3659 réponses à ce sujet

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

Johnsen1972 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Just the scan of the registry is too much, and a deal-breaker. 

As for the DRM, that's been covered at length.  All DRM is quickly cracked, this will do nothing.  All Origin will do is prevent people who are too informed to install Origin and too principle to "ocean raid" the game from buying and using EA software.

The registry bit falls into scan part of my comment, I do not know if sends registry information, but I think was mentioned scanned it while back.

I was under the impression that the data sent back to EA is encrypted, and that no one as of yet had any idea what was being sent back to EA  (and if someone did crack that encryption, I'm sure that EA would push to have them charged with a computer crime). 

Has that changed?  Do we know what is being sent?

Just read the EULA. It says all hardware & all software information. So bascially everything?  

It says no private data , unless your enter the data through their service which would be your profile on origin(which is optional).Dmex last page talked about what it collected.

[Killjoy Cutter]

MingWolf wrote...

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

Ok , so if the eula were re-written then you wouldn't have a problem with origin.

Never said that.  I believe the EULA has been edited several times.  For me, personally, Origin is just useless baggage.

Same here.  Had Origin and its EULA been completely well-behaved, clean, and above board from the beginning, and the intention to require it had been honestly communicated from the beginning, I might have been willing to hold my nose and install it long enough to play ME3. 

The long lies of omision regarding Origin, its behavior in earlier tests, the EULA, and EA's continuing blatant deceit as to the intent and nature of Origin, have made it impossible for me to ever, in good conscience, install Origin on any computer I use or own. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:43 .

[PyroByte]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

PyroByte wrote...

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...
For every post that tells the truth about what the software does , same people will ignore it unfortunately.

And what is the truth? There is so much hysteria going on

Their is over one time activation through origin , alternative origin and that origin even though proved not to be spywware by dmex.I admit I thought at first dmex was a forum hacker , but why won't anyone trust his word about origin.

Oh ok, I thought you were coming from another direction

I witnessed the initial outrage when Origin was launched with BF3 and wasn't fond of Origin either but I got to the conclusion that Origin isn't spyware or doing anything bad.

Most things people bring up about Origin (gathering your IP, OS etc.) can be done by a website (or cookie) but nobody cares about that.

Edit: The changes made to the EULA and the test done by a major german computer magazine, which showed that Origin isn't doing anything wrong (they did an intensiv scan and sniffed the network traffic), finally convinced me 

Modifié par PyroByte, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:47 .

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

Lumikki wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Pretty sure was mentioned by Dmex and others that the only information scans (maybe sends) is registry, it's own games folder and own client information which includes by law (IP and MAC address). I think that is what he said it does and noone has been able to refute that with evidence. So the EULA won't say does not send anything. It's whether what it does send is acceptable to you. How do you think it will know what updates you will need if can't send back information about what version you have, again with activation sending information as well as maybe DRM checks making sure the game application hasn't been cracked or tampered with (which is reasonable thing to do to be honest imho). So by your own wording your breaking your own worded EULA.

You seem to nitpicking my words. What I say, EULA should reflect WHAT the Origin client actually does.
Now you say, it does that.

I say Origin client acts like Spyware.
Dmes say it doesn't.
I say, but in even Origin EULA says it does, it's action are like Spyware.

Now we start argue about data collection and what's spyware. You self sayed it collects data.

NOT ACCEPTABLE EULA. I don't accept ANY data collection for ANY reason.

Do I look like I'm happy customer when it comes related Origin client?

I don't know what to tell you , mutiple users and an unofficial cofirmed ea member has told you what it does.

[Killjoy Cutter]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Pretty sure was mentioned by Dmex and others that the only information scans (maybe sends) is registry, it's own games folder and own client information which includes by law (IP and MAC address). I think that is what he said it does and noone has been able to refute that with evidence. So the EULA won't say does not send anything. It's whether what it does send is acceptable to you. How do you think it will know what updates you will need if can't send back information about what version you have, again with activation sending information as well as maybe DRM checks making sure the game application hasn't been cracked or tampered with (which is reasonable thing to do to be honest imho). So by your own wording your breaking your own worded EULA.

You seem to nitpicking my words. What I say, EULA should reflect WHAT the Origin client actually does.
Now you say, it does that.

