757 réponses à ce sujet

[shepskisaac]

Feanor_II wrote...

Why? Why? Why? I only ask WHY it takes so long to get an answer? As other people have said TOR and BF3 players received their answer in a much shorter time......

I appreciate Mr. Priestly cooperation with this subject...... But how long has been since we first asked about Origin/ME3?

I'm praying the lack of answer is because BioWare is/was fighting with EA to NOT have Origin be mandatory in ME3

[Dovahzaan]

IsaacShep wrote...
I'm praying the lack of answer is because BioWare is/was fighting with EA to NOT have Origin be mandatory in ME3

I think we already know the answer is "Yes, Origin is required". But like you said, I still have hope.

[outlaw1109]

Aquemin1 wrote...

if we all just dont buy the games that are not available via other platforms, then origin will face a slow but necessary death. EA doesnt care if some people dont except origin. They care about the dumb people who do except everything you throw at them. This is the group they want on their platform and no where else.

I really dont understand why gamers dont see the big picture. Somebody already mentioned it in this threat, that if every publisher would start doing this, you end up wiht numerous platform and friends all over the place.

This morning I was actually going to pre-order ME3 but the only place I could buy it was origin. HOW LAME! EA must really think that the whole world is as dumb as an average american. They should really hire some more gamer and less business men wit lame ass ties and big lease car.

Yeah...while I understand your point of view...

It's not that gamers don't see the big picture.  It's that they don't care.  You have to understand, at least in america where our average person is dumb in your opinion, that while unfortunate, most people WILL play ME3 regardless of whether or not Origin is involved.  It has nothing to do with Origin and everything to do with ME3.  When games started charging for DLC, I didn't want to pay.  I wanted to complain like everyone else.  Protest even.  But then I broke down and bought DLC because, well, I wanted to play it.

Also, calling the average American dumb is...(how do you say not smart?) especially on a North American forum.
(the forums still have regions, right?)

(don't let it derail the thread, please...)

Modifié par outlaw1109, 11 janvier 2012 - 07:26 .

[jamesp81]

Feanor_II wrote...

The game will be released in two months..... I really can't believe that nothing has been decided about this!

Oh, believe me, it's been decided, and the decision made was the wrong one.

[outlaw1109]

[quote]jamesp81 wrote...

[quote]Feanor_II wrote...

The game will be released in two months..... I really can't believe that nothing has been decided about this![/quote]

Oh, believe me, it's been decided, and the decision made was the wrong one.

[/quote]


ME3 Homepage has a Origin Logo/link on it.

[quote]Edit

It's actually a banner across the entire website...they're probably not responding to this thread because, at this point, isn't it obvious?  Didn't they remove DA from STEAM?  I wonder why...

Modifié par outlaw1109, 11 janvier 2012 - 07:32 .

[billy the squid]

Shepard the Leper wrote...

What competition are you talking about? Do you even understand what competition means? It's about choice, and both Origin and Steam don't have a choice - you are forced to install their system one way or the other. Forcing thrid party software upon customers has NOTHING to do with competition (it's in fact the complete opposite).

Distribution is also a farce. It would only be a distribution platform if it wasn't required to play. It's FORCED upon everyone including those who've used a different distribution channel.

DRM has and will never work - that's a simple fact. Ironically, the CEO of Valve has stated that the only way to combat piracy is to make it worthwhile to purchase a legit copy. Defensive mechanisms (like DRM) have little to no purpose at best and more likely reduce sales (like Ubisoft). Please explain to me why you believe in something Valve has dismissed already.

Advertising is everything. I hope you're familiar with Google - they make all their money through advertisement. The key difference is; Google doesn't force anything on anyone, they try to make products people WANT to use. Origin and Steam are forced upon us, and, if what you say is true, why are games ALWAYS more expensive to buy on Steam and/or Origin compared to "normal" retailers? Wouldn't it be logical to be cheaper (where's the "competition")? They don't need to produce discs, cases, manuals and ship the lot all over the world.
Why is it that when I upload videos to YT (owned by google) I have the option to share in some of the advertising revenue? Wouldn't it make sense that when we use Origin or Steam, we gain something from it? Like reduced prices or whatever. Valve and EA are making money with their systems to spy upon us and sell that info to the highest bidder after all - it's win-win from their perspective, and lose-lose for everyone else.

Origin and Steam are platforms for EA and Valve to advertise their products forcefully; and to aquire additional data which they can either use themselves or sell to other parties. To suggest otherwise is silly, it's in EA's goddamn EULA for Christ's sake.

