604 réponses à ce sujet

[MACharlie1]

Youknow wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

Kawamura wrote...
I see no change in depth of character.

So when everybody is made into Shepard-sexuals because somewhere some obsessive player wants to sleep with them you don't see that cutting into the quality of the story in any way?

Lets just take the next step and replace the team with robots with no opinions of their own whatsoever.

Why does everything have to be about sex? (wait, did I honestly ask that?) 

All of the romances in ME have so far been (with the exception of the Consort) on a deep and meaningful level that is beyond just bumping uglies. Dontcha get it? It's not about the sex. It's about the intimate and emotional connection people want their Shepards to have with the members of the same sex. 

Perhaps they should have just made the relationships a friendship sort of thing. Where it's not really clear if the person harbors romantic feelings towards the PC but it's not exactly left out to field if they don't. I don't know if you've played the game, but sort of how Chrono Cross has the whole thing with Serge and Kid. It's implied that Kid and Serge like each other at least enough to be comrades, but it never actually states if she's in love with him. So it's left up to player interpretation. 

But to be fair, some of the romances did feel like quick sex. 

I honestly wouldn't have a problem but thus far there hasn't been any real emotional connections for Shepard to really make except with the romance interests. And in media like video games and movies, if you want a romance there has to be an indication of it and the ultimate, no questions about it, is a sex scene. It's the ultimate showance of trust, acceceptance and intimacy. We're all just too dumb and shallow to understand a romance that doesn't involve it. We're all about having gratification and knowing something for sure. 

[Ryzaki]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

A. Shep's not necessarily Bi.

B. No one's Shep is forced to be anything.

C. Your last bit...whatever. There are heroes that were gay. I'd suggest you get used to that fact. It's not like gay Shep is gonna burst out the game, hold you down and rape you.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 19 décembre 2011 - 06:00 .

[Kawamura]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? 

For some people, their Sheps were always bisexual, pansexual, homosexual, etc, etc, just like for some people their Sheps were sexually attracted to Turians, Quarians and Drell in ME1 as well. Oppening up the option for those interspecies romances didn't seem forced, did it?

[MACharlie1]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

Can I show my diagrams of a man's G-spot now? :innocent:

Everybody needs some pleasure - and it sounds like you could use it right about now. 

[FoxHound109]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

I guess that says a lot about you, then.

It's very hard to take your claims of maturity seriously when, during the first month of being part of this forum, you randomly decided to accuse me of supporting S/S thread creations in BSN pre-Mass Effect 3 and wanting anti-S/S threads shut down when neither is technically true.  I was never here pre-Mass Effect 3. In fact, I only started posting here after Vega's reveal. I also don't condone the closing of anti-S/S threads, and not because I think the anti-S/Sers have logical arguments but because they deserve to voice their opinion. It's also stupid that mods tell anti-S/Sers to use the S/S support thread to discuss the subject when that's not going to happen. I have less issues with anti-S/S threads than I do with having the same repeated arguments over and over again; THAT is what bothers me about this thread: how it started and knowing exactly what it would eventually degrade to (and I think that ULTIMATELY, this is why the mods close them; it's not that they want to take away your ability to talk about it it's that they don't want to deal with the flamewars). We all know who believes what in this forum concerning S/S romances already; we know where the line is on the sand. We even know everyone's arguments right down to the minor details, rendering this entire fiasco utterly pointless. Your role is to pretend to be the voice of reason and maturity while subsequently missing the entire point of nearly everything ever posted and coming to hasty conclusions from assumptions. My role is to post random pictures. That's why you get ponies too.

Modifié par FoxHound109, 19 décembre 2011 - 06:05 .

[rapscallioness]

Mental Surge wrote...

I dont care all that much about this but I will say that the way DA2 did it, was really annoying and lazy.

Oh, I had a blast with that! I boinked everybody. Everbody. Wasn't there an Achievement for that?

I wanted a collection of companions sporting red ties and my family shield.

Isabella? Hell yeah, I hit that. Fenris--got sum good hate sex. And he still fought against the Templars. He was like, "Why am I doing this?"  Cuz you got my red tie on, Baby!

All except for Anders. Goddamm!t Anders. Living up in my house and ain't got nothing to say. Where was the option for get the hell out my house!? *throws lute out the window*

But Varric was my love. The only one who truly had my heart. But he wasn't into humans...

That is all.  Carry on:whistle:

[PinkDiamondstl]

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

I love your homophobia despite you having the word "Pink" in your username.  Curious, where are you from?

Why?

