3659 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Jackal7713 wrote...

Zargon VII wrote...

Origin = no sale. Bioware is dead to me now and I have bought Bioware games since the original Baldur's Gate. I may give in and finish the series on PS3 but I will be damn sure to buy used if I do so EA doesn't see a dime. It will also be the last Bioware game I ever play.

For real? Origin is just making sure to protect their software rights. They are not going into the files systems to raid your computer. Its just like the software protection that Microsoft uses on Windows. Are you going to get rid of Windows because they do they same thing? Also, its not just these two doing it. Adobe, Apple, Norton, etc., all have software protection. This should only make people who want to torrent their software mad, because they aren't getting it for free.

This baffles me.

You do realize all those things you listed are torrented right? DRM hasn't stopped pirates yet. It'll slow them down. But it hasn't stopped them.

Now I understand wanting to protect your property. Hell I'd probably do the same. But let's not pretend it actually works well.

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:13 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Ryzaki wrote...

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

On mine it is 113-114mb but if look at the more accurate/detailed size it is just short of 120mb.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:16 .

[TheRealJayDee]

casadechrisso wrote...

I have yet to hear anything actually positive about Origin besides simply accepting it as a necessary evil to play. 

It's actually almost comforting that Bioware doesn't even try to make Origin look appealing in any way. "It's there, deal with it." Almost every gamer comment I read was voicing rejection or indifference, with a select few defendig Origin without better arguments than "Steam is bad also" (which it is, though not exactly in the same ways) and "it's not spyware anymore". All in all there ain't much any real positive comments on Origin, because there simply isn't much anything positive to comment on.

Also, still want the thread stickied.

craigdolphin wrote...

In other words, make it respect our privacy and ensure that we get what we pay for.

Do that and I'll pre order ME3 that same day. Do it not, and I'll buy a secondhand copy for console instead. It's legal, I still get to play, and i get to vote with my wallet and you get nothing. And ah, yeah, forget about me paying you for any dlc for it either. Can't vote with my wallet if I bought that stuff after all.

That's the only method of experiencing ME3 for me as well atm. Not satisfying, but the only course of action I can sympathize with.

Modifié par TheRealJayDee, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:19 .

[Ryzaki]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

On mine it is 113-114mb but if look at the more accurate/detailed size it is just short of 120mb.

How big is steam in comparison?

[AlanC9]

billy the squid wrote...
In addition although modifying their own EULA without user acceptance is a little shady in function, it will depend if one is able to opt out of the patch/ DLC download or not, which contains the updated EULA. If the opt out is available and the game stiill functions then you have chosen to continue on the original terms not on the updated terms and are bound by them. The problem is that patches should not contain a new EULA as technically they are not a product, but an existing service, possibly it could be construed as new terms of service, the original EULA being limited to the original form of the IP, not subsequent service updates.

So they couldn't just pack  the new EULA into the patch's readme, right? You'd have to explicitly approve before patch installation for it to be binding.

[Dragoonlordz]

Ryzaki wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

On mine it is 113-114mb but if look at the more accurate/detailed size it is just short of 120mb.

How big is steam in comparison?

If only take the main folder into account and deduct the size of the games within the Steam folder, it comes to about the same around 100-150mb at a glance. I'll go check again this time work it out exactly (only main folder which is what used for Origin size).

Edit: Gone back and checked more closely it came to 177mb.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:24 .

[Ryzaki]

Dragoonlordz wrote...
If only take the main folder into account and deduct the size of the games within the Steam folder, it comes to about the same around 100-150mb at a glance. I'll go check again this time work it out exactly (only main folder which is what used for Origin size).

Awesome thanks for checking for me.

Re edit: Oh I see. Thanks.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:24 .

[Jackal7713]

Ryzaki wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Zargon VII wrote...

Origin = no sale. Bioware is dead to me now and I have bought Bioware games since the original Baldur's Gate. I may give in and finish the series on PS3 but I will be damn sure to buy used if I do so EA doesn't see a dime. It will also be the last Bioware game I ever play.

For real? Origin is just making sure to protect their software rights. They are not going into the files systems to raid your computer. Its just like the software protection that Microsoft uses on Windows. Are you going to get rid of Windows because they do they same thing? Also, its not just these two doing it. Adobe, Apple, Norton, etc., all have software protection. This should only make people who want to torrent their software mad, because they aren't getting it for free.

This baffles me.

You do realize all those things you listed are torrented right? DRM hasn't stopped pirates yet. It'll slow them down. But it hasn't stopped them.

Now I understand wanting to protect your property. Hell I'd probably do the same. But let's not pretend it actually works well.

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

Buddy, I never said it worked well, I said thats why they are doing it. But to say Origin is data mining with their software without proof is just to much. I could careless about it, to be honest. My copies are going to be on 360 and PS3.
Also if your worried about this stuff, then get two different computers. One for Gaming and one for whatever.

Modifié par Jackal7713, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:30 .

