129 réponses à ce sujet

[Ravensword]

GMagnum wrote...

wel we had lot of practic heehee tbh

i c wut u mean dawg practice makes perfect tbh

[knightnblu]

iakus wrote...

knightnblu wrote...

There has been a lot of discussion about how Shepard should handle the situation in ME3. So I decided to weigh in on the issue with this: Shepard should be a warrior. He should be so shot in the ass with confidence that he inspires those around him to join the fight. He should attack, attack, attack. He should find any and every weakness and begin to tear and if he can't find any weaknesses he should start making them at every opportunity. He should toss out the rules of war because what he will be called to do will not be civilized, but barbaric and vicious in the extreme.
 
He should be death's special emissary to the galaxy and his mission is to send all of the Reapers to death's embrace because their end is long overdue. His mission is not to preserve the citizenry because that time has now past. It is time to end the threat once and for all by whatever means necessary and God help anyone who gets in his way be they friend, lover, or foe.
 
Man's greatest gift is the ability to destroy and to conquer. We have honed those aspects of humanity for thousands of years freely spilling the blood of our fellows. It's high time we employ those skills to their maximum effect and allow the resulting rivers of blood to run under our feet and if it is to be our end, let the Reapers quake when they recall their victory over us because of the terrible cost of that victory. Let us show them the great error of their ways illustrated in their dearest blood.
 
That should be Shepard's attitude and mindset in ME3.

Call me overly paragon, but I think Shepard's goal and mindset should be about preservation.  Saving whoever he can.  Doing that will mean stopping the Reapers, of course, and he should pull out all the stops to accomplish that.  

Basically Shepard needs something to fight for as well as to fight against.  A cause, a group, a person.  More than simple survival.  Shep needs something to cling to when things get grim.  And things will get grim.  It's not enough to simply kill.  He also needs to save.  With too bloodthirsty a mentality, Shepard may prove as destructive to the galaxy as the Reapers.

http://www.youtube.c...ch?v=4hOArZSg3cI


As Lorien in Babylon 5 put it "It's easy to find something worth dying for.  Do you have anything worth living for?"

I believe that the time for saving people has past. ME1 and 2 was about saving people and providing time to prepare. The Council and the Alliance wasted those chances and as a result spilled the blood of untold millions. It is far too late to concentrate on that now. The Reapers do not seek to conquer nor do they seek to dominate. They seek to exterminate all sentient life in the galaxy. The war we are presented with in ME3 is a war for survival and losing means death.
 
There will be no negotiation, no diplomacy, and no second chances. Each and every race is all in and we are fighting an experienced enemy that has gone through this process about 570+ times already. Think about that for a moment. More than 570 times the galaxy has been wiped clean of life. That is untold trillions of lives lost in a cyclical pattern that has been going on for at least 37 million years and possibly longer.
 
In order to survive against those odds you must have the mind of a hunter and your prey is your enemy. He will give no quarter and he absolutely will not stop until you are consumed. The galaxy is truly pitted against an implacable foe who will not rest, does not tire, possesses no mercy or compassion, will never accept your surrender, and will use whatever means necessary to accomplish their goals.
 
If you fight this enemy as a gentleman or in a civilized manner the Reapers will eat you alive. Man has made this mistake many times in the past and it has cost those who made it dearly. Expect worse from the Reapers.
 
I expect that we will be making decisions about which world burns and which is saved and those decisions will have nothing to do with who is more innocent or pure. Those decisions must be made based on who can do more to aid in the fight against the impending doom of all. The sacrifices we make will involve the lives of men, women, and children and may possibly consign entire races to their doom. We may even be called upon to sacrifice Earth itself.
 
If we do not transition from hero to General, we may lose the war of survival due to too soft a heart. In ME1 and ME2 we could afford to be the hero, but in ME3 we can no longer afford to expend effort saving those who are beyond hope or who cannot or will not assist. We are going to have to triage and save those who can help us win or we all die. It is just that simple.
 
