210 réponses à ce sujet

[TEWR]

Brockololly wrote...

This:
*snip*

This guy gives off more of an Elven vibe to me. Had I been able to recreate him in Origins, who knows how I might've felt regarding their looks.

[tmp7704]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

I didn't look or feel Dalish. I didn't look or feel like an Elf. I just felt... like a bland human with pointy ears who was supposed to be an Elf because of what codexes about the past said.

There wasn't enough of a sense of "These guys are close to nature and everything". Maybe it's because of my Native American heritage, but these guys should be using everything about nature in what they do. Like using the fur of animals and other things.

I never got impression that DAO elves were supposed to be particularly "close to nature and everything". Seemed more like natural byproduct of being refugees with pretty much no other places where they could exist. But they had cities and **** in the past, when they were in position where they could actually choose.

However, if you had expectations along the lines of "elves = total nature nuts, great circle of life yo" then i can see how what the game actually had, could fail to live up to such expectations. But i'd argue it's not different from people coming with expectation elves should be superior tolkien-like etc and then feeling disappointed in what they got.

Although on the other hand, really... shaping your weapons and armours out of trees, wearing leather, moving in wooden carts pulled by animals treated as equals rather than cattle, acquiring metal only through barter etc... that isn't "using everything about nature in what they do?" I'm actually hard pressed to come up with what in particular the Dalish do that isn't "using the nature" in some way.

[xkg]

Tom12 wrote...

I made a new poll in which there is no option *on the fence* because some people still dont know which elves are more preferred, so i suggest everyone to vote on it

You know what? This new poll isn't all that much different from the previous one.
Basically  "i hate both" OR "i like both" == "on the fence"

You've just split one option into two. So this poll is even worse than the previous one.
But that is just my opinion.

Modifié par xkg, 10 décembre 2011 - 05:34 .

[tmp7704]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

She looks human there because that's the actress. But the actual characters -- the Elven princess, her brother, and their father -- give off a distinct vibe that only the movie can properly convey.

There's that word! Distinct!

My point is the actual characters have the exact same facial features, with only the smallest modifications (eye colour, stitches) As such, to say they aren't like humans with small modification to you is absurd to me, because it requires you to pretty much ignore what your own eyes are telling you.

[Tom12]

xkg wrote...

Tom12 wrote...

I made a new poll in which there is no option *on the fence* because some people still dont know which elves are more preferred, so i suggest everyone to vote on it

You know what? This new poll isn't all that much different from the previous one.
Basically  "i hate both" OR "i like both" == "on the fence"

You've just split one option into two. So this poll is even worse than the previous one.
But that is just my opinion.

So i replaced the old poll with a new poll with just two options:
Dao Elves or Da2 Elves

Modifié par Tom12, 10 décembre 2011 - 05:46 .

[Salaya]

It's so cool when I try to argue with someone in th BWN forums and just ignores me ^_^u

The worst part is, I don't know if it's due to my english saying stupid things, or just myself saying correct-stupid things xD

Sigh

[xkg]

Tom12 wrote...

xkg wrote...

Tom12 wrote...

I made a new poll in which there is no option *on the fence* because some people still dont know which elves are more preferred, so i suggest everyone to vote on it

You know what? This new poll isn't all that much different from the previous one.
Basically  "i hate both" OR "i like both" == "on the fence"

You've just split one option into two. So this poll is even worse than the previous one.
But that is just my opinion.

Omg very well i thought that people would start complaining then but i dont like both or i like both but anyways ok have it your way i make a newer poll with only 2 options

Yep. That will be better in this case. There have been enough "2 options + neutral" polls already.

We need one definitely answer without any ambiguous options.

Modifié par xkg, 10 décembre 2011 - 05:48 .

[TEWR]

tmp7704 wrote...

I never got impression that DAO elves were supposed to be particularly "close to nature and everything". Seemed more like natural byproduct of being refugees with pretty much no other places where they could exist. But they had cities and **** in the past, when they were in position where they could actually choose.