[Ryzaki]

Jackal7713 wrote...
Buddy, I never said it worked well, I said thats why they are doing it. But to say Origin is data mining with their software without proof is just to much. I could careless about it, to be honest. My copies are going to be on 360 and PS3. 

My response was towards the bolded.

They're not gonna get mad.

They have no reason to.

They'll get it DRM free.

As for datamining supposedly origin was looking outside it's folder BEFORE they changed the EULA which gives them the ability to change it back to the way it used to be at their lesiure. So yes I see why people are alarmed.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:27 .

[billy the squid]

AlanC9 wrote...

billy the squid wrote...
In addition although modifying their own EULA without user acceptance is a little shady in function, it will depend if one is able to opt out of the patch/ DLC download or not, which contains the updated EULA. If the opt out is available and the game stiill functions then you have chosen to continue on the original terms not on the updated terms and are bound by them. The problem is that patches should not contain a new EULA as technically they are not a product, but an existing service, possibly it could be construed as new terms of service, the original EULA being limited to the original form of the IP, not subsequent service updates.

So they couldn't just pack  the new EULA into the patch's readme, right? You'd have to explicitly approve before patch installation for it to be binding.

They could, as it is possible to claim the patch is a service and is not subject to the existing terms of the EULA. The acceptance of the new terms would be implied by accepting the patch, but that is why I don't have auto update on games which I use, they require permission and ask me if I want to read the EULA which accompanies it, before I install it.

Edit: As such as I have accepted no patch and no new terms I am bound by the original terms of the EULA which I accepted, not the subsequent ones.

Modifié par billy the squid, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:34 .

[Dragoonlordz]

AlanC9 wrote...

billy the squid wrote...
In addition although modifying their own EULA without user acceptance is a little shady in function, it will depend if one is able to opt out of the patch/ DLC download or not, which contains the updated EULA. If the opt out is available and the game stiill functions then you have chosen to continue on the original terms not on the updated terms and are bound by them. The problem is that patches should not contain a new EULA as technically they are not a product, but an existing service, possibly it could be construed as new terms of service, the original EULA being limited to the original form of the IP, not subsequent service updates.

So they couldn't just pack  the new EULA into the patch's readme, right? You'd have to explicitly approve before patch installation for it to be binding.

From what I read you have in the EULA (not only Origin but also checked Steam to see if just stated in EA's version) 30 days to decline the new terms by way of written letter everytime they make a change. This goes for both versions I looked at.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:30 .

[billy the squid]

Ryzaki wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...
Buddy, I never said it worked well, I said thats why they are doing it. But to say Origin is data mining with their software without proof is just to much. I could careless about it, to be honest. My copies are going to be on 360 and PS3. 

My response was towards the bolded.

They're not gonna get mad.

They have no reason to.

They'll get it DRM free.

As for datamining supposedly origin was looking outside it's folder BEFORE they changed the EULA which gives them the ability to change it back to the way it used to be at their lesiure. So yes I see why people are alarmed.

They actually got into trouble in the EU for the overt scanning process and a number of other issues, so they had to change the EULA, to change it back after would be painting a bullseye on EA's head saying
"file here for easy win"

[jamesp81]

Jackal7713 wrote...
For real? Origin is just making sure to protect their software rights.

They can do that without scanning my entire hard drive.

Jackal7713 wrote...
They are not going into the files systems to raid your computer.

Origin has, in fact, done exactly this in the past.

Jackal7713 wrote...
Its just like the software protection that Microsoft uses on Windows.

No, it isn't.

Jackal7713 wrote...
Are you going to get rid of Windows because they do they same thing?

A lot of people have done just that.

Jackal7713 wrote...
This should only make people who want to torrent their software mad, because they aren't getting it for free.

The privacy of my data is not up for negotiation or discussion.  I don't have anything illegal on any of my computers.  That's also completely irrelevant.  The info I  DO have on my computer is NO  ONE  ELSE'S  BUSINESS.

Seriously, people need to learn to mind their own damn business.  It would save society a lot of problems.

Modifié par jamesp81, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:37 .

[jamesp81]

Jackal7713 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Zargon VII wrote...

Origin = no sale. Bioware is dead to me now and I have bought Bioware games since the original Baldur's Gate. I may give in and finish the series on PS3 but I will be damn sure to buy used if I do so EA doesn't see a dime. It will also be the last Bioware game I ever play.

For real? Origin is just making sure to protect their software rights. They are not going into the files systems to raid your computer. Its just like the software protection that Microsoft uses on Windows. Are you going to get rid of Windows because they do they same thing? Also, its not just these two doing it. Adobe, Apple, Norton, etc., all have software protection. This should only make people who want to torrent their software mad, because they aren't getting it for free.

This baffles me.

You do realize all those things you listed are torrented right? DRM hasn't stopped pirates yet. It'll slow them down. But it hasn't stopped them.

Now I understand wanting to protect your property. Hell I'd probably do the same. But let's not pretend it actually works well.

