440 réponses à ce sujet

[CrutchCricket]

Ryzaki wrote...
Then she shouldn't have handed the body over.

Really though this is from my RP that Shep is not comfortable in the Lazarus body because it is *not* the same and he has doubts as to how human he really is anymore.

Yes it is her fault. (and we will do this back and forth all day so we should probably agree to disagree).

I don't agree to that:P

[Skullheart]

Let's see... why I'm not a Liara fan
- Character assassination. She isn't the same persona in ME and ME2 (she started being ooc in Redemption).
- Forced close friendship.
- Ninjamance.

I didn't have any problem with Liara before ME2. It just too damn pandering to her, and imo she started to be some kind of Mary Sue.

And a reason for her to not being in the squad: she is the Shadow Broker. In this days we don't see any intelligence officer in the field. She is too worthy to have her shooting in the battlefield.I rather to have Feron in the squad instead of Liara, he could be the eyes on the field for Liara.

Modifié par Skullheart, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:22 .

[rapscallioness]

Ryzaki wrote...

Jeanne22 wrote...
Because there is no ingame reason for Shepard to hate Liara or Garrus (Shepard doesn't care about plot-armor, DLCs or obnoxious fanbases).

Really? You don't think Shepard could be bitter about be restored back to life via Lazarus project and having his BF/Lover hating him because Liara couldn't be bothered to share intel? Really? 

Garrus yeah sure I can get behind Garrus but Shep has plenty of reason to dislike Liara.

Not to mention you don't have to hate someone not to want to be friends with them.

alex90c wrote...

You can be a bit mean to Liara at the end of LotSB when she asks to go up to the Normandy some time.

When I saw it on youtube I cringed because it just looked so harsh, but you can do it yourself if you want.

I
really didn't see that as being mean though. Just professional. It's a
bit sad though I lose out on my Shep's dogtags but I was thankful for
the option to avoid her. But considering I had to go through the whole buddy buddy act the whole DLC it was too little too late.

Dogtags: see, I never understood why Liara waited to give Shep the tags. She took them with her when she left. Was it BW reward for asking her up to the Normandy? But it's still weird because they make it a point to show Liara taking Shep's tags w/ her...or something important judging by the close camera angle.

Was even she not sure you were Really Shepard?

And the options to respond to the lazarus project news are weak. They are. I mean, Liara drops this bomb on Shep. She gave the dead body....the riddled corpse..to Cerberus for them to ..touch and manipulate as they will.  And I get 2 dialogue options. On the one hand my Shep is happy to be alive, but wth? I picked the top, I think, and I get this "you did the right thing...my misssion is to important..blah, blah.." Ugh. It was awful.

I just feel like that particular dialogue round and plot point should have gotten way more dialogue paths.

As far as having mostly original crew as primary squaddies, it seems only fitting. We started this together. We were the team that first broke the story that the end was nigh. We should end it together.

Mind you, I love my ME2 cast. I really do. I would have loved to see them play bigger on screen roles. We'll see, I guess. I also thought it would have been interesting to see the reactions from Liara and VS as they really start meeting and getting to know those guys.

The ME2 cast is an acquired taste

[MisterJB]

Someone With Mass wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

she's the shadow broker she doesn't need to be fighting on the ground when she can be pulling strings to have every situation go in Shepard's favor to the best of her SB abilities.

She does in ME3.

Why? 

The problem starts with a C.

Contrived storytelling.

Modifié par MisterJB, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:16 .

[feliciano2040]

Liara's presence is rationalized into the game, as it is with many characters.

Not saying she is a bad character or anything, absolutely not, I think she's fantastic.

But it leads me (again) to thinking of where Bioware drops the ball and at the same time pretending it never fell of their hands. No Bioware, we were not dying to see Ashley, Kaidan, Garrus, Tali or Liara in ME 3, and we are not going to be in awe about it, specially when all of those are easily re-introduceable into the main story.

Modifié par feliciano2040, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:18 .

[Ryzaki]

CrutchCricket wrote...
I don't agree to that:P

[CrutchCricket]

MisterJB wrote...
Contrived storytelling.

Fiction=contrived storytelling.

[Drone223]

Skullheart wrote...


And a reason for her to not being in the squad: she is the Shadow Broker. In this days we don't see any intelligence officer in the field. She is to worthy to have her shooting in the battlefield.I rather to have Feron in the squad instead of Liara, he could be the eyes on the field for Liara.

I bolded the part I agree, I think is a good (but not great) character but she is more usefull on the SB base sending intell to the Normandy, and Feron can serve as her agent on the field, even if Liara joins Shepard it has to be for a good reason, Just becuase she wants to be with Shepard is not good enough imo 

[Gespenst]

CrutchCricket wrote...