I say Origin client acts like Spyware.
Dmes say it doesn't.
I say, but in even Origin EULA says it does, it's action are like Spyware.

Now we start argue about data collection and what's spyware. You self sayed it collects data.

NOT ACCEPTABLE EULA. I don't accept ANY data collection for ANY reason.

Do I look like I'm happy customer when it comes related Origin client?

I don't know what to tell you , mutiple users and an unofficial cofirmed ea member has told you what it does.

Or rather what it does right now. 

Not what it once did, and not what EA reserves the "right" to have it do again in the future. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:44 .

[Lumikki]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

I don't know what to tell you , mutiple users and an unofficial cofirmed ea member has told you what it does.

It doesn't matter, because EVERYONE can read the EULA. It's right there is says it collects DATA. It even says what data it's collecting. NOT accetable for me. It ask data what I consider PRIVATE.

If origin client would be empty program and do nothing. It would have no meaning to me as long it has Origin client like EULA, what has to be accepted. It's contract what defines what the program CAN do, not what it does now.

Modifié par Lumikki, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:50 .

[Furtled]

@Dmex
I appreciate what you're trying to do and you've done more to foster trust towards EA in your brief postings on here than EAs marketing machine have managed in the last six months. However being in full understanding of what Origin currently does and the intended meaning of the EULA (in combination with EA's privacy policy), I still do not want the Origin client on my PC merely to play a single player game I have bought and paid for in one of those odd physical shop things (yes, I am one of those old and stubborn types).

I'm not sure why this concept seems so alien to EA, but it's my PC, it should be my choice (a real choice, not an all or nothing choice which is no real choice at all). EA are removing my choice by making Origin (and any data collection by Origin) mandatory - so I am removing my money.

Also (and apologies if I've missed this, the thread's moving quickly) will this OpenOrigin be live by March 6th?
If not any discussions of it (no matter how well intentioned) are unfortunately a little moot.

Modifié par Furtled, 23 janvier 2012 - 07:14 .

[Johnsen1972]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

It says no private data , unless your enter the data through their service which would be your profile on origin(which is optional).Dmex last page talked about what it collected.

So what kind of software you installed isnt private data? I doubt it!

[kofelover]

Well, however if may be interpreted, sales for the PC aren't exactly going the way EA would like I presume:

Week Ending (VGChartz - USA presales):

1/14 589
1/21 591

So, a net gain of two copies ......

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

MingWolf wrote...

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

Ok , so if the eula were re-written then you wouldn't have a problem with origin.

Never said that.  I believe the EULA has been edited several times.  For me, personally, Origin is just useless baggage.

Same here.  Had Origin and its EULA been completely well-behaved, clean, and above board from the beginning, and the intention to require it had been honestly communicated from the beginning, I might have been willing to hold my nose and install it long enough to play ME3. 

The long lies of omision regarding Origin, its behavior in earlier tests, the EULA, and EA's continuing blatant deceit as to the intent and nature of Origin, have made it impossible for me to ever, in good conscience, install Origin on any computer I use or own. 

Ok but they can't go back time and change the past.It's just buying defective tires or bad food and the place where you got them at offers for you to come in for a free exchange.Now are you telling me because they screwed up once you wouldn't accept the offer before asking for a refund.

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

kofelover wrote...

Well, however if may be interpreted, sales for the PC aren't exactly going the way EA would like I presume:

Week Ending (VGChartz - USA presales):

1/14 589
1/21 591

So, a net gain of two copies ......

I think they expected the pc sales to be low , they're more interested in 360/PS3 sales.I think the PS3 version is a way of trying to offset low PC sales.(just my opinion , not a fact)

[Furtled]

Annnnd to repeat since there's still no answer and EA's customer service sent me right back here (again)...

Chris Priestly wrote...
5) Is there an opt in or opt out clause for data collection?
Users will be allowed to opt-out of Mass Effect 3 data collection from inside the game.

Would it be possible to get some official clarity on this one please? 

Right now that reads like you can opt-out of ME game data collection as you could with previous games, but that there is no option to opt out of any potential Origin data collection - which is another kettle of fish entirely, and a pretty smelly one at that. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/unsure.png


Moar Questions! (sorry Chris)
Will future DLC and patches be available through the BSN site like the ones for ME2 or will they only be available via Origin?