On to Origin. How much harddrive space does it take up? 

Buddy, I never said it worked well, I said thats why they are doing it. But to say Origin is data mining with their software without proof is just to much. I could careless about it, to be honest. My copies are going to be on 360 and PS3.
Also if your worried about this stuff, then get two different computers. One for Gaming and one for whatever.

There are screen shots on this very website demonstrating Origin in the act of datamining, or at least executing processes that appear to be datamining and are definitely NOT required to verify the legitimacy (ie, non-pirated status) of the software it controls.

[abaris]

Jackal7713 wrote...


For real? Origin is just making sure to protect their software rights. They are not going into the files systems to raid your computer. Its just like the software protection that Microsoft uses on Windows.

No, it's not.

First, Windows only requires a one time registration and they even trust their customers enough to do the activation by phone. The general phone home behaviour of windows can be disabled without suffering any consequences.

Second, the Origin client is capable of scanning more than the above mentioned files. It was doing it before the outrage in Germany. The EULA still reserves the right to do it.

Thrid, the client business in general is something to be concerned over. Same goes for all the different toolbars and apps provided by google or yahoo or any other company. They are all designed to get a clearer picture of the particular user to be used for marketing purposes.

So, if you're saying, Origin isn't that much worse than any other given client, I tend to agree. But if you're saying, it's nothing to be concerned of, you clearly aren't concerned with your privacy.

Modifié par abaris, 17 janvier 2012 - 05:43 .

[Bostur]

Niki78 wrote...

count_4 wrote...

The points remains the same: The only thing Origin does is change some permissions. It does that using the Windows API as you pointed out. However it does not use the Windows API to scan files. The Windows API does it all by itself without relaying the information of the scan to Origin.
Origin does neither initiate the scan nor does it receive the resulting information.

I've been programming with Windows API for about 15 years, and I find that claim very dubious. The Windows API does pretty much what you tell it to do, nothing more. (Why should changing one file trigger a scan in completely different directories??)

If EA wants us to believe this, they should release sample source code that demonstrates that changing one file's security permissions leads to a scan in a different directory. Until then, I will treat Origin as malware/spyware.

It also seems very strange to me. My best guess is that Origin used to change permission of c:\\Program Files and because of that Windows might have done some recursive actions in all subdirectories. Why Origin would want to change permissions of a system directory is weird though. Maybe it was a dirty hack that was meant to be removed before release.

It's a bit suspicious that EA never responded to any of the concerns, but just secretely changed the behaviour.

[mustafarslan]

[Violation of Rule #2 removed]

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:34 .

[Dragoonlordz]

abaris wrote...

You clearly aren't concerned with your privacy.

A better and less inflammatory way of making your point would of been to use the wording "as concerned compared to some others". The way you put it comes across as both condescending and belittling. If you did mean it to come across that way then might I suggest being a little bit more civil. If just made mistake in how you put your point across then that is fair enough. Even if use the new wording it is still not 100% accurate assessment in that the element of trust goes across both sets of people. You may trust some people with your information and others may trust EA more so than you do with theirs.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:00 .

[Erode_The_Soul]

Edit: Post removed.


EDIT: Just participating in a discussion that seemed relevant. My apologies.

Modifié par Erode_The_Soul, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:25 .

[The Prince Zeel]

Edit: Post removed. 

Modifié par Chris Priestly, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:20 .

[The Prince Zeel]

Edit: Post removed.

Modifié par Chris Priestly, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:19 .

[AlanC9]

billy the squid wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

billy the squid wrote...
In addition although modifying their own EULA without user acceptance is a little shady in function, it will depend if one is able to opt out of the patch/ DLC download or not, which contains the updated EULA. If the opt out is available and the game stiill functions then you have chosen to continue on the original terms not on the updated terms and are bound by them. The problem is that patches should not contain a new EULA as technically they are not a product, but an existing service, possibly it could be construed as new terms of service, the original EULA being limited to the original form of the IP, not subsequent service updates.

So they couldn't just pack  the new EULA into the patch's readme, right? You'd have to explicitly approve before patch installation for it to be binding.

They could, as it is possible to claim the patch is a service and is not subject to the existing terms of the EULA. The acceptance of the new terms would be implied by accepting the patch, but that is why I don't have auto update on games which I use, they require permission and ask me if I want to read the EULA which accompanies it, before I install it.

Edit: As such as I have accepted no patch and no new terms I am bound by the original terms of the EULA which I accepted, not the subsequent ones.

Ah. Got it. Thanks.

[AlanC9]

[inappropriate post removed]

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 17 janvier 2012 - 06:35 .

[Harley_Dude]

Let's not forget Origin creates a monopoly for DLC. Even XBL allows for DLC purchases at Amazon, Best Buy, etc. Origin is the only place for PC DLC and they have no incentive to reduce prices due to competition. The EA CEO has publicly stated the desire to move towards recurring revenue streams. How would you like an Origin Gold account?