48 réponses à ce sujet

[JamieCOTC]

This may help.

Shepard had no choice but to work with Cerberus in ME2. But both ME2 and ME3 let you roleplay whether you agreed with that. - Casey Hudson

http://twitter.com/#...335404373377024

[jbblue05]

LPPrince wrote...

And Dr. Wayne confirmed it, if I recall correctly.

You do know Dr. Wayne and all the scientets were currently working with the Alliance before and after Akuze when Hackett gives you the mission

[Xeranx]

JamieCOTC wrote...

This may help.

Shepard had no choice but to work with Cerberus in ME2. But both ME2 and ME3 let you roleplay whether you agreed with that. - Casey Hudson

http://twitter.com/#...335404373377024

Tell Casey, LOTSB (Tela Vasir especially) say hi.

[Nashiktal]

JamieCOTC wrote...

This may help.

Shepard had no choice but to work with Cerberus in ME2. But both ME2 and ME3 let you roleplay whether you agreed with that. - Casey Hudson

http://twitter.com/#...335404373377024

IMO they didn't do a good job of telling us why we had to work with them. If we could have been shown why we had to work with cerberus instead of the *slap slap kiss* thing it might have worked.

I mean really why can't we call up anderson and talk to him? Even if the council and the citadel don't trust us why can't we try to work it out? They didn't have to write a whole alliance arc or anything, but showing us a clear and concise reason why we can't work with our old allies would have done wonders to make shep less derpy.

"ILL NEVER WORK WITH JUU!!!!" *tim says stuff and sounds suspicious the entire time* "lul k lets go but I dun like you."

[Gespenst]

Xeranx wrote...

Tell Casey, LOTSB (Tela Vasir especially) say hi.

Forget her, she's clearly insane and not just for trying to fight Shepard. She thinks that the way Shepard has been forced to make hard decisions that cost people's lives to save the galaxy (and to whatever extent compromise his/her integrity) is totally the same thing as being an enforcer for a gangster.

Sure, I'm working with Cerberus (an organisation that includes some of the most unpleasant, amoral people ever born)  to stop the greatest threat to the galaxy this side of ever but if they randomly told me to blow up a building full of innocent people I'd tell them where they could stick their bomb.

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Nashiktal wrote...

JamieCOTC wrote...

This may help.

Shepard had no choice but to work with Cerberus in ME2. But both ME2 and ME3 let you roleplay whether you agreed with that. - Casey Hudson

http://twitter.com/#...335404373377024

IMO they didn't do a good job of telling us why we had to work with them. If we could have been shown why we had to work with cerberus instead of the *slap slap kiss* thing it might have worked.

I mean really why can't we call up anderson and talk to him? Even if the council and the citadel don't trust us why can't we try to work it out? They didn't have to write a whole alliance arc or anything, but showing us a clear and concise reason why we can't work with our old allies would have done wonders to make shep less derpy.

"ILL NEVER WORK WITH JUU!!!!" *tim says stuff and sounds suspicious the entire time* "lul k lets go but I dun like you."

This, and I really think that a dialogue branch specific to Sole Survivors would have made the ordeal more believable for Shepards with that background.

Even if it just turned out to be a small tangential argument between Shepard and TIM.

[Seboist]

SS Shepard should be grateful to Cerberus, it's because of them s/he was able to become a Spectre despite accomplishing absolutely nothing unlike his/her ruthless and war hero incarnations.

Modifié par Seboist, 05 décembre 2011 - 09:34 .

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Seboist wrote...

SS Shepard should be grateful to Cerberus, it's because of them s/he was able to become a Spectre despite accomplishing absolutely nothing unlike his/her  ruthless and war hero incarnations.

Depends on how you play it. The way I see it, my main char, Reno Shepard, would have been assigned to the mission on Torfan, and thus would have gained the "Ruthless" reputation, if he hadn't already been assaulted and traumatized by the thresher maws on Akuze the year before.

It took Reno Shepard a while to recover from the incident on Akuze, so he never actually got a chance to fight on Torfan.

:D

Modifié par Mr. MannlyMan, 05 décembre 2011 - 09:46 .

