3659 réponses à ce sujet

[Pupuppu]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Pupuppu wrote...

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Pupuppu wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Other tests were done and showed results that even if do not Opt In to Steams data collection it in fact sends more information than Origin and that also did not include the [extra] data gained from Opting In and doing surveys. Now given the the amount of data sent is more from Steam (friends services and other features were not to explain this as both had same amount of friends and services running at same time) and that it looked at more places than Origin. It comes down to hate for EA and lack of trust for some people compared to bias they have towards Steam. 

Still spreading your your FUD on Steam with no clue whatsoever? Get wireshark, check the packets, check the protocol specification. At the same time where Steam is talking to the instant messanger service to send it's keep alive packets, Origin contacs five servers, including third party marketing servers.

Anyhow, continue using Origin, if you think this is the future in Digital Software distribution, but be aware not everyone will see this as a secure investment of their software licenses.

Are you just assuming those are marketing servers just because they are owned by Amazon?

No, Orgin also contacts Omniture, and Digitalriver as their payment processor as another third party site.

I'm quite familiar on how Omniture operates and what companies usually send over, but I'm not familiar with Digitalriver, not have any of my collegues brought it up to me.

I'm fine with Digitalriver, they are imho a well respected payment processor. It's even written in small letters in the Origin client store front in the lower parts iirc.

[Dark_Matter79]

Icinix wrote...
Arguments saying "Well don't buy it." are missing the point by a few galaxies.

It's the only real option though, aside from buying the game for another platform. What other options are there? I'm simply saying that I understand the reasoning for not buying, but saying that this is a breach of privacy and that by installing the software, EA is intentionally breaching yours is a bit unfair. It is a method of protecting their intellectual property rights.

That said, if enough people decide not to buy the product, that will send a clear message that Origin is not the proper method of distribution for this product. The method of protection used for the first Mass Effect game was changed after concerns were raised, and I agree wholeheartedly that the initial method was a bit heavy handed. Time will tell if this method is similarly changed, and for the sake of those who are both concerned about the risk Origin presents and who also are fans of the franchise I hope it does.

It's your choice. I'm simply trying to put the decision into clearer perspective, and I am not saying that your concerns are not valid. I simply do not share them.

[Ob4rul3r]

"Mass Effect 3 is not currently available on Steam. This may change in the future, but complaining to BioWare/EA that it is not on Steam will not help. We continue to work with Steam/Valve to make Mass Effect 3 available on Steam."



I know it is pointless to complain about this issue, but I still will state my disappointment about this decision by EA, to let them know that I, as one of their customers, won't go along with that.

It is very obvious that the decision to not publish the game on Steam is basically EAs fault, thinking giving Valve a ~30% share for the DLCs that would have to be sold through Steam as well would be too much of lost money ....


So, since this is mainly an issue about lost money: My money for ME3 is lost for EA, sad but true. I'd instantly pre-order the game (as Digital Deluxe Edition, if available) through Steam. But since there is no option to purchase it at my prefered store, and on top of that is enforcing me to use Origin, I will quit on the idea purchasing ME3 for PC (which is pretty sad, since I pre-ordered both prequels, ME2 through Steam).


But, because I do want to know how the story ends (and because I own a PS3 as well), I will just rent the PS3 version over a weekend and play the campaign ... which is not as satisfying as "continuing with my PC character", but it will work out somehow for me .... ~3 Euro renting fee for a weekend is fine, as long as I can avoid being domineered by EA.


~60€ for a sold copy for EA vs 3€ for a rented PS3 version for some video rental stores owner .... yeah, good thing you didn't gave Valve a 30% share for the DLCs, your stock holders will applause you for sure.



(Still: The game pops up at Steam - It's mine, so think about that. And there's MANY other ppl I know that think that way)

Modifié par Ob4rul3r, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:34 .

[Ahglock]

Chris Priestly wrote...


5) Is there an opt in or opt out clause for data collection?
Users will be allowed to opt-out of Mass Effect 3 data collection from inside the game.

I would want to opt out of all data collection, not just ME3 data collection is that possible?  If the answer was yes I think that would solve a lot of peoples(not everyones) privacy concerns.    

