457 réponses à ce sujet

[Wulfram]

Hawke's voice, Lady Hawke's in particular, is very characterful, which makes it quite limiting in what sorts of character you can play.  It's strongly upper class, with a sense of confidence that is at least bordering on arrogance.  It could never fit, for example, my City Elf Warden

Morroian wrote...

I mean pre-defined as per the post I was replying to, yes the Warden is just as pre-defined as Hawke we just get a choice of pre-defined origins. 

Which choice makes a big difference, because you can choose the origin which has details which fit in best with the story that you want to play.

Modifié par Wulfram, 11 janvier 2012 - 12:49 .

[Deadmac]

Morroian wrote...

Deadmac wrote...

When you give the main character (pc) a voice, the actor (player) no longer plays a particular role. You become a spectator. Instead of being in the first person's perspective, you are now in the third person's perspective. If you played a 'table-top role-playing' game, the voice of the role you play is your own. As a result of keeping the silent protagonist, your inner voice and personality determines the pitch and tone of the dialogue. Once the player character is given a voice by another person, the player controlling the character can not use his or her imagination to form a personality. All you are doing is selecting an option, and then BioWare's voice actor is determining the chracter's personality. During a real roleplaying experience, the player's imagination is key in the creation of a character.

How does another person's voice represent me? My voice has a very specific pitch and tone, so how can a voice over player character represent my personality?

If you want to role play a completely different character to yourself why should it represent you? LIke I said in my previous post it is still possible to use imagination to create a character in the 3rd person that the player controls despite the VO. VO doesn't stop a player from doing this although it may restrict the options to an extent. Voice and tone aren't the entirety of a persons character.

Hmmm... You must have missed a line. You looked at the last sentence without leaving it in context.

Its all about making a personal interpretation about the personality of the character you play.

Modifié par Deadmac, 11 janvier 2012 - 12:46 .

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke's voice, Lady Hawke's in particular, is very characterful, which makes it quite limiting in what sorts of character you can play.  It's strongly upper class, with a sense of confidence that is at least bordering on arrogance.  It could never fit, for example, my City Elf Warden

Morroian wrote...

I mean pre-defined as per the post I was replying to, yes the Warden is just as pre-defined as Hawke we just get a choice of pre-defined origins. 

Which choice makes a big difference, because you can choose the origin which has details which fit in best with the story that you want to play.

Yep, Cousland fit my favorite character for being a noble and a knight. While Hawke is a common peasant who then rise to  nobility in a most pathetic way. I was hoping a more complex rise to power theme like the movie,
"A Knight's Tale" with some of plot line taken from the novels,  The Three Muskeeters

Sigh Da 2 is what happen when you put too much stories in 40 hours gameplay - 30 hours combat. There isn't any focus.

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 11 janvier 2012 - 01:18 .

[Wulfram]

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

[Plaintiff]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

I know, right? Aside from everyone calling him "Serrah" and "Messere", and the Viscount asking for personal favours, and Aveline constantly reminding him of the responsibility of his position, and Grand Cleric Elthina telling Hawke she's glad to see the Amell's returning to Hightown, and the Arishok remarking on Hawke's change of fortune, and Cullen mentioning it and Hawke's mother telling him how glad she is to be back in her childhood home, it's completely ignored.

[CrimsonZephyr]

Plaintiff wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

I know, right? Aside from everyone calling him "Serrah" and "Messere", and the Viscount asking for personal favours, and Aveline constantly reminding him of the responsibility of his position, and Grand Cleric Elthina telling Hawke she's glad to see the Amell's returning to Hightown, and the Arishok remarking on Hawke's change of fortune, and Cullen mentioning it and Hawke's mother telling him how glad she is to be back in her childhood home, it's completely ignored.

Yet he still needs loot dead bodies and scour trash bins in Darktown to make ends meet.

Must have blown the rest of the fortune on lyrium and ****s.

[Gibb_Shepard]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

I know, right? Aside from everyone calling him "Serrah" and "Messere", and the Viscount asking for personal favours, and Aveline constantly reminding him of the responsibility of his position, and Grand Cleric Elthina telling Hawke she's glad to see the Amell's returning to Hightown, and the Arishok remarking on Hawke's change of fortune, and Cullen mentioning it and Hawke's mother telling him how glad she is to be back in her childhood home, it's completely ignored.

Yet he still needs loot dead bodies and scour trash bins in Darktown to make ends meet.

Must have blown the rest of the fortune on lyrium and ****s.

Gameplay and story seggregation is kind of important here. 

Modifié par Gibb_Shepard, 11 janvier 2012 - 08:13 .

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Plaintiff wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

I know, right? Aside from everyone calling him "Serrah" and "Messere",

Everyone called him Serrah even when he is still a refugee.  