For two and a half years the Council and the Alliance knew this was coming, but they ignored it. They did not fast track new warships, they did not increase recruiting efforts to bolster the armed forces, they did not warn the public that this was coming, they did not develop new or improved weapons technologies aside from the Turians and the Thanix cannon. They did not develop strategies and tactics to deal with this threat. They just sat on their asses and hummed until it was too late. We warned them. Told them what was coming and they didn't believe us. Now the innocent will have to pay the price for their stupidity because there is nothing more that we can do. As for something to fight for, that's the right to keep on breathing.
 
As a personal aside, good to see you again my friend :-)

[XEdge]

Shep's mindset should be......

I'm tired of these ****** ******* Reapers in my ****** ******* galaxy!!!!

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Garrus: Incoming Cerberus pukes.

Shepard: MAIM KILL BURN!!!! MAIM KILL BURN!!!! *charges off to the fight*

Garrus:...It might not have been a good idea to let him near those movies...

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

knightnblu wrote...

iakus wrote...

knightnblu wrote...

There has been a lot of discussion about how Shepard should handle the situation in ME3. So I decided to weigh in on the issue with this: Shepard should be a warrior. He should be so shot in the ass with confidence that he inspires those around him to join the fight. He should attack, attack, attack. He should find any and every weakness and begin to tear and if he can't find any weaknesses he should start making them at every opportunity. He should toss out the rules of war because what he will be called to do will not be civilized, but barbaric and vicious in the extreme.
 
He should be death's special emissary to the galaxy and his mission is to send all of the Reapers to death's embrace because their end is long overdue. His mission is not to preserve the citizenry because that time has now past. It is time to end the threat once and for all by whatever means necessary and God help anyone who gets in his way be they friend, lover, or foe.
 
Man's greatest gift is the ability to destroy and to conquer. We have honed those aspects of humanity for thousands of years freely spilling the blood of our fellows. It's high time we employ those skills to their maximum effect and allow the resulting rivers of blood to run under our feet and if it is to be our end, let the Reapers quake when they recall their victory over us because of the terrible cost of that victory. Let us show them the great error of their ways illustrated in their dearest blood.
 
That should be Shepard's attitude and mindset in ME3.

Call me overly paragon, but I think Shepard's goal and mindset should be about preservation.  Saving whoever he can.  Doing that will mean stopping the Reapers, of course, and he should pull out all the stops to accomplish that.  

Basically Shepard needs something to fight for as well as to fight against.  A cause, a group, a person.  More than simple survival.  Shep needs something to cling to when things get grim.  And things will get grim.  It's not enough to simply kill.  He also needs to save.  With too bloodthirsty a mentality, Shepard may prove as destructive to the galaxy as the Reapers.

http://www.youtube.c...ch?v=4hOArZSg3cI


As Lorien in Babylon 5 put it "It's easy to find something worth dying for.  Do you have anything worth living for?"

I believe that the time for saving people has past. ME1 and 2 was about saving people and providing time to prepare. The Council and the Alliance wasted those chances and as a result spilled the blood of untold millions. It is far too late to concentrate on that now. The Reapers do not seek to conquer nor do they seek to dominate. They seek to exterminate all sentient life in the galaxy. The war we are presented with in ME3 is a war for survival and losing means death.
 
There will be no negotiation, no diplomacy, and no second chances. Each and every race is all in and we are fighting an experienced enemy that has gone through this process about 570+ times already. Think about that for a moment. More than 570 times the galaxy has been wiped clean of life. That is untold trillions of lives lost in a cyclical pattern that has been going on for at least 37 million years and possibly longer.
 
In order to survive against those odds you must have the mind of a hunter and your prey is your enemy. He will give no quarter and he absolutely will not stop until you are consumed. The galaxy is truly pitted against an implacable foe who will not rest, does not tire, possesses no mercy or compassion, will never accept your surrender, and will use whatever means necessary to accomplish their goals.
 