Also this entire story was contrived for the purpose of making money.

The story was contrived for the purpose of making a story!

Storyception?

DJRackham wrote...

No, the Shadow Broker arc was created in order to funnel money from player's pockets into EA/Bioware's coffers.

I am assuming control of this cash.

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Having also read the leaked script, I can think of one extremely good reason not to have Legion. And yes, from my point of view, the ME3 squad makes perfect sense.

Aww, they've not screwed Legion over have they?

On second thoughts don't tell me.

Ryzaki wrote...

I mean for the love of christ I spent most of ME1 insulting and belittling her then in ME2 "OMG LIARA! *HUGS*"

Well that sounds like a great big case of not-our-problem. So good luck with being needlessly cruel to your teammates. 

CrutchCricket wrote...

The Council's blind and wouldn't know their shatterpoint if it smacked them in the face. Also none of  these examples carry the emotional attachment I mentioned. Finally careful with spoilers I don't know who Kai Leng is (nor do I really care to know until March).

I think he's a character from a tie-in novel. A Cerberus operative of some sort.

HiroVoid wrote...

I think going from unsocial archaeologist to skilled information broker was a bit contrived and really differed from her original goals in ME1.

Two years is a long time in espionage. Like Liara says, the main difference between spying and archaeology is that the bodies still smell.

hhh89 wrote...

A xenophobic Shepard could hate Liara or Garrus. Or simply a Shepard that doesn't like their personality.

My heart bleeds for such terrible people.

Jeanne22 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Really? You don't think Shepard could be bitter about be restored back to life via  Lazarus project and having his BF/Lover hating him because Liara couldn't be bothered to share intel? Really?

No. Your Shepard doesn't like being alive anymore? Shoot yourself - problem solved.

Airlock's over there.

Modifié par Gespenst, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:23 .

[Ryzaki]

Oh yes the great "You don't play the way I do so clearly your way of playing shouldn't be supported."

Sad.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:23 .

[Someone With Mass]

MisterJB wrote...

Contrived storytelling.

Nope.

By the way, if Liara's precense in ME3 is contrived, then so is Cerberus'.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:26 .

[The Elder King]

Gespenst wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

A xenophobic Shepard could hate Liara or Garrus. Or simply a Shepard that doesn't like their personality.

My heart bleeds for such terrible people.

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

[Ryzaki]

rapscallioness wrote...

Dogtags: see, I never understood why Liara waited to give Shep the tags. She took them with her when she left. Was it BW reward for asking her up to the Normandy? But it's still weird because they make it a point to show Liara taking Shep's tags w/ her...or something important judging by the close camera angle.

Was even she not sure you were Really Shepard?

And the options to respond to the lazarus project news are weak. They are. I mean, Liara drops this bomb on Shep. She gave the dead body....the riddled corpse..to Cerberus for them to ..touch and manipulate as they will.  And I get 2 dialogue options. On the one hand my Shep is happy to be alive, but wth? I picked the top, I think, and I get this "you did the right thing...my misssion is to important..blah, blah.." Ugh. It was awful.

I just feel like that particular dialogue round and plot point should have gotten way more dialogue paths.

As far as having mostly original crew as primary squaddies, it seems only fitting. We started this together. We were the team that first broke the story that the end was nigh. We should end it together.

Mind you, I love my ME2 cast. I really do. I would have loved to see them play bigger on screen roles. We'll see, I guess. I also thought it would have been interesting to see the reactions from Liara and VS as they really start meeting and getting to know those guys.

The ME2 cast is an acquired taste

Didn't she say Hackett gave them to her? (which makes even less sense. If he gave them to anyone shouldn't it have been Anderson?).

And yes that's my issue. Something that should've been a deep conversation reduced to "oh well. Thanks!" or "I'm mad but let's move on after I act chastised like a child." bleh.

I really just wish most squaddies were optional. Especially those who aren't assigned to the ship. Why wouldn't my Shep be able to ask Liara to stay with Feron on the sidelines out of the major blast zone? Bleh.

[MisterJB]

Someone With Mass wrote...
Nope.

Yep.

By the way, if Liara's precense in ME3 is contrived, then so is Cerberus'.

Yes, it is. By the end of "Retribution", Cerberus had been dealt a major blow. Now, suddenly, they have this gigantic army.
It is contrived.

[Someone With Mass]

hhh89 wrote...

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

Don't have to hate the ones you barely know either.

Unless you're a raging racist, in which case, I won't bother sympathize.

[Barquiel]

The writers have planned Liara's story arc before Mass Effect 2 was even released (the sidelining in ME2 to avoid the suicide mission, the redemption comic, the DLC files on the ME2 disc) -> No, Liara's presence in ME3 is not contrived.