Velanna says that they are close to nature in a figurative manner. Merrill says that the Dalish frolic in the woods and are one with nature. Marethari says that nature has great wisdom if you look for it. And Halamshiral was comprised of homes within the trees.

Although on the other hand, really... shaping your weapons and armours out of trees, wearing leather, moving in wooden carts pulled by animals treated as equals rather than cattle, acquiring metal only through barter etc... that isn't "using everything about nature in what they do?" I'm actually hard pressed to come up with what in particular the Dalish do that isn't "using the nature" in some way.

Using fur for practical purposes other than just "hunting an animal so I can marry some girl and be seen as a man in the eyes of my peers because I'm an ugly ass elf".

But, as I said I'm tired and can't express myself the way I'd like.

I'll be back in several hours.

And, again, an irreversible fact does not change an opinion. That group shouldnt be added anywhere. Their opinion is "on the fence", and the new style being kept doesn't change that. 

you're right that their opinion doesn't change. The opinion is "Whatever the devs decide, I'm happy with it".

As such, they should be added to the likes group because they're content with it.

But I think we've reached a point where it's "agree to disagree".



Now... I need to get some sleep.

[Tom12]

 i myself would like the elves to look like this 



i think it would also help making the majority of the elves for example blonde or red haired and have a pale skin etc... 

Modifié par Tom12, 10 décembre 2011 - 06:20 .

[MassStorm]

 the red one is really hot.I know it sound paradoxical but elven should be similar to humans but at the same time also different in the eyes and hairs, behaviour and abilities.   Physically speaking they should be thinner than humans and more agile and sneaking....and BTW where the "big" idea of elves being shorter than humans came from??

Modifié par MassStorm, 10 décembre 2011 - 06:11 .

[yusuf060297]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Oddly enough, why I liked the Elves in Hellboy II was due to the different appearance that they had along with the fact that they spoke Gaelic.

i dont know why... but somehow he reminds me really much of joker from batman 

[MassStorm]

yusuf060297 wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Oddly enough, why I liked the Elves in Hellboy II was due to the different appearance that they had along with the fact that they spoke Gaelic.

i dont know why... but somehow he reminds me really much of joker from batman 

To me it reminds more a vampire rather than an elf...but i have not watched that film this "elf" is referred to so i cannot judge......just my impression

[HowlHowl]

What's-her-face from MotA was fine. I don't see why they can't do something between DA:O and DAII designs.

[Morroian]

MassStorm wrote...

You seems to have trouble accepting that someone is superior to humans...in reality you will discover that even in DA dalish elves are morally superior to humans which are corrupts and evil.....god how much i miss my past Elven adventures in DAO killing every human i can.

Why should elves be superior to humans? Why should any race be superior to any other? Being perfect is boring. There is nothing saying elves in a fantasy series HAVE to be an idealised humanity.

MassStorm wrote...

In reality what really bugs me in DA is that they do not want to have the so called High Elves that are present in almost every respectable fantasy story. In Elder Scroll you have high elves that are better and wiser than wood and dark elves. 

Only if you think being racist and wanting to destroy the world are better and wiser.

Tom12 wrote...

And making a whole race in every aspect ugly makes them also boring the dao elves had a great story i was really driven in by it and i said to my self hate humans for what they did to the elves, the city elf origin for example, in da2 they are just looking ugly and are just dumb. bioware has left nothing interesting/attractive about them. I must even say when i see like merrill or fenris, the elves deserved what humans did to them

So they deserved to be slaughtered because of their looks.

Modifié par Morroian, 10 décembre 2011 - 10:14 .

[HowlHowl]

MassStorm wrote...

In reality what really bugs me in DA is that they do not want to have the so called High Elves that are present in almost every respectable fantasy story. In Elder Scroll you have high elves that are better and wiser than wood and dark elves. 

I'm glad BioWare trying to take a different approach than the same old cliches. Elves being shorter than humans is actually an old trope. Your knowledge of fantasy is obviously limited.