If you fight this enemy as a gentleman or in a civilized manner the Reapers will eat you alive. Man has made this mistake many times in the past and it has cost those who made it dearly. Expect worse from the Reapers.
 
I expect that we will be making decisions about which world burns and which is saved and those decisions will have nothing to do with who is more innocent or pure. Those decisions must be made based on who can do more to aid in the fight against the impending doom of all. The sacrifices we make will involve the lives of men, women, and children and may possibly consign entire races to their doom. We may even be called upon to sacrifice Earth itself.
 
If we do not transition from hero to General, we may lose the war of survival due to too soft a heart. In ME1 and ME2 we could afford to be the hero, but in ME3 we can no longer afford to expend effort saving those who are beyond hope or who cannot or will not assist. We are going to have to triage and save those who can help us win or we all die. It is just that simple.
 
For two and a half years the Council and the Alliance knew this was coming, but they ignored it. They did not fast track new warships, they did not increase recruiting efforts to bolster the armed forces, they did not warn the public that this was coming, they did not develop new or improved weapons technologies aside from the Turians and the Thanix cannon. They did not develop strategies and tactics to deal with this threat. They just sat on their asses and hummed until it was too late. We warned them. Told them what was coming and they didn't believe us. Now the innocent will have to pay the price for their stupidity because there is nothing more that we can do. As for something to fight for, that's the right to keep on breathing.
 
As a personal aside, good to see you again my friend :-)

...This is your brain on Chaos.

[ForteSJGR]

I'll sacrifice Earth if it means everyone else can live...

[Ravensword]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

knightnblu wrote...

I believe that the time for saving people has past.

I have to say, this makes me facepalm.

I think he's talking about using everyone else's blood to fuel a spell that will stop the reapers once and for all.

Modifié par Ravensword, 09 décembre 2011 - 05:12 .

[Iakus]

knightnblu wrote...

I believe that the time for saving people has past. ME1 and 2 was about saving people and providing time to prepare. The Council and the Alliance wasted those chances and as a result spilled the blood of untold millions. It is far too late to concentrate on that now. The Reapers do not seek to conquer nor do they seek to dominate. They seek to exterminate all sentient life in the galaxy. The war we are presented with in ME3 is a war for survival and losing means death.
 
There will be no negotiation, no diplomacy, and no second chances. Each and every race is all in and we are fighting an experienced enemy that has gone through this process about 570+ times already. Think about that for a moment. More than 570 times the galaxy has been wiped clean of life. That is untold trillions of lives lost in a cyclical pattern that has been going on for at least 37 million years and possibly longer.
 
In order to survive against those odds you must have the mind of a hunter and your prey is your enemy. He will give no quarter and he absolutely will not stop until you are consumed. The galaxy is truly pitted against an implacable foe who will not rest, does not tire, possesses no mercy or compassion, will never accept your surrender, and will use whatever means necessary to accomplish their goals.

Now is absolutely the time to save people.  Because the goal of the Reapers is to kille everyone.  Or turn them into smoothie.  The Council and the Alliance were fools to not listen to Shepard, so now Shep has to do their job for them.  Making his job doubly hard.

As such, every planet saved is a Reaper offensive thwarted.  Every colony protected is a Reaper offensive turned back.  Protecting the  people of the galaxy means stopping the Reapers.  Stopping the Reapers means protecting the people of the galaxy,   Shep must never forget that the two are inextricably entwined.

 

If you fight this enemy as a gentleman or in a civilized manner the Reapers will eat you alive. Man has made this mistake many times in the past and it has cost those who made it dearly. Expect worse from the Reapers.
 
I expect that we will be making decisions about which world burns and which is saved and those decisions will have nothing to do with who is more innocent or pure. Those decisions must be made based on who can do more to aid in the fight against the impending doom of all. The sacrifices we make will involve the lives of men, women, and children and may possibly consign entire races to their doom. We may even be called upon to sacrifice Earth itself.

