973 réponses à ce sujet

[Rinshikai]

If I post my asunder entry, would anyone be willing to give me some feedback and suggestions on how to improve it. I have gotten some feedback, but I wouldn't  mind getting more.

Modifié par Rinshikai, 04 février 2012 - 10:41 .

[Klidi]

ColorMeSurprised - that's interesting story! I like how you used colours and sharpness of the picture to show how he grows, sees and understand more, and with that, finds courage to accept himself. Great job!

[Muirin]

Hello everyone,

I'm another Asunder-er who'd like to join in the chat about writing. In answer to Mahati's general question (of a few pages ago) I've published > 100 papers in scientific refereed journals (astrophysics), but published nothing (outside of the usual ff sites) of my creative writing (not written much yet but keen to continue).

Name: BSN Muirin, and on ff.net I am bluemuirin  
Location of works: http://www.fanfiction.net/~bluemuirin
(Anonymous reviews allowed: YES - I just enabled them)
Current ongoing project: Bittersweet http://www.fanfictio...6/1/Bittersweet
(why oh why didn't I use this name and theme for my Asunder competition entry)
Favorite story I've written: Not yet written one I like enough to give this label
Favorite story I've read: http://www.fanfictio...8/1/Cartography
and also http://www.fanfictio...a_Mirror_Darkly
Non ff fave, "A Booke of Days, by Stephen Rivele"

I put my Asunder entry (The Palimpsest) onto the fanfiction.net account, in case anyone has time to read and review it. I'd also appreciate reviews on the WIP, Bittersweet. I'll certainly review other folks entries as I get through reading them all.

Modifié par Muirin, 05 février 2012 - 04:27 .

[Muirin]

Rinshikai wrote...

If I post my asunder entry, would anyone be willing to give me some feedback and suggestions on how to improve it. I have gotten some feedback, but I wouldn't  mind getting more.

I'll have a look at it if you send me the link

[tklivory]

 I've updated the 'front page' post with all author bios submitted so far.

Also:

Because this is still being developed, I'm opting to leave the 'Article o' DIscussion' and the 'Concrit' stories as is (since neither of them got a full week of discussion).  I've noticed some people doing concrit of the stories - thank you!

ARTICLE DISCUSSION:
I already have an article suggestion that I will post come next Sunday for discussion.  Please, please, please PM links to articles to be used in future discussions!  I will update the 'front page' post on Sunday weekly with a new article, but I'd love for the suggestions to come from the community here rather than Uncle Google.

CONCRIT STORY OF THE WEEK:
For those of you looking for concrit, I've decided that the system suggested by Corker and seconded by others will be the way to go.  I will maintain a list of authors interested in having their work concrittered and work through them each week.  Each Sunday, I will pick someone from the list of authors who send me their names (probably using dice or RNG) and PM/contact them and ask if they would like to 'play' (i.e) have their story posted the following week or pass the opportunity on to someone else.  If I do not hear from them by mid-week (Tues/Wed), then I will pick another name and contact them.  Whoever 'plays' is removed from the 'active list' and put onto the 'pending list' until all names on the 'active list' have been used, then the 'pending list' will become the new 'active list'.

To keep it fair, if someone on the 'active list' doesn't respond after three attempts, they will be removed from all lists and will need to resubmit their name to be included again.

TO BE PUT ON THE LIST: please PM me your BSN name and contact info, if an email is preferred over BSN PMs.

[Klidi]

Ok so here's my profile:

Name:Klidi, on FFN I'm Ventisquear
Location of works: BSN blog, FFN account, and if you want to see some of my photos and translation of one of my original stories, I have aldo devArt account, also as Ventisquear
Anonymous reviews allowed: Yes. Anonymous flames can be deleted, so it's not that big issue.

Current ongoing project: The main one is Failed to Fail - with Zevran/m!Surana pairing, but it's not and will not be explicit. The 'worst' thing that will happen is a kiss, but that's stilll a distant future. 
The second one is a dark, Zevran/fem!Cousland story I started just recently Ignis Internum
I have others, but these are the two most important ones.

Favorite story I've written: Besides Failed to Fail, Noblesse Oblige and The History of Coming Home
Favorite story I've read: Fanfiction? That's difficult question, because I know too many awesome authors.
Not fan fiction: there are three books that share the 'No. 1' place for long years now: Lord of the Rings by Tolkien, Foucault's Pendulum by Eco, Goat in the Milk by Yuriy Polyakov
[/quote]

Concrit: I welcome concrit to any of my stories, especially concrit that goes beyond spelling and typos.

