147 réponses à ce sujet

[ladyofpayne]

renjility wrote...

ladyofpayne wrote...

Zevrzn isn't evil person. He kills no more than like Warden. I can't say that he is like Morinth or Hannibal Lector. 

He indeed isn't evil, but in his first few conversations, he can come across as fairly ruthless by happily claiming he enjoys killing. But when you take the time to get his approval up and get to know him better, you learn he really is not a bad person. I think the same can be said about Morrigan.


I think it can be interesting to have a ruthless companion, but I'd prefer that he/she still has some grey aspects that make him/her not Disney bad-guy evil. There always should be more to the character. What is good or evil depends on the point of view of the person. 

Oh, and no insane aspect that should rectify their evilness. Enough with the insane bad guys after DAII. 

He tell it to player, yes. But I really don't see it in game. In Anvil he don't punish Player to use it, but Morinth. Isabela is a pirate but I really can't say that she is like Ann Bonny, who was cruelty and ruthless. 

Modifié par ladyofpayne, 04 janvier 2012 - 05:57 .

[Pleasureslave]

Zevran is closer to Scoundrel achetype. He is professional, yes, but not ruthless or cruel.

[SomniariKess1124]

I played evil in dragon age origns; its kind of fun, but it made me kind of guilty afterwards. i stayed sarcastic/ humorus hawke but made free the mages but don't take it out on templars choices.

[Pedrak]

I support the presence of evil companions - although I almost exclusively roleplay a good guy who gets along well with nicer companions, morally questionable party members add much-needed variety.

However, I'd also like their presence to have some kind of weight, of consequence.

For example, if you are playing a goody-two-shoes and keep an obviously evil guy in your party, this choice might bite you in the rear later - ex. the evil guy steals your stuff, betrays you, murders another companion... When the cracks in the relationship begin to appear, you may keep the guy around because he is useful (but have troubles later) or kick him out of the party and go on without him.

Viceversa for a good party member and an evil pc - he/she turns against you to stop you.

Modifié par Pedrak, 04 janvier 2012 - 09:28 .

[Thiefy]

Only if there is one or more characters there to mind screw or troll the evil characters. What I really liked about Bishop's "evilness" is how others interacted with him; and I don't just mean Casavir. Pretty sure all the characters at one point in time or more took a jab at him just as he would jab at them.

[TEWR]

Are those Pokemon eggs in your sig, Thief-of-Hearts?

As for evil companions, not really.

[surfgirlusa_2006]

This echoes the sentiments of several others who posted, but I'll throw in my two cents' worth. I'm fine with evil companions, as long as they are still complex and nuanced characters rather than caricatures or stock villains found in bad adventure books.

Modifié par surfgirlusa_2006, 04 janvier 2012 - 11:09 .

[Mark of the Dragon]

I dont want a character that is just straight up evil. I would rather meet them in a really bad situation and then if you decide they should join you get to know them with that in mind. For example meeting Sten and knowing he murdered a whole family, including the children, really made me not like him at first. He seemed more evil and learning his reason why made him worse. Eventually however he grew on me and while I couldn't ever consolidate his choice I could forgive him. I dont want someone predefined evil because there would be no point in getting to know them. Thats my opinion at least.

[Silfren]

Cultist wrote...

Would you like to see evil andor malicious companions in Dragon Age 3?
Not scoundrels or opportunists but cruel and ruthless party members
like Edwin, Viconia, Bishop or One-Of-Many?
Dragon Age 2, as well as DA:O got only "grey" companions. But would you like to see someone who is actually evil? Like tevinter magister, who is not repenting for owning slaves and abusing his power, blood mage, who wish to butcher templars or consort with demons. Assassins without moral code, reaver who fights just to spill more blood and defeat more foes?
We got a lot of good and neutral ones, but not a single bad guygirl on our side. the closest one to "evil companion" was Morrigan.

Not especially, at least insofar as the descriptions you gave for the examples of Tevinter Magister or Blood Mage are not all that interesting.  Evil for the sake of being evil isn't really all that compelling. 

