3659 réponses à ce sujet

[ArkkAngel007]

Adugan wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

apixaez wrote...
I noticed and I did read it. However I do not appreciate being treated like a child as it all boils down to having Origin on your computer which is the sole issue, no matter where it is made available for purchase. As I apparently have the need to clarify what I meant (shocking really), I will do so. Why am I forced a client upon me when there already is a perfectly working client with less issues doing the exact same thing, but better? Is it EA's sheer arrogance or do they really think Origin will become a success with all the negative publicity it has gotten?

Mass Effect is not currently available on Steam. You cannot get the game on Steam right now. Steam is not currently selling Mass Effect 3.

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question. The question is what has already been brought up in these discussions by others who feel as you do--whether to purchase Mass Effect 3 or not. And I have very little to do with that decision. i'm just trying to keep the screaming down to manageable levels so Mrs. Fenway in the apartment downstairs doesn't show up at our door again.

We both know the disagreement about the TOS is a load of .. well you know .. and some more fancy talk to make Origin feel like it's the "way forward".

No, we don't "both know" that. the disagreement about the TOS starts with the TOS itself, which can be considered an offer. Now that many of the big questions have been answered, each player and consumer has to decide for himself whether to accept that offer and purchase the game. Some have chosen not to take the offer. Some have suggested alternatives. Some have chosen to accept the offer.

Uh no, the german EULA has been updated, not the one that matters to me. And let's see, general community with a brain:"ORIGIN DATAMINES YOUR COMPUTER FOR STUFF IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH! VIEW EVIDENCE A TO Z!" Single person working for the company providing Origin:"No guys, really, it doesn't (anymore)!"

Yeah, you make a pursuading arguement. Unfortunately, whether it still does or not, the damage has been done and trust has been damaged beyond repair.

Then we really have nothing more to talk about, do we?

Thank you for giving me my right to what I am entitled to do with my hard earned cash. I wish you were this easy going with your choice of forcing Origin on me too as I am supposed to buy Mass Effect 3 and not Origin or OriginEffect3. But I do appreciate your comments, it makes you a lot more popular in my book.

The right to do as you wish with your cash was not given by me. I'm just reiterating it since some people tend to forget that such choice and power is ultimately theirs. in fact, it even slips your mind when you mention "forcing Origin on me". The offer is there. We are not offering to sell them separately. Chris Priestly states rather explicitly that Origin is coming with Mass Effect 3. It is up to you, the consumer, to choose whether to purchase the game (ie. accept the offer) or not purchase the game. I promise you, no one here will think any differently of you regardless of your choice.

Thank you for clarifying your position.

Stanley, you are a moderator on these forums. Being blunt and disrespectful does not suit your role.

He wasn't being disrespectful in the slightest.  All he is saying is that folks have a choice and that nothing is being forced.  Whether or not things will change doesn't matter.  Things are the way they are now and we as consumers have to deal with it. 

We can work to change it, but that takes time...longer than the time between now and ME3.  So instead of attacking BioWare employees on something that you all are aware that they can't fully answer or have control over, just accept the situation and make your decision, while also working on finding a way to change EAs stance.

[shepskisaac]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Let's not hate on Mr. Woo, he's not in the wrong here. He has to defend this.

Agree, he and Chris are just the messangers.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 17 janvier 2012 - 01:42 .

[Rockworm503]

MysterD wrote...

Ravenknight wrote...

Tenryu7 wrote...

I have heard nothing but bad things about Origin from my friends who have used it for BF3 and I would really like for my Mass Effect games to be on the same service considering I already have 1 & 2 on Steam.

Best of luck working with Steam to put Mass Effect 3 on it. I will wait patiently for that day.

First off, I'm not buying the whole "we're working with Steam" bit. It's just loading more "Valve is being stubborn" deflection ammo.

Second, considering the quote: "Mass Effect 3 WILL require Origin for all PC editions, both physical and digital. This will not change." exactly how will that all mesh together? Steam loads the game, which actually loads ORIGIN (Hallowed are the Ori), which THEN loads ME3? Steam would not be a safe haven from Origin (Hallowed are the Ori) my friends. And I think it rather obvious that Valve would not prostrate and allow a competing platform to load on top of their own. Thus adding to the "Valve is the 'man in the black hat' " pile-on.

Origin (hallowrd are the Ori) would have to be removed from the equation before any mere flicker of hope could be sparked for Steamers. Put aside that argument for now. It's only diverting from the core issue and giving EAware plenty of red herrings to strew about.