[Andorfiend]

Gespenst wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

Tell Casey, LOTSB (Tela Vasir especially) say hi.

Forget her, she's clearly insane and not just for trying to fight Shepard. She thinks that the way Shepard has been forced to make hard decisions that cost people's lives to save the galaxy (and to whatever extent compromise his/her integrity) is totally the same thing as being an enforcer for a gangster.

Sure, I'm working with Cerberus (an organisation that includes some of the most unpleasant, amoral people ever born)  to stop the greatest threat to the galaxy this side of ever but if they randomly told me to blow up a building full of innocent people I'd tell them where they could stick their bomb.

I think the point (that I made earlier as well) is that during the conversation with Vasir there is no "Screw Cerberus, I'm just using them" dialogue option. And there really should be.

[Destroy Raiden_]

It was moronic that sole survivor shep couldn't say anything against TIM and bring up that little fact his unit got killed along with the fact he and Tombs are both scared for life because of it. Though I doubt TIM would bat an eye much less say sorry TIM's the sort to think breaking a few omelets is necessary he would let 99% of the galaxy die and call it collateral damage so long as he got what he wanted out of it. Who cares who or what stands in his way so long as he's on top the ends justified the means.

Basically I take BWs railroading as that I won't dress it up with, " My shep thought," or as " Fancy first name Shepard decided it was" it is what it is. Personally I waited the whole game to see if shep would be able to lob a nuke at TIM in the end but alas nothing all I got to do was lose that channel and take away a potential toy for TIM's garage.

Modifié par Destroy Raiden , 05 décembre 2011 - 10:03 .

[goofyomnivore]

I believe a better way of forcing us to work with Cerberus would of been letting Shepard quit, storm off or whatever after Freedom's Progress. Head to the Citadel and then be given the good ole "ah yes reapers", and then contacted again by Miranda about a proposal -- new Normandy, familiar faces(Joker/Chakwas), or heck even throw in the first part of her first convo(Cerberus goals, etc) to coerce Shepard.

[Destroy Raiden_]

StarcloudSWG wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

For my sole survivors, I just go with the ol' "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." Cerberus may be the reason Shep's life is f*cked up forever,

[citation needed]

You only know they experimented on Toombs and were part of some "classified (Alliance) project on Akuze". Whether or not they were actually repsonsible for the massacre is still up in the air.

classified military project on Akuze: "What are the effects of Thresher Maw poison on human beings? What attracts and repels Thresher Maws?"

Seriously, you didn't add two and two together to get four? Cerberus set up the project. They got a platoon of Marines to land near an area known to be inhabited by Thresher Maws. They used the Marines as bait to study Thresher Maw behavior, and what causes Thresher Maws to attack. They clearly did this without the Marines knowledge. And when it was over, they scooped up the one surviving Marine (Toombs) who was left behind and experimented on him.

This was all obvious in ME, if you paid attention to what was being said during that mission, even throwing out the more hysterical claims by Toombs. And then in ME 2, if the scientist survived, there's a news story about him *admitting* Cerberus was behind it.

Love is blind you won't convince him/her you know. Someone somewhere will call all that collateral damage aka acceptable losses, necessary, unavoidable, ect and talk about how much of a payoff in knowledge they got from said event. I'm sure Cerberus counts it as saving lives by offering those marines up to maws.

[goofyomnivore]

I'm sure Cerberus counts it as saving lives by offering those marines up to maws.

For what it is worth the Mako was created by what happened on Akuze. That alone has probably saved thousands of lives.

[HiroVoid]

Soul Survivor isn't entirely getting lucky. It's basically Grunt's loyalty mission except having to last longer and with more thresher maws.

[Gespenst]

Andorfiend wrote...

I think the point (that I made earlier as well) is that during the conversation with Vasir there is no "Screw Cerberus, I'm just using them" dialogue option. And there really should be.

Isn't one of the options along the lines of "I know what Cerberus is, and it doesn't matter. I've got a galaxy to save. And right now you're in my way."

[Annihilator27]

Seboist wrote...