[Dragoonlordz]

IliyaMoroumetz wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I'll put in a clear way, no change will happen. It is easy for EA to change wording in their EULA but they will not stop pushing their ideal for future being based on their own DD service. They own Bioware and they own ME3 by proxy. They are breaking no laws with their current DD service which is the same service as Steam and their EULA has now been reworded to comply with the laws in Germany where was a conflict. They have stated that this "WILL" not change and ME3 "WILL" come with Origin. There is by no means anywhere near enough people up set over this to impact EA directly. There is no outrage articles by mainstream media over ME3 being bundled with EA's version of Steam aka Origin and the loss in some sales from a small section of possible ME3 buyers is nothing but a drop in the ocean compared to the millions ME3 will sell and the truly insane amount of income EA makes from other sources.

http://www.joystiq.c...equires-origin/
http://www.shacknews...ilable-on-steam
http://kotaku.com/58...launch-on-steam
http://www.destructo...-3-219711.phtml
http://www.1up.com/n...requires-origin

I'm sorry, what?  And those are just the ones I could find in my RSS feed.  And you know what the primary response has been?  Surprise, surprise!  Negative!

Limiting your customers'  choices is *not* how you go about garnering customer good will.

Most are neutral actually if you bother to read the comments. Neutral as in will still buy, has no issue with Origin or do not see why people are moaning to such extent.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:19 .

[slimgrin]

Complistic wrote...

Iron Spetsnaz wrote...

To all those ****ing about Origin,

Get an xbox, get ME1 & ME2 for xbox, Pre-Order ME3 for xbox, that way you WON'T have to deal with this Origin bull****

but then i'd have to play with a controller. Gross.

Yeah I'm gong to spend an extra 200 bucks to buy a console I wouldn't use for anything else other than a doorstop. No thanks.

Console users , this topic does not affect you so don't come in here fuming with your insipid little arguments.

[Ryzaki]

Ultai wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Will not change?

Well there goes my hope.

I'm not installing more bloatware BW. I'm not. I hope you're happy that I'm stuck buying it on Xbox now. Grrr.

Unless I can install Origin, authorize ME3 and then uninstall it and keep playing ME3 (single player of course).

Oh, they are happy, they get your money regardless it seems.  If you wanted to show them, you'd have to get enough willpower to resist buying this piece of entertainment and stand your ground. EA won't listen until it hits them in their bottom line, or they get enough bad press.

Considering I'm pretty sure they want my marketing data as well. I did show them something. My xbox is offline

I'm not gonna miss out on a game I really want though. No way. I'll give them their 15 - 20 bucks. They could've had more if they hadn't used crappy origin though.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:20 .

[Sylvianus]

Ultai wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Will not change?

Well there goes my hope.

I'm not installing more bloatware BW. I'm not. I hope you're happy that I'm stuck buying it on Xbox now. Grrr.

Unless I can install Origin, authorize ME3 and then uninstall it and keep playing ME3 (single player of course).

Oh, they are happy, they get your money regardless it seems.  If you wanted to show them, you'd have to get enough willpower to resist buying this piece of entertainment and stand your ground. EA won't listen until it hits them in their bottom line, or they get enough bad press.

So just don't buy the game, and that's it ?

This type of combat can not be won by thousands of angry fans in the short term, about one particular game. Origins won't concern only Mass effect anyways. It is a kind of long-term struggle. The results on sales, could  take years before they can perceive a real effect.

At this level, it would be stupid to waste an opportunity to finish the series, if you can buy the game on another platform and you aren't that much bothered. After, you are free to never buy any EA game again, as well.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:23 .

[Drimberly]

Just heard about it not being avalible on steam
My first reaction ''Oh Bioware....''
Yeah. I will maybe go with they guy two posts up. Ob4rul4r

[Alpha Bootis]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

vallore wrote...

I will repost my questions here then:


Very important: What data, exactly, is collected from our PCs?

(example of what I’m aiming here: if we knew it collected only information about what EA games we have installed and nothing else, that would we reassuring, but if it was something vague as “data that allows us, at EA, to improve our relation with our customers,” it would not, as it is too vague for us to know what you are aiming for).


Also, why, exactly, is it collected?

