291 réponses à ce sujet

[Eurypterid]

From what I understand, yes.

[Raxtoren]

Gabochido wrote...

And here is another question. Why is it that some people demand that if content was created in time to be in the same game, then it should be given as part of the original game? So, if Mass Effect 2 had been ready at the same time as Dragon Age should Bioware be giving it away as part of buying Dragon Age? Obviously the company can't do that because it took a lot to build Mass Effect 2 and it requires its own revenue, but why would that be different from extra content in the same IP, as is DLC?

Are you for real?
Two diffrent games, by two diffrent teams and games with diffrent settings fantasy/sci-fi.
Your telling me DLC cost as much as ME to produce?
Your comparing a 20-40 min dlc with ME2 ?

Either Mass Effect  2 must be crap, or your logic is almost retarded.

Here is the issue, I know greed, you cant see past anything because you work for Bioware thus the greed benefit you.
However, if you release content on day 1 then it could have been in the retail box.
Its that simple. do other companies have DLC-teams that charge for DLC on day 1?
See here is the problem, your delaying a game with 1 year, and telling people you have people working on content not relevant with the retail game, unless you pay extra.
You dont see the greed with that?
REALLY?

Tell me, why do every other game company not have DLC-teams releasing content on day 1?
Could it be because they actually work on the retail game?
If the game isnt out then all the content done should be going for the retail game, thats what every other company do, however bioware split their divison to make more money.
I dont care if you claim the game is bla bla amount of hours, im sure FF13 and squar-enix could make them same bs up, and yet they wont, because they care about their fans.
They want the retail game to be as good as possible, for their fans, on day 1.

Modifié par Raxtoren, 27 novembre 2009 - 02:25 .

[Eurypterid]

Raxtoren wrote...
However, if you release content on day 1 then it could have been in the retail box.

No, it couldn't. And if you'd bothered to actually do a minimal search of some dev posts, or even read more of his, you'd see why.

Further, I suggest you refrain from implying the devs are retards if you want to maintain your posting privileges.

[YR_Lim]

I think the price for the original game without additional content is reasonable, quit whining about paying more for DLC... c'mon bioware is like any other company, it isn't greed, it is just business, and business ain't charity.

[IHEARTEA]

Gabochido wrote...

It wasn't the case for DA or any other game I know of, but people seem to think that companies are doing that and they are evil for it, but I ask again, why is it so bad for a company to plan ahead by making a large, complete game and in addition, have another team work on extra content that can be bought optionally to increase the size of the original game for those who want it?

I thought it was a good thing to be able to have options.

It's not bad at all, it is awesome!

So are there any plans for day 28 DLC? 

[astrallite]

It was greed when other companies did it. When Bioware does it, it's just business.

[Fernando Melo]

I've said in the past that for us 'dlc' is anything from items all the way to full expansions.  It is additional content for DA:O - the size, shape and even delivery method is somewhat irrelevant.  It's a generic term. Nothing more, nothing less.

It stands to reason that the larger the content being developed, the longer it takes to produce and the more people are needed to produce it - so a measure of patience may be appropriate, it is still early days. 

Continuing on the train of thought above, logic also dictates that the interim period between launch and larger content is more likely to produce either nothing (which is the standard, for no other reason than it is exceptionally difficult to plan and commit to having a parallel team in place early enough to make 'future' content for a game that may or may not do well), or smaller content as the larger endeavor would most likely need to consume a suitably large portion of resources.  (and no, i'm not confirming anything)

Comparing DA:O's initial DLC to other title's offerings after a year of development is a bit premature.  Not factoring in other title's poorly received initial offerings into the same equation in order to compare apples to apples, I'd suggest is also a bit of a rose colored perspective.   I'm not putting other titles down mind you, I'm a fan of (and in some cases worked on) some of those titles - I am saying that early dlc is not necessarilly indicative of the future content for a title.

For now however, know that all the DLC is produced here at BioWare using genuine 100% organic DA team members specially selected for the dedicated DLC team - no genetically modified staff, constructs or preservatives are used. 