Well, there are Steam versions of some games that use both Steam and G4WL.

Heck, Steam versions of GTA4 + EFLC use G4WL; Rockstar Social Club; and Steam

I got Batman Arkham City on steam
Thats Steam, GFWL and SecuROM.  I put up with a lot for a good game so it says more about Origin that I won't put up with it.

[Hedera]

Incognito JC wrote...

kofelover wrote...

Or -- sometimes it's just better to say nothing than open your mouth and dig a deeper hole.

This is true. I really wonder what had driven him to post what he did.

Probably a tough day at the office and lo and behold, the BSN is mad too.

[crimzontearz]

Zanallen wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...
Dragoon we may not see eye to eye on this little affair called Origin....but I work in the custonmer service field and saying that to a customer would resul, in my company, in a write-up. Not even a verbal, a direct write-up.

Then its a good thing he doesn't work at your company.

But really, what do you want him to say? Or Chris? Or anyone at Bioware? They don't make these decisions. The higher ups at EA corporate do. At best they can relay your concerns to whomever at EA may be listening and bring back whatever answers they are allowed to give you.

Of course, Chris has already said that ME3 is going to require Origin. He has said that this isn't going to change. As such, your choice at this point is to either purchase the game and utilize Origin or don't purchase the game. That is the one choice you have at this junction and, lucky for you, it is the only choice that really matters. If enough people refuse to purchase ME3 and make it clear, through speaking directly with EA and not getting angry at Bioware moderators, that Origin is the reason for the poor sales, then perhaps EA will relent. Or perhaps they won't. Either way, the game developers and the mods on the BSN have nothing to do with the decision.

if you can say nothing to quell the situation for whatever reason then say nothing at all....

un bel tacer non fu mai scritto

[swenson]

Hrm, so I'm looking through the Privacy Policy, and it looks fairly standard... the real issue for me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) is simply that EA is not exactly our favorite company, so simply trusting them with our data is not an attractive option. But I realize I'm going to have to just suck it up and give them the benefit of the doubt.

I will say that this part does concern me, though:

We cannot assume responsibility or liability for unauthorized access to our servers and systems.

Because quite frankly, yes, a company with access to sensitive data about customers (I'm talking about credit card info here) SHOULD assume responsibility for unauthorized access to that data. If I'm going to trust my bank account information to a company, I want to know that they're going to do something for me should that information be compromised. I know this is probably a standard statement because no system is impregnable. Still, it's not really comforting.

[Dragoonlordz]

Incognito JC wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...
What do you expect him to say?

If he came into this thread telling people to buy it people would rage.

Offering sympathy would be admitting that Origin is a bad thing, and they've clearly been given rather rigid guidelines as to what they can and can't say about Origin.

All he said was that its our choice whether to buy the game or not.

You missed out on the fact that his wording shows no appreciation of the fans and customers, thus taking us for granted. He was quite blunt and disrespectful.

But a persons perception is influenced by the mood aforementioned person may be in. I did not see anything offensive in what he said. Straight to the point maybe but straight to the point (yes I get the irony given it is me saying this) it is a respectable trait in my perceptions (even if I lack it myself).

[Candidate 88766]

Incognito JC wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

I promise you, no one here will think any differently of you regardless of your choice.'

Eh, I quoted that line so I don't have to quote a long post. Read the entire thing, it gives me that feeling after reading.

Frankly I found his honesty more refreshing than the standard PR thing most companies do of just blowing their own trumpet so to speak.

People in this very thread complained about the highly PR-ified manner in which Origin was announced. He was just trying to strip all of that away and tell us the truth as directly as possible - ME3 requires Origin, that isn't going change, and its up to you whether to buy it or not. They aren't going to pressure you into buying it.

[Incognito JC]

cgrimm54 wrote...

Probably a tough day at the office and lo and behold, the BSN is mad too.

I can relate to such days. Understood. I just wish he was slightly cranky at that moment, because the alternative is that they might really take their fans/customers/sales for granted. It's pretty much like giving a service without a smile, to put it roughly.

[Hedera]

swenson wrote...

Hrm, so I'm looking through the Privacy Policy, and it looks fairly standard... the real issue for me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) is simply that EA is not exactly our favorite company, so simply trusting them with our data is not an attractive option. But I realize I'm going to have to just suck it up and give them the benefit of the doubt.