(if we are supposed to give you our data, it would be nice to know what, exactly,  is it for).

Most importantly; in regard to Origin, why can’t we have an opt-out from data collecting? Can we hope this will change?
(Not everyone has the same desire of privacy. It is both an individual and cultural issue; it would be great if EA would acknowledge this by allowing those of us who desire greater privacy to keep it).

Finally; assuming the EULA does not reflect what exactly is being collected, (it seems to give EA the right to collect anything),is it going to be changed to be accurate? When?



Thanks for reading, and if you can get any answer to this, it would be much appreciated,
 Vallore

(edited for clarity)

1. Data sent based on what looks at has been tested by me and others in last thread. It only scans its own game folder and your registry.

2. I can't answer but marketing is most obvious to me of which you answered yourself in your first question detail. However this isn't factual and more my own assumption based on most likely.

3. You can opt out of data collection on your EA account I believe on their website and you can opt out of data collection within ME3, whether not this also opts you out of data collection from those 2 sources I just mentioned in question one within Origin I do not know.

4. All EULAs are based on broad paint strokes and copy and pastes same with any other EULA in order to try to cover every possiblity they can. It says in it that only collects data from where client is shown to actually collect data in the current EULA I believe it was in the "we care about your privacy" part or something where states the client only looks at game folder and registry which fell under no identifiable information (however this also includes IP address but if upset over that then you may aswell stop using the internet given your ISP, search engine and BSN knows your IP or records it for legal purposes).

I am aproaching midnight so i can't be bothered to look it up anymore but EA's Origin EULA has been quoted to do a lot worse then you right here try to make me beleive. 
In fact i think it factually states EA has the right to gather some or some other private data and EA has the right to collect this data. Wether they actually do this and to what ends is quite irrelevant to me, nor are the intentions behind the way they write things down. Some of the worst things in human history have been done with the best intentions, the fact of the matter is im not signing anything that makes my privacy very uncontrollable because they want to "cover everything" in some EULA.
And yes i have facebook, but facebook contains no relevant private data and is in fact really controllable.

Modifié par Alpha Bootis, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:22 .

[Luvinn]

Ahglock wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...


5) Is there an opt in or opt out clause for data collection?
Users will be allowed to opt-out of Mass Effect 3 data collection from inside the game.

I would want to opt out of all data collection, not just ME3 data collection is that possible?  If the answer was yes I think that would solve a lot of peoples(not everyones) privacy concerns.    

They wont give an answer on that. Notice how sneaky the wording is on that topic too. Its like they think that the majority of customers are morons. Nice that a company like Bioware treats their customers this way.

[anzolino]

@ _Guy_Fawkes_
The last 230 pages this guy has only constantly repeated his enthusiasm about Origin, Steam and Ubsioft's online DRM and about there is nothing to fear about Origin, because EA said that. He wasn't able do deliver only one proof of his claims. He only was able to put bad analogies on the table. He obviously doesn't care about his privacy as other do.
So, I'm just curious: Why do you answer him? He only repeat the same every fifth page.

[Epsilon330]

Complistic wrote...

welp preorder cancelled.

I might pick this up in a steam sale.




Oh wait...

We should try to make this "Preorder Cancelled" thing a new meme...

[ttchip]

IliyaMoroumetz wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I'll put in a clear way, no change will happen. It is easy for EA to change wording in their EULA but they will not stop pushing their ideal for future being based on their own DD service. They own Bioware and they own ME3 by proxy. They are breaking no laws with their current DD service which is the same service as Steam and their EULA has now been reworded to comply with the laws in Germany where was a conflict. They have stated that this "WILL" not change and ME3 "WILL" come with Origin. There is by no means anywhere near enough people up set over this to impact EA directly. There is no outrage articles by mainstream media over ME3 being bundled with EA's version of Steam aka Origin and the loss in some sales from a small section of possible ME3 buyers is nothing but a drop in the ocean compared to the millions ME3 will sell and the truly insane amount of income EA makes from other sources.

http://www.joystiq.c...equires-origin/
http://www.shacknews...ilable-on-steam
http://kotaku.com/58...launch-on-steam
http://www.destructo...-3-219711.phtml
http://www.1up.com/n...requires-origin

I'm sorry, what?  And those are just the ones I could find in my RSS feed.  And you know what the primary response has been?  Surprise, surprise!  Negative!

