1667 réponses à ce sujet

[Someone With Mass]

Dave of Canada wrote...
Except... you're arguing with people who do care about it, we're arguing from Shepard's point of view and your argument against is by mentioning Cerberus is evil. When people are saying "Based on the information/logic at the time", don't argue that Cerberus tries to kill you in ME3.

You're talking as if I do that all the time. Which I don't.

[Medhia Nox]

@Saphra: But you still "seem" to see all Paragon choices as wrong. There is no room for "grey" in your mind... you either choose Renegade/Cerberus - or you're wrong. ((At least from the posts I have read and admittedly - they are clearly not all the posts you have posted.))

[Dave of Canada]

Medhia Nox wrote...

What amazes me - is that we often "claim" we want more than just "black and white" in our fiction.

All people like Saphra, Dave, and Kaiser argue about is their "White" view against SWMs "Black" view...

I understand where Cerberus comes from and fully support them, though in no way do I view them as "White".

[Someone With Mass]

Medhia Nox wrote...

What amazes me - is that we often "claim" we want more than just "black and white" in our fiction.

All people like Saphra, Dave, and Kaiser argue about is their "White" view against SWMs "Black" view...

And vice versa.

I don't think I've seen very many people ever say: "Well, I could be wrong - but it's still how I see the situation."

People's views will always be Black and White - always.

The funny thing is when the one side tries to claim that they're "morally gray" when it looks more like they don't know the meaning of the phrase.

Or when they're saying that the other side is biased.

[Dean_the_Young]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...
Except...
you're arguing with people who do care about it, we're arguing from
Shepard's point of view and your argument against is by mentioning
Cerberus is evil. When people are saying "Based on the information/logic
at the time", don't argue that Cerberus tries to kill you in ME3.

You're talking as if I do that all the time. Which I don't.

[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

*Thumbs up for restraint*

[naledgeborn]

Someone With Mass wrote...

That's it? I just wrote a comment as to why, and you're taking that little part of it (out of context too) and ignores the rest?

And what was it you wrote before? "F**k Cerbeurs haters?"

Okay. F**k you too, then.

That's the highest level of discussion I'll ever bother to get involved with when you're calling anything out.

Woah now homey, someone's estrogen meter is off the scales. You need to calm down. This is the intrawebz, no need to get all hostile and emo on your keyboard.

[GMagnum]

dayum dat popcorn luk hella gud tbh leme get sum i got sum lil debbie snack 2 so i we cn share tbh

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...


You're talking as if I do that all the time. Which I don't.

Oh, you're really not the right person to start anything. Especially when you're telling one side that they have biased viewpoints all the time, while trying to justify the even most douchebaggy of Renegade actions.

[Medhia Nox]

@Dave of Canada: You're taking the word "White" and transforming it to "Good" - transform it to "Right" or "Correct" or "Best" or any number of words - and that's how many/most people treat all their world views.

A Black and White person says: "You either agree with me, or you are X" (("X" on this forum seems to be the word "illogical" - I blame the fact that it's a science fiction forum.))

-----------

Or, stating the other side "has no merit" - that's another black and white viewpoint.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 01 décembre 2011 - 04:54 .

[DarkPsylocke26]

I always blow up the base. I really don't want Cerebrus to have it.

[CrutchCricket]

GMagnum wrote...

dayum dat popcorn luk hella gud tbh leme get sum i got sum lil debbie snack 2 so i we cn share tbh

lol tru dat gmagz we need lots hella good popcorn thnx 4 sharin tbh.

[Someone With Mass]

naledgeborn wrote...

Woah now homey, someone's estrogen meter is off the scales. You need to calm down. This is the intrawebz, no need to get all hostile and emo on your keyboard.

Don't start what you can't finish, then.

And before any of you other people starts indicating that I'm doing it myself, here's something to think about: WHAT IF I ALREADY KNOW THAT?

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Your bias is showing.

Case in point.

By the way, there's no such thing as being completely unbiased.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 01 décembre 2011 - 04:56 .

[Medhia Nox]

But the ones you see as "wrong" - there is no possibility that you could be wrong - am I correct?

Let's take the Cerberus base (to keep on topic):

I destroyed it - not because I have a hate-on for Cerberus.

I've given my reasons before - and I have to go to work soon.

But I fully accept that - as a fictional character who has to make decisions - that not all of them will be correct, but still, a decision must be made.

Yes - I made it with what appears to me as the right or "White" reason - and the other choice seems wrong or "Black" to me - but, as a third party real person - I am more curious about what Bioware decides my decision means - than I am proving some victory of logic about a video game.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 01 décembre 2011 - 04:59 .

[Dave of Canada]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Dave of Canada: You're taking the word "White" and transforming it to "Good" - transform it to "Right" or "Correct" or "Best" or any number of words - and that's how many/most people treat all their world views.

A Black and White person says: "You either agree with me, or you are X" (("X" on this forum seems to be the word "illogical" - I blame the fact that it's a science fiction forum.))

Then I'd not view myself as such (though some people possibly do), as I usually argue in favor of the most logical side and tend to argue the logic of others. While this might fall into the "illogical" thing which you mention, I have yielded some points and have had a view thoughts completely changed based on some of these arguments.

Originally, I was paragon and only became renegade upon balancing the logic of both sides and finding myself more in agreement with the Renegade (though some of the decisions I do still fall under paragon because the logic behind the Renegade is weak).

When somebody mentions they've blown up the base for X, X and X. I usually don't argue against the person, I argue against their reasoning. Disagreeing with them doesn't mean I instantly think they're illogical.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 01 décembre 2011 - 04:59 .

[Medhia Nox]

@Dave of Canada

Some thoughts about "logic":

"Logic is the art of going wrong with confidence." Joseph Wood Krutch

==============

Logic is misused by many people - and the vast majority are not formally trained in it. Forgive me if I view your appeal for "logic" as simply "my opinion self-justified".

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...
Sure, but you take it to new extremes.

I want you to try and see the Renegade side as I have seen the Paragon side.

As in the past? No, thank you. That'd be pointless.

I see Paragon and Renegade as two different things. And I don't like every single action both sides have, so I'm mixing it up, Paragade style.

By the way, punishing Paragons because Renegades are doing something different is just retarded, because that's the whole point. Different choices, different outcomes. If you can't deal with it/don't like it, then stop picking that side in that particular choice.

That's the whole point in having a choice to begin with.

[BloodyTalon]

Really hjas someone who saved the collectors base shep gave it awaythey knew that it was more of a gift to make sure cerebus was behind him so yea.

nothing to yank away when it was given

Modifié par Talosred, 01 décembre 2011 - 05:07 .