Such decisions may have to be made.  But it shouldn't be forgotten that these are in fact sacrifices, and should not be done unless there is absolutely no alternative.  Like Shepard sacrificing the 300k batarians in the Bahak system.   It was what had to be done.  But it's not an act to be taken lightly,  It is a choice of absolute neccessity, not of convenience.

"Nothing except a battle lost can be half so melancholy as a battle
won.'  Arthur Wellsley 1st Duke of Wellington
 

If we do not transition from hero to General, we may lose the war of survival due to too soft a heart. In ME1 and ME2 we could afford to be the hero, but in ME3 we can no longer afford to expend effort saving those who are beyond hope or who cannot or will not assist. We are going to have to triage and save those who can help us win or we all die. It is just that simple.

If that's what it takes to save the galaxy, there was no need to bring Shepard back.  Humanity already had such a champion.

 He goes by The Illusive Man
 
 

As a personal aside, good to see you again my friend :-)

Yup. My Shepard's fighting for Ash 

[knightnblu]

The problem with that way of thinking is as soon as the Reapers figure out you will try to save everyone, they will broaden their attacks thereby endangering more lives. This will most certainly be done to thin the opposing forces and to divide Shepard's mind by keeping him from focusing on his main objective.

The offensive capability of Shepard's forces will most certainly be reduced by such an action and therefore his chances of survival, and the galaxy's, will dwindle. Each and every encounter with a Reaper will weaken the opposing forces because even if you come out on top the victory will cost you dearly. Do that enough times and your offensive capability is destroyed. From this we can deduce that the Reapers will most certainly engage at every opportunity. As the war is widespread when Shepard departs Earth, he is already at an extreme disadvantage from a tactical and strategic perspective and that's not even mentioning that all he has at his disposal is a single ship.

If it comes down to saving a planet full of children or a battle ready fleet its sorry kids, but I need that fleet. If you read "Night" or "Man's Search for Meaning" it becomes readily apparent that survival changes the rules. What a man would do under ordinary circumstances is completely different if his very survival hangs in the balance. I doubt that aliens would be much different.

Additionally, when one considers the mass hysteria and panic of the civilian populations and the uncounted refugees going here there and yonder and stealing whatever they can get their hands on in order to survive, I guarantee you that your supply lines will be hell to maintain. Add in to that soldiers on duty who are worried about their families back home and not having any means of contacting them will lead to mass desertions from standing forces. In other words, the galaxy will find itself in chaos relatively quickly with standing governments on the verge of collapse.

As for TIM, he didn't get those eyes because he likes blueberry pie. First, there is no way to know for certain that he was not a puppet of the Reapers. Second, his attitude has absolutely no regard for anyone who isn't human. Going solo on this will not save you. The galaxy must stand united before this foe in order for anyone to survive. That is why we can no longer be sentimental.

We are going to have to do some ugly things in order to preserve what we can and we are going to take a massive beating just to survive. Hundreds of other Reaper victim races have fought with everything they had and perished in the attempt. History favors our enemy and the Reapers have one hell of a record. We have to find weaknesses and vulnerabilities, we have to formulate a strategy to beat them, and we have to gather our forces to oppose. That all takes time and it is time that we do not have because of indoctrination and the progress of the Reapers.

The first thing you do when you find yourself on the floor in a knife fight is to get up. Otherwise, you will die on that floor. ME3 is going to be a knife fight.

[Iakus]

Indeed, many other races fought and lost to the Reapers. Facing them strength for strength, feeding people into the meat grinder is simply not going to work. It takes multiple fleets to bring down just one Reaper. There are many, many Reapers out there.