However, that also means that producing even just 1hr of content at BioWare quality and adhering to the main game production value standards, including the same great writing and lore, the reactivity to your choices, bringing back all the voice actors for all the followers for all the lines (yes, try to replay the dlcs with different party members), cut scenes, music, creatures, combat balancing, localization for all the supported languages, testing, etc and then deliver all that for 3 platforms - is expensive, and takes time. (have a gander at the dlc credits some time)

You might comment about overall length of the DLC so far.  To be clear, I am not sure we will ever just want to produce 'bulk' filler - e.g. here's a 5hr dungeon crawl of random repeatedness, with minimal story/connection to the main game world.  Given the choice, I think we will always err on the side of make it a bit smaller if needed, but do it really well.

So for now, our preference has genuinely been to really add a lot more lore and story telling about the world and its characters, history and places - expanding its horizons as it were - and I believe all our DLCs so far (including the upcoming RtO) do this in spades, if you care for that sort of thing and enjoy taking the time to pursue it. 

For that reason, I think evaluating future DAO dlc purely on length is not going to be helpful - unless of course, that is your only measure of value/worth, in which case it may actually be that simple for you, and you may opt to pass up on this and wait it out for more substantial content.  There's nothing wrong with that.

As always, if in doubt I've also said many times for folks to hold off buying.  Listen to the reviews.  Listen to the other forumite comments.  Browse our own additional screens/videos etc that is sure to also be coming as we begin promoting new content.  Then make an informed decision on your own time - although most DLC give you more value by getting early in your playthrough as that xp/loot you carry benefits you more - you can still play DLC anytime, even after having finished the main campaign.

I've also said that we are definitely still trying out new things to see what works for our different audiences - and we do have very different audiences across the 3 platforms and play styles (many of whom are silent on here) that we still need to cater content for. 

So for what it is worth, we will be rolling out even smaller content, just as we also plan to roll out larger content too - knowing it may not work for all, and that is perfectly fine.  With each release we continue to spend a lot of time trying to find a price that we feel is appropriate and fair for the effort, and your feedback (either through your posts or purchases, or lack thereof) is very helpful in continuing to improve this.  I certainly do not take offense if no one purchases a particular dlc, that is a good way (if painful) for us to learn more about what we should be making for you.

As I've also said before, ultimately our plan is to keep listening and be willing to adjust the plan to what works for you over time... so if you really want more bulk content over substance, then I'm sure we can oblige (in time though - even that takes some time).

Modifié par Fernando Melo, 27 novembre 2009 - 05:51 .

[VanDraegon]

Raxtoren wrote...

Gabochido wrote...

And here is another question. Why is it that some people demand that if content was created in time to be in the same game, then it should be given as part of the original game? So, if Mass Effect 2 had been ready at the same time as Dragon Age should Bioware be giving it away as part of buying Dragon Age? Obviously the company can't do that because it took a lot to build Mass Effect 2 and it requires its own revenue, but why would that be different from extra content in the same IP, as is DLC?

Are you for real?
Two diffrent games, by two diffrent teams and games with diffrent settings fantasy/sci-fi.
Your telling me DLC cost as much as ME to produce?
Your comparing a 20-40 min dlc with ME2 ?

Either Mass Effect  2 must be crap, or your logic is almost retarded.

Here is the issue, I know greed, you cant see past anything because you work for Bioware thus the greed benefit you.
However, if you release content on day 1 then it could have been in the retail box.
Its that simple. do other companies have DLC-teams that charge for DLC on day 1?
See here is the problem, your delaying a game with 1 year, and telling people you have people working on content not relevant with the retail game, unless you pay extra.
You dont see the greed with that?
REALLY?

Tell me, why do every other game company not have DLC-teams releasing content on day 1?
Could it be because they actually work on the retail game?
If the game isnt out then all the content done should be going for the retail game, thats what every other company do, however bioware split their divison to make more money.
I dont care if you claim the game is bla bla amount of hours, im sure FF13 and squar-enix could make them same bs up, and yet they wont, because they care about their fans.
They want the retail game to be as good as possible, for their fans, on day 1.

lol. You dont know half as much as you think you do, but you sure are entertaining.