[I-AM-KROGAN]

D3MON-SOVER3IGN wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

SAGEHONOR wrote...


If you are against it, you are labled sexist, homophobic, or a troll..Even if you defend it logically. I've seen it. Whats the deal with that? why does a characters sexual preference matter so much to you in a video game?

actually that's false. I have plentyof BSN friends who are not in favor of S/S romance being involved with certan character and I respect it. It's when you start being an **** about it and telling people the way tey play their games are wrong. That's when you are labeled a troll, sexist, and homophobic. For example: I want there to be Same sex, but the one character I can't see that with is Jacob. I do't know why, I just don't. I am in favor of Ashley, Kaidan, Miranda, and Tali being S/S romances though.

What about Tali,Garrus, and James
I can see this with Jack

In ME2 Jack said she doesnt play for the girl team or something like that. That shes not intrested in women.

[Kaiser Shepard]

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

I love your homophobia despite you having the word "Pink" in your username.  Curious, where are you from?

Eh, did I miss the news report about gay people getting the exclusive rights to the color pink?

[PinkDiamondstl]

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

A. Shep's not necessarily Bi.

B. No one's Shep is forced to be anything.

C. Your last bit...whatever. There are heroes that were gay. I'd suggest you get used to that fact. It's not like gay Shep is gonna burst out the game, hold you down and rape you.

Name three...

[Inquisitor Recon]

IsaacShep wrote...
With so many flaws already there, one more 'flaw' won't make a difference. Especially in a series like Mass Effect where morality actually plays a huge role in the entire franchise thus is a MUCH bigger flaw if it ain't considered by LIs than sexual orientation that plays absolutely no role in the story. Start your crusade by whining how morality then. If you don't, you're a hypocrite.

Ohh and BTW, none of these are really "flaws". With all the realistic romance availability factors & conditionals ignored, it is obvious this was a concious design path taken by BioWare. Not an accident or flaws they missed. Romances are bonus content that allows further customization of the Shep and more personalized experience. That's why they ain't restricted based on looks, morality and other factors. Making an exception for sexual orienation has no basis and is not cohesive with the general design approach they've taken.

When the LIs become available based on other realistic factors such as morality, actions, and of course when ManShep doesn't have a harem of women, then I could agree with you sexual orientation proportions should also be treated realistically.

Yes, to you it doesn't make a difference because that is what you want. Yet Bioware is supposed to be making a game for more people than just yourself. You can try to hide it behind whatever you like but the only reason this flaw would be acceptable is because you're obsessed with sleeping with Kaidan.

The ugliness and morality factors aren't flaws because we are talking about dynamics that would need a lot of programming and investment to implement. Depsite being a minor feature the romances are part of the story and game as a whole, not some seperate thing to boost the self-esteem of forever alone guys and gals. Making a distinction for one's sexuality does make sense when you consider that it is realistic behavior, and Bioware is reknown for doing a good job of presenting a wide array of different characters in their games. Like it or not, making them all bisexual simply to please the whims of some fanboys/girls is degrading the quality of that character development.

As I said, the only reason you think said characters should sleep with Shepard regardless of gender is because of your personal interest in the matter.

[Youknow]

IsaacShep wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

Oddly enough, none of that pointed out any reason why Bioware should make everybody bisexual.

It would be some awfully wacky logic if you were suggesting that should make everybody bisexual because ME doesn't take into account how ugly or pretty Shepard is. One flaw doesn't justify another.

With so many flaws already there, one more 'flaw' won't make a difference. Especially in a series like Mass Effect where morality actually plays a huge role in the entire franchise thus is a MUCH bigger flaw if it ain't considered by LIs than sexual orientation that plays absolutely no role in the story. Start your crusade by whining how morality ai't considered in romances availability conditionals. If you don't, you're a hypocrite.

Ohh and BTW, none of these are really "flaws". With all the realistic romance availability factors & conditionals ignored, it is obvious this was a concious design path taken by BioWare. Not an accident or flaws they missed. Romances in ME franchise are bonus content that allows further customization of the Shep and more personalized experience. That's why they ain't restricted based on looks, morality and other factors. Making an exception for sexual orienation has no basis and is not cohesive with the general design approach they've taken.

When the LIs become available based on other realistic factors such as morality, actions, and of course when ManShep doesn't have a harem of women, then I could agree with you sexual orientation proportions should also be treated realistically.

I don't know if I'd want to add more flaws though. I see what you mean though. 