[MisterJB]

Trinity66 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...
Problem? I'm hearing you can tell her off in ME3. Where's the problem?

In ME1 you can threaten to throw Liara into a volcano if she is not useful.
In ME2, the first thing Shepard does when he sees her is hug her. And you can't choose not to.
That's a problem.

Poor thing, and Miranda covered half of my screen with her ass and I didn't ask her to do so.

Yes, but unlike with Liara, the game didn't try to tell you how your Shepard feels towards Miranda.

[Gespenst]

hhh89 wrote...

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

Turians didn't attack Mindoir. Asari didn't attack Mindoir.

Ryzaki wrote...

Oh yes the great "You don't play the way I do so clearly your way of playing shouldn't be supported."

Sad.

Ok then try...

Everyone from Shepard's previous life hates her and has to a greater or lesser extent chewed her out for trying to save inteligent life as we know it. Including the VS ten minutes ago. She'd take a hug from anyone at this point.

If that's not good enough for you... well we're back to not-my-problem.

Ryzaki wrote...

Didn't she say Hackett gave them to  her? (which makes even less sense. If he gave them to anyone shouldn't  it have been Anderson?).

I don't think so. She just said "It took some digging but I found them" basically.

Modifié par Gespenst, 05 décembre 2011 - 10:37 .

[The Elder King]

Someone With Mass wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

Don't have to hate the ones you barely know either.

Unless you're a raging racist, in which case, I won't bother sympathize.

Agreed. I wasn't talking about myself though. One of the things I like of ME is some of the alien species (Krogans on top of the rest).

[Melra]

Someone With Mass wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

Don't have to hate the ones you barely know either.

Unless you're a raging racist, in which case, I won't bother sympathize.

Lul. People don't hang around here for your sympathies, for mine, maybe. Being nice to all characters is incredibly boring way to go, nobody likes everyone. If they couldn't please everyone by having the characters that each player would like to see in the game in a role that would please everyone, then they should've just made whole new characters and reduced all old characters into tiny cameos.

[The Elder King]

Gespenst wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

Well, Shepard could be traumatized by the event of Mindoir, and decided to hate all the aliens. Or he simply hates them. You don't have to love aliens.

Turians didn't attack Mindoir. Asari didn't attack Mindoir.

Shepard could be traumatized. He wasn't an adult if I remember well. Btw, there are racist even among the other species (the Asari on Illium in Shiala's mission among others). I don't understan why someone couldn't create a racist Shepard.

[rapscallioness]

Ryzaki wrote...


Didn't she say Hackett gave them to her? (which makes even less sense. If he gave them to anyone shouldn't it have been Anderson?).

And yes that's my issue. Something that should've been a deep conversation reduced to "oh well. Thanks!" or "I'm mad but let's move on after I act chastised like a child." bleh.

I really just wish most squaddies were optional. Especially those who aren't assigned to the ship. Why wouldn't my Shep be able to ask Liara to stay with Feron on the sidelines out of the major blast zone? Bleh.

Yeah, she did say Hackett gave them to her. But they were on her desk the whole time at the beginning of lotsb. When Shep gives Liara the SB intel, she leaves while grabbing them to take with her. Not even mentioning them to Shep. That seems odd to me.

Also odd that Hackett would actually give them to Liara. That makes no sense. Anderson would be the appropriate choice. (unless it's some kind of canon LI glitch...maybe)

But wait..wait....how would Hackett have gotten the tags? Wasn't Shep wearing them we s/he went down? And at that time the Alliance didn't go after Shepard's body.....cuz....of something I forgot.  And sense there was a Normandy Crash Site quest and collection of dog tags, the Alliance didn't go search and retrieve later either.

So, what could that mean? Either Liara's not telling the truth, but why would she lie about that..now? She just could've said yeah, I took your dog tags when I transporting your corpse around.

Or Hackett got the tags from SB, or Cerberus.  Implications potentially unpleasant.

[Ryzaki]

Gespenst wrote...

Ok then try...

Everyone from Shepard's previous life hates her and has to a greater or lesser extent chewed her out for trying to save inteligent life as we know it. Including the VS ten minutes ago. She'd take a hug from anyone at this point.

Now we're at the "my shep feels X so your Shep feels X."

How about no.

If that's not good enough for you... well we're back to not-my-problem.

Cute. And yes we're right back at the "you're way of playing is not like mine so it shouldn't be supported." 

I don't think so. She just said "It took some digging but I found them" basically.

Ah okay.

So she got them off Shep's corpse? And decided not to give them to him/her when she first saw him/her. How nice.

[MisterJB]

CrutchCricket wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
Contrived storytelling.

Fiction=contrived storytelling.

True but there are ways of making that storytelling convicing, logical ways for the story to play out and for the characters to develop.
And then there is Liara T'soni's journey.