[Aumra]

Man... when I was working for 10 bucks an hour, I'd have to save for a whole hour to afford the DLC. Tragic.

[Bloodseeker2009]

I see so many people say "Bioware should just make an expansion!"



Well lets look at gaming definitions shall we.



Gaming Expansion: Data usually in the form of a disc or downloaded that adds new content such as levels, models, area's and items to a pre-existing game; Most expansion's with the exception of Mmorpg's give on average 8-10 hours of additional gameplay to the original game.



DLC: Data that has been created for a game that can include minor changes such as "Easter-Eggs" and visuals to major changes that can include new area's, models, item's and/or content.



In other words, DLC is just an expansion broken up into parts, with the ability to buy which 'parts' you want instead of the entire package. Together they will add up to roughly the same as an expansion and around the same price, quit complaining, it is not necessary.



Thank you

[mstermith]

[I have nothing constructive to add to this discussion.]



EDIT: Inappropriate content removed by Moderator.

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 27 novembre 2009 - 06:45 .

[JamieTavelli]

Sorry Im new to RPGs and gaming in general.. If Im not using this forum right Im sorry too..



OK.. I can get the regular version for $35 or spend $79 on the Collectors edition of Dragons Age Origins - a Christmas gift for a teenager that DOES play alot of RPGs. Is it worth it to pay the extra $45? Also, approxiametly how much do you think is needed to pay for the "extra" (sorry if improper wording) things to actually play the character? I do not mind spending the $$$ if it is worth it as I know EA/Bio are both reputable companies that tend to have the best possible games. (Based on research not personal exp.) Lastly, should I buy the book too?



Im sorry to be a pain but Id really like him to enjoy the game and be able to play it to its fullest potential. Thank You.

[Bloodseeker2009]

mstermith wrote...
[I need to calm down and not post inappropriate content or I might find my posting privileges revoked.]

Someone apparently doesn't know how much time and resources it takes to make content on such a scale for a game, you don't have to buy it and on a semi-related note Bioware did give out alot of copies of DA:O with DLC with them, my content itself came with Shales DLC.

Also most likely Bioware had two seperate development teams, one for the actual game, and another for the DLC as most companies do.

Though I do love how Bioware has made this game so mod friendly, I quite enjoy making my own custom levels and area's, I loved it on the TES games and I love it here.  If any of you truly want some unique DLC and think you can do better, just study up on Gaming Design or go to a college(like I'm doing) and you will enjoy how companies such as Bethesda and Bioware give you all the tools you need to shape their games as you want them.


EDIT: Quote edited by Moderator.

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 27 novembre 2009 - 06:46 .

[Mordaedil]

mstermith wrote...
[I have nothing constructive to add to this conversation.]

Thank you for establishing exactly who are the grownups and who are the cry-babies in this conflict.

If this post is anything to go by, I think it's safe for Bioware to say; Keep on truckin'.

(Though Bio-Boy 3000 does bring up  good point. I suggest maybe extending the NPC offering the quest to maybe show you a bit what you're going in for, though wouldn't people feel more robbed because they'd be unable to progress because they didn't buy the DLC? Man, people can never truly be satisfied, can they?)



EDIT: Quote edited by Moderator.

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 27 novembre 2009 - 06:47 .

[Bloodseeker2009]

Mordaedil wrote...

Man, people can never truly be satisfied, can they?)

Its human nature.

"We're born crying, we live complaining, we die dissappointed"

[supakillaii]

Fernando Melo wrote...

For that reason, I think evaluating future DAO dlc purely on length is not going to be helpful - unless of course, that is your only measure of value/worth, in which case it may actually be that simple for you, and you may opt to pass up on this and wait it out for more substantial content.  There's nothing wrong with that.

...

