32 réponses à ce sujet

[SkittlesKat96]

What do you guys think about this?

On one hand I think being a Grey Warden can be considered an honor and they can be much much more than just fighters of the Darkspawn (listen to what Wynne says.)

On the other hand though you have to realize how serious of a threat the Darkspawn are and there are big downsides to becoming a Grey Warden.

The Grey Wardens are actually a parallel to the Night's Watch, a group of people in the ASOIAF series.

In Westoros (the world in ASOIAF) if you do something horrible like what Loghain did (in fact you can do much, much worse than what Loghain did and still get the same choice) you get the choice to join the Night's Watch instead of get executed. And the Night's Watch go to the Wall where they protect Westoros from the Wildlings, the Others and the other threats from the North (similar to with the Darkspawn and the Deep Roads.)

Also it should be noted that the Grey Wardens are similar in another way too.

The Night's Watch and the Grey Wardens are similar in the fact that they are both lacking in numbers (Ferelden's Grey Warden number was the lowest in Thedas) and people have started forgetting about them and not caring aobut them (since their hasn't been a blight in Thedas for such a long time. People like Loghain dislike the Wardens and don't understand the threat of the Darkspawn.)

Also as you guys probably remember, Jory was killed by Duncan at the start of DA:O, again, becoming a Grey Warden is kind of a death sentence. Alistair was an exception for this (when he leaves the Grey Wardens)

And as for Anders I'm not really sure how he got out of the Grey Wardens, but I do know that if he died in Awakening he says this was so he could escape the Templars and the Grey Wardens (he says this to Nathaniel and Hawke I think.)

So those are just my thoughts on it...I think Alistair and Wynne's idea of the Grey Wardens is noble but if you've read the ASOIAF book series then you'll agree with my views instead.

Its always frustrating when reading those books when people completely disregard and disrespect the Night's Watch.

If there were a group of murderers and rapists from Ferelden who all agreed to take the Grey Warden oaths and ritual and they were all good fighters with strong minds would you bar them from joining? Especially if there is a current Darkspawn invasion...like with Loghain's situation.

Also it should be noted that Alistair unless hardened wasn't really that great of a king, in the long run its better to make Loghain become a Grey Warden general/recruiter (or whatever the rank he attained was) and Queen Anora become queen, even better though is to harden Alistair and make him marry Queen Anora and have him leave the Wardens (although you kind of betray Alistair and hurt him by doing that, its still the proper choice.)

Also in my opinion Duncan would have let Loghain live, I just have this feeling. Also you should note that Alistair is no senior Grey Warden, his views come from his emotions and not his logic (not saying emotion is bad though. Like I said, Alistair has the right intentions and nobleness.)

Modifié par SkittlesKat96, 28 décembre 2011 - 07:11 .

[Hambacon]

as a Ferelden, if there were a group of murderers and rapists who murdered and raped your family, you might not want them to be considered heros.
as a grey warden, you might not want to work, eat, sleep side by side with psychopaths.
think of the safety issues there. It's not practical up to a certain point.
You have to be able to trust your Grey Wardens, and criminals aren't trustworthy.
At the same time, if they seem truly remorseful and willing, if their crimes were "justifiable", then yes, I can see it being ok.

[CrimsonZephyr]

Unless they submit to the law of the land, they are a threat. Given the fact that Grey Wardens can ignore laws regarding things such as blood magic, and are likely packed with brigands, murderers, and rapists who lack scruples, I would be very suspicious of such an organization. I would assist them, of course, when necessary, but having so much unilateral power in the hands of suspect individuals would turn society on its head, especially now that they have an arling.

Just wait, that "we accept all" mentality is going to bite them soon enough.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 28 décembre 2011 - 08:46 .

[AlexXIV]

Why do you think there is an 'or'? It is a death sentence and sacrifice for sure. And for some it is an honor. For others have no choice in the matter, for example our Warden.

[nightscrawl]

I think it really depends on your point of view and how you were recruited into the Wardens in the first place.

-- SPOILERS for novel The Calling --

Warden Commander Genevieve thought being a Warden was the best thing since sliced bread. Whether she felt that way because of societal limitations or expectations because she was a woman, whether she really felt compelled to fight against the darkspawn, or whether she just desired power it's never really made clear in the novel. But she wanted to be one (or perhaps it was and I don't remember...)

Other people: all of our Warden PCs from DAO, Duncan, Fiona, and even Anders were recruited as a means of escaping some other unpleasant fate.