Plaintiff wrote...

and the Viscount asking for personal favours,

Yeah sure, since Hawke is known for doing errand works for everyone including the thugs.

Plaintiff wrote...


and Aveline constantly reminding him of the responsibility of his position,

What responsibility? He has no castle. No army. No servants. No king and lords to serve. No court. No horse...hmm... ok ,ignore the horse.

Plaintiff wrote...

and Grand Cleric Elthina telling Hawke she's glad to see the Amell's returning to Hightown,

Yeah? When she should have concern more about the Amell who sarcifice her life to end the 5th blight. That's the real Amell who deserve the credits. Hawke is not worthy of any respect from the Amell family.

Plaintiff wrote...

and the Arishok remarking on Hawke's change of fortune,

What fortune? The last time I checked Hawke only have 50 golds in his coin purse.

Plaintiff wrote...


and Cullen mentioning it and Hawke's mother telling him how glad she is to be back in her childhood home, it's completely ignored.

Cullen also mentioned something "there is no one like you and I". That guy couldn't even tell the difference between Rogue/Warrior and an apostate mage. And Leandra comments? It's home, that true. More likely an empty estate that I have to get an elf maid, Bodahn, Sandal and dog to keep it alive. Hawke is nothing I imagine as the medieval lords. He is more like a commoner with an estate than a king's knight like Sir Lancelot and the round table knights. 

Nope. Hawke never fit to be my character from his background to his personality.

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 11 janvier 2012 - 12:05 .

[Corine_esq]

What to say...I don't like Elders Scroll games at all.  I think that they are a giant world of side quest of little import.  Kind of like doing chores in a game.  My arguement for a silent protagonist is that they are the perfect picture of a Taoist disciple where everything molds them, but I've always felt that with a voice actor you can actually experiance a story with narrative and passion.  The further the main character gets away from being a doll, the better in my opinion.  Sorry, first post because having an empty world like Skyrim scares the ghost out of me.

[Morroian]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

What fortune? The last time I checked Hawke only have 50 golds in his coin purse.

The mansion is nothing is it? 

[Tartan1456]

Why give your Hawke 100s of coins when potions and stuff are fairly cheap, I mean a health potion is only about 30 silver each.

[IanPolaris]

Morroian wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

What fortune? The last time I checked Hawke only have 50 golds in his coin purse.

The mansion is nothing is it? 

Pretty much really.  The decore may be fancier, but I don't see much going for the Mansion over Gamlen's hovel.  Not even the neighborhood seems to be much better.

-Polaris

[Wulfram]

IanPolaris wrote...

Pretty much really.  The decore may be fancier, but I don't see much going for the Mansion over Gamlen's hovel.  Not even the neighborhood seems to be much better.

-Polaris

It doesn't have Gamlen in it, which is surely a virtue beyond price.

[IanPolaris]

Wulfram wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Pretty much really.  The decore may be fancier, but I don't see much going for the Mansion over Gamlen's hovel.  Not even the neighborhood seems to be much better.

-Polaris

It doesn't have Gamlen in it, which is surely a virtue beyond price.

Yeah, but it has Hawke's mother in it, which is nearly as bad.

-Polaris

[Heimdall]

IanPolaris wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Pretty much really.  The decore may be fancier, but I don't see much going for the Mansion over Gamlen's hovel.  Not even the neighborhood seems to be much better.

-Polaris

It doesn't have Gamlen in it, which is surely a virtue beyond price.

Yeah, but it has Hawke's mother in it, which is nearly as bad.

-Polaris

Not for long

[CaribWarrior J]

I hope they get inspiration from almost nothing. Skyrim is to me one boring game.

[CaribWarrior J]

Voiced protagonist, 3rd person. Nuff said.

[Morroian]

IanPolaris wrote...

Morroian wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

What fortune? The last time I checked Hawke only have 50 golds in his coin purse.

The mansion is nothing is it? 

Pretty much really.  The decore may be fancier, but I don't see much going for the Mansion over Gamlen's hovel.  Not even the neighborhood seems to be much better.

You're just being pedantic, even taking the presentation in a literal sense the Mansion is a lot bigger and better presented than Gamlen's house. You realise all of Mama Hawke Hawke and Carver/Bethany would have been sleeping in the same room.

[Plaintiff]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Hawke isn't a peasant. They're a scion of the Amell family.

And their preference for killing and stealing over sullying their hands with anything resembling actual work is an appropriately noble attitude.

Yeah but the people doesn't seem to response to his nobility status in ACT II.

I know, right? Aside from everyone calling him "Serrah" and "Messere",

Everyone called him Serrah even when he is still a refugee.  

Plaintiff wrote...

and the Viscount asking for personal favours,

Yeah sure, since Hawke is known for doing errand works for everyone including the thugs.

