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[rabidhanar]

With an obvious troll is obvious post up there...

Genophage necessary evil in galaxy: other races cannot stop fast breeding Krogan from engulfing galaxy. Krogan tendencies toward violent disputes (Ravaging of Tuchanka, Rachni Wars, Krogan Rebellions) lead to strained relationships. Ticking time bomb waiting to happen. Must increase fuse of bomb, decrease birth rates to slow the overpopulation of species to compensate. Less competition among Krogan, less need for resources, less need for more territory. Lower threat of war escalation, increase chances for peaceful negotiation with council races. Give time for adaptation to galactic role in society. Perhaps a change in Krogan Species in the future. Uncertain.

[Ticktank]

I wasn't trolling. The world is spiralling towards doom because of uncontrollable population growth. Just wait until we reach peak oil, food and energy levels, which won't be long. If you think that comfortable life of yours can still be sustained after adding another 2 billion mouths to feed, enjoy your deluded childhood.

In many ways, the reasons for humanity's population explosion are the same as the Krogan. The environment we live in is no longer harsh enough to keep our numbers in check.

[Dean_the_Young]

Amazingly, there are people here who remember that last several predictions of impending peak oil and Malthusian collapse.

Of course, there's also the common oversight that a Malthusian collapse often only lasts until the population returns to sustainable levels, because for the environment the most established method of all for population control is starvation.

[rabidhanar]

Humanity as a whole shall therefore either cull themselves (competition in it's finest form) due to military might/political prowess or expand. Certain countries will naturally begin to monopolize the resources we do have. Revolts of masses will occur over large areas of the planet(s), swift violent changes in governments, rise of dictatorships that promise better treatment. The Rich shall be richer, the poor poorer. Those are the only two options. Do not make me go out of my way to link Thane's Convo about what happened to the Drell.

Is it a bleak truth? Most truth is harmful in some nature. Far better to see what shall happen then to ignore it before it becomes too late. Will this be the end of the human race? Do not be rediculous. We live on a bell curve, the majority of the time we are in the center. When we begin getting too big, we have war and famine, which brings down the population cap until we can sustain ourselves again. Then the process repeats itself to the infinite degree.

Modifié par rabidhanar, 01 janvier 2012 - 02:32 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Malthusian collapse fiction is about as much the truth as any other sort.

You could just as well see a return to de facto colonizations in which there are stable regions and unstable regions, you could have widespread Zimbabwe's (the rich are poor, the poor are destitue), you could have mass collectivization movements. You could have fast collapse or slow, terminal or temporary, accidental or deliberate. The most populous country in the world today is going to undergo a population shrinkage of its own design.

You could also do what happened and has happened since Malthus made his prediction, and see science and industries continue to increase and break the underlying assumptions that predict collapse.

[GreenDragon37]

No. God no.

A complete cure for the Genophage would undermine all of the work Wrex put into changing the Krogan culture. The Krogan are a violent race, but we have seen that they can be improved. Especially if you have Wrex. The Genophage does not need to be fully cured, it should be modified a little. Krogan should not give birth to still born babies. That's horrifing.

We don't want to go back to the era of the Krogan Empire. Especially not after the Reaper War.

Under Wrex, a cure may be possible down the line.
Under Wreav... never.

Modifié par GreenDragon37, 01 janvier 2012 - 04:35 .

[KadianK]

AlphaDormante wrote...

KadianK wrote...

No one really considered that it would takes years for them to perfect a cure for the genophage.

Mordin: "Best years of my life."
Mordin: "Still years away from the cure, but closer then starting from scratch."

Considering it took many years to create the genophage in the first place.
The cure that Maelon is working on is worse then doing nothing, so copying the data is basically a miss fire in the first place.

Actually, Mordin helped modify the genophage, which was in his own words much more difficult than simply making it. So reversing the process shouldn't take quite as long.

Your point still stands, though. However much time has been shaved off the process, Mordin DID say "years". And we don't have years.

Agreed. =) 

[chaosomegas]

Ticktank wrote...

I wasn't trolling. The world is spiralling towards doom because of uncontrollable population growth. Just wait until we reach peak oil, food and energy levels, which won't be long. If you think that comfortable life of yours can still be sustained after adding another 2 billion mouths to feed, enjoy your deluded childhood.

In many ways, the reasons for humanity's population explosion are the same as the Krogan. The environment we live in is no longer harsh enough to keep our numbers in check.

go tell nasa speed up man mission to mars and start building spaceships that can fit 1000 people so we can start move people to mars. i think move 10% human population off world it increase worlds live able by 400 years 500 if we start space mine plus we can see if bioware right about mass effect thing lol

[Ryzaki]

I just hope we can convince Wrex to go along with an increased birthrate for Krogans but nowhere near pre-genophage levels.

I doubt it though.

[Bat32391]

Honestly I would cure it to give them a second chance but if they screw it up it should be dropped again.

[KadianK]

Bat32391 wrote...

Honestly I would cure it to give them a second chance but if they screw it up it should be dropped again.

Second chance is all they need to make every other alien race extinct. Their much further in technology then their ancestors. 

[TheAntiMoral]

in my opinion they should cure the genophage, but have like some type of law where if you have to many babies you'll get exiled or something like that. But the krogan would really be a big help when fighting the reapers

[KadianK]

TheAntiMoral wrote...

in my opinion they should cure the genophage, but have like some type of law where if you have to many babies you'll get exiled or something like that. But the krogan would really be a big help when fighting the reapers

Yeah great idea, if they have too many babies we'll exile them and either slaughter their babies, or exile them with the babies.