I suppose some others might want to join because of the sort of comradeship and purpose that one generally finds in a military organization. The benefits of joining the Wardens specifically, instead of your own country's military, would be that the Wardens are supposed to be politically neutral, and as such might attract various kinds of misfits not wanted elsewhere.

Then there are the ones with a mission. These people truly believe that being a GW is "a calling," as Stroud seems to. They believe that darkspawn are evil and need to be eradicated.

Being a Warden affects different people in different ways. Anders hated it and attempted to escape it, just as he escaped being in the Ferelden circle. Carver, while not enjoying it, felt that he was serving a useful purpose and making something of himself away from his sibling's shadow. I'm sure that no matter the circumstances of joining the Wardens, some eventually come to think of it as an honor, while still others just count the days until they go to their final fight in the Deep Roads, or are killed in some skirmish with the darkspawn.

If there is one thing that DAO, DAA, The Calling, and Legacy illustrate is that there are various sorts of people in the Wardens, just as there are in all walks of life, and they will each feel differently about what they do and why they are doing it.

[Tatinger]

As Joseph Campbell would say: "The hero sacrifices himself for something greater -- that's the morality of [being a hero]".

[sylvanaerie]

Anders was just all about the "Don't fence me in" and couldn't have cared less about the Wardens, it was just a 'get out of the Circle, free' card. His attitudes in DAO:A and DA2 really project that. When questioned about it, he even says, one day either the Circle or the Wardens will find him and drag him back. (Though I doubt the Circle will want him back with Justice inside him, he's just as likely to get the 'sword of mercy').
Riordan says the Wardens recruit anyone with skill, murderers, thieves, blood mages, kinslayers, so Loghain would fit right in. Who wants someone at your back just as likely to shove a knife between your ribs as kill the enemy? It all boils down to who do you trust? I get the feeling these sorts even stand to the side during Joinings and take bets on who will die and who will live?
That said, there are various types from that pool who join. In Ostagar, Jory is clearly unsuitable from the moment you meet him, you can tell he's not going to make it, but Daveth had such a positive attitude from the beginning, I kind of hoped. Even though he's the 'less reliable' one, it was Daveth who argued FOR the Wardens where Jory, the knightly guy, did nothing but whine and complain. And Jory was a volunteer. Neither Daveth or the PC Warden were recruited by choice (depending on how you RP your Warden).
It depends mostly on the person I think whether they can be trusted, and how they view being a warden. For some it could 'rehabilitate' and turn them around serving some higher purpose, (like Daveth-who in my mind died a true Warden), or they can stagnate and despise what has happened to them.
And to answer the OP's second point, I always kill Loghain, my Warden just doesn't trust someone who has spent the entire Blight trying to kill her, and the numbers don't change. You just traded someone who is young, healthy, and an excellent warrior for some old fart who's best years are 30 years ago in the past.

[nightscrawl]

SkittlesKat96 wrote...

In Westoros (the world in ASOIAF)... you get the choice to join the Night's Watch instead of get executed. And the Night's Watch go to the Wall where they protect
Westoros from the Wildlings, the Others and the other threats from the North (similar to with the Darkspawn and the Deep Roads.)

This is an interesting comparison. It's mentioned that a noble house sending a son to The Wall to join the Night's Watch used to be considered an honor. But it's been hundreds of years since there was any real threat, just as there were hundreds of years between the fourth and fifth (DAO) blights. Throughout the books (I'm still reading book four) The Night's Watch pleads with the kings(s) for more men to fill their ranks, citing danger from beyond The Wall, but no one takes heed. Similarly, with the darkspawn amassing near Ostagar, Cailan and Loghain still speak derisively about the threat.

Although it's horrible to say, Ostagar needed to happen so that people could see that the darkspawn threat is still very real. As we know from DAO, the darkspawn army at Ostagar was a pittance of their actual force. If they had been defeated, no one would have listened if Duncan had tried to convince them that the Archdemon was out there and waiting for us to grow complacent again.

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Unless they submit to the law of the land, they are a threat. Given the fact that Grey Wardens can ignore laws regarding things such as blood magic, and are likely packed with brigands, murderers, and rapists who lack scruples, I would be very suspicious of such an organization. I would assist them, of course, when necessary, but having so much unilateral power in the hands of suspect individuals would turn society on its head, especially now that they have an arling.

Just wait, that "we accept all" mentality is going to bite them soon enough.