Limiting your customers'  choices is *not* how you go about garnering customer good will.

those aren't considered 'mainstream', are they? hell,  here in germany we had whole sections of our news on TV devoted to how the previous version of the EULA mutilated our personal rights.

Modifié par ttchip, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:23 .

[count_4]

Accidental double post. Disregard this one.

Modifié par count_4, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:27 .

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

Still waiting to here on the single player operation, whether independent of the client after registry or dependent (requires offline mode Origin)...

[Ahglock]

Luvinn wrote...

Ahglock wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...


5) Is there an opt in or opt out clause for data collection?
Users will be allowed to opt-out of Mass Effect 3 data collection from inside the game.

I would want to opt out of all data collection, not just ME3 data collection is that possible?  If the answer was yes I think that would solve a lot of peoples(not everyones) privacy concerns.    

They wont give an answer on that. Notice how sneaky the wording is on that topic too. Its like they think that the majority of customers are morons. Nice that a company like Bioware treats their customers this way.

It could have just been poorly worded, and the answer could be yes you can fully opt out.  I highly doubt it, but I am not going to call them sleazy for this until the answer is no.  I have a wide range of other reasons I have problems with EA, but this one is a deal breaker for me.  And a total deal breaker I wont get it on xbox, imight borrow it form my nephew since he will get it on the xbox, but I wont give them a dime for a game that wont let me opt out of data mining.  

[_Guy_Fawkes_]

IliyaMoroumetz wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I'll put in a clear way, no change will happen. It is easy for EA to change wording in their EULA but they will not stop pushing their ideal for future being based on their own DD service. They own Bioware and they own ME3 by proxy. They are breaking no laws with their current DD service which is the same service as Steam and their EULA has now been reworded to comply with the laws in Germany where was a conflict. They have stated that this "WILL" not change and ME3 "WILL" come with Origin. There is by no means anywhere near enough people up set over this to impact EA directly. There is no outrage articles by mainstream media over ME3 being bundled with EA's version of Steam aka Origin and the loss in some sales from a small section of possible ME3 buyers is nothing but a drop in the ocean compared to the millions ME3 will sell and the truly insane amount of income EA makes from other sources.

http://www.joystiq.c...equires-origin/
http://www.shacknews...ilable-on-steam
http://kotaku.com/58...launch-on-steam
http://www.destructo...-3-219711.phtml
http://www.1up.com/n...requires-origin

I'm sorry, what?  And those are just the ones I could find in my RSS feed.  And you know what the primary response has been?  Surprise, surprise!  Negative!

Limiting your customers'  choices is *not* how you go about garnering customer good will.

+ Google trends to see how much interest in "mass effect origin" was observed and where:
http://www.google.co...date=ytd&sort=0

Try your own search terms. There is no need to sign up for that service. It's an interesing feature.

[count_4]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Not be be rude or anything, but in the middle drop-down option, you should change "mit" to "with." Not everyone knows German.

Thanks for catching that one, wasn't intentional. When I'm a little distracted I sneak in some German surprisingly often. 

Modifié par count_4, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:26 .

[SimJoseph7]

This is from the Origin Faq regarding Privacy and Security in regards to Origin:

Privacy and Security   (found at:  www.origin.com/faq)

Can I control my privacy?

Yes, Origin has robust privacy features which can be accessed from the 'Privacy' tab, within Origin's 'Settings.'We take the privacy of our users’ information and protection of that data very seriously. EA’s Privacy Policy can be found at http://tos.ea.com/le...IVACY/US/en/PC/. You should also review the Origin End User Licensing Agreement, which is located here: http://www.ea.com/1/product-eulas.

Why does Origin run while my game (i.e. Battlefield 3) is running?
There are a number of benefits to Origin, all designed to add value to the gaming experience for players. Origin authentication will provide gamers with consistent installation and the latest game updates, and also allows players to install games on as many PCs as they want. Beyond the fast download, automatic log-in, and built-in customer service, the in-game overlay and chat with friends features make for a more lively social experience, and cloud storage lets gamers save and continue games from any computer, anywhere, anytime. Altogether, the services provided by Origin make for a more dynamic and convenient play experience for the gamer, and also provides EA with a direct connection to the consumer to deliver the very best service and gaming content.