Any plans for making Origin mandatory on DA3?

Thank you
(I know I'm being tedious/annoying but I would really, REALLY like these questions answered please)

Modifié par Furtled, 23 janvier 2012 - 07:14 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

No, they can't go back and change the past. They made their actual intent clear, and the transparent attempt to force Origin onto as many PCs as possible just continues to make it clear.

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

Johnsen1972 wrote...

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

It says no private data , unless your enter the data through their service which would be your profile on origin(which is optional).Dmex last page talked about what it collected.

So what kind of software you installed isnt private data? I doubt it!

Well the software I install doesn't take pictures . files , video's or other secrets I may or may not have.Which is why I have origin on my computer to begin with , saying it again I'm big on privacy.But data collection comes with using any program (especially in the internet age), as long as it's not uploading private data.
 

Modifié par LOST SPARTANJLC, 23 janvier 2012 - 06:55 .

[jeweledleah]

I didn't see it answered in a top post, so here it is again

1. I've heard from various sources that origine uses at least 3 times as much memory as steam does.  my computer is not top of the line.  I already have to turn down my settings to play mass effect 2 with any sort of effectiveness.  is there any work being done to make Origin more efficient in terms of memory usage?  exactly how big of a memory drain Origin is?  I cannot afford to buy a new computer, ust to have ability to play mass effect 3.

2.  modding.  will Origin still allow for single player game modding, or will it no longer be possible.  i understand that you probably wouldn't want poeple gaining advantage in multiplayer (though to be honest, concidering that its co-op, not vesus, its not nearly as necessary IMO), but the primary advantage of playing on a PC vs consoles is ability to make minor changes to game files, from something as simple as unlocking more outfits and hairstyles, to .. making adjustements to paragon/renegade scores, giving yourself a max level, etc etc.  I would like to know if pc plaers will still retain said advantage, while playing solo.

[Dragoonlordz]

Lumikki wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Pretty sure was mentioned by Dmex and others that the only information scans (maybe sends) is registry, it's own games folder and own client information which includes by law (IP and MAC address). I think that is what he said it does and noone has been able to refute that with evidence. So the EULA won't say does not send anything. It's whether what it does send is acceptable to you. How do you think it will know what updates you will need if can't send back information about what version you have, again with activation sending information as well as maybe DRM checks making sure the game application hasn't been cracked or tampered with (which is reasonable thing to do to be honest imho). So by your own wording your breaking your own worded EULA.

You seem to nitpicking my words. What I say, EULA should reflect WHAT the Origin client actually does.
Now you say, it does that.

I say Origin client acts like Spyware.
Dmes say it doesn't.
I say, but in even Origin EULA says it does, it's action are like Spyware.

Now we start argue about data collection and what's spyware. You self sayed it collects data.

NOT ACCEPTABLE EULA. I don't accept ANY data collection for ANY reason.

Do I look like I'm happy customer when it comes related Origin client?

Then there is no helping you. There is a section of people with different aspects they are unhappy with, but the much smaller group within those sections; the ones who want no clients at all or no sale and the ones like yourself who seems to want the same as the other group in this sub section but is using a different method are simply not I think going to get their way. There is only so much Dmex can do and only so much EA is willing to give. 

The rest I think are more flexible and whether thats explaining what does from Dmex and building some trust in giving people information about Origin, how EA procedures work with regard to the whole ban aspect being fixed, the passing on message to legal department about concerns people have with the EULA, the trying to make open source client which hopes will be approved of which will supply source code and let people see exactly what his version does, the ones who are pushing for simple opt in/opt out within the client. All those stand a chance of getting somewhere. The ones in the sub section I think are going to be disappointed in a big way and without doubt if hope to get what they want prior to ME3 release. I support the Opt In/Opt Out because it is what Steam has and those who like Steam may be appeased / okay with having similar functions in Origin.

[DonSwingKing]

kofelover wrote...

Well, however if may be interpreted, sales for the PC aren't exactly going the way EA would like I presume:

Week Ending (VGChartz - USA presales):

1/14 589
1/21 591

So, a net gain of two copies ......

VGchartz is a horrible website. All numbers from outside the U.S are terribly wrong and they cannot include digital sales. That menas copys bought from Origin or Steam are not included. Also the U.S is a console market, no doubt, but here in Europe it looks different.