Unfortunately, the events of The Calling and DAO do little to dispel these views. Genevieve recruited Duncan out of her own personal vengeance and the desire to see him die in the joining ritual. Although he was an unsavory type originally, Duncan matured into the strong leader we know from DAO, so for him it turned out well. That's not to say that there aren't other examples of people like him being recruited that do not turn out well.

We actually don't know how many bad-types are recruited into the Wardens on a regular basis. Unfortunately, the decision is up to the Warden Commander of the region, and as The Calling and DAO illustrate, they can conscript anyone they choose, even if their motives are less-than-noble.

In a way, it's a Catch-22. As you say, the ranks of the Wardens will contain these individuals, but on the other hand they will be placed in a military organization where discipline and training is enforced, possibly making better individuals out of them. Or they might even die in the joining. Either way, they are being removed from the general population.

Also, like A Song of Ice and Fire, you have to consider that normal people don't want to join the Wardens. If you have some farmer who is only concerned with providing for his family, he certainly isn't going to want to abandon them. If however, that same farmer commits murder and is going to be executed, he might be persuaded into joining the Wardens instead.

Incidentally, being a murderer doesn't necessarily make you a bad sort, especially in the social climate of Westeros or Thedas. Committing murder generally just means you are prepared to kill, for whatever reason, which is necessary in battle. As far as brigands and rapists are concerned, I laugh at this. People in the Ice and Fire books comment about the types of men who are sent to The Wall for similar reasons, the "quality" of Watchman being lowered over the years. But the war that takes place throughout the books if full of raping, looting, and blighting of the land on all sides of the conflict. Nobles on one side ravage the land of their opponents, rape and kill their smallfolk, and then the rivals do the same in retaliation. It's pathetically hypocritical, and the only people who suffer are the farmers and other normal folks who have nothing to do with any conflict other than living on the land.

Loghain may lament the rape and murder of his own mother at the hands of the Orlesians (the source of his intense hatred and distrust of them and any possible future alliance Cailan might try to make), even going as far as to remind people of such acts during his address to the nobles shortly after Ostagar, but I guarantee you that similar things were done during the civil war that HE STARTED, and by his own men.

So, let's not crucify the Wardens for possibly having people among their ranks who do the same sorts of things that are passively condoned by the noble commanders of a Bann or Arl's armies.

[AlexXIV]

They are usually recruited by veteran Grey Wardens. They seem to be a better sort. Like Duncan or Riordan. They are probably picky about their recruits even if they don't have to be. I guess Duncan could have found more than three to join them at Ostagar, but he was going with only three. Of which none was a murderer or rapist. And even though Riordan would take Loghain you have to take into account that Loghain is old already and even if he survives the Joining his years are counted. Calling will get him soon enough. And they are going to fight the Archdemon the next day. I doubt Riordan thought he would be the only one of them to perish in the battle ...

Modifié par AlexXIV, 28 décembre 2011 - 11:35 .

[Plaintiff]

I don't see why the two conditions have to be mutually exclusive. That said, being a Grey Warden may be an honour, but the Grey Wardens are not an honourable institution. Honour has no place in the organization; their job is to do what it takes to defeat the darkspawn and many of the tactics they employ to that end could be considered questionable.

There is no stipulation that you have to stay in the Order forever if you survive the Joining. An Anders who survives the events of Awakening will mention that he was actually expelled from the order for joining with Justice.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

It's a death sentence, that goes without saying.

Honour and sacrifice? Depends on the Warden. Not all of them join because they want to, or even stay to serve the order. Alistair can leave. Anders does. And in Awakening, Nathaniel, Velanna and Sigrun can all abandon the Grey, if you can trust anything the epilogue slides say anymore.

[TEWR]

It is neither, and yet it is both

[WhiteKnyght]

It's a calling. Nothing more.

In war, victory. In peace, vigilance. in death, sacrifice.

[nightscrawl]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

It's a calling. Nothing more.

In war, victory. In peace, vigilance. in death, sacrifice.

Oh please. Yes, my dwarf noble suddenly felt the calling after she was banished into the deep roads for killing (or being framed for killing) her brother. Or that my dwarf commoner felt the calling when deciding between exile, death, or possibly the best out of the three with the Wardens, for competing in the proving...

Human noble: Duncan gives you the opportunity for revenge against Howe.
City elf: you're about to be arrested when Duncan steps in.
Dalish elf: you have contracted the taint from the mirror and Duncan suggests that you join the Wardens to live.
Mage: you go with Duncan to escape punishment and Greagoir's wrath for helping Jowan to escape.