[Muirin]

To get back on to the article under discussion, "Storming the Sand Castle". What do folks think about DGs point #3? Flow...of course, I see the point, but cutting all the 'extra' adverbs and adjectives, I'm not sure where one might ideally draw the line. I like depth of description, it brings alive the characters and places and gives a lot of atmosphere to a story. So perhaps it is a matter of taste, but I fear I will never write a story that appeals to DG.
An example is the one of the stories I noted as a favorite in my mini-bio: http://archiveofourown.org/works/47775
lush and wonderful (that is my opinion) or too much?

Modifié par Muirin, 05 février 2012 - 08:38 .

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

For flow, you have to remember what your character is feeling (or what you want the reader to feel). If they're tearing through a jungle being chased by wild animals, too many descriptive words slow it down to the point the reader has to wonder if they're meant to be admiring the scenery or dashing through at top speed. Descriptions can aid the flow IMO, but only if you use words appropriate to the situation. You're unlikely to admire a particularly gorgeous flower unless you run straight into it, fall over, and have the torn petals rain down on your face until the landscape stops spinning.

[Corker]

I suspect attention to flow/extra words is one of the areas I could stand to pay some attention to. (Edit: Lady Redundant Woman is redundant.  See?)  When I have to revise to meet a word or character count (e.g., on LJ), I can usually find ways to tighten up my sentences. Thing is, I don't usually do that level of revision *unless* I'm up against a hard limit. Whiiiich makes me think I should look at it a little more closely, in my Copious Free Time.

Modifié par Corker, 06 février 2012 - 12:14 .

[Muirin]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

 If they're tearing through a jungle being chased by wild animals, too many descriptive words slow it down to the point the reader has to wonder if they're meant to be admiring the scenery or dashing through at top speed.

Good example. OK, I can see how it might be vital to keep it in check there. Guess it's a judgement call then that becomes easier with practice.

[Corker]

Name: Corker (BSN, AO3) / Corkerite (FF.net)
Location of works: Corker's Short Fics in the Community Creations thread.
Anonymous reviews allowed: No on FF.net; yes on the kmeme, obvs.
BSN PMs: Yes
Current ongoing project: The Demon Queen of Kirkwall  (rated conservatively as M/R)
Favorite story I've written:The Search for the Dragon's Claw (rated T/PG13)
Favorite story/book I've read: Guh... Well, "The Sword of Samurai Cat" will always have a special place in my heart, although it's not the best book I've read.

Modifié par Corker, 06 février 2012 - 01:37 .

[maxernst]

Name: maxernst (BSN), magritte (ff.net)
Location of Works: see signature
Anonymous Reviews Allowed: no
BSN pm's: yes
Current Project:  Alistair's Journey in signature (but really all three works are part of one long story)
Favorite Story I've Written:  There's really nothing out there other than my one long piece.  I was fairly proud of the backstory I wrote for a character I was playing in a NWN2 persistent world, but its forums are now offline and I lost most of the story in a hard drive crash, though I might try and resurrect some of it from the part that's still on my old laptop.  I'll post it on ff.net if I go back to it.
Favorite Book I've Read:  Probably Not Wanted on the Voyage, by Timothy Findley.  But if I were to choose a work that represents how  I'd like to be able to write, it would be The Innkeeper's Song, Peter S. Beagle.  I admire how he was able to write in the first person from about a dozen characters and give them distinctive narrative voices  Oh, and a shout out to Klidi:  I LOVE Foucault's Pendulum. It would be in my top 10 novels ever, as well..

I'm not as experienced or skilled a writer as many on here, and I know there are still typos and a couple glaring continuity errors in my story that should be cleaned up.  But there it is.  Oh, and a warning to canon purists:  the story posits a relationship between Alistair and an M!Cousland warden.

Modifié par maxernst, 06 février 2012 - 02:42 .

[The Sarendoctrinator]

I've been away from BSN for a few days, mostly working on my novel, and I'd like to thank you guys for the advice because my rate of progress is very much improved. I'll be finishing up another chapter real soon!

There wouldn't be much point in me filling out the profile. None of my writing has been posted online, I haven't read enough fanfiction to list a favorite, and I don't even have a favorite book (which is strange, since I do have a chosen favorite movie, TV series, and videogame series) unless I can count my own book because... you know, it'll always be my sentimental favorite. And the title is a big secret for now anyway, so yeah, not much point.

I really like the idea of weekly discussion about writing articles though! I used to read them a lot more often than I do now.

ColorMeSuprised wrote...

Yeah, I will support whoever publishes their novel from you guys here.  As long as it's not only avaible on kindle (don't have one) and I can read the language. :happy: Since not everyone here writes English (or in my case German).

I'll have to check if the e-book edition of mine will be exclusive to kindle, or available on other devises as well. It'll definitely be available to order online for anyone who lives outside the US.

Unfortunately, I can't read any other languages fluently, so if anyone here publishes a book that's not in English, I'd only be able to understand a few words. ^^; I'll probably buy all the English ones to support you guys though! And I say "probably" just because I draw the line at... um, anything like that Sten/Warden-based novel.