Very well. I shall now explain. (to other readers techno babble may follow)

Competition dictates that there be seperate business competing for a consumer base. Origin and Steam are the distribution service, Valve and EA are the companies which are in competition with one another. You having choice is not a prerequisite it is a symptom of that competition. Steam had a quasi monopoly, being the dominant service, it is now challenged by Origin.

The Third Party are subsequent publishers and developers such as THQ who have signed contractual distribution clauses to distribute products on Origin. whether one selects Origin, Steam, Direct to Drive or another constitutes competition although it remains limited due to start up and financing costs and the dominance of Steam and rise of Origin.

The client instalation does not enter into any analysis of competition determination as per the Europeran Competition Commission regulations and decisions. Ipso Fcato installing Origin or Steam is irrelevant and your inital point is rendered moot.

(Personally I don't mind Steam too much as far as DD platforms go, Initially it was buggy and the EULA was dodgy, but to their credit valve did a lot of work to improve.)

As to distribution, pray do tell how does one down load the game? Via a distribution platform, it distributes does it not?
Steam is not required to be active upon play nor upon start up, only upon initial installation. Origin appears to be the same, but I''m not entirely sure yet. BF3 requires a connection when using MP I believe, but that doesn't suprise me, although I'm unsure why they did so via a new web window, very poor way of opening the battle log.

Your point on DRM is disengenuous. DRM is and has been used to try and prevent early leaks and casual piracy. If people really want to get something they'll get it. Ubisoft has one of the most draconian DRM systems around and worse they still mess up on their end which results in the player getting booted from the game. Steam's version is a necessity as few publishers will allow IPs to be DRM free. Unfortunately it is a legal reality of the current situation and Steam therefore implements it's own version of DRM.

Although it's actually one of the better ones and far less intrusive than others, such as Ubisoft. Ubisoft's down fall was it tried to use it to restrict gamers by using piracy as a scapegoat. The underlying fiscal reports imply that it is poor products which have lead to Ubisoft's decline, not the rise in piracy. There were no corresponding increases in console sales compared to 90% decline in PC sales, Yet other DRMs have proved somewhat effective, look up the death scorpion on serious sam.

DRM is tricky in that it is subject to a cost benefit analysis, the potential damage it can cause to the IP equity is vast for very little return, hece Ubisoft's discontinuation. the best ones are less intrusive, but also use enticements, it doesn't mean the DRM is gone or going, but exclusives and pre order bonuses are used to attract users to buy it legitimately as much as to compete with other developer's IP's. Carrot and Stick scenario if you will. Ubisoft used the stick, and then used a bat, there was no upside. Ubisoft failed to understand the mindset and motivating factors of it's consumer base.


Re: Advertising, does Google manufacture anything?
 
It's rvenue stream is derived from service provision and advertisment. Its business model is entirely differnt to that of EA's as such its underlying structure is differnt in what it faces in costas and what areas it derives income from.

As to the cost of production that is caught up in the legal contracts between retailers, DD platforms and publishers. Inital retail costs are equal to that of Steam and Origin due namely to the retail market refusing to stock items should DD be able to stock it a lower price, thus depriving Publishers a large avenue for their console products which would heavilg damage inital revenue streams at the point of launch.

Secondly, Steam and Origin do not incur manufacturing costs, I'm unsure why you are under the impression that they do. Which makes my question the extent of you're understanding of how companies function. EA incurs costs, and Valve maybe for the games they publish, but the other costs come out of the developers and retailers depending on case by case basis.

As to the sale of market data, it's termed distribution. Not sale, it's a legal side step. As I have already explained, EA and Steam do Valve do not derive the majority of their revenue from marketing, although they do use the telemtry for internal marketing and ecnomic analysis and subsequent publishing of company fiscal reports. Indeed I remember seeing adverts for BF3 on Youtube, which has far more traffic than Origin, better avenue for advertising, than a place where you go only to buy games.

Finally are you aware of Steam Sales? With some games being less than £5 of being bundled together with another for less than £10. Certail retailers are indeed cheap, shuch as Amazon, which I tend to use. But that is due to the unique nature of Amazon as an online distributer and a big one at that. Economies of scale allows it to absorb the cost and undercut competitors who must charge a higher price, such as some retailers or the cost : profit ratio is minimal and not worth the opportunity cost.

Modifié par billy the squid, 11 janvier 2012 - 07:49 .

[Serrow]

Eagerly waiting for an update to this, I've got my pre-order ready for cancellation once the official word is out - but fingers crossed.