Yeah, I'll admit, I don't even get into the whole "romance" scene usually, but I found it pretty silly that in addition to Kelly liking my FemShep, I suddenly had dialogue options in ME2 towards liking her more than friends when I was pretty sure that Bioware had said "Sheperd is straight." I'll also admit I first thought "I wonder if 'Kelly' becomes someone else when I play MaleShep." But of course, she doesn't, and I thought it was lazy more than anything else. 

Yeah, those ratios are pretty bad. I wouldn't really call it a harem, but there do need to be less women that are into MaleShep or more men that are into FemShep. Especially odd when you think about it, because males are more likely to express interest vocally than females. I mean, if we are going to bring up realism...

[Ryzaki]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...
Name three...

I won't.

Can't be bothered frankly.

Yes I'm a lazy ****.

[Youknow]

MACharlie1 wrote...

Youknow wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

Kawamura wrote...
I see no change in depth of character.

So when everybody is made into Shepard-sexuals because somewhere some obsessive player wants to sleep with them you don't see that cutting into the quality of the story in any way?

Lets just take the next step and replace the team with robots with no opinions of their own whatsoever.

Why does everything have to be about sex? (wait, did I honestly ask that?) 

All of the romances in ME have so far been (with the exception of the Consort) on a deep and meaningful level that is beyond just bumping uglies. Dontcha get it? It's not about the sex. It's about the intimate and emotional connection people want their Shepards to have with the members of the same sex. 

Perhaps they should have just made the relationships a friendship sort of thing. Where it's not really clear if the person harbors romantic feelings towards the PC but it's not exactly left out to field if they don't. I don't know if you've played the game, but sort of how Chrono Cross has the whole thing with Serge and Kid. It's implied that Kid and Serge like each other at least enough to be comrades, but it never actually states if she's in love with him. So it's left up to player interpretation. 

But to be fair, some of the romances did feel like quick sex. 

I honestly wouldn't have a problem but thus far there hasn't been any real emotional connections for Shepard to really make except with the romance interests. And in media like video games and movies, if you want a romance there has to be an indication of it and the ultimate, no questions about it, is a sex scene. It's the ultimate showance of trust, acceceptance and intimacy. We're all just too dumb and shallow to understand a romance that doesn't involve it. We're all about having gratification and knowing something for sure. 

I don't. I'm not big into sex actually. I realize I'm in the vocal minority on this one though, and there probably will never be a romance made for me that's ideal. But yeah, you're right, it has become more common nowadays that we have to have the person out and out have sex with them for there to be and understanding. It bothers me, and apparently other people in real life that I feel this way. 

[Esbatty]

My favorite part of these arguments/discussions is the people who complain about it when Bioware is one of the few Western Developers that actually take into consideration gender and sexuality in not just character creation but also the damn storyline.

[MACharlie1]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

A. Shep's not necessarily Bi.

B. No one's Shep is forced to be anything.

C. Your last bit...whatever. There are heroes that were gay. I'd suggest you get used to that fact. It's not like gay Shep is gonna burst out the game, hold you down and rape you.

Name three...

Fictional or non-fictional? 

[Inquisitor Recon]

FoxHound109 wrote...
It's very hard to take your claims of maturity seriously when, during the first month of being part of this forum, you randomly decided to accuse me of supporting S/S thread creations in BSN pre-Mass Effect 3 and wanting anti-S/S threads shut down when neither is technically.  I was never here pre-Mass Effect 3. In fact, I only started posting here after Vega's reveal. I also don't condone the closing of anti-S/S threads, and not because I think the anti-S/Sers have logical arguments but because they deserve to voice their opinion. It's also stupid that mods tell anti-S/Sers to use the S/S support thread to discuss the subject when that's not going to happen. I have less issues with anti-S/S threads than I do with having the same repeated arguments over and over again; THAT is what bothers me about this thread: how it started and knowing exactly what it would eventually degrade to (and I think that ULTIMATELY, this is why the mods close them; it's not that they want to take away your ability to talk about it it's that they don't want to deal with the flamewars). We all know who believes what in this forum concerning S/S romances already; we know where the line is on the sand. We even know everyone's arguments right down to the minor details, rendering this entire fiasco utterly pointless. Your role is to pretend to be the voice of reason and maturity while subsequently missing the entire point of nearly everything ever posted and coming to hasty conclusions from assumptions. My role is to post random pictures. That's why you get ponies too.

Paragraphs son, easier to read, think of the possibilites.

It's odd that you accuse Kaiser of pretending to be "mature" when outside of spamming images (your stock isn't even good trolling 101 material), you pretend to have such great arguments and answers to support this S/S nonsense that you refuse to lower yourself to posting them. That right there says everything one needs to know about the quality (or lack thereof) of your arguments. Would it be more comparing people to transportaion and water fountains?