I can understand how someone might RP getting into the Warden's mission throughout the game itself, but there is certainly nothing in any of the origins to indicate that your character felt any sort of calling. And taking RP out of the situation altogether, there are examples of people who joined for similar reasons (ie to save their hides), Duncan and Anders being the most prominent example of this.

[sylvanaerie]

Daveth as well, was caught by guards in Denerim just before Duncan recruited him.

[Fast Jimmy]

nightscrawl wrote...

I can understand how someone might RP getting into the Warden's mission throughout the game itself, but there is certainly nothing in any of the origins to indicate that your character felt any sort of calling. And taking RP out of the situation altogether, there are examples of people who joined for similar reasons (ie to save their hides), Duncan and Anders being the most prominent example of this.

True, almost every Origin story was about how you were forced into the Wardens. But you also had the dialogue options to say (and act) like it was a great honor.

Also, I feel like part of the honor/benefit/boon of being in the Wardens is the comraderie. Facing things like waves of Darkspawn, nightmares from the Taint, your own mortality as your time to enter the Deep Roads the last time approaches... these are all shared burdens with your fellow Wardens. By keeping vigilant the threat of the Blights and the Darkspawn, you honor those who you share this lifestyle with and those who came before you. And there is honor in that.

[CrimsonZephyr]

nightscrawl wrote...

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Unless they submit to the law of the land, they are a threat. Given the fact that Grey Wardens can ignore laws regarding things such as blood magic, and are likely packed with brigands, murderers, and rapists who lack scruples, I would be very suspicious of such an organization. I would assist them, of course, when necessary, but having so much unilateral power in the hands of suspect individuals would turn society on its head, especially now that they have an arling.

Just wait, that "we accept all" mentality is going to bite them soon enough.

Unfortunately, the events of The Calling and DAO do little to dispel these views. Genevieve recruited Duncan out of her own personal vengeance and the desire to see him die in the joining ritual. Although he was an unsavory type originally, Duncan matured into the strong leader we know from DAO, so for him it turned out well. That's not to say that there aren't other examples of people like him being recruited that do not turn out well.

We actually don't know how many bad-types are recruited into the Wardens on a regular basis. Unfortunately, the decision is up to the Warden Commander of the region, and as The Calling and DAO illustrate, they can conscript anyone they choose, even if their motives are less-than-noble.

In a way, it's a Catch-22. As you say, the ranks of the Wardens will contain these individuals, but on the other hand they will be placed in a military organization where discipline and training is enforced, possibly making better individuals out of them. Or they might even die in the joining. Either way, they are being removed from the general population.

Also, like A Song of Ice and Fire, you have to consider that normal people don't want to join the Wardens. If you have some farmer who is only concerned with providing for his family, he certainly isn't going to want to abandon them. If however, that same farmer commits murder and is going to be executed, he might be persuaded into joining the Wardens instead.

Incidentally, being a murderer doesn't necessarily make you a bad sort, especially in the social climate of Westeros or Thedas. Committing murder generally just means you are prepared to kill, for whatever reason, which is necessary in battle. As far as brigands and rapists are concerned, I laugh at this. People in the Ice and Fire books comment about the types of men who are sent to The Wall for similar reasons, the "quality" of Watchman being lowered over the years. But the war that takes place throughout the books if full of raping, looting, and blighting of the land on all sides of the conflict. Nobles on one side ravage the land of their opponents, rape and kill their smallfolk, and then the rivals do the same in retaliation. It's pathetically hypocritical, and the only people who suffer are the farmers and other normal folks who have nothing to do with any conflict other than living on the land.

Loghain may lament the rape and murder of his own mother at the hands of the Orlesians (the source of his intense hatred and distrust of them and any possible future alliance Cailan might try to make), even going as far as to remind people of such acts during his address to the nobles shortly after Ostagar, but I guarantee you that similar things were done during the civil war that HE STARTED, and by his own men.

So, let's not crucify the Wardens for possibly having people among their ranks who do the same sorts of things that are passively condoned by the noble commanders of a Bann or Arl's armies.