SS Shepard should be grateful to Cerberus, it's because of them s/he was able to become a Spectre despite accomplishing absolutely nothing unlike his/her ruthless and war hero incarnations.

Maybe SS are more battle harderned or can concentrate better.They did you overcome physical torments and psychological stresses that would have broke most people I believe It said.....I am a SS.

[Dean_the_Young]

HiroVoid wrote...

Soul Survivor isn't entirely getting lucky. It's basically Grunt's loyalty mission except having to last longer and with more thresher maws.

And running away while a few other meatshields act as destruction.


No one's ever suggested Shepard beat them all on foot or anything.

[PauseforEffect]

Seboist wrote...

SS Shepard should be grateful to Cerberus, it's because of them s/he was able to become a Spectre despite accomplishing absolutely nothing unlike his/her ruthless and war hero incarnations.

If not that way, then through another way a sole-survivor Shepard would have distinguished themselves. Shepard holding a grudge against them would hardly be any different than from their other surviving "experiments" coming after Cerberus for revenge. If anything, Cerberus has Shepard to thank for cleaning up their SNAFU missions and for accomplishing what they apparently couldn't do by themselves.

[Ryzaki]

strive wrote...

I believe a better way of forcing us to work with Cerberus would of been letting Shepard quit, storm off or whatever after Freedom's Progress. Head to the Citadel and then be given the good ole "ah yes reapers", and then contacted again by Miranda about a proposal -- new Normandy, familiar faces(Joker/Chakwas), or heck even throw in the first part of her first convo(Cerberus goals, etc) to coerce Shepard.

This would've been awesome.

[Andorfiend]

Gespenst wrote...

Andorfiend wrote...

I think the point (that I made earlier as well) is that during the conversation with Vasir there is no "Screw Cerberus, I'm just using them" dialogue option. And there really should be.

Isn't one of the options along the lines of "I know what Cerberus is, and it doesn't matter. I've got a galaxy to save. And right now you're in my way."

Yes. But that's not the same as the normal repudiation. Why couldn't we save her anyway? A shot of medi-gel would mean one more Spectre in the galaxy, and holy crap are we going to need every one of them in ME 3.

[SkeletonMurderer]

I created Shepard as a colonist/sole survivor because heroism was not a choice they made, it was who they really were inside. They were an Action Survivor at heart.
Living through a colony raid certainly gave them alot of anger issues that the military helped them through, but after Akuze they could never be the same. It gave them the sort of distant-eyed hauntedness that had experienced both social evil and animalistic survival first-hand.
By all merits they should be insane or cynical and yet are neither because they could not be broken. Shepard is a hero because of the perserverance and the hope that comes from having watched the world burn. They see how thin the line is between good and evil, order and chaos, and fight because they must.

The Illusive Man is the complete antithesis of Shepard: he has chosen to be a monster. He's a person that has families enslaved or Marines butchered and justifies it to himself as "for the greater good" because he's a liar and a hypocrite. His megalomania is an all-consuming thing; it's taken everything from him right down to his own eyes. He's diluted himself, rewritten his history, because he does not have the inner-strength to rid himself of his ego and greed. His argument for Cerberus is that what is seen as evil when looked at objectively can be just as nebulous as good. This to him justifies the terrible decisions he knows in his heart are wrong.

If not for Cerberus, Shep would not be the soldier they are today (cos we totally live in the year 2185). My Shep's gonna thank TIM by the end of Mass Effect 2 for everything they gave him...

Shepard and The Illusive Man are diametrically opposed in every way.
Not only would these men never shake hands if anything they would be the bitterest of rivals.

Which is exactly why the entire plot of ME2 didn't make any sense.

Though a renegade Shep may have entertained working with Cerberus a paragon Shep, let alone a sole survivor, would have opposed them outright. Bioware certainly railroaded the player into the long game of taking apart Cerberus from the inside, but a just as effective option would be to fire Miranda out the airlock and steal the new Normandy for the Alliance.

Modifié par SkeletonMurderer, 14 septembre 2013 - 05:45 .

[Br3admax]

Arise, thread, arise.