Is it true that when servers are down some people won’t be able to access any game modes?
This is not true. Players that do not have internet access can still play the single-player aspects of their games.

Origin is not spyware, is it?
Origin is not spyware, and does not use or install spyware on users' machines. In order to allow Origin to install games and their patches for everyone to use, Origin implements a permission change that results in Windows, not Origin, reviewing the filenames of every file in a directory and can have the appearance of a scan. This is an ordinary Windows function, not an information-gathering process – Origin is not scanning the directory, no information is accessed, collected, stored or shared by Origin during this process. However, we are aware that this process has created some customer confusion, and are updating our software in future releases to eliminate unnecessary operations. Consumer privacy is very important to EA and we take every precaution to protect our users’ data.

Does Origin access, collect or store information from my system?
Origin collects a limited amount of information needed to provide players with a service that allows them to purchase, download, access and play games and game content, connect online with other gamers and directly provide content and software updates. The information is also used to identify and fix software bugs as they arise. No information such as pictures, documents or other personal data unrelated to the application’s performance on a player’s system is accessed or collected. The collection and use of information by Origin helps ensure that consumers are able to access their games as easily as possible and are able to enjoy the best service and experience from EA.

Is my information secure with Origin/EA?
Yes – consumer privacy is very important to EA and we take every precaution to protect personal and anonymous user data. EA would never sell your personally identifiable information to anyone. We do not share information that personally identifies you without your consent, except in rare instances where disclosure is compelled by law.

So, what am I supposed to believe? The Faq? The EULA's? Will either of them change at any given time? It DOES look rather harmless IF IT IS TRUE. Or is it E.A. that could be the ones wanting all the data (even though Origin says it doesn't data mine)?

Thier Privacy Policy does not leave me a warm and fuzzy feeling though (tos.ea.com/legalapp/WEBPRIVACY/US/en/PC/#section3).

Joseph

[abaris]

Sylvianus wrote...


So just don't buy the game, and that's it ?

That's the only thing I can do.

I haven't got a console and never was tempted to get one. But even if I had one, why should I protest this business decision which is an invasion of my privacy and still give them money?

The only logical decision is to close my wallet. That's the only language the market understands.

[Sylvianus]

Also, get ready to never buy any bioware games. If the 6 March , Mass Effect is with origin, DA3 will be with Origin.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 16 janvier 2012 - 10:28 .

[Ahglock]

ttchip wrote...


those aren't considered 'mainstream', are they? hell,  here in germany we had whole sections of our news on TV devoted to how the previous version of the EULA mutilated our personal rights.

They are main stream gaming news, which is to say they aren't news sites at all and have nothing to do with journalism  or being main stream.  Just main stream for the hobby of gaming.  

[Icinix]

Dark_Matter79 wrote...

Icinix wrote...
Arguments saying "Well don't buy it." are missing the point by a few galaxies.

It's the only real option though, aside from buying the game for another platform. What other options are there? I'm simply saying that I understand the reasoning for not buying, but saying that this is a breach of privacy and that by installing the software, EA is intentionally breaching yours is a bit unfair. It is a method of protecting their intellectual property rights.

That said, if enough people decide not to buy the product, that will send a clear message that Origin is not the proper method of distribution for this product. The method of protection used for the first Mass Effect game was changed after concerns were raised, and I agree wholeheartedly that the initial method was a bit heavy handed. Time will tell if this method is similarly changed, and for the sake of those who are both concerned about the risk Origin presents and who also are fans of the franchise I hope it does.

It's your choice. I'm simply trying to put the decision into clearer perspective, and I am not saying that your concerns are not valid. I simply do not share them.

Its wrong to create a situation where your only choices are to kiss arse or walk away.  
Privacy concerns or not, creating an environment where a companies only customers are ones prepared to do whatever to play their games is wrong.
Leaving honest customers out of the 'in' crowd because they're not prepared to smile and take whatever a company throws at them is even worse.

Enjoy your freedom and privacy while you've got whats left of it.