Every victory will be dear. Every victory will be costly If Shepard goes in fighting like this is a standard war, or even a total war, he will lose. The Reapers are more akin to a force of nature: Vastly powerful, literally older than dirt, remorseless as no human enemy can hope to be. Defeating them may not even be an option. Surviving them, however, is a necessity. Shepard needs to find an exploitable weakness that levels the playing field.

I'm not so naive as to think Shepard will be able to save everybody. But he should make every effort to save as many as he can. The Reapers' goal is to kill. Shepard's goal should be to deny them that. If even one colony gets missed by the Reapers, then they haven't won. Look at what a dozen Prothean scientists managed to accomplish.

As for TIM: He has little regard even for other humans. Corporal Toombs and David Archer say "hi" So does the population of Horizon. Taken too far, that's what Shepard can become. Experimenting on humans and throwing thousands of lives away on "calculated risks" He doesn't even deny wanting to build his own Reaper when challenged about why he wants to keep the base. That's where tossing out the rules can lead. Or, as Mordin puts it "hard to see big picture over pile of corpses"

[FlyinElk212]

Merchant2006 wrote...

My Shepards mindset will be on TAPPIN AS MUCH BLUE BUTT AS I CANNNNNNNNNNNNNN WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Liara- Commander!! What's our plan of action????
Shepard- ..............super-orgy.

[Ozzelll]

So... that's your opinion. If you didn't notice, mass effect is a choice based game. There are different mindsets -- paragon, renegade and in-between.

I get kinda disgusted of texts like the OP. Not that it's renegade, but that you push your opinions on others without even recongnicing that it's not the only valid opinion.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

How does one win a war against a foe with far superior technology and power?

Shepard, remember, is only a Commander and a Spectre, not an Admiral, not a military leader. Shepard's job is go from being an annoyance, to being a real pain in the arse to the Reapers. His/her job is going to be: 1) making sure alliances are intact; 2) keeping the Reapers focused on Shepard. Basically (s)he'll probably get a field promotion to Captain and command a small squadron of N2 class ships, and hit and run. Guerrilla warfare in space. Who knows, maybe they'll have the tech ready to take down a smaller Reaper between a few ships with focused fire.

Saving worlds? That's going to be up to the higher ups. I don't think making a decision to save Thessia or the Turian homeworld is going to be up to Shepard. Shepard may get ordered to aid in that. How Shepard aids is going to up to you.

Making decisions like in Arrival? Shepard may have to make a couple calls like that. There are going to be casualties and a lot of them.

[Iakus]

Ozzelll wrote...

So... that's your opinion. If you didn't notice, mass effect is a choice based game. There are different mindsets -- paragon, renegade and in-between.

I get kinda disgusted of texts like the OP. Not that it's renegade, but that you push your opinions on others without even recongnicing that it's not the only valid opinion.

It is indeed his opinion, and I respect that.

Anyone else who wants to play Shepard a different way is welcome to.  And to explain why they made those choices.

[knightnblu]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

How does one win a war against a foe with far superior technology and power?

Shepard, remember, is only a Commander and a Spectre, not an Admiral, not a military leader. Shepard's job is go from being an annoyance, to being a real pain in the arse to the Reapers. His/her job is going to be: 1) making sure alliances are intact; 2) keeping the Reapers focused on Shepard. Basically (s)he'll probably get a field promotion to Captain and command a small squadron of N2 class ships, and hit and run. Guerrilla warfare in space. Who knows, maybe they'll have the tech ready to take down a smaller Reaper between a few ships with focused fire.

Saving worlds? That's going to be up to the higher ups. I don't think making a decision to save Thessia or the Turian homeworld is going to be up to Shepard. Shepard may get ordered to aid in that. How Shepard aids is going to up to you.

Making decisions like in Arrival? Shepard may have to make a couple calls like that. There are going to be casualties and a lot of them.