Plaintiff wrote...


and Aveline constantly reminding him of the responsibility of his position,

What responsibility? He has no castle. No army. No servants. No king and lords to serve. No court. No horse...hmm... ok ,ignore the horse.

Plaintiff wrote...

and Grand Cleric Elthina telling Hawke she's glad to see the Amell's returning to Hightown,

Yeah? When she should have concern more about the Amell who sarcifice her life to end the 5th blight. That's the real Amell who deserve the credits. Hawke is not worthy of any respect from the Amell family.

Plaintiff wrote...

and the Arishok remarking on Hawke's change of fortune,

What fortune? The last time I checked Hawke only have 50 golds in his coin purse.

Plaintiff wrote...


and Cullen mentioning it and Hawke's mother telling him how glad she is to be back in her childhood home, it's completely ignored.

Cullen also mentioned something "there is no one like you and I". That guy couldn't even tell the difference between Rogue/Warrior and an apostate mage. And Leandra comments? It's home, that true. More likely an empty estate that I have to get an elf maid, Bodahn, Sandal and dog to keep it alive. Hawke is nothing I imagine as the medieval lords. He is more like a commoner with an estate than a king's knight like Sir Lancelot and the round table knights. 

Nope. Hawke never fit to be my character from his background to his personality.

And this series of non sequiturs was supposed to prove... what, exactly?

None of that has anything to do with anything. You said that nobody in Kirkwall reacts to Hawke's newfound nobility. I proved you wrong. You then proceeded to spew a fountain of irrelevent arguments.

Is English your second, or possibly third language?

[John Epler]

That's quite enough of that.

Let's cut out the personal attacks, shall we? We can disagree without descending to petty insults.

[Kyriani Agrivar]

I'm a little late to weigh in on the voiced protagonist thing but...

I don't mind a voiced protagonist... IF and only IF multiple voice options are available for each gender. Three to five at least so that there's a reasonable chance to have a voice match the character. Otherwise you run the risk of causing a disconnect between the player and their character by virtue of the voice just not sounding right with the appearance the player has chosen.This was my issue in DA2. The hawke male voice works fine for any character with dark colored hair and facial hair (basically the default hawke) but when you make a young looking blonde guy? Well let's just say the voice sounds very strange to me. If I had a younger sounding voice for my hawke, or as many options as origins had for voices, I would have identified with him alot more I think.

Unfortunately voice acting is expensive and paying multiple actors to do protagonist dialogues would probably break the budget alotted for the game. If a company could make such an investment I'd say go for it otherwise I'd say stick with a silent protagonist. Most RPG's are very story driven and involve numerous dialogue interactions between the player and various NPC's. Non voiced protagonists typically have a few voice options at creation simply for combat and interaction audio and thus have the advantage of letting the player decide how they sound when speaking.

Modifié par Kyriani Agrivar, 12 janvier 2012 - 08:23 .

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Plaintiff wrote...

And this series of non sequiturs was supposed to prove... what, exactly?

None of that has anything to do with anything. You said that nobody in Kirkwall reacts to Hawke's newfound nobility. I proved you wrong. You then proceeded to spew a fountain of irrelevent arguments.

How can I be wrong when I was just stating a preference? It's everything to do with how I perceive my character's origin  should be and how Kirkwall's people should response to it. And why are you quoting me in the first place? I was responding to other people's post regarding origins choices and I agree with him since I can create my noble knight character as Cousland very well in DAO as oppose to Hawke in DA 2. Wheter I expect more or less response from Kirkwall people is not your character's problem. As I said, Hawke did not fit to be my character due to his origin and how people react to it. Are you playing the same character as I did? 
 

Plaintiff wrote...

Is English your second, or possibly third language?

Insulting other people is not allowed here and you have just violating the forum's rule. Since, John already quoted your remark, I see no reason to report you. 

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 12 janvier 2012 - 07:18 .

[LobselVith8]

Morroian wrote...

You're just being pedantic, even taking the presentation in a literal sense the Mansion is a lot bigger and better presented than Gamlen's house. You realise all of Mama Hawke Hawke and Carver/Bethany would have been sleeping in the same room.

I think the criticism is focusing on the fact that the limit of Hawke's accomplishments with the fortune from the Deep Roads seems to be nothing more than the aquisition of a mansion. It feels a little hollow for those of us who had been thinking that Hawke would accomplish something more meaningful in his seven years in Kirkwall.

[Morroian]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

How can I be wrong when I was just stating a preference? It's everything to do with how I perceive my character's origin  should be and how Kirkwall's people should response to it.

You may have thought they should respond differently but the fact is the NPC response to Hawke changed from Act 1 to Act 2 and to Act 3 clearly due to Hawke's changing circumstances so its disingenuous to suggest that there was no response.