Now, for my opinion about the current topic, word flow and description: I agree that there are times when a lot of description is not appropriate. My description tends to be more about emotion than the landscape because I like the reader to know exactly what my characters are feeling, and especially in my novel, this sort of thing is really important. As for not using a lot of adjectives/adverbs... I guess that's mostly a matter of personal taste, unless the author really goes overboard. I think sentence structure flows better with a good balance, rather than none at all (unless they're not appropriate for that sentence).

Yeah, if a character is running for his life through the forest, I would include brief descriptions of the landscape when it's important to the reader imagining the scene - like if the character is trying to hide behind trees, dodge branches while they run, or nervous because the sound of leaves under their feet might let the person chasing them know where they are. Stuff like that. And then the rest of the description would be emotional, how the character is dealing with the situation, if they're afraid, if running from someone has become so routine in their life that it doesn't bother them anymore and they're just thinking strategically, etc.

Modifié par The Sarendoctrinator, 06 février 2012 - 07:22 .

[Bethadots]

Corker wrote...

  When I have to revise to meet a word or character count (e.g., on LJ), I can usually find ways to tighten up my sentences. Thing is, I don't usually do that level of revision *unless* I'm up against a hard limit.

This is a good point. A lot of people complained about the word limit with the Asunder competition but I found it did me a lot of favours. I think I had to cut about 500 words from my original story and it came out a lot tighter for it.

Did anyone else find that?

Modifié par Bethadots, 06 février 2012 - 01:35 .

[Maria13]

Name: Maria13 here Clariana on FF.net
Location of works: http://www.fanfiction.net/~clariana
Currently writing: http://www.fanfictio...and_Other_Tales and my own stuff.
Anonymous reviews: Why not?
BSN pm: Yeah & promise to answer
Published: Once got an article published on an obscure point of British Employment Law...
Favourite Story written: Nah.
Favourite book: Changes weekly.

Modifié par Maria13, 06 février 2012 - 04:12 .

[tklivory]

Just wanted to say that I've updated the front page post with all the new bios - thank you everyone!

I'd like to once again encourage people to PM those links for future article discussions!  I have a list of 2 right now, so I need more!

Also, if you want your name to be on the list of authors awaiting an opportunity to be concrittered, please make sure to PM me the request to be added to the list with your BSN name and the best way to contact you!  I'll generally be contacting the person the week before their story will actually be listed in case they need to 'pass' their week to someone else, or decide if they want to 'play'.  (details of the new concritter system on on the front page post!)

Also, if I missed your bio, let me know!

And, please please please concrit the sacrificial lambs!  You can either comment here, send them a BSN PM, or comment on their blod, but I encourage the concrittin' to commence!

@ Sarendoctrinator:  The bios are completely voluntary and for the ease of everyone finding other people's works.  It's no problem if you don't want to post one!

-----

Now, some actual writing discussion (gasp!):

As an Aspie, I have an inordinate fascination with words - their usage, their placement, their precise meaning.  I will frequently use words becuase they fit *exactly* what I want to say, even if, in retrospect, they aren't common usage or even very well known.  Sometimes this is good, as I can frequently reduce a phrase or even a sentence down to a word (like 'penultimate' instead of 'the one before the last').  Other times, this means I likely come off as a bit of a either a work dork or a snob (maybe? dunno).

This becomes exarcerbated in short story writing, especially when the word limit is pre-determined, as this means I get caught up in finding the 'perfect' word and end up using an obscure word because it is 'perfect' rather than because it is best for the reader.  This is especially true because I hate to repeat words in a story as well.  (My Asunder short story has a perfect example: to try to avoid the re-use of the word 'remember' I used 'anamnesis'.  Now, I love that word, and it meant exactly what I wanted to say, and I knew the word independent of a thesaurus and have actually used it in conversation.... BUT, in hindsight, I don't think it comes off as anything but a 'fancy thesaurus lookup' to the reader. )

Now, as for the 'description' thing: my initial reaction to that part of the article was dubious.  In general, I dislike writing that begins with dialogue alone.  I like to know 'who' i'm reading before I read the words.  Now, again, I am a word lover, so description is generally not a problem for me.  In fact, I grew up without a TV, so maybe I am far more inured to the written word and 'wordiness' than most people...  I have seen description get out of hand, certainly (especially in my own writing), and do acknowledge when description can be alienating to the reader...  But I tend to personally prefer verbosity and detail to sparsity and pure inference.

Anyway, in short & TL;DR version:
I think myself more as a writer's technician than a writer.  I loooove writing, but I approach writing more from a technical aspect than an organic one (with very few exceptions, like my Once Upon a Time series, although even some of *those* got more technical than perhaps they might have been - even though I wuv my Dog story to pieces in it, it is definitely a 'technical' piece of writing.)


