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[111987]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

It's not elitism, it's a reaction against the assinine core notion of the thread, that the ME franchise should try to be "more GoW than GoW", against the notion that every game has to be like the most widely popular games, against the idea of "Oh hey let's make ME a cross between GoW, HALO, and CoD!"

People who like those sorts of games have a myriad to choose from. The world doesn't need YAGOW. Let ME be ME for people who like ME.

People aren't saying ME should be like GoW. They're saying the gameplay, which is influenced heavily by GoW should replicate GoW's gameplay more than it already does. This means including slipping from cover to cover, rolling (honestly, going from GoW to ME, the lack of rolling SUCKS), a half-decent, reactive AI (rather than the nonexistent ME2 one), larger maps to give more room to manoeuvre, and more organic maps. Sure, Gears had plenty of moments where there were things in the map that were purposely designed for cover, but it was hell of a lot more believable than ME1/2's going in to an open space with a load of random boxes business.

Story? Stick to the Bioware way. Characters? Stick to the Bioware way. We're not saying the whole of ME should be like GoW, we're just referring to the combat.

Whatever else, could we please not have ME turn into a roll-fest?  Or is it already too late with ME3? 

Combat rolling is one of those rediculous video-gamey immersion-breaking things -- reminds me of the scenes in Galaxy Quest with Allen's character rolling around in the dirt and losing his pistol like an idiot.

You know, you don't have to roll if you don't want to.

Even in Gears of War rolling is only used in certain situations, like in real life. If a grenade is tossed at you, you jump-roll-dive away from it, do you not? In ME2, you can't do that. Or if someone is firing at you and you roll-dive into a nearby room to avoid the fire.

Yeah, you can roll anytime you want, but that doesn't mean the feature shouldn't be in the game. It's like saying jumping shouldn't be in games because you can make the character jump at any time, which they wouldn't really do.

[alex90c]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

alex90c wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

It's not elitism, it's a reaction against the assinine core notion of the thread, that the ME franchise should try to be "more GoW than GoW", against the notion that every game has to be like the most widely popular games, against the idea of "Oh hey let's make ME a cross between GoW, HALO, and CoD!"

People who like those sorts of games have a myriad to choose from. The world doesn't need YAGOW. Let ME be ME for people who like ME.

People aren't saying ME should be like GoW. They're saying the gameplay, which is influenced heavily by GoW should replicate GoW's gameplay more than it already does. This means including slipping from cover to cover, rolling (honestly, going from GoW to ME, the lack of rolling SUCKS), a half-decent, reactive AI (rather than the nonexistent ME2 one), larger maps to give more room to manoeuvre, and more organic maps. Sure, Gears had plenty of moments where there were things in the map that were purposely designed for cover, but it was hell of a lot more believable than ME1/2's going in to an open space with a load of random boxes business.

Story? Stick to the Bioware way. Characters? Stick to the Bioware way. We're not saying the whole of ME should be like GoW, we're just referring to the combat.

Whatever else, could we please not have ME turn into a roll-fest?  Or is it already too late with ME3? 

Combat rolling is one of those rediculous video-gamey immersion-breaking things -- reminds me of the scenes in Galaxy Quest with Allen's character rolling around in the dirt and losing his pistol like an idiot.

If you don't like rolling, don't use it. The AI use it so sparingly anyway you won't even see it that much.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Rolling has seemed coded into many games I've seen it in, in such a way that the character randomly and automatically rolls, not in such a way that you hit a certain button to roll.

As for jumping, the jump button is one of the reasons I hate FPS games. Can't stand playing a
"modern combat game" and watching people hop around in circles because it makes them harder to hit in the game, while it would make them sitting ducks in a real firefight.

[111987]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Rolling has seemed coded into many games I've seen it in, in such a way that the character randomly and automatically rolls, not in such a way that you hit a certain button to roll.

As for jumping, the jump button is one of the reasons I hate FPS games. Can't stand playing a
"modern combat game" and watching people hop around in circles because it makes them harder to hit in the game, while it would make them sitting ducks in a real firefight.

You definitely haven't played Gears of War 3 then, or the ME3 demo. You have to tap 'a' and the directional stick in the direction you want to roll to roll. It isn't random our automatic.

And jumping definitely doesn't make you harder to hit. But there are times where jumping is useful, such as jumping over cover.

You seem like you would almost be impossible to please. Are you mad when Shepard sprints on the Normandy or on the Citadel? Because no-one would really do that either, right?

If you don't like an optional feature, don't use it.

[Someone With Mass]

When BioWare incorporates a mechanic that lets you slide kick people over cover, then they're almost there.

Oh, and Shepard is remarkably mobile in the Sur'Kesh demo. It's almost more in your favor to run around than to stick to cover.

[Alicia Keys]

Mass Effect series is so much better than the Gears of War series because it has story and character to it and it's epic.

At first my the topic I thought you were talking about God of War 3...

[Killjoy Cutter]

Luc0s wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Really?  Because I consider GoW and HALO utterly unplayable.

Maybe if you'd suck less you'd realize that Gears of War's gameplay is smoother and over-all better than Mass Effect's gameplay, .

A) Still find GoW unplayable.
Did I kick your favorite game or something?

A) Then that problem lies with you, not with the game.

It's definately the game.  There's nothing to it, bog standard brainless console shooter.  It's designed for and has vanilla mass accesability as a beer-and-chips game.  It's just a bunch of steroid freaks in Hollywood combat getups running around blasting things.    Dudebro.  Implied grotch-grab. 

Nope it's not the game, it really is just you.