[Kawamura]

ReconTeam wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
With so many flaws already there, one more 'flaw' won't make a difference. Especially in a series like Mass Effect where morality actually plays a huge role in the entire franchise thus is a MUCH bigger flaw if it ain't considered by LIs than sexual orientation that plays absolutely no role in the story. Start your crusade by whining how morality then. If you don't, you're a hypocrite.

Ohh and BTW, none of these are really "flaws". With all the realistic romance availability factors & conditionals ignored, it is obvious this was a concious design path taken by BioWare. Not an accident or flaws they missed. Romances are bonus content that allows further customization of the Shep and more personalized experience. That's why they ain't restricted based on looks, morality and other factors. Making an exception for sexual orienation has no basis and is not cohesive with the general design approach they've taken.

When the LIs become available based on other realistic factors such as morality, actions, and of course when ManShep doesn't have a harem of women, then I could agree with you sexual orientation proportions should also be treated realistically.

Yes, to you it doesn't make a difference because that is what you want. Yet Bioware is supposed to be making a game for more people than just yourself. You can try to hide it behind whatever you like but the only reason this flaw would be acceptable is because you're obsessed with sleeping with Kaidan.

The ugliness and morality factors aren't flaws because we are talking about dynamics that would need a lot of programming and investment to implement. Depsite being a minor feature the romances are part of the story and game as a whole, not some seperate thing to boost the self-esteem of forever alone guys and gals. Making a distinction for one's sexuality does make sense when you consider that it is realistic behavior, and Bioware is reknown for doing a good job of presenting a wide array of different characters in their games. Like it or not, making them all bisexual simply to please the whims of some fanboys/girls is degrading the quality of that character development.

As I said, the only reason you think said characters should sleep with Shepard regardless of gender is because of your personal interest in the matter.

Did making all of the non humans LI's willing to engage in a romance with a human degrade the quality of character development? If so, how? If not, why not?

[slimgrin]

Esbatty wrote...

My favorite part of these arguments/discussions is the people who complain about it when Bioware is one of the few Western Developers that actually take into consideration gender and sexuality in not just character creation but also the damn storyline.

I'm sorry but this was covered like 1000 pages ago. We already know this.

[PinkDiamondstl]

MACharlie1 wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

A. Shep's not necessarily Bi.

B. No one's Shep is forced to be anything.

C. Your last bit...whatever. There are heroes that were gay. I'd suggest you get used to that fact. It's not like gay Shep is gonna burst out the game, hold you down and rape you.

Name three...

Fictional or non-fictional? 

Non-fictional.

[Kaiser Shepard]

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...
Name three...

I won't.

Can't be bothered frankly.

Yes I'm a lazy ****.

You not being able to think of any is more likely.

I know, it can hurt when you make an outrageous claim only to later discover you have nothing to back it. Luckily I've only seldomly been there.

[Inquisitor Recon]

Kawamura wrote...
Did making all of the non humans LI's willing to engage in a romance with a human degrade the quality of character development? If so, how? If not, why not?

No, thanks to Captain Kirk syndrome. Although Tali's obession with Shepard even when he shows her no interest is rather creepy from what you learn in LotSB.

Modifié par ReconTeam, 19 décembre 2011 - 06:19 .

[MACharlie1]

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...

Red by Full Metal Jacket wrote...

Wow, and nobody complains when FemShep is confirmed to be into women. This thread doesn't help the stereotype that gamers are a bunch of whiny man-children.

Shepard can be into dudes. It's in the game. It's not forced upon you and it's not going away. Deal with it.

It feels forced. Why make Shepard bi now? The saver of the earth ,the hero a butt hunter.

A. Shep's not necessarily Bi.

B. No one's Shep is forced to be anything.

C. Your last bit...whatever. There are heroes that were gay. I'd suggest you get used to that fact. It's not like gay Shep is gonna burst out the game, hold you down and rape you.

Name three...

Fictional or non-fictional? 

Non-fictional.

- Leonardo da Vinci
- Michelangelo
- Alexander the Great

[Ryzaki]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

PinkDiamondstl wrote...
Name three...

I won't.

Can't be bothered frankly.

Yes I'm a lazy ****.

You not being able to think of any is more likely.

I know, it can hurt when you make an outrageous claim only to later discover you have nothing to back it. Luckily I've only seldomly been there.

Seldomly? 

1. T.E. Lawrence.
2. Richard the Lionhearted
3. Alexander the Great.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 19 décembre 2011 - 06:17 .