[jeweledleah]

wait a minute... steam prices are higher then normal retailers???

/looks at her list of games that she purchased sometimes for 25% off the hard copy price on amazon/gamestop/etc

/boggles

[Aquemin1]

says the guy who thinks camping is being efficient. Open your eyes here m8 and smell that coffee. You do know that EA only exsist because we - the gamers / the people who buy their stuff - play and buy their games. Dont you see that in this way the consumers are the onces standing in the rain?
Al you guys do here is talk about the differences between digital platforms and why they even exsist. Less talking and more demanding please!! They already tricked us wit BF3, which was just the beginning. ME3 is game number 2. Which one will be next!

Seriously, I no 1 buys games via origin, then they will get the picture. We - the gamer - let these company exsist in the first place!

[jamesp81]

Serrow wrote...

Eagerly waiting for an update to this, I've got my pre-order ready for cancellation once the official word is out - but fingers crossed.

Official word will be released, oh, probably about March 6.

[billy the squid]

Aquemin1 wrote...

says the guy who thinks camping is being efficient. Open your eyes here m8 and smell that coffee. You do know that EA only exsist because we - the gamers / the people who buy their stuff - play and buy their games. Dont you see that in this way the consumers are the onces standing in the rain?
Al you guys do here is talk about the differences between digital platforms and why they even exsist. Less talking and more demanding please!! They already tricked us wit BF3, which was just the beginning. ME3 is game number 2. Which one will be next!

Seriously, I no 1 buys games via origin, then they will get the picture. We - the gamer - let these company exsist in the first place!

No, says the guy who clearly knows more about law, economics and marketing than you.

I suggest reading the updated EULA and examining the modifed Origin scanning protocols, nor is Origin going anywhere as much as you might wish it to. I suggest approaching and thinking about it logically and pragmaticaly, rather than attempting to be an impotent demagogue.

Modifié par billy the squid, 11 janvier 2012 - 08:04 .

[outlaw1109]

[quote]Aquemin1 wrote...

says the guy who thinks camping is being efficient. Open your eyes here m8 and smell that coffee. You do know that EA only exsist because we - the gamers / the people who buy their stuff - play and buy their games. Dont you see that in this way the consumers are the onces standing in the rain?
Al you guys do here is talk about the differences between digital platforms and why they even exsist. Less talking and more demanding please!! They already tricked us wit BF3, which was just the beginning. ME3 is game number 2. Which one will be next!

Seriously, I no 1 buys games via origin, then they will get the picture. We - the gamer - let these company exsist in the first place![/quote]


EA is only a publisher.  They don't make the games.  What you're suggesting is that we don't buy "their" games, which, while a novel idea, would cripple the developers/studios that actually create the games.  Which is economically stupid.  Also, there are those out there that don't mind Origin, thus they will buy ME3 regardless. 

My point:  even if you get a few thousand people to protest Origin, their voices will be muffled by the MILLIONS of people who just want to play the game...

[quote]Edit
impotent demagogue.

I applaud your mental thesarus.

Modifié par outlaw1109, 11 janvier 2012 - 08:13 .

[Merchant2006]

I thought it was already established that the Origin program will be needed to play ME3... :\\?

[shepskisaac]

Merchant2006 wrote...

I thought it was already established that the Origin program will be needed to play ME3...

It ain't over till it's over. We're fighting till the very end! Hope dies last!!!

[hidden185]

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Each time it has been closed before is because talks turn to piracy or other copy/protection circumvention. Sicne this hasn't yet, it will stay open until we give you answers or someone takes teh discussion off course again.

Do appreciate that btw.

Think theres a chance we can get any information about this before March 6th? I know it's an uncomfortable subject, but people are waiting.

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Each time it has been closed before is because talks turn to piracy or other copy/protection circumvention. Sicne this hasn't yet, it will stay open until we give you answers or someone takes teh discussion off course again.

Do appreciate that btw.

Think theres a chance we can get any information about this before March 6th? I know it's an uncomfortable subject, but people are waiting.

Dear Chris Priestly and Mass Effect 3,

I honestly did not know much that about Origin or people's problems until this thread.  However, I feel like there is a collective wish of the custumer's for Mass Effect 3 for you to specify whether or not it will be on Orgin.  