Your comparison with Westeros is pathetically simple, sir (or ma'am). The culture of Ferelden is nowhere nearly as brutal as that of Westeros, so the idea that the nobles, soldiers, and townspeople are just as brutal as the scum you'd meet in the darkest depths of a prison is just myopic. With the exception of Howe and that guy from the city elf origin, none of them ever since to the depths of say...Roose Bolton, Tywin Lannister, or the Greyjoy clan when it comes to sheer brutality, or for that matter, most of their bannerman. Saying that being a rapist or murderer is irrelevant because the nobles and many of the knights are markedly and obviously not these types of people, whereas the Wardens actively recruit from the prison population. They give these people, who may have committed horrible crimes or indeed, will continue to do so when given such limitless political power. Now that they have an arling, this problem is even worse.

You see, the difference between rape and pillaging happening in war and rapists and pillagers given free rein to kill things is that in the former case, most of the bannorn did not say "rape and kill as many ordinary citizens as possible" whereas the Wardens actively disregard that the people they recruit may be sociopaths just waiting for a way out. One is a symptom of an unpleasant, but necessary act, the other is giving power to those who have already deemed themselves unworthy to be members of society. It may be small comfort to a farmer, but morality does not really concern itself with small perspectives and is largely detached. But to say "government is full of rapists and killers" and then respond and say "we should add more!" is just stupid.

At best, Grey Wardens should get their pick of the army, which would already have a code of discipline. But to recruit literally anyone, including the worst criminals and blood mages, and give them extrajuridicial powers, where not even the Chantry can prosecute them? That's a recipe for disaster.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 28 décembre 2011 - 04:22 .

[GavrielKay]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

At best, Grey Wardens should get their pick of the army, which would already have a code of discipline. But to recruit literally anyone, including the worst criminals and blood mages, and give them extrajuridicial powers, where not even the Chantry can prosecute them? That's a recipe for disaster.

I suppose it would depend on who was out recruiting.  Duncan obviously was looking for folks that he saw had some potential to make good Wardens.  I'm sure he could have gathered up any number of murderers, rapists and theives around Ferelden, but he didn't.  In all of the origins that I can recall (I'm really fuzzy on the dwarf ones) if you press him enough, he will eventually tell you that he's not just sparing your life, he actually thinks the Wardens would benefit from having you.

Saying they will do whatever it takes to defeat a Blight should include not recruiting a bunch of murderous bastards who pillage the countryside while fighting Darkspawn.  After all, turning the populace against them only makes their job harder.

The Nights Watch is different in an important way.  The watch are all located at the Wall.  They do not mix freely with the rest of the citizens of the realm.  I would imagine the worst of that lot, who are simply too evil to really take to the watch and its purpose are just sent north of the wall repeatedly until they end up dead or deserters.

The Wardens move around more and anyone truly evil in their ranks would have to be dealt with eventually.

[GarethJShep]

i took the dark ritual so... i didnt do my job LOL shamfuly i admit i got quite attached to male male mage warden Gareth i did not want him to die

[Urzon]

Talking about the ASOIAF series always makes me sad. I loved the first two books, but the later books (and the LONG LONG waits) drove away any interest in the series for me. I'm hoping HBO will do a good job with the rest of the books, like they did with the first one. Never thought i would be saying those words...

Anyway...

The Night Watch is more of a place to exile criminals now than anything else. They might have started off like the Grey Wardens, them being full of honor of sacrifice and whatnot, but after centuries of decay; they have become a misfit band of theives, thugs, rapists, murderers, and the few rare goodhearted folk under a banner with a bit of military training. Not the best combinations.

The Grey Wardens could have easily turned out like them during the long wait between Blights before DAO, but the saving grace was the  sparatic darkspawn attacks in Thedas. They caused just enough of a problem for all the nations of Thedas to keep the Grey Wardens active. The Night Watch didn't have that. With no sign of the Others, they slowly faded into myth, and the kingdoms slowly stop supporting the Night Watch. Sure there were wildlings, but they had Winterfell and the Night Watch to deal with them.

[Ponendus]

It depends on one's character I suppose. My warden was honored by the opportunity to do good in the world, but depressed at the thought of a short existence.

I guess the good thing about the Warden as a story mechanic is that it makes one think of such things. Remember the Warden did not really make a choice, they were told about all the disastrous things that come along with being a Warden at the time of, or after, the Joining. In addition, had they refused the Joining they would be killed. Such a thing stirs up a lot of self-reflection on the part of the player-character for all of these reasons - a brilliant achievement by the writing team really.