I will say that this part does concern me, though:

We cannot assume responsibility or liability for unauthorized access to our servers and systems.

Because quite frankly, yes, a company with access to sensitive data about customers (I'm talking about credit card info here) SHOULD assume responsibility for unauthorized access to that data. If I'm going to trust my bank account information to a company, I want to know that they're going to do something for me should that information be compromised. I know this is probably a standard statement because no system is impregnable. Still, it's not really comforting.

That's probably in the XBL and PSN EULAs as well.  It's just there so every little breach doesn't result in a class-action lawsuit.  EULAs are written so that the service they cover is protected from lawsuits in every possible way, thus the incomprehensible legalese.

[Pupuppu]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question.

Of course this is one of many questions, as EA is trying to force users to switch to their platform. Many others have failed and the FAQ answer "EA is to big to fail" hasn't stopped much bigger players to shut it down when their platform didn't provide the expected revenue.

[Zanallen]

crimzontearz wrote...

if you can say nothing to quell the situation for whatever reason then say nothing at all....

un bel tacer non fu mai scritto

Yes, because that is a proven method when dealing with rage on the BSN. Oh wait, no. That never works. Instead it just causes people to get louder and louder while conspiracy theories crop up about why Bioware isn't saying anything.

[MysterD]

Rockworm503 wrote...

MysterD wrote...

Ravenknight wrote...

Tenryu7 wrote...

I have heard nothing but bad things about Origin from my friends who have used it for BF3 and I would really like for my Mass Effect games to be on the same service considering I already have 1 & 2 on Steam.

Best of luck working with Steam to put Mass Effect 3 on it. I will wait patiently for that day.

First off, I'm not buying the whole "we're working with Steam" bit. It's just loading more "Valve is being stubborn" deflection ammo.

Second, considering the quote: "Mass Effect 3 WILL require Origin for all PC editions, both physical and digital. This will not change." exactly how will that all mesh together? Steam loads the game, which actually loads ORIGIN (Hallowed are the Ori), which THEN loads ME3? Steam would not be a safe haven from Origin (Hallowed are the Ori) my friends. And I think it rather obvious that Valve would not prostrate and allow a competing platform to load on top of their own. Thus adding to the "Valve is the 'man in the black hat' " pile-on.

Origin (hallowrd are the Ori) would have to be removed from the equation before any mere flicker of hope could be sparked for Steamers. Put aside that argument for now. It's only diverting from the core issue and giving EAware plenty of red herrings to strew about.

Well, there are Steam versions of some games that use both Steam and G4WL.

Heck, Steam versions of GTA4 + EFLC use G4WL; Rockstar Social Club; and Steam

I got Batman Arkham City on steam
Thats Steam, GFWL and SecuROM.  I put up with a lot for a good game so it says more about Origin that I won't put up with it.

I bought Batman: Arkham City on Origin.
Only needed Origin for the download.

I don't have have to run Origin in the background to run the game.
So, that means I'm stuck w/ only Securom and G4WL to run the game.

Modifié par MysterD, 17 janvier 2012 - 01:48 .

[Aaleel]

I don't see anything wrong with what Stanly Woo said. All he said was that every gamer was entitled after doing their research/looking into Origin to decide for themselves whether or not they want to buy the game. Which is basically what people are doing. I don't see disrespect or taking customers for granted.

Taking customers for granted is saying I don't care what you guys do, don't buy it, we'll still get enough sales so it won't matter or something like that. I don't see what's so offensive about saying you have the right to make up your own mind.

Modifié par Aaleel, 17 janvier 2012 - 01:48 .

[kofelover]

Zanallen wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

if you can say nothing to quell the situation for whatever reason then say nothing at all....

un bel tacer non fu mai scritto

Yes, because that is a proven method when dealing with rage on the BSN. Oh wait, no. That never works. Instead it just causes people to get louder and louder while conspiracy theories crop up about why Bioware isn't saying anything.

You're missing the point - Mr. Woo does NOT have any answers to our questions and nobody EXPECTS him to.  In this case, saying nothing would have been better.

[slimgrin]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question.

Gotta be honest here. I hope Origin goes down like a fiery comet.

[Adugan]

Quite a lot of what he said was blunt and patronizing. Repeating that steam does nothave me3 certainly did not seem polite or even respectful. He is a representative of bw, so he should know that the tone of his posts reflects on his company.