An assassin without a moral code isn't evil, IMO.  Not in the least.  Not having a moral code is not a necessary component of evil.  Neither is being cruel or ruthless, honestly.  Morrigan is a great example of a character with no moral code, and I wouldn't even consider her as "closest" to it, as you put it.  Shale could also be considered as amoral, at least to a degree.  Zevran, too.  For that matter, I think Isabella fits the bill.  Hell, in Origins, even a good-aligned Warden can choose to make ruthless decisions that don't effect whether they're "good" or "evil."  Executing Connor over his mother's screaming objections, even to the point of knocking her out, is ruthless, but there's a serious argument to its necessity, whether it's a "nice" thing to do or not.

There's actually a good reason why we're not given truly evil characters to play:  It's very damn difficult to have a heroic game where the ultimate objective is to save the world from evil, when you're allied with objectively evil character(s). 

This is why it's easier--and better, I think--to have grey characters who do evil things.  There are some actions that few people would argue as NOT being evil, while the motivations of the people behind the actions very much is open to interpretation.  Anders in DA2 is the most extreme example of this, but there's also the Anvil quest in Origins, the question of whether to abandon Redcliffe, etc. 

But no.  I've no interest in playing a character who is unabashedly, gleefully evil for the sheer sake of evilness.  That kind of nonsense is better left to unambiguous children's programming, like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles or Sailor Moon.  Leave it off my Bioware, please.

[Silfren]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

 Personally, no.

'Evil' characters do not fit with the Dragon Age games IMO.  A few things to take into consideration:

1) In Baldur's Gate, the PC him/herself could be good or evil, or neutral.  You were allowed to perform good and evil actions.  This is not possible in Dragon Age.  It is possible to be mean or uncaring, or very focused on your objective, but there is no doubt that both The Warden and Hawke are goody-goody two shoes who want to save the world, not crush and rule over it while killing as many kittens as possible.

Eh, you can very easily play a selfish, non-goody-goody two shoes Warden.  It's difficult to have wealth, status, and power when your nation's been reduced to a smoking crater.  The Warden can be a ruthless, ends-justify-the-means character who isn't in the least bit a goody two shoes, or an all-round **** who just wants the glory.  Indeed, the latter's how I played my cynical and embittered City Elf Rogue.

[Luminus]

I am planning to play the Baldur's Gate Saga again with an evil team.
If there weren't any evil NPCs in the game, I wouldn't have much incentive to play it again. And I mean I wouldn't have a much different experience, I would just play it again because it was fun.

If DAIII wants to be considered a serious RPG, it should have realistic options and realistic companions.
Not all people are goody-two-shoes or "grey" characters. Some are really benevolent, kind, good-hearted and sweet. And others are just greedy, power-hungry, hateful, angry and some are just psychopaths.

If I am playing an evil character, I want evil companions so I don't feel like I am travelling with a bunch of losers and wimps, that cramp my style.

[Plaguemaster]

As long this evil is rational I'd like to see them. Being bad for badness sake - no, thanks.

[SeanMurphy2]

I liked how it was in Origins. Often things were not presented as clear cut good or evil, especially the mid game choices.

I also liked how companions logic and moral judgements did have complexity. So there were not always predictable reactions to a situation. Morrgian could be in favour of releasing a prisoner. Or Leliana could advocate doing something quite ruthless. Because their logic can be based on multiple aspects of their beliefs and personality.

Not just the good evil chaotic lawful structure.

Modifié par SeanMurphy2, 05 janvier 2012 - 09:27 .

[SeanMurphy2]

Could be one of those things that sounds cool. But may end up being annoying in practice.

DA2 had companions with their own independent agenda going around messing things up. Rather than being mostly dependent and subservient to the protagonist.


Youi could have an evil companion who does his own thing, kills people and makes decisions for you because he thinks he is the protagonist. But it would be annoying.

[Marionetten]

Definitely. I'd love to see an absolutely irredeemable companion for once. Cicero was a blast in Skyrim.

Thief-of-Hearts wrote...