[Gervaise]

Would just like to point out to the Plaintiff that Anders was not booted out of the Wardens. He either feigned his death in order to get away or (if you follow the short story) he was called out by a templar recruit over his behaviour and killed him and a bunch of Grey Wardens before making good his escape. Since there were no witnesses to this event it is likely the wardens didn't associate him with the deed. Alistair and Fiona were exceptions to the rule - being a warden is for life and if you betray them, death would usually follow like with any army but that doesn't mean you are no longer a warden.

Being a warden can be seen as a honour and clearly many people perceive them as heroes. When Averline criticises the order, Sebastian is quick to jump to their defence. They do recruit questionable characters but on the basis that they do bring something useful to the wardens. It is normally made clear that once a warden, always a warden. As Riordan says, no matter where you go you will still have the taint within you, so from that point of view you are always a warden even if you do desert them, as Anders found out in Legacy. However, the secrecy the wardens adopt over their admission ritual and its consequences, mean that the majority of recruits have no idea prior to taking it what they are risking when they do so. So it is a sacrifice but not one that is taken knowingly and as a result I have always been somewhat ambivalent about the "honour" of being a warden. In some ways, for a criminal, it is a bit like the Rite of Tranquility. It saves you from execution but at a cost of part of your humanity. You have a prolonged death sentence ending in madness, instead of a swift one.

As for those who volunteer, I think the warden's treat them shabbily in not revealing the true cost to either them or their families. Nathaniel says that they never knew what became of their relative but realises in hindsight that he must have failed the joining. So it would appear that Jordy's wife would never have known what became of him. Why he had to be killed always seemed horrible. If that is the attitude the wardens have to take, then they should take only single people or those with grown up children. To knowingly take someone who is just married with a child on the way and then not let him opt out when he has second thoughts, to my mind is criminal. There is no evidence that they continue to support widows or orphans they create.

In Awakening, the wardens have just suffered a massacre at the beginning, so the warden taking on questionable people such as Anders and Nathaniel is understandable, given that both demonstrate abilities that the wardens can use. The difference between them would seem to be that Anders always saw it as a way to escape the templars and nothing more. When my warden tried to be honest with him about the downside of being a warden, Anders just did not want to hear it (you suffer a negative point loss over it). He also questioned my warden about what he was going to do in the future as though there was an alternative to being a warden and reacted favourably to the notion that they might use their warden status to advance their own agenda. Clearly wardens can't always be trusted - look at what happened in Legacy - the actions of that warden mage were certainly not approved by the leadership. And the reason the wardens were originally thrown out of Ferelden was over a warden misusing their status.

So I would say that to the population on the whole they are perceived as heroes but the reality is somewhat less noble.

[jwalker]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

It's a calling. Nothing more.

In war, victory. In peace, vigilance. in death, sacrifice.

A calling  ? really ?

Looks like the warden's most succesful recruitment method is just prey on good desperate people. When your immediate future looks really black you say, "what the hell, let's join the mysterious order and see what happens"

If being a warden can be an honor, that might depend on the character. But it's a death sentence for everybody.

[Plaintiff]

Gervaise wrote...

Would just like to point out to the Plaintiff that Anders was not booted out of the Wardens. He either feigned his death in order to get away or (if you follow the short story) he was called out by a templar recruit over his behaviour and killed him and a bunch of Grey Wardens before making good his escape. Since there were no witnesses to this event it is likely the wardens didn't associate him with the deed. Alistair and Fiona were exceptions to the rule - being a warden is for life and if you betray them, death would usually follow like with any army but that doesn't mean you are no longer a warden.

"The Wardens agreed we can't harbor an abomination," he is saying, nasal voice vibrating with smug satisfaction, and I don't need to hear more. He's brought the templars down on me, on us, and this is just what we've been waiting for.

The Wardens and the Templars are working together to take down Anders; representatives of both groups are present. They plan to either kill him or send him back to the Circle, most likely the former. Either way, it's safe to say he's out of the club. 'Warden' is a job description, not a biological classification. It's perfectly possible to simply stop doing it. The taint and its specific side effects are for life, being a Warden is not, depsite what the organization itself might have you believe, and simply being tainted isn't enough to make you a Warden anyway.

While it may be something of an unwritten law, there are no real measures in place to prevent people from leaving if they want to, they don't devote much time or energy to chasing down deserters that I can see, and in Awakening, several of your companions, despite being inducted into the order, will leave under various circumstances.

Neither Nathaniel or Stroud will kill Anders if they encounter him, and a warden sibling in DA2 is free to ditch their supposed higher duty to pursue personal goals in associated DLC.