Exiling them with their babies, would cause off world chaos.

Slaughtering their babies is inhumain. 

[notsoavragejoe]

I saved the cure during the mission, but I'm not sure that it would do that much good unless the Krogan had more leaders like Wrex, which is highly unlikely for the Krogan species as a whole. If you do get a choice to cure them then I will, but I also saved the Rachni so mabey I just make awful decisions in the game. An anyway, it gave me 100% paragon again, so double reason to do it.

[neenee77]

we can all do what we want in our playthroughs. I will cure it no matter who's in charge, because it's the right thing to do. in keeping with the op though should shepard (no matter who) cure it? i say yes. it's the right thing to do. someone brought up the klingons and i agree. to compare to star trek further, the Vulcans used to be an extremely violent race before they started meditating and controlling all their emotions. I look at it this way if the krogan go back to trying to take over the galaxy then there is a story for the next game of the series.

[KadianK]

neenee77 wrote...

we can all do what we want in our playthroughs. I will cure it no matter who's in charge, because it's the right thing to do. in keeping with the op though should shepard (no matter who) cure it? i say yes. it's the right thing to do. someone brought up the klingons and i agree. to compare to star trek further, the Vulcans used to be an extremely violent race before they started meditating and controlling all their emotions. I look at it this way if the krogan go back to trying to take over the galaxy then there is a story for the next game of the series.

I'm sure it's just as easy to make something up.

[Di-Hydrogen-Monoxide]

The practical side of me says leave it as it is (allows stable population) and attempt to make the Krogans realise this.

The part of me that likes Krogans says cure it.

[Brownfinger]

This is something that I've been conflicted over, and still can't make a definitive choice on.

Logic tells me that the eventual consequence will be a danger to the galaxy. But, this trilogy and our decisions end immediately after the game has concluded, and we don't get to see any long term result. Not unless Bioware steps in and establishes a "canon" story path for future Mass Effect games. Unless the next Mass Effect game is a prequel, which is my guess.

So, in the short term, it's probably a good thing. And it will make my Krogan buddies happy. In the context of a video game universe, yeah I'd save the Krogan. But if this was an actual decision with real repercussions, I'd keep them bottled up. Their birth rates are crazy, and they're too irresponsibly dumb and violent.

Love 'em, though.

[mitthrawuodo]

rabidhanar wrote...

Humanity as a whole shall therefore either cull themselves (competition in it's finest form) due to military might/political prowess or expand. Certain countries will naturally begin to monopolize the resources we do have. Revolts of masses will occur over large areas of the planet(s), swift violent changes in governments, rise of dictatorships that promise better treatment. The Rich shall be richer, the poor poorer. Those are the only two options. Do not make me go out of my way to link Thane's Convo about what happened to the Drell.

Is it a bleak truth? Most truth is harmful in some nature. Far better to see what shall happen then to ignore it before it becomes too late. Will this be the end of the human race? Do not be rediculous. We live on a bell curve, the majority of the time we are in the center. When we begin getting too big, we have war and famine, which brings down the population cap until we can sustain ourselves again. Then the process repeats itself to the infinite degree.

The worst case scenario is nuclear war kicked off and we end up with one of the post-apocalypse world or pure extinction of all life. Perhaps the best case is like the Krogan/star trek in which we are uplifted by aliens for showing potential or danger (best way to stop an enemy is to make them a friend) to them. Your idea may be right or too soft. These days companies can wield more power than governments and they will be a major player in the future, however it could come down to people who put practicality first vs those who put morals first.

It will be interesting with the Krogan because Wrex could  lead them nobly in to a better future will the other guy could continue with the civil war so in the end though there might be more krogan they will either be safe or killing each other (few krogan have the idea to unite - fewer live to lead)

[Nhorn]

I think this is why the genophage resonates so strongly with players, because it easily relates back to us. We have similar savagery to the krogan in our species, so in parallel it becomes a question, that if you could infect humans with a genophage to cure our population problems etc. would you?

I didn't cure the genophage, for the record.

Thought it was the single most powerful point in Bioware's games, the scene is so damn powerful if you have kill Mordin and have Wrex thanking you after your betrayal.

[Nanuzsh]

The problem is that humans don't reproduce 1000 babies a YEAR, we don't live for 1000 years nor do we have regenaration and secondary organs.


In light of that knowledge curing the genophage is a bad choice if Wrex and Eve are dead.

Even if both are alive you should have had the option of Sabotaging the cure and still keep Wrex's support.


Wrex already has the cure. In the form of Eve and the research Data. Curing ALL the Krogans in tuchanka is a mistake. He had the cure in the palm of his hand he could use that to leverage support and unite the krogan under the Urdnot Banner.

If he cured all of them he would loose that leverage. He could force the krogan to not rebel by withholding the cure to the rebellious and dangerous krogans like Wreav. In a way truely ensuring the krogans have a path forward.


Shepard should have been able to show Wrex the value of not curing ALL the Krogans. Just the good ones.


That could have been an awesome political twist.


What do you think Dean!

[VampireSoap]

I don't mean to be offensive, but...uh...how come this thread was not locked for "discussing story spoilers" while millions of others were locked. It's a little bit unfair, don't you think?

[Vubica]

OFC you should cure it, the Salarians and the galactic community in general has played god with the Krogan race on more then one instance.....

[WarpedDog]

I'm not so sure if outright CURING it is such a good idea - even with Wrex and Eve in charge others may rebell once they have the cure. I'd tend more towards another modification that allows more krogan to be born and spares them from looking at mountains of stillborn.