As I've also said before, ultimately our plan is to keep listening and be willing to adjust the plan to what works for you over time... so if you really want more bulk content over substance, then I'm sure we can oblige (in time though - even that takes some time).

Suggestion: For the people who judge DLCs by pure length, make five or six very, very long (max. distance the Game Engine allows) hallways, and after you enter one, you can't turn back. Of course there'll be an Ogre or two in there.

Modifié par supakillaii, 27 novembre 2009 - 07:52 .

[Shadowcrazy4]

to be honest the only problem i've had with DLC was wardens keep and thats only because i spent about 40mins or so doing all this work to be locked out of my own keep when i finished it...thought i was going to be inside the keep and it was going to be my camp with everyone in their own room and such...and the chest would be in the lobby or something...sadly that wasn't the case...still happy i made the purchase...just for next time BIOWARE...give me the keys to my keep

[cerulianknight 2]

Totally agree concerning soldiers' peak keep; it should have been a stronghold for the party,basically a magnificent "camp" w/ necessary living arrangements. Certainly would hve liked to seen more romantic situations and dialoge. Pay attention Bioware.

[cerulianknight 2]

Totally agree concerning soldiers' peak keep; it should have been a stronghold for the party,basically a magnificent "camp" w/ necessary living arrangements. Certainly would have liked to seen more romantic situations and dialogue. Pay attention Bioware.

[Jonfon_ire]

mstermith wrote...
[I have nothing constructive to add to this discussion.]

Luckily, I wore protection when I bought it as part of the original pack. Sometimes I wish some peoples parents had done the same

OK.. I can get the regular version for $35 or spend $79 on the Collectors edition of Dragons Age Origins

Hmmm. I dunno. Gameplay-wise there's not a massive difference, a few extra items and some short add-ons like Wardens Keep.

That said when I was a teenager and into my roleplaying games something like a Collectors Edition on Xmas morning would make me very, very happy indeed. You do know you're not going to see them for about a month afterwards, right? 

But is the additional 34 bucks worth it? I'm not so sure, not when you could get them another game as well with that cash instead. Weighing the two up personally I'd spread my bets a little, get the standard edition and then get something else for them too.



EDIT: Quote edited by Moderator.

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 27 novembre 2009 - 06:55 .

[Chriagon]

Gabochido wrote...

So the DLC thing has already been explained thoroughly, but I'm curious (and this is unrelated to any plans EA or Bioware might have), how many people would like a paid up-front model: Lets say there was a 30 hour game (as is common now a days) and the company promised to churn out content for an extra 30 hours of gameplay for free during the next year. Would you buy it for 60 dollars? How about if the game had 60 hours of gameplay and 30 extra hours were promised, but it was sold for 90 dollars?

Not in general. But if the game would be from Bioware and you would promise me that I would get an expansion like "Throne of Baal" or "Hordes of the Underdark" for free during the next year then I would pay you 90 dollars. I have paid 50 Euro for DA and if the game would have been twice as long I would also have paid twice the money for it.

However if the idea was to offer some low quality one hour DLC every two weeks for one year, then I would say "no, thanks".

Having said this, I probably won't buy "Return to Ostagar" etc. But maybe I'll buy it as a little addition once you offer a true expansion...

Modifié par chrissicross, 27 novembre 2009 - 12:54 .

[Farlington]

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Then don't. Nobody forces you to buy the additional content.

I have to disagree somewhat. Having a man with a neon "!" above his head the the party camp saying "To get rid of me you have to spend five quid extra because you didn't buy the exact version of the game where you get Wardens Keep unlock codes so I'm going to stand here destroying your immersion until you get your credit card out, is forcing you to buy additional content.

Dragon armour, rings and even Shale don't intrude into the game if you lack them, but Wardens Keep should either be removed from the game entirely in a patch, or included free with EVERY copy of the game.

In every other regard, I have no problems with DLC, but this stinks as bad, if not worse than the DRM in Mass Effect.

Expect illegal downloads to increase just as they did with Mass Effect. Lesson not learned methinks.