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

Adugan wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

apixaez wrote...
I noticed and I did read it. However I do not appreciate being treated like a child as it all boils down to having Origin on your computer which is the sole issue, no matter where it is made available for purchase. As I apparently have the need to clarify what I meant (shocking really), I will do so. Why am I forced a client upon me when there already is a perfectly working client with less issues doing the exact same thing, but better? Is it EA's sheer arrogance or do they really think Origin will become a success with all the negative publicity it has gotten?

Mass Effect is not currently available on Steam. You cannot get the game on Steam right now. Steam is not currently selling Mass Effect 3.

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question. The question is what has already been brought up in these discussions by others who feel as you do--whether to purchase Mass Effect 3 or not. And I have very little to do with that decision. i'm just trying to keep the screaming down to manageable levels so Mrs. Fenway in the apartment downstairs doesn't show up at our door again.

We both know the disagreement about the TOS is a load of .. well you know .. and some more fancy talk to make Origin feel like it's the "way forward".

No, we don't "both know" that. the disagreement about the TOS starts with the TOS itself, which can be considered an offer. Now that many of the big questions have been answered, each player and consumer has to decide for himself whether to accept that offer and purchase the game. Some have chosen not to take the offer. Some have suggested alternatives. Some have chosen to accept the offer.

Uh no, the german EULA has been updated, not the one that matters to me. And let's see, general community with a brain:"ORIGIN DATAMINES YOUR COMPUTER FOR STUFF IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH! VIEW EVIDENCE A TO Z!" Single person working for the company providing Origin:"No guys, really, it doesn't (anymore)!"

Yeah, you make a pursuading arguement. Unfortunately, whether it still does or not, the damage has been done and trust has been damaged beyond repair.

Then we really have nothing more to talk about, do we?

Thank you for giving me my right to what I am entitled to do with my hard earned cash. I wish you were this easy going with your choice of forcing Origin on me too as I am supposed to buy Mass Effect 3 and not Origin or OriginEffect3. But I do appreciate your comments, it makes you a lot more popular in my book.

The right to do as you wish with your cash was not given by me. I'm just reiterating it since some people tend to forget that such choice and power is ultimately theirs. in fact, it even slips your mind when you mention "forcing Origin on me". The offer is there. We are not offering to sell them separately. Chris Priestly states rather explicitly that Origin is coming with Mass Effect 3. It is up to you, the consumer, to choose whether to purchase the game (ie. accept the offer) or not purchase the game. I promise you, no one here will think any differently of you regardless of your choice.

Thank you for clarifying your position.

Stanley, you are a moderator on these forums. Being blunt and disrespectful does not suit your role.

He wasn't being disrespectful in the slightest.  All he is saying is that folks have a choice and that nothing is being forced.  Whether or not things will change doesn't matter.  Things are the way they are now and we as consumers have to deal with it. 

We can work to change it, but that takes time...longer than the time between now and ME3.  So instead of attacking BioWare employees on something that you all are aware that they can't fully answer or have control over, just accept the situation and make your decision, while also working on finding a way to change EAs stance.

[swenson]

cgrimm54 wrote...

swenson wrote...

Hrm, so I'm looking through the Privacy Policy, and it looks fairly standard... the real issue for me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) is simply that EA is not exactly our favorite company, so simply trusting them with our data is not an attractive option. But I realize I'm going to have to just suck it up and give them the benefit of the doubt.

I will say that this part does concern me, though:

We cannot assume responsibility or liability for unauthorized access to our servers and systems.

Because quite frankly, yes, a company with access to sensitive data about customers (I'm talking about credit card info here) SHOULD assume responsibility for unauthorized access to that data. If I'm going to trust my bank account information to a company, I want to know that they're going to do something for me should that information be compromised. I know this is probably a standard statement because no system is impregnable. Still, it's not really comforting.

That's probably in the XBL and PSN EULAs as well.  It's just there so every little breach doesn't result in a class-action lawsuit.  EULAs are written so that the service they cover is protected from lawsuits in every possible way, thus the incomprehensible legalese.

Fair enough. I know perfectly well that a lot of the reason I'm overanalyzing the ToS is because I don't like EA in general, so I'm biased, but I'm trying to overcome that.

[MysterD]

Aaleel wrote...

I don't see anything wrong with what Stanly Woo said. All he said was that every gamer was entitled after doing their research/looking into Origin to decide for themselves whether or not they want to buy the game. Which is basically what people are doing. I don't see disrespect or taking customers for granted.