(Sigh, wall o' text.  Sorry)

Modifié par tklivory, 06 février 2012 - 04:34 .

[tklivory]

Rinshikai wrote...

If I post my asunder entry, would anyone be willing to give me some feedback and suggestions on how to improve it. I have gotten some feedback, but I wouldn't  mind getting more.

If you want to submit your name to the 'active authors' list for our weekly concrit story, please PM me!  The front page post has some details about some of the stuff we're looking to implement in our writing community here.

[Rinshikai]

Name: BSN: Rinshikai , FF.net: Rinshikai
Location of works: Rinshikai at FF.net.
Anonymous reviews allowed: No
BSN PMs: Yes
Current ongoing project: Trust and Understanding
Favorite story I've written: None so more
Favorite story I've read: None at the moment

[Bethadots]

I want to join the list, but really the only fanfic I have so far is my story for the Asunder comp. Maybe I should hold off until I've got a bit more done.

Modifié par Bethadots, 06 février 2012 - 06:52 .

[wangxiuming]

Name: wangxiuming
Location of works: BSN Blog
Anonymous Reviews: Yes, but I don't think you'll be able to if I keep everything on the BSN.
BSN PMs: Yes
Current ongoing project: The Price of Blood (DA Fanfic), and a mishmash of untitled fantasy novels
Favorite story I've written: Blood of the Tranquil
Favorite story I've read: I love fantasy fiction and almost all of its sub-genres, though my current "must-read" series is probably George R.R. Martin's "A Song of Ice and Fire." I also enjoyed J.V.Jones' "The Book of Words" series from way back in the day.

Hello all =)

Modifié par wangxiuming, 06 février 2012 - 10:40 .

[Tryynity]

A huge thank you to the people who have responeded to my request and visited my Asunder entry to critique it. I really want to grow as a writer and I appreciate the time it takes to read and review things.

In all honesty I am only keen to respond to other people's requests who have taken the time to answer mine

My friends know how generous I am with reading and reviewing their work. I am only too happy to obligue, I even often do this without being asked because I believe in encouragement at the very least with all kinds of performance, as we are putting ourselves out there, and I do not expect return reviews that is not why I do it.

But it irks me quite honestly when people ask all the time and do not give - sorry just giving people the heads up if they want me to review their work.

I appreciate time is more available freely to me, I work from home and I am my own boss. But I do run a national company, and a household of 3 kids one of whom is severely disabled - I find reading and encouragement a pleasure mostly, its like a gift.

So thank you again to people who have commented on my blog or post reviews on my story.

I really do appreciate your time.

Again a huge welcome to our new ASUNDER people - I am hoping to read what you have submitted and hear what you have to say in discusssions.... the more the merrier.

Modifié par Tryynity, 07 février 2012 - 12:03 .

[Klidi]

I guess I'm missing something. I see this advice 'cut out adjectives and adverbs', 'use simple words', 'make the story flow easily' all the time. And I fail to see how is that 'creative writing'. Sure, there are times when I want to read a book like that, e.g. on the beach or in the places where it's difficult to concentrate. But in most cases, I want more than just easy flow with unexpected twist in the end. I want challenge. I want the story to make me stop and think. And I want beauty. In the story, it means language. I want it to be creative, fresh, innovative. And funny.

That is why I dislike generalizations in recommendations for writers (in fact, I dislike any kind of generalizations). Not all readers are the same: we like different styles, diffrent things, and have different reasons why we read or write. To push forward one style as 'the best' or 'correct', is anti-creative, imho. Just because the author of the book written in such style managed to get the book published and sold, doesn't mean it should be now copied by everyone.

Modifié par Klidi, 07 février 2012 - 02:15 .

[BevH]

Klidi wrote...

I guess I'm missing something. I see this advice 'cut out adjectives and adverbs', 'use simple words', 'make the story flow easily' all the time. And I fail to see how is that 'creative writing'. Sure, there are times when I want to read a book like that, e.g. on the beach or in the places where it's difficult to concentrate. But in most cases, I want more than just easy flow with unexpected twist in the end. I want challenge. I want the story to make me stop and think. And I want beauty. In the story, it means language. I want it to be creative, fresh, innovative. And funny.

That is why I dislike generalizations in recommendations for writers (in fact, I dislike any kind of generalizations). Not all readers are the same: we like different styles, diffrent things, and have different reasons why we read or write. To push forward one style as 'the best' or 'correct', is anti-creative, imho. Just because the author of the book written in such style managed to get the book published and sold, doesn't mean it should be now copied by everyone.

I could be wrong, and probably am, but I think this advice was intended for those writing short stories where the climax needs to be attained quickly. In this case, you'd need to "cut out adjectives and adverbs", "use simple words", and "make the story flow easily" so that you can get there quickly.