hand to keep it steady.

Well, if you're aiming at anything father away than five goddamn feet.

Yes I get very upset when people in video games hold guns wrong.

You must just adore Shepard then, since he/she is using only one hand in almost all the cutscenes where he/she points a gun at someone.

Pretty much the only time I can recall when it was done with both hands was in LotSB.

[Trekfanboy]

I don't really care either way regarding the possibility of wielding two handguns in ME3 ... but I think it's AWESOME that so many people in this thread are freaking out over how "unbelievable" and "impractical" aiming and shooting two handguns is when we're talking about a game where people fire handheld weapons that have INSANE destructive power, have sex with aliens, drive around in rovers and "firewalkers" that defy the laws of physics, and you guys are worried about whether someone holding two handguns can hit a target with reasonable accuracy???

ROTFLMAO!

Modifié par Trekfanboy, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:31 .

[CrutchCricket]

Han Shot First wrote...
Engaging a single target with dual wielded weapons is equally pointless when one weapon can make a target just as dead, and without any drop off in accuracy.

Double the gun, double the bullets, half the usage of each and the life span of the enemy. Seriously if Shepard's augmentations can get rid of the physical constraints, explain to me how what you just said makes any sense.

Modifié par CrutchCricket, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:32 .

[Harmless Citizen]

Miranda's loyalty mission too, I think.

[Welsh Inferno]

I think its worse that Garrus is looking to fire a sniper rifle from the hip..

[Nashiktal]

Someone With Mass wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Amen to that.  In fact, you usually need both hands to fire a handgun anyway--you use your non-dominant hand to keep it steady.

Well, if you're aiming at anything father away than five goddamn feet.

Yes I get very upset when people in video games hold guns wrong.

You must just adore Shepard then, since he/she is using only one hand in almost all the cutscenes where he/she points a gun at someone.

Pretty much the only time I can recall when it was done with both hands was in LotSB.

I can't look at that picture without being reminded of that photoshop job that replaced the weapons with instruments.

[AdmiralCheez]

Someone With Mass wrote...

You must just adore Shepard then, since he/she is using only one hand in almost all the cutscenes where he/she points a gun at someone.

Shepard does a lot of dumb things while trying to look cool.

"Hey.  I'm a good dancer.  Watch this!"

Pretty much the only time I can recall when it was done with both hands was in LotSB.

*picsnip*

TALI GARRUS WTF R U DOIN

YOU GUYS ARE LUCKY VASIR IS LIKE TWO FEET AWAY CUZ YOU AIN'T HITTIN' SH*T SHOOTIN' FROM THE HIP, KIDDIES.

[Someone With Mass]

Nashiktal wrote...

I can't look at that picture without being reminded of that photoshop job that replaced the weapons with instruments.

Funny that, because that's the first thing I thought of and then I remembered that they used to hold guns instead of trumpets and stuff. 

[AdmiralCheez]

Trekfanboy wrote...

I don't really care either way regarding the possibility of wielding two handguns in ME3 ... but I think it's AWESOME that so many people in this thread are freaking out over how "unbelievable" and "impractical" aiming and shooting two handguns is when we're talking about a game where people fire handheld weapons that have INSANE destructive power, have sex with aliens, drive around in rovers and "firewalkers" that defy the laws of physics, and you guys are worried about whether someone holding two handguns can hit a target with reasonable accuracy???

ROTFLMAO!

Hey pal, I target shoot in real life.  I worked really hard to get good at it, and it drives me insane when I see people doing it wrong.  There's a point where you stop looking cool and start looking like a moron.

Ironically, my aim is really, really bad in videogames.

[Someone With Mass]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

TALI GARRUS WTF R U DOIN

YOU GUYS ARE LUCKY VASIR IS LIKE TWO FEET AWAY CUZ YOU AIN'T HITTIN' SH*T SHOOTIN' FROM THE HIP, KIDDIES.

My first reaction was: "Uh, Tali, you have a damn hand cannon attached to your hip. Why are you using that puny Shuriken?"

[capn233]

I suppose I won't call anyone stupid in this thread, but clearly there are some that have fired a pistol and those that haven't.

A person is not nearly as accurate with a pistol in each hand as they are firing a single one with a two handed or even one handed technique. It isn't just trigger control and recoil management, but you really can't effectively get a sight picture on both guns. You just can't align both sets of sights in your vision rapidly. If you try to lock them together to shoot at the same thing you will still end up with less recoil management and accurate followup shots will be more difficult than if you fire a single pistol correctly.

Mythbusters even did an episode where they were trying to fire pistols with various "Hollywood" techniques to see if any of them were workable. Two guns put less rounds on the target compared to two hands on a single pistol despite doubling the volume of fire.