This being said, I did look at Orgin's wikipedia page and there is something I do want to mention that I don't think people have really brought up.   In the modern computing era, corporations need to be very careful what, how, and who they give custumer personal information to even when in the case of google or twitter that information is called "anonymous" or completely disassociated from username/credit card info.   This may sound like preaching to the choir; however, as in the case of Sony, the consequences are serous legal and economical damage especially if you ****** off people who work for US military like Sony has done twice.  So please make sure you higher ups know to not be like Sony (*) but be more like Google and how they profit in a world were users really feel threatened by the release of there info to a third party. 

_______________
P.S. While I forget the exact number, good portion of the leaked user information happened to be from US soliders and navy overseas and at home. There as reason a slightly hidden 4chan party van was sitting outside, Sony's  US headquarters hours before Sony """asked""" for FBI help and """graciously accepted""" DHS involvement.  The first incident has to do with 1708 USAF supercomputer cluster called Condor.

[didymos1120]

outlaw1109 wrote...

EA is only a publisher.  They don't make the games. 

Not remotely true.  They own a number of development studios outright.  Many of them even have "EA" right in the name.

Modifié par didymos1120, 11 janvier 2012 - 08:18 .

[hidden185]

Merchant2006 wrote...

I thought it was already established that the Origin program will be needed to play ME3...

Sorry I was typing this open message to Mr. Priestly giving him advice to pass on, so I have not really had a chance to catch up on any new information about ME3 being Orgin exclusive.

[Fredvdp]

Merchant2006 wrote...

I thought it was already established that the Origin program will be needed to play ME3...

Now that we know the demo won't require the Origin software maybe the full game doesn't require it either.

[Ravenmyste]

jeweledleah wrote...

wait a minute... steam prices are higher then normal retailers???

/looks at her list of games that she purchased sometimes for 25% off the hard copy price on amazon/gamestop/etc

/boggles

25% off what they bloated it up to so you bassically pay normal sale prices

[Zannana]

The new EA game, Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning, doesn't have Origin so here is to hoping that our objections will be heard by Bioware and EA.
I have preordered ME3 and since it will not ship directly to me on release day, I will have ample time to cancel it should Origin is required.

[Gotholhorakh]

Ravenmyste wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

wait a minute... steam prices are higher then normal retailers???

/looks at her list of games that she purchased sometimes for 25% off the hard copy price on amazon/gamestop/etc

/boggles

25% off what they bloated it up to so you bassically pay normal sale prices

I have done a lot better than 25% off the Amazon price before now. Considering the Amazon price is often 10-50% cheaper than retail, I don't think that's bad.

On that note, as I said Origin could be in on the sales action almost as easily as EA snapping their fingers, I have literally no idea why they don't attack this PR problem of awful, unacceptably invasive terms.

It might do Origin and EA good to be in the competition proper anyway - I went to buy some EA games to test it out some time ago and the games were something like twice what you'd pay over the counter.

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 11 janvier 2012 - 08:27 .

[didymos1120]

Zannana wrote...

The new EA game, Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning, doesn't have Origin so here is to hoping that our objections will be heard by Bioware and EA.

That's not an EA game.  It's made by an independent studio.  EA is only the publisher in this case.

[outlaw1109]

didymos1120 wrote...

outlaw1109 wrote...

EA is only a publisher.  They don't make the games. 

Not remotely true.  They own a number of development studios outright.  Many of them even have "EA" right in the name.

I stand corrected, however, my point was more or less that to stop buying EA games/Origin games would be to stop buying games from the likes of Bioware, Dice, Mythic, Visceral (spelling?) etc.

While it was ultimately their decision to become a part of EA, it still means that you're missing out on a lot of good games...

[Hedera]

At his point, it has become quite clear to me that Origin is going to be a big issue. Regardless of what it actually does, whether they change the EULA or not, and even if they, you know, start handing out free games. (Like they did to BF3 pre-orders) A lot of people are simply going to hate it for what they think it is. I wasn't gaming on my PC back when Steam rose to its current place, but I do believe this same sort of thing happened then, too. As much as I think Origin was incredibly poorly timed, the fact that some games require it just makes me think of games like Skyrim, Deus Ex HR, Fallout NV, Saints Row 3, and MW3, which require Steam to run. Heck, if you buy a hard copy you have to run a basic cmd prompt to install it from disc instead of digitally. Origin, for all its failings, is essentially the only comparable competitor Steam has ever seen, and this may end up paying off for us, the consumers, in the future. And, yes, I know about D2D. They sell downloads from within a browser-based store, some of which require Steam or Origin anyway. This is, like it or not, what the current game market is moving towards, and a few thousand people dragging their feet isn't going to change anything.