[kofelover]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

kofelover wrote...

Well, however if may be interpreted, sales for the PC aren't exactly going the way EA would like I presume:

Week Ending (VGChartz - USA presales):

1/14 589
1/21 591

So, a net gain of two copies ......

I think they expected the pc sales to be low , they're more interested in 360/PS3 sales.I think the PS3 version is a way of trying to offset low PC sales.(just my opinion , not a fact)

I respect your opinion.  But if they aren't interested in PC sales, why push Origin?  They could have just marketed it like the previous games.

[igneous.sponge]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

DonSwingKing wrote...

I'm sorry to ask this, but what exactly would OpenOrigin change? Origin is no spyware. I'm more vexed about the simple fact, that i am forced to to install it on my harddrive. It needs to be running, when playing Multiplayer also.

Could i uninstall Origin, after i activated my copy on OpenOrigin or what? Does OpenOrigin only replace the real Origin? How can features like Facebook and Steamworks be integrated into OpenOrigin? How will it look like?

^This , it wouldn't change a single thing because it's the same software.

Going from what dmex has posted, OpenOrigin will be a modular and open-source version of the official client. So, provided OpenOrigin could be used as a direct replacement for the official client, there would be several advantages:

1. An Origin client of open-source nature would be a community effort, meaning we, the community, would not only be given the chance to examine the code and see what's actually going on under the hood, but would also be able to contribute continual improvements to the program (e.g., documentation, fixes, features, and code optimisations). These improvements could also be rolled into the official client over time.

2. A modularised Origin client would allow you to install a version compiled only with the features you're interested in. So, for example, if you wanted a sleek and streamlined version which only processes log-ins and SSOs for your Origin-required games, you could have it. On the other hand, if you wanted a full-featured client with all the integrated social functions, Steamworks, and so on—with the added advantage of the open-source oversight—you could have that, too.

Again, this assumes OpenOrigin could be used a direct replacement for the official client, as opposed to a nice little plaything on the side. This is all still speculation, at this point.

[Pupuppu]

dmex wrote...

Pupuppu wrote...Can the customer also be informed what information exactly is transmitted via secure channels by the Origin client?

Based on what I've seen, Origin transmits the following: 
* Username
* Password
* SSO token

Thank you.

Pupuppu wrote...Speaking of Origin, can you tell me, why an English EA game, bought in the UK, forces me to register the German version?

You'll have to ask support about that one. I do know 3rd party sites are selling keys but don't say where those keys are from, for example; keys sold in/from Germany, online via other distributors, will give you the german version when activated on Origin.

This key was bought by a UK citizen with an UK bank account on the UK Steam store and then gifted. This Game registered fine on Steam as the international version not the cut German version.

Anyway, the important question in general is, can we register out imported games (i.e. from amazon.co.uk) on Origin and receive the international version or is Origin, as it looks based on the IP address, offering only the German version if there are different versions of a game.

[Annoyed Dragon]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Annoyed Dragon wrote...

I don't know if this question has been asked but does ME3 automaticly assumes that your ea account is the same as your origin account.

What I mean by this is when you install ME2 or  DA2 it requests your ea account email and password which can be different to your origin account is ME3 the same?

Personally I hope so.    

Your EA account is your Origin account, it just changed name. When I install ME2 which did again only day ago the same account information is used as my Origin account because they are same account now. Unless you have something wierd going on. 

Well I suppose it a little strange best way to put is like this:

Person A & B shares B's ea account in playing games but B is uncomfortable about putting their email through Origin so A makes a account with his own email while redeming their physical copies of ea games they have but the problem is all of A's DLC is under B's account.

So that is my problem, any ideas.  

[Burori]

LOST SPARTANJLC wrote...

kofelover wrote...

Well, however if may be interpreted, sales for the PC aren't exactly going the way EA would like I presume:

Week Ending (VGChartz - USA presales):

1/14 589
1/21 591

So, a net gain of two copies ......

I think they expected the pc sales to be low , they're more interested in 360/PS3 sales.I think the PS3 version is a way of trying to offset low PC sales.(just my opinion , not a fact)

Could be related to the reason for the recent attempts to sell the Kinect with its compatibility.

Furtled wrote...