Only if there is one or more characters there to mind screw or troll the evil characters. What I really liked about Bishop's "evilness" is how others interacted with him; and I don't just mean Casavir. Pretty sure all the characters at one point in time or more took a jab at him just as he would jab at them.

I absolutely loved the banter between Bishop and the other party members. Him commenting on Elanee acting like a female dog in heat around the protagonist was golden. Not to mention threats of using Grobnar as a pin cushion. Every party needs an ass and Bishop delivered in spades.

Modifié par Marionetten, 05 janvier 2012 - 09:59 .

[Plaguemaster]

There was also Qara, who was chaotic neutral, but gravitated steadily towards Evil realms with her lust for power, disregard for others and desire to show others her might.

[SkittlesKat96]

I think they shouldn't get too carried away with 'evilness' in characters...DA:O did a pretty good job with it, and it sort of was in the more grey and realistic area.

I mean I know there are evil maniacal jerks out there who are evil and I'm not saying evil characters don't exist (the OP already mentioned a bunch of evil characters) but I think they should just be a rare companion...I don't think it should be all like 'Okay guys lets make two or three evil companions for DA 3 and make sure we have at least one evil companion every Dragon Age game' or etc.

Morality is kind of a complicated thing and I think Morrigan, Shale, Zevran, Loghain and even Oghren are really well done in this aspect (DA 2 didn't have characters like this, not that that's a necessarily bad thing but I hope Bioware doesn't quit making characters like the ones I just mentioned)

Modifié par SkittlesKat96, 06 janvier 2012 - 01:25 .

[wsandista]

All characters are somewhat grey, but in DA:O Alistar was good and Loghain was evil. Alistar could be convinced to do something that seems heartless and Loghain at least thought he was doing what was best, but it is pretty evident by the majority of their actions where they stand on the good-evil axis. I just hope the evil companion is like Bishop, he was probably the best thing in NWN2

[jshadow]

Evil as Lord Scourge is Jedi Knight storyline?
dunno honestly

[ladyofpayne]

I'd like to see Sawyer - style NPC. Egocenrtic but reaaly charming guy.

[Slayer299]

OP I would absolutely *love* to see evil char's in DA3, that is something I've really missed in BW games for a while. You've had Death's Hand but he's the last evil char I can think of you can have in your party. I miss people like Shar-Teel, Edwin, Xzar, Tiax (who was a riot!) and the consequences of having them.

edit - hit enter by mistake too early.

Modifié par Slayer299, 12 janvier 2012 - 02:24 .

[Plaintiff]

What is "evil", anyway? That seems like an extremely subjective judgement.

Plenty of people see Anders as "evil" (or insane, or both), but personally I consider him to be entirely in the right. I agree with his actions and his moral views. Conversely, I find Aveline and Fenris to be self-righteous hypocrites, too blinded by the law (in Aveline's case) and their own biases (in both cases), to see the true injustice that occurs right under their noses.

Plenty of people see Morrigan as "evil", but I don't. I think those people have grossly misinterpreted her character.

I perceive the Chantry to be extremely evil; an oppressive fascist theocracy that knowingly perpetuates a cycle of bigotry and hatred, falsely claiming authority in the name of a dead woman and an absent god. I think it deliberately incites conflict between mages and the general populace to distract them from the fact that the Chantry itself is the real problem.

But many people don't agree. To them, the chantry is a force for good, taking in invisible orphans, protecting all of Thedas from being enslaved because blah blah blah.

Even if Bioware introduced a "really evil" companion, and told everyone who he/she was, who's to say that you would agree that he was "evil"?

[Luminus]

Plaintiff wrote...

What is "evil", anyway? That seems like an extremely subjective judgement.

Generally, evil is considered not caring to harm the innocent, without remorse, for selfish reasons.

If you kill some orcs that are killing innocent farmers, you are not evil.
If you make a deal with the orcs and kill the innocent farmers for money, status, power or fun, you are evil.

Modifié par Luminus, 12 janvier 2012 - 05:56 .

[Slayer299]

^ That pretty much says it for me.

@Plaintiff - And yes, Anders was evil. because his cause, right or wrong, he murdered innocents and thought that was fine. The whole "ends justify the means crap".