171 réponses à ce sujet

[mcneil_1]

If Bioware use DXM then it would go against what they said a few months (maybe a year or so) ago when they said the ME3 would not have a DXM in it.

[Paula Deen]

MofoingSANTA wrote...

Halo 1 pistol.

As someone who bought and played the original Halo on the day of its release, having no idea what it was...that just made me all kinds of nostalgic.

Not to mention that I was a little kid back then, too.

That pistol wrecked everything and made it look easy.

Maybe we could oneshot Reapers like Hunters, thereby avoiding a DXM by having Shepard personally and individually killing each Reaper.


EDIT: I'm okay with a well-written, well-developed ending that utilizes previously uknown stuff. But given that Mass Effect was planned as a trilogy from the start, it just makes the first two games feel rather pointless (ESPECIALLY the second), and just hints at bad writing. If you introduce a threat in ME1, shouldn't you introduce some way to fight it in ME2?

To put it another way: Despite its flaws, the Harry Potter series was good about connecting the events of each installment with later/earlier installments. ME3 is connected with ME2 largely by the DLC, which is kind of...wrong.

Bah, I'm rambling.

Modifié par Paula Deen, 26 décembre 2011 - 10:01 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Paula Deen wrote...

Mass Effect 3's deus ex machina would be some previously unheard of entity or device that literally just kills all of the Reapers at the figurative push of a button.

Which I can tell you right now that it won't have such an ending. You have to build everything up first, which pretty much contradicts the definition of the deus ex machina.

And that "everything you build up" is introduced in ME3 after the reaper already invaded.
It's still DEM-ish

[Bleachrude]

As long as the elements were introduced in the first two games, (or even the majority) then I would disagree Lotion.

Eg. There is a superweapon that can shatter an ice dwarf somewhere in the krogan DMZ - we know this from reading the planet descriptions from ME2. If that superweapon turns out to be a part of the final solution, I wouldn't consider that part to be an ass-pull...

[MrDizazta]

Knowing Bioware, the DXM will end up being a Chekhov's gun.

[Lotion Soronarr]

It won't be that gun/superweapon.

It's a combo of DEM and AssPull.

[Bleachrude]

Do we know for a fact that it is DEM?

Spoiler

I thought the script made mention of a Turian superweapon in the Krogan DMZ

[Homebound]

How did the Warden in dragon age:origins beat the blight god?

[Bleachrude]

Not considered an ass-pull since it took place during the same game...Now if the sequel had this, then yeah, that's DEM.

(Of course, one could argue that it was a DEM given how late we find it out, but given the relationship between Fiona, Maric and Duncan, I have no trouble believing Duncan kept that information from Alistair)

Actually, let me expand since a DEM can occur in a singular work.

In DA:O, we learn that the first blight lasted for a couple hundred years and only until the coming of the grey wardens did it end (from the opening cinematic). From that point on, every blight has been ended only with the help of the grey wardens and we even know the name of the last grey warden to kill the archdemon in the last blight (during the course of the game)....

What we dont know is WHY a grey warden is needed but we do know a grey warden is required. The reveal isnt a DEM since the game from the beginning has insisted that grey wardens are required to end a blight.

Modifié par Bleachrude, 26 décembre 2011 - 11:34 .

[MrDizazta]

MrDizaztar wrote...

Knowing Bioware, the DXM will end up being a Chekhov's gun.

It's going to be a Chekhov's gun much like how everything in the first game was a Chekhov's gun

Mass Effect. Throughout the Citadel there are these innocuous insect creatures called the Keepers, who don't talk to anyone and only seem to exist to keep the impossibly ancient space station running. It turns out that the Keepers' job is to maintain the Citadel because it is a giant Mass Relay that will bring the Reapers into the galaxy. The Keepers' job is to enable civilizations that discover the Citadel to use it without realizing the stations' intent, enabling the Reapers to hit the center of galactic civilization first and without warning.

Heck, Mass Effect is replete with these. Who would guess that the Mass Relay sculpture in the Presidium was the destination point of the Conduit? (Though if you have Kaidan in your group he'll comment that the statue is making his teeth vibrate.) Or that the krogan genophage and the Rachni War would become important plot points on two of the planets you visit later?

A very subtle example takes place in the Citadel Council tower, if you have Ashley in your party. She'll comment that "I bet these stairs aren't just for show. They'd make for good defensive positions if this place is ever attacked...." Turns out, you are the one who does the attacking at the endgame.
Incidentally, they don't make very good defensive positions.

A very minor example occurs if you choose all the paragon interactions with the Asari Consort. She gives you a seemingly worthless trinket that you can later use on another planet to unlock a cache of valuable equipment.
Quite a few things have been set up as possible Chekhov's Guns which been fired yet. One of the best examples is Haestrom's sun which is, inexplicably, destablizing much faster than it should be.
It is stated to be due to dark energy, but it was really set up as something possibly important.
Given that Mass Effect technology is explained to work through the manipulation of dark energy, chances are it will become incredibly important in Mass Effect 3.

Subverted with the Great Rift on Klendagon. It was caused by a glancing blow from a shot that killed a Reaper. In Mass Effect 2, the Illusive Man says that the weapon was found, but is inoperable.  And we believe it's inoperable because the Illusive Man is so trustworthy.

Modifié par MrDizaztar, 26 décembre 2011 - 11:41 .