Actually, Shepard is a Commander in the Alliance and while not a flag officer he is never the less a command level officer. As far as I am aware the Alliance fleet is in pieces over Earth. What few ships are left are likely scattered and in no position to counter. Further, it would appear that attacks are occurring on multiple worlds and involve multiple governments judging by the husks encountered on Earth when the Reapers arrived. This would mean that the militaries of the Council species are hard pressed, if not in the same condition as the Alliance fleet. It is likely that unaligned species and the Quarians possess the only remaining forces in sufficient quantity to pack a decent punch.
 
With the military situation being what it is and the Council governments in disarray, that essentially leaves Shepard as a de facto Admiral/General/diplomat. Whether BioWare will agree remains to be seen. As far as fighting a guerilla war, if the galaxy relies on that we are doomed. Hit and run tactics will not insure survival. They may however, buy some time to put together a force that can effectively deliver a counter blow to the Reapers.
 
If the Arrival DLC had a meaning, it was that we are going to have to operate on both the tactical and strategic level as we did with the assault on the Collector base. Choosing both objectives, team members, and targets in order to carry out our mission objectives. At least that is the way that I see it and I honestly have no idea what BioWare has cooked up for ME3. But it would seem to have been leading up to this scenario.

[knightnblu]

iakus wrote " Or, as Mordin puts it "hard to see big picture over pile of corpses""

Or in the case of the Reapers, planets of corpses.

[Another_Golden_Dragon]

Win. Or Die. There can be no other options.

[FFinfinity1]

THE REAPERS ARE KILLING THEM...AND THEN THEIR GOING TO KILL ME...OH MY GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD

[CARL_DF90]

Heh. In any case, this will be a war of both survival and sacrifice. Some MUST be sacrificed if all are to be saved. Period.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

knightnblu wrote...
 As far as fighting a guerilla war ... may buy time to put together a force that can effectively deliver a counter blow to the Reapers.
 

That is the point. This time is different than the others. During every single previous reaping the Citadel was hit first and the relays were shut off for everyone except those with a Reaper IFF. That threw the entire galactic governments in total disarray. This time that didn't happen. They've had two years to prepare, and I hardly think that they've been sitting on their hands, no matter what the Turian councilor said. I think that's for show and it's not mentioned to Shepard because of the Cerberus association. The situation is still dire.

The reaping of a galaxy took decades the last time. Then the Reapers hung around for a couple hundred years. Saving worlds saves replacement personnel and workforces to build replacement ships.

Commander commands one ship. If Shepard is still a Spectre, and along with the VS they could coordinate tactical responses. Strategic command? No. Tactical decisions most definitely. I'm expecting a lot of recon missions, some tactical battles, and whatever else is unknown.

[Destroy Raiden_]

knightnblu wrote...

iakus wrote " Or, as Mordin puts it "hard to see big picture over pile of corpses""

Or in the case of the Reapers, planets of corpses.

Then you just do what Attila did, you build a ramp out of the corpses. You can see pretty well when you're on that.

[Destroy Raiden_]

Another thing to consider Shotgun is that Specters overrule the captain on normal ships or they can if they choose so Nilus could've over ridden Anderson at any time. One more way to have shep be nearly an admiral would be the council gives orders to all spectors giving them complete emergency power control over sections of the galaxy shep controls a sector, VS controls another, so if a spector tells say the 5th fleet to do something they must do so or be considered traitors and will then have the order issued for them to be destroyed. The 5th fleet like a troop would be assigned to a spector and wouldn't act unless his spector said to or told him that he was under the command of a new spector.

This would also create in story conflict say the VS really is indoctrinated he/she orders their sector to attack other sectors creating internal chaos the reapers can move in from behind the effected forces or take the areas those forces were suppose to be defending. This also leads into the spectors own versions of what is law and order Turian spectors may go iorn fists on their areas and insist if shep wants to pass he needs to act within their guidelines could make for some interesting negotiations for passage between held areas.

Modifié par Destroy Raiden , 10 décembre 2011 - 12:43 .