Agreed w/ this.

[Ryzaki]

guys can you trim the quotes? Those wall of quotes are kind of agitating to read.

[Incognito JC]

Aaleel wrote...

Taking customers for granted is saying I don't care what you guys do, don't buy it, we'll still get enough sales so it won't matter or something like that.

It's more of the way he said it, rather than what was literally said. It shows exactly what you just said here. Maybe I read too much into it. Maybe he was just cranky from a crappy day. Either way I hope this is not the case.

[kofelover]

slimgrin wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question.

Gotta be honest here. I hope Origin goes down like a fiery comet.

       Me too.

[apixaez]

Mass Effect is not currently available on Steam. You cannot get the game
on Steam right now. Steam is not currently selling Mass Effect 3.

You're repeating yourself. Apparently you're not understanding my question. Let me rephrase it: can you understand from our point of view why I would not go for Origin if there is a better alternative out there with more choices of games with less issues and scrutiny and why I would prefer that client, whether the game is available there or not (yet)?

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question. The question is
what has already been brought up in these discussions by others who
feel as you do--whether to purchase Mass Effect 3 or not. And I have
very little to do with that decision. i'm just trying to keep the
screaming down to manageable levels so Mrs. Fenway in the apartment
downstairs doesn't show up at our door again.

I already said that I understand it's not really up to you and that I do appreciate your reply, but not in the way it was formulated. And if you really do care about your fanbase I'd say you have a lot to do with that decision. Show trust and respect for your fanbase and they will do so in return. It's a two-way thing.

No, we don't "both know" that. the disagreement about the TOS starts
with the TOS itself, which can be considered an offer. Now that many of
the big questions have been answered, each player and consumer has to
decide for himself whether to accept that offer and purchase the game.
Some have chosen not to take the offer. Some have suggested
alternatives. Some have chosen to accept the offer.

Then I ask you from a business point of view, what is better? "Losing" (Investment I'd say in exchange for their servers, etc) 30% in definite sales or losing 100% sales by who knows how many exactly by pushing people this way? Besides that, we have a saying in my language .. "customer is king" .. I believe that's a business lesson not taught there..

Then we really have nothing more to talk about, do we?

And doesn't it tell you anything that because we are, it might actually mean I care? Like I said in an other post I've been a loyal customer of Bioware for years. I've always found the games totally worth my money and it's because I want to see Bioware stay a successful developer that I (and we) are voicing our concerns. Not because we have ill will towards you or what so ever.

The right to do as you wish with your cash was not given by me. I'm just
reiterating it since some people tend to forget that such choice and
power is ultimately theirs. in fact, it even slips your mind when you
mention "forcing Origin on me". The offer is there. We are not offering
to sell them separately. Chris Priestly states rather explicitly that
Origin is coming with Mass Effect 3. It is up to you, the consumer, to
choose whether to purchase the game (ie. accept the offer) or not
purchase the game. I promise you, no one here will think any differently
of you regardless of your choice.

Thank you for clarifying your position.

It has not slipt my mind at all, I'm just saying that I wish you were as easy going with giving me choice when it comes down to Origin considering it's my money. I am just slightly alarmed by your attitude that you do not seem to care whether you make more sales or not. Need I remind you what happened to Ubisoft when they adopted a certain attitude?

Please do not take this as a personal attack of any sort, I am just concerned the way Bioware is heading, a company I've supported and cherished for a long time, one of the few developers that always stood out for me.

[photographerleia]

kofelover wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Stanley Woo wrote...

Whether Origin will "succeed" isn't really the question.

Gotta be honest here. I hope Origin goes down like a fiery comet.

       Me too.

Me three.

[TheRealJayDee]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Chris Priestly states rather explicitly that Origin is coming with Mass Effect 3. It is up to you, the consumer, to choose whether to purchase the game (ie. accept the offer) or not purchase the game.

Ah, damn it, I had started writing a lengthy reply, but then I realized that I should already be sleeping for a long time now, and that it's just not worth it. It's really sad that my short but passionate relationship with Bioware (love DA:O & ME/ME2) seems to end in a rather ugly breakup. DA2, probably being the last Bioware game I played, was a huge disappointment, and as of now I won't play ME3 at all, which really saddens me, because there have been few games ever I was so looking forward to. Shame, but hey, c'est la vie.

Just please sticky the fracking thread.