As for the weapons in ME having "autotargeting," they just compensate for atmosphere. Even the upgrades only alter the trajectory in a minor fashion. That is why you still have to aim the weapons.

Modifié par capn233, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:53 .

[lyssalu]

Cheesy Blue wrote...

Chewin3 wrote...

suprhomre wrote...
Oh! God yes! Do you have one with FemShep?

No, but I have him with a knife too.





EDIT: They are not mine of make.

Jiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiizzzz

really

[capn233]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Ironically, my aim is really, really bad in videogames.

Just concentrate more on operating the mouse correctly and less on hitting the target

Modifié par capn233, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:42 .

[Sgt Stryker]

Trekfanboy wrote...

I don't really care either way regarding the possibility of wielding two handguns in ME3 ... but I think it's AWESOME that so many people in this thread are freaking out over how "unbelievable" and "impractical" aiming and shooting two handguns is when we're talking about a game where people fire handheld weapons that have INSANE destructive power, have sex with aliens, drive around in rovers and "firewalkers" that defy the laws of physics, and you guys are worried about whether someone holding two handguns can hit a target with reasonable accuracy???

ROTFLMAO!

Look up the term Suspension of Disbelief, then come back to us.

[CrutchCricket]

capn223: I hear you and having never fired a gun I wouldn't presume to lecture anyone on real world shooting. That being said Shepard's augmentations aren't fully defined yet and it's unclear whether or not he's able to circumvent what you're saying. That's why for the time being we may conclude dual wielding as plausible at least potentially. And of course that says nothing about Legion (a synthetic) or krogan (got redundancies for everything)

[Giant ambush beetle]

You know there is a reason nobody wields two pistols at once in real life - you need the second hand to control the recoil of the pistol, if you use just one hand follow up shots are pretty slow because of the muzzle rise.
Next point is you can just aim with one at a time, the other pistol just shoots in the general direction, also with just one hand its much harder to aim steady, you'll be really shaky.
And I can imagine ejecting the heat sink would be pretty awkward and s l o w if your character doesn't have third hand.

In a nutshell: shooting one pistol with two hands is way more effective than shooting two pistols. Some may say ''but akimbo pistols is teh l33t shiat!!!!!1111zomg''. Yeah, in a (stupid) movie shooting pistols with blank ammo and where accuracy isn't important at all it probably looks cool to some people, but in my book effectiveness is teh shiat.

Oh, by the way, I've sent thousands rounds downrange, so I can speak from experience.

[DiebytheSword]

Ah big giant knife. I love bringing knives to gunfights. ME3 will be so much fun.

*edit*  I too have some practice at the range, mostly rifles and shotguns, but handguns on occasion.  You can't control even smaller rounds firing one handed, imagine a mini rail gun.

Modifié par DiebytheSword, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:47 .

[AdmiralCheez]

D3MON-SOVER3IGN wrote...

What did you shoot?

Mostly rifles.  Learned on a .22, but the .308 is my baby.  Recently talked my dad into letting me play around with revolvers (John Wayne a go-go).  Never touched a shotgun, not yet anyway.

[mango smoothie]

You know the one fad that's kind of pissing me off in games today is akimbo/dual wield. So don't put any thoughts of it in a game that doesn't have it.

[Han Shot First]

Trekfanboy wrote...

I don't really care either way regarding the possibility of wielding two handguns in ME3 ... but I think it's AWESOME that so many people in this thread are freaking out over how "unbelievable" and "impractical" aiming and shooting two handguns is when we're talking about a game where people fire handheld weapons that have INSANE destructive power, have sex with aliens, drive around in rovers and "firewalkers" that defy the laws of physics, and you guys are worried about whether someone holding two handguns can hit a target with reasonable accuracy???

ROTFLMAO!

While we are at it, why not have Shepard defeat the Reapers from the open cockpit of a WW1 era Sopwith Camel?
Just because the game has some unrealistic or implausible elements doesn't mean that Bioware should be piling more of those elements into ME3. And I don't think anyone is seriously worried about dual wielding weapons. They just don't see lame action movie tricks/stunts as 'must have' features.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:52 .

[Colintastic]

111987 wrote...

Colintastic wrote...

some guy who's name is numbers wrote...

This is a game, not reality.

At least the quote looked something like that...

Yes it's a game but it's one that strives for a sense of realism or posibility.

As others have pointed out though, with Shepard's enhanced strength it would certainly be possible for Shepard to duel wield though. However as I said, there's really not much point into implementing a dual-wield system if only one class of guns can use them. It made sense for a game like Halo where you had pistols, smg's, covenant weaponry, etc...that could all be dual wielded. In Mass Effect there's only the Predator and thr Shuriken that could be dual wielded. It's just not worth all the work.