BioWare's Elves would be fine if they weren't so overdone. It's fine to have them look smaller or whatever, but the Beavis and Butthead Elves we saw in DAII were pathetic.

Modifié par HowlHowl, 10 décembre 2011 - 10:07 .

[Serpieri Nei]

Humans are cliche as well - can we make them with very big heads and inverted chests?

[Travie]

Petite and beautiful humans with long ears.

Simple as that.

[HowlHowl]

MassStorm wrote...

 the red one is really hot.I know it sound paradoxical but elven should be similar to humans but at the same time also different in the eyes and hairs, behaviour and abilities.   Physically speaking they should be thinner than humans and more agile and sneaking....and BTW where the "big" idea of elves being shorter than humans came from??

Wait, so elves should be tall and wise and smart and beautiful, but they should also be sneaky, smaller, and like cats?

[Aaleel]

Man people are serious about their elves lol. On my list of problems with DA2, elves are pretty low on the list.

All they really need to do is not give them all wild, neon eye colors and have them eat something so they don't look so anorexic. Then go back to the Origins art style and they'll look fine.

Either way, the elves aren't something that's going to be a deal breaker as far as me buying future games.

[HowlHowl]

Serpieri Nei wrote...

Humans are cliche as well - can we make them with very big heads and inverted chests?

Humans in fantasy are based on actual beings. What do they call those again?

Elves aren't. And therefor cliches are less easily excused because there is no actual point of departure outside of Tolkien lore.

[Morroian]

Travie wrote...

Petite and beautiful humans with long ears.

Simple as that.

Why?

[Serpieri Nei]

HowlHowl wrote...

Serpieri Nei wrote...

Humans are cliche as well - can we make them with very big heads and inverted chests?

Humans in fantasy are based on actual beings. What do they call those again?

Elves aren't. And therefor cliches are less easily excused because there is no actual point of departure outside of Tolkien lore.

Fantasy is Fantasy.

If you want to limit your imagination and not include humans because they exhist somewhere simply defeats fiction.

and I'd take a nother look at elves theres a lot of variations - heck even ones that have blue fur.

[addiction21]

I thought this thread was ment to provide some ideas as how to improve the elf desigh not to be another pissing match?

[byzantine horse]

The bland-staple-of-fantasy-elves or the not-as-bland-but-still-bland-staple-of-fantasy-elves? Aww, what to choose, so hard.

I'll go with the not-as-bland-but-still-bland-staple-of-fantasy-elves.

Those who find distinction between the two and motivate it with a hurtful "Avatar rip-off!" are dillusional at best ad at worst grasping for straws. They look almost exactly the same, except that the elves no longer look like verything else. Yes, emphasis on the 'almost' there. Still the same, just not as much of a copy paste.

Modifié par byzantine horse, 10 décembre 2011 - 11:00 .

[tmp7704]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Velanna says that they are close to nature in a figurative manner. Merrill says that the Dalish frolic in the woods and are one with nature. Marethari says that nature has great wisdom if you look for it. And Halamshiral was comprised of homes within the trees.

All these happen either in Awakening or DA2, while i said i never got that impression about DAO elves. In other words, when you were originally playing DAO, "they're one with nature" was a rather unfounded expectation to have, imo...

(incidentally, always took the whole frolic thing as Merrill messing with people than actual fact)

Using fur for practical purposes other than just "hunting an animal so I can marry some girl and be seen as a man in the eyes of my peers because I'm an ugly ass elf".

We don't exactly get to see the interiors of their carts, so they may be sleeping on furs and whatnot, for all we know. And the keeper robes include fur shoulders.   And of course, they do wear leather armour; where do you think that leather comes from, if not the animals?

Like i said, it's hard for me to come up with examples of Dalish-related items and activities that aren't related to the nature in some manner. As such, i can't really understand what extra (or different) should they be doing to demonstrate that connection at the level you'd find satisfying.