[Fatemaster]

1: Create shield-disrupting weapon
2: Fire everything
3: ???
4: Profit!

[Candidate 88766]

Some people seem to think that anything introduced in ME3 not hinted at in ME1 or ME2 would be a deus ex machina, which is wrong.

If something were introduced right at the end of ME3 that killed off the Reapers, with no hints or build-up at all then it would be, but if it is introduced earlier in ME3 and is built up then it isn't.

[Georilla]

I wonder if the reapers are really that badass that they can single handedly take on all possible races, including the Rachni (if you saved the Queen).

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

It won't be that gun/superweapon.

It's a combo of DEM and AssPull.

Yeah, if you don't know the definition of the word and what's required to nullify its effect.

[didymos1120]

MrDizaztar wrote...

Incidentally, they don't make very good defensive positions.

That's more to do with enemies not being very bright in ME1.  Also, there aren't all that many in there, your Shep is almost certainly well into the 50s level-wise, and it's a video game rather than a realistic simulator of warfare.

A very minor example occurs if you choose all the paragon interactions with the Asari Consort. She gives you a seemingly worthless trinket that you can later use on another planet to unlock a cache of valuable equipment.

Um, that's not what that thing does.

[MrDizazta]

didymos1120 wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

Incidentally, they don't make very good defensive positions.

That's more to do with enemies not being very bright in ME1.  Also, there aren't all that many in there, your Shep is almost certainly well into the 50s level-wise, and it's a video game rather than a realistic simulator of warfare.

A very minor example occurs if you choose all the paragon interactions with the Asari Consort. She gives you a seemingly worthless trinket that you can later use on another planet to unlock a cache of valuable equipment.

Um, that's not what that thing does.

Don't mind that. I pretty much copied and paste that from TV Tropes. I know about that secret in ME1. But anyways, even ME1 has been known to use this plot device.

[KenKenpachi]

If the leak is True, there won't be any way lulz.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

It won't be that gun/superweapon.

It's a combo of DEM and AssPull.

Yeah, if you don't know the definition of the word and what's required to nullify its effect.

I know the definitions. Do you?

[CARL_DF90]

The voice work and the story that goes with it is more or less complete so we'll see what happens when the game comes out, won't we?

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I know the definitions. Do you?

Yes. 

It's called "God from the machine" because people in the ancient times used to make "gods" appear in their drama plays through complex machinery, fix everything wrong and then disappear just as fast as they appeared.

What they're doing in ME3 is not a deus ex machina. If it's prepared and everyone knows about it and it acts according to their terms, then it's not a deus ex machina.

[Dean_the_Young]

Because Im bored wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

1.) Capture Collector base

2.) Study Collector base

3.) Develop weapons specially engineered for fighting Reapers

4) Find weaknesses in Reaper designs you can exploit to your advantage (if any)

5.) Still lose.

A pessimist is what an optimist calls a realist.

And a defeatest is what a stalinist calls dead.

[Random citizen]

Drone223 wrote...

Bioware may have too, even if all the ships in the galaxy are equipped with Thanix cannon's defeating the Reaper's by conventinal (sp) mean's will most likely be impossible

"It took multiple fleets and the DA to bring Sovereign down; and that was just one Reaper" -Admiral Hackett

Hackett forgets that they where not doing any noticable damage before Shepards team destroyed Sovereigns avatar which for some reason seemed to cause a power surge shutting down the shields and "stunning" the reaper.

[Random citizen]

AlexXIV wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Random citizen wrote...

To be fair, the reapers should be pretty much unstoppable unless the younger races gets help some kind of ally as advanced as the Reapers. If they have studied and come to understand reaper technology, the Geth might be able to hold their own against a reaper or two, especially if the manage to create their "Dyson sphere" They are realistically the only out there who could possibly match the sheer power, intellect and calculating capacity of an armed "artillect" such as a reaper (unless they seriously nerf the reapers of course). Otherwise, the chances to counteract the reapers in any meaningful way seems minimal to non-existing. How many cave-men does it takes to bring down an army group of tanks full of geniuses? A lot more then there ever been or ever will be.

Finally someone who understands the dillema.
There is a massive technological CHASM..nay, a CANYON between us and the reapers. We have to bridge it.

There is no way to bridge it. We have to do with what we have. Realistically, even if we start researching the base with the best researchers available in the galaxy, we still couldn't reach Reaper tech level before the invasion. They are around millions of years old and harvested probably 100+ species.

Realistically speaking we have nothing. But we have more. We have Shepard. Also I find the caveman-tank allegory horribly off. Because you cannot compare it like that. That's like saying humans to dogs are like cats to ants. Which isn't true. There are no cavemen in this scenario. Actually if we were cavemen, we'd have a chance to survive the Reaper purge, like our cavemen ancestors 50.000 years ago.

Oh you know what I am getting at.

[CroGamer002]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I know the definitions. Do you?

Yes. 

It's called "God from the machine" because people in the ancient times used to make "gods" appear in their drama plays through complex machinery, fix everything wrong and then disappear just as fast as they appeared.

What they're doing in ME3 is not a deus ex machina. If it's prepared and everyone knows about it and it acts according to their terms, then it's not a deus ex machina.

It is in fact a plot device, that some people( namely pro-Cerberus Templars people) don't like for reasons I don't know since I haven't seen leaked script but from what I heard it's definitely a plot device.