The strength issue is less a problem as is the aiming. People can fire pistols with a single hand moderately well. Especially if you're standing sideways where your shoulders line up with your arm. Granted it's not as accurate as 2 hands, but reasonably doable. I accept that Shep is stronger than the average bear. Hell, his N7 suit probably gives him some bonus to strength as well, otherwise it would be way too heavy to hulk around. Mideval knights would get tired after short periods of moving in their armor, which is why they rode on horses. It's only reasonable that Shep is exceptionaly strong based on any number of factors. 

The real issue is the aiming. Being able to focus down the sights of two seperate guns simulateously is a real pain. If you alternate, shooting and therefore alternate the sight you're looking down, you can increase accuracy... but then what's the point? doubling ammo capacity? Get an extended clip... Same result, more accurate. As a side note, making a heat clip bigger would effectively have the same effect as a modern extended bullet clip. The idea is the heat clip absorbs the heat generated by the gun, greater surface area would require more heat energy to heat the entire object, so the concept of an extended clip would not be impossible to transfer.

In a somewhat related issue, but unrelated to Mr. Number's quote here, in Halo there was a functional game purpose for DW. That was the combination of guns. DW allowed the player to mix different kinds of weapons such as plasma pistol charge and magnum. Blow out shields, then a couple magnum bullets and the guy is dead super fast. There were some obvious advantages that I'm not going to go through and it came at the disadvantage of limiting grenades. Were this concept to be used in ME, what's the point? not every class can use grenades and there isn't such a difference between the pistols or their effect on the various life bars that the game play would change that much. The resultant effect would simply be an extended clip... which has already been confirmed as one of the available weapon mods in ME3.  

[Trekfanboy]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Hey pal, I target shoot in real life.  I worked really hard to get good at it, and it drives me insane when I see people doing it wrong.  There's a point where you stop looking cool and start looking like a moron.

Ironically, my aim is really, really bad in videogames.

I am also an avid target shooter. I am aware that using two handguns at the same time is a pretty stupid idea.

However, I'm pretty sure there are some engineers from NASA who would be "driven insane" by all the stupid things that happen in the ME games that break the laws of physics.

The M-920 Cain gun in ME2 which is essentailly a handheld "Mass Effect Nuke" that atomizes your enemies but somehow leaves the environment (floor, walls, obstacles, etc.) untouched is TOTALLY believable.

Again, I'm NOT saying I want dual handguns in ME3. I'm simply pointing out that it doesn't make sense to maintain the "suspension of disbelief" for EVERY idiotic thing in the ME universe EXCEPT the idea that someone would use two handguns in a firefight.

Modifié par Trekfanboy, 01 décembre 2011 - 01:05 .

[Abraham_uk]

The Woldan wrote...

You know there is a reason nobody wields two pistols at once in real life - you need the second hand to control the recoil of the pistol, if you use just one hand follow up shots are pretty slow because of the muzzle rise.
Next point is you can just aim with one at a time, the other pistol just shoots in the general direction, also with just one hand its much harder to aim steady, you'll be really shaky.
And I can imagine ejecting the heat sink would be pretty awkward and s l o w if your character doesn't have third hand.

In a nutshell: shooting one pistol with two hands is way more effective than shooting two pistols. Some may say ''but akimbo pistols is teh l33t shiat!!!!!1111zomg''. Yeah, in a (stupid) movie shooting pistols with blank ammo and where accuracy isn't important at all it probably looks cool to some people, but in my book effectiveness is teh shiat.

Oh, by the way, I've sent thousands rounds downrange, so I can speak from experience.

I have to agree. Having played Headhunters (a game where you shoot each other with laser rifles in a forest) it is virtually impossible to aim at anything. Seriously. The target is right in front of me, and I end up shoting something else. So two pistols is out of the question. As for the recoil, damn. GUYS EVEN PISTOLS ARE HEAVY!!!

They carry ammo that weighs loads. The amount of lactic acid involved in holing one and aiming building up in one arm is tremendous. Forget the recoil for one moment and think of the gun lowering due to the arm dropping. Now add the recoil and your arm will jerk making the shot inaccurate.

Learning how to use an assault rifle accurately is a skill that few people are incapable of learning! Fact. People go into army training thinking it will be easy. They find the assault rifle too heavy and their arms can't handle the weight. Two assault rifles will cause back problems. You can't carry more than two guns unless you're really strong. Name me one real life soldier who carries three or more guns in their inventory (on top of the other necessary army gear).

GUNS ARE HEAVY!!!! End of story.

Modifié par Abraham_uk, 01 décembre 2011 - 12:58 .

[Someone With Mass]

I have never touched real guns myself (pretty hard to get if you don't have a hunter's license where I live), but I'd imagine that shooting akimbo anything often results in misses.

What is the average weight for a pistol, anyway? Close to a kilogram?