The fact that you think GoW is a brainless console shooter (cool opinion by the way) already shows that the problem lies with you. Let me guess, you never even played the GoW games have you? You never really played Gears of War, that's pretty clear when I read your ignorant posts.

You're wrong on everything.

GoW is designed for the "hardcore gamer", not mass accesabillity. But you clealry have never played the game, else you wouldn't be so ignorant. If you'd actually play the GoW games, you'd know how wrong you are, especially on GoW3. That game goes deeeeeeep with achievements, unlockables, challenges and hardcore gameplay. Way deeper than Mass Effect ever went. Again, you'd know this if you actually played GoW3, but you clearly haven't.

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Rolling has seemed coded into many games I've seen it in, in such a way that the character randomly and automatically rolls, not in such a way that you hit a certain button to roll. 

^
Haha. Now I'm 100% certain. You clearly really have never played Gears of War.

Go play Gears of War, a whole new world of intense gameplay and hardcore shooter action will open up for you. I promise you, there is no coded, random or automatic rolling in GoW. It's all manually controlled by the player. You need some actual skills to pull off those moves at the right moment though.  But then again, GoW isn't your typical mass beer-and-chips game.


Now please, go spit your nonsense somewhere else. Or at least play the games before you're going to say dumb sh*t about those games.

Since you didn't read the exchange that followed that post, you ironically missed the explanation of how that whole  "skills" things makes GoW just another typical shooter.  That talk about "intense gameplay and hardcore shooter action" fits exactly into the kind of game and the kind of gamer/attitude I want kept at least a light year away from Mass Effect.  What Mass Effect DOES NOT NEED is more of the "achievements, unlockables, challenges and hardcore gameplay" nonsense. 

I did play the GoW demo.  Twitchy-fest, just like most other shooters.  You'll notice, if you're not too busy with your knee-jerk defense of the game, that I didn't say that GoW specifically had "automatic" rolling and other moves, just that many of the games with rolling do it automatically. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

111987 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Rolling has seemed coded into many games I've seen it in, in such a way that the character randomly and automatically rolls, not in such a way that you hit a certain button to roll.

As for jumping, the jump button is one of the reasons I hate FPS games. Can't stand playing a
"modern combat game" and watching people hop around in circles because it makes them harder to hit in the game, while it would make them sitting ducks in a real firefight.

You definitely haven't played Gears of War 3 then, or the ME3 demo. You have to tap 'a' and the directional stick in the direction you want to roll to roll. It isn't random our automatic.

And jumping definitely doesn't make you harder to hit. But there are times where jumping is useful, such as jumping over cover.

You seem like you would almost be impossible to please. Are you mad when Shepard sprints on the Normandy or on the Citadel? Because no-one would really do that either, right?

If you don't like an optional feature, don't use it.

No, I haven't tried GoW3, just the first two. 

If I do end up playing ME3 (ie, it's available without the Origin spyware), I'll have to demap the roll "feature" off the keyboard, either through options or modding.  That is, if it's not inherently linked to five other functions...

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 07 décembre 2011 - 01:44 .

[DifferentD17]

jreezy wrote...

Alicia Keys wrote...

Mass Effect series is so much better than the Gears of War series because it has story and character to it and it's epic.

At first my the topic I thought you were talking about God of War 3...

Gears of War 3
Story? Check
Characters? Check
Epicness? Check

Not seeing the "better" part here.

I would say ME has better characters, but that's the only place it may win in.

[InvincibleHero]

Why does it have to? I think every game should try to be itself. It doesn't have to OU gear gears just be ME the series many have grown to love. They are not going to spend the resources to make the shooter aspect on par with GOW while also simultaneous going with the deep story RPG aspect. It would cost too much and take too long. Most devs are hurting for poisitve cash flow since sales are down due to recessions in major parts of the world.

[Il Divo]

Can't we all just get along?

[Killjoy Cutter]

Luc0s wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

If I do end up playing ME3 (ie, it's available without the Origin spyware), I'll have to demap the roll "feature" off the keyboard, either through options or modding.  That is, if it's not inherently linked to five other functions...

Why the hell would you do that? That duck-and-roll MECHANIC (not feature) is something Mass Effect 2 really missed and I'm glad that they put this mechanic (that they smartly copied from Gears of War) into ME3.

This duck-and-roll mechanic adds a lot to the gameplay and experience. it gives the player more freedom and the ability to quickly dodge enemy attacks, or quickly jump towards cover to get yourself out of fire.
It's awesome, if you don't totally suck at it (which you most likely do, else you'd also see how good this duck-and-roll mechanic is).

Because it's one of the stupidest-looking things ever seen in a video game.  Shepard is an Alliance Marine and Spectre, not a damn circus clown.  Why the hell are highly-trained soldiers wearing tons of gear doing a gymnastics routine while taking heavy fire?  Take a look at any training in the US military, from basic to the SEALs, and you won't find them teaching rolling around on the floor as a method of moving, while under fire or otherwise.  It's a stupid game-ism, just like the idiots in FPSs hopping around the battlefield because it makes them harder to hit in the game.

[Dean_the_Young]

Yeah. We just belly-flop into the nearest ditch.

THAT'S what Mass Effect needs. Fewer chest-high walls! More drainage ditches!

[alex90c]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Yeah. We just belly-flop into the nearest ditch.

THAT'S what Mass Effect needs. Fewer chest-high walls! More drainage ditches!

Gears' cover looks organic. Mass Effect's just looks really, really contrived. Walk in to a room, a load of boxes. In Gears 3, take the Trenches map for example, I thought the cover in that map fit in really well. 

Maybe ME3 will have some urban environments though, would be pretty cool to fight in a city in a futuristic setting.