@Dmex
I appreciate what you're trying to do and you've done more to foster trust towards EA in your brief postings on here than EAs marketing machine have managed in the last six months. However being in full understanding of what Origin currently does and the intended meaning of the EULA (in combination with EA's privacy policy), I still do not want the Origin client on my PC merely to play a single player game I have bought and paid for in one of those odd physical shop things (yes, I am one of those old and stubborn types).

I'm not sure why this concept seems so alien to EA, but it's my PC, it should be my choice (a real choice, not an all or nothing choice which is no real choice at all). EA are removing my choice by making Origin (and any data collection by Origin) mandatory - so I am removing my money.

This is basically my own greatest concern as well.

I spent over 2K in building my own custom PC. It is my baby. Whatever I have on it I feel I DESERVE to have the right to control the sharing option of my personal info with anyone as well I DESERVE to know what the software that I install needs to look at in order to provide excellent service to me as a consumer. 

Steam is an exception because I have had that service for many, many years and have had no problems with them. 

Origin has not gained my trust to install the software and unless I am given solid, hard facts from someone from EA (No offense to you @Dmex) that it will not now, and in the future threaten my personal information, I will not install it. 

Modifié par Burori, 23 janvier 2012 - 07:11 .

[Dragoonlordz]

jeweledleah wrote...

I didn't see it answered in a top post, so here it is again

1. I've heard from various sources that origine uses at least 3 times as much memory as steam does.  my computer is not top of the line.  I already have to turn down my settings to play mass effect 2 with any sort of effectiveness.  is there any work being done to make Origin more efficient in terms of memory usage?  exactly how big of a memory drain Origin is?  I cannot afford to buy a new computer, ust to have ability to play mass effect 3.

2.  modding.  will Origin still allow for single player game modding, or will it no longer be possible.  i understand that you probably wouldn't want poeple gaining advantage in multiplayer (though to be honest, concidering that its co-op, not vesus, its not nearly as necessary IMO), but the primary advantage of playing on a PC vs consoles is ability to make minor changes to game files, from something as simple as unlocking more outfits and hairstyles, to .. making adjustements to paragon/renegade scores, giving yourself a max level, etc etc.  I would like to know if pc plaers will still retain said advantage, while playing solo.

On mine Origin used 90k memory while Steam used 45k so only around double. However thats less than having a web browser open with one tab open doing nothing which on mine even at lowest of times usage came to 115k (firefox), chrome was/is vastly more memory on mine than that.

[SpringMan]

Ok but they can't go back time and change the past.It's just buying defective tires or bad food and the place where you got them at offers for you to come in for a free exchange.Now are you telling me because they screwed up once you wouldn't accept the offer before asking for a refund.

If the dealer offers you tires you can only mount with a special four-way socket wrench that has an in-built camera and needs internet access? Well i guess when he promises that the camera won't take any photos for now it's ok.

[wolfsite]

jeweledleah wrote...

I didn't see it answered in a top post, so here it is again

1. I've heard from various sources that origine uses at least 3 times as much memory as steam does.  my computer is not top of the line.  I already have to turn down my settings to play mass effect 2 with any sort of effectiveness.  is there any work being done to make Origin more efficient in terms of memory usage?  exactly how big of a memory drain Origin is?  I cannot afford to buy a new computer, ust to have ability to play mass effect 3.

2.  modding.  will Origin still allow for single player game modding, or will it no longer be possible.  i understand that you probably wouldn't want poeple gaining advantage in multiplayer (though to be honest, concidering that its co-op, not vesus, its not nearly as necessary IMO), but the primary advantage of playing on a PC vs consoles is ability to make minor changes to game files, from something as simple as unlocking more outfits and hairstyles, to .. making adjustements to paragon/renegade scores, giving yourself a max level, etc etc.  I would like to know if pc plaers will still retain said advantage, while playing solo.

I'll help with Question Number 1:

Based on Windows Task Manager:

Steam has peaked at about 89,884 K Mem Usage

Origin is at about 116,500 K Mem Usage

For a comparison My version of FireFox is at 182,236 K Mem Usage.


I will say Steam appears to jump around a lot in terms of memory usage as it has gone up and down as you use the program (It dipped to 60,234 K then jumped up to 96,875 K at